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| zaneb | harlowja: so say a hypervisor dies. your HA will fail over. but you also need to replace the dead VM, right? that's the OpenStack native part | 00:57 |
|---|---|---|
| harlowja | gotcha | 00:57 |
| zaneb | and I guarantee that you will run into all sorts of interesting problems that effectively prevent users from doing this kind of cloud-like thing on OpenStack | 00:59 |
| harlowja | yup | 00:59 |
| harlowja | openstack to low level | 00:59 |
| zaneb | e.g. there's no way to get notifications that a hypervisor has died, because Nova doesn't believe that's a thing that users will ever need | 00:59 |
| harlowja | sure, that to | 00:59 |
| zaneb | you'll have to put your cloud credentials on a VM somewhere because Keystone hasn't implemented application credentials yet (although mordred is now working on it) | 01:00 |
| harlowja | zaneb though how does heat do it then? or how did it simulate that | 01:00 |
| harlowja | celiometer back channel... | 01:00 |
| zaneb | harlowja: there's _some_ stuff you can do with ceilometer | 01:01 |
| zaneb | but not enough | 01:01 |
| harlowja | ya, guess we forgot to define | 01:01 |
| harlowja | 'OpenStack native ' (from the start) | 01:01 |
| harlowja | lol | 01:01 |
| harlowja | oops | 01:01 |
| harlowja | sorry bout that, ha | 01:01 |
| zaneb | harlowja: e.g. I wrote this http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/heat-templates/tree/hot/autohealing/autohealing_server.yaml but to use it you need to enable some config in ceilometer that ~nobody enables | 01:02 |
| zaneb | I don't care if you use Heat or not | 01:02 |
| harlowja | ya, i get it | 01:02 |
| * harlowja thinks we need to make diagram like https://raw.githubusercontent.com/cncf/landscape/master/landscape/CloudNativeLandscape_v0.9.7.jpg lol | 01:03 | |
| zaneb | but I would love for someone to build the demo of what SamYaple described, and then come back with a list of all the things that you can't actually do in OpenStack and then pull the fire alarm | 01:03 |
| harlowja | more diagrams, hahahaha | 01:03 |
| harlowja | zaneb or just admit that perhaps people don't want to do those things anymore in openstack (if they ever did in the first place)? | 01:04 |
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| zaneb | harlowja: that'd be fine too, we could change the mission statement and make it clear to the world that Nova/Glance/Neutron/Cinder are all you're ever gonna get and if you want to build cloud-like things on top then you're going to be writing your own thing that does a lot of polling (like nodepool, maybe?) | 01:06 |
| zaneb | and I can go work on something else | 01:06 |
| harlowja | ya, how's our outreach programs going :-P | 01:06 |
| zaneb | that diagram is interesting. apparently CNCF would like people to think that the only thing OpenStack is good for is bare-metal provisioning | 01:09 |
| harlowja | ya, i raised that on openstack-dev a few weeks ago | 01:10 |
| zaneb | which we don't even do well | 01:10 |
| harlowja | being, like ummm, does anyone know who to contact to fix that, lol | 01:10 |
| harlowja | http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2017-September/122203.html lol | 01:10 |
| fungi | ildikov has been trying, i think. or maybe it was lsell | 01:11 |
| harlowja | cool | 01:11 |
| fungi | harlowja: aiui, that diagram is the checklist of projects the cncf wants to recruit to help boost their image | 01:11 |
| harlowja | ya, i know | 01:11 |
| harlowja | (not hard to tell that, ha) | 01:11 |
| harlowja | *all the boxes* | 01:12 |
| harlowja | https://lists.cncf.io/pipermail/cncf-toc/2017-September/001197.html i thought was funny, ha | 01:12 |
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| fungi | they apparently just convinced tuf and notary to join | 01:12 |
| harlowja | ya, in some fantasy world of mine, CNCF and openstack foundation would be the same thing | 01:13 |
| fungi | it's an interesting tactic, taking existing reasonably successful projects and convincing them to become part of the cncf | 01:13 |
| harlowja | ya, slightly different then the 'built in openstack' only problem | 01:14 |
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| fungi | oh, and i guess we've officially been in office hour for 16 minutes now | 01:16 |
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| harlowja | oh nice, ha | 01:22 |
| fungi | and everybody clams up once i point that out ;) | 01:23 |
| zaneb | yeah, way to kill the discussion fungi ;) | 01:23 |
| * fungi is used to it | 01:23 | |
| harlowja | nah, talking to my manager | 01:26 |
| harlowja | not clammy | 01:26 |
| fungi | harlowja: not as much "built in openstack" but rather that we have projects coming to us asking to join, to the point that we don't really go looking for projects to talk into becoming an openstack project | 01:26 |
| fungi | maybe they're just looking to reach critical mass to the point where projects will seek them out rather than having to go about it the other way around | 01:27 |
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| EmilienM | fungi: any examples we can discuss tonight? | 01:29 |
| fungi | EmilienM: zaneb and harlowja's conversation about a self-healing "hello world" application using openstack native solutions is an interesting thought exercise, at least | 01:31 |
| fungi | EmilienM: not sure what sort of examples you're looking for | 01:32 |
| EmilienM | fungi: I wasn't sure if you were refering to recent applications request | 01:32 |
| EmilienM | I agree it's an interesting exercise | 01:32 |
| fungi | oh, nope. just all of them really | 01:32 |
| EmilienM | ok | 01:33 |
| fungi | we get lots of great projects applying to join | 01:33 |
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| fungi | SamYaple just pushed up one for loci | 01:33 |
| EmilienM | yeah, I saw that today, this is really good. | 01:33 |
| * fungi feels bad, has been too busy to read through it properly yet | 01:34 | |
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| SamYaple | fungi: its cool, i give you permission to skip it if you +1 it in return | 01:40 |
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| fungi | bwahahaha | 01:40 |
| EmilienM | hehe | 01:42 |
| EmilienM | fungi: he didn't have to do the same with me, I gave it before :P | 01:42 |
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| openstackgerrit | Dai Dang Van proposed openstack/governance master: Add policy artifacts for senlin https://review.openstack.org/514908 | 04:37 |
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| ildikov | fungi: that was lsell in this case :) | 06:20 |
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| ttx | roster updated at https://www.openstack.org/foundation/tech-committee/ -- you might want to check/update your bios and affiliations on OpenStackID if not correct | 07:07 |
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| ttx | tc-members if you have people you would like to nominate for a contributor award in Sydney, you probably still have a couple of hours to do so | 07:59 |
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| cdent | that dinner location looks nice | 10:12 |
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| ttx | Oh and btw if you see anything we should really be discussing in Sydney at the Forum, there should be extra Forum slots set aside to cover for last-minute needs that we can reuse | 13:36 |
| cdent | ttx: flaper87 suggested perhaps a followup on the topics that arose from the term limits conversation | 13:40 |
| mugsie | I think that might be a good candidate for a f2f conversation | 13:44 |
| flaper87 | yeah, I would like to pursue that conversation further. I think it'll provide good food for thoughts and it'll help us revisit some (tribal?) knowledge | 13:47 |
| flaper87 | this is not to say I agree/disagree either way but I wouldn't mind having that conversation | 13:47 |
| flaper87 | I think EmilienM is planning to send an email out | 13:47 |
| EmilienM | flaper87: I'll, when you do my breakfast. | 13:48 |
| flaper87 | also, I won't be at the TC+Board meeting so, let's please not discuss this there :D | 13:48 |
| EmilienM | milk + juice please | 13:48 |
| flaper87 | EmilienM: gimme and address, I'll call uber eats | 13:48 |
| flaper87 | or dunkey eats, depending where you are | 13:48 |
| TheJulia | lol | 13:49 |
| EmilienM | there is no über on the Island that I live | 13:49 |
| flaper87 | EmilienM: I'm sure I can hire a donkey to get you food. | 13:49 |
| flaper87 | EmilienM: worst case scenario, you eat the donkey | 13:50 |
| * flaper87 stfu and stops spamming the channel | 13:50 | |
| * EmilienM stfu as well and prepares an email | 13:50 | |
| openstackgerrit | Thierry Carrez proposed openstack/governance master: Add Storyboard Migration to Rocky https://review.openstack.org/513875 | 13:51 |
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| pabelanger | ttx: roster looks good, but noticed linkedin URLs are not correct, they are invalid URLs | 14:54 |
| ttx | pabelanger: ok, will communicate issue up | 15:01 |
| ttx | pabelanger: they work for me | 15:02 |
| ttx | (open a new tab on https://twitter.com/pabelanger) | 15:02 |
| ttx | oh, linked in | 15:03 |
| ttx | ignore me | 15:03 |
| cdent | I suppose I should tidy up my bio if it is going to be so…available | 15:12 |
| EmilienM | cdent: just write "hi i'm cdent and here for you" | 15:47 |
| cdent | and you and you and you | 15:47 |
| smcginnis | Hah | 15:52 |
| flaper87 | cdent: and me? | 15:57 |
| cdent | and you! | 15:57 |
| flaper87 | (emoji with heartened eyes) | 15:57 |
| cdent | 😍 | 15:58 |
| flaper87 | es, it is cheating..but heck you want to get a space, right? | 15:59 |
| flaper87 | arg, bad paste | 15:59 |
| flaper87 | 😍 | 15:59 |
| flaper87 | that one | 15:59 |
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| EmilienM | how do you do that | 16:17 |
| EmilienM | we need a doc | 16:17 |
| cdent | Or a resolution to not allow emoji here | 16:17 |
| EmilienM | Rollcall +1 | 16:18 |
| cdent | communalism finally comes to openstack: if not everyone can do it, then no one can do it! | 16:19 |
| EmilienM | well, you didn't tell me how to do it :P | 16:21 |
| cdent | 💩❤️❤️👾👾🤖🎃👺💩👊👊 | 16:22 |
| cdent | i have one of those useless touchbars | 16:22 |
| cdent | that ^^ is pretty much all they are good for | 16:22 |
| EmilienM | it hurts my eyes | 16:23 |
| smcginnis | We have become slack. | 16:24 |
| Rockyg | are you sure we're not just slackers? | 16:25 |
| mugsie | well, that is a given :) | 16:28 |
| mugsie | especially if we make our touchbars have emjois :) | 16:28 |
| * dtroyer wonders if he can resurrect his old slackersatowrk.com domain | 16:49 | |
| openstackgerrit | Kendall Nelson proposed openstack/governance master: Add Storyboard Migration to Rocky https://review.openstack.org/513875 | 16:56 |
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| ttx | tc-members: for a board+TC+UC meeting in Dublin, would you prefer Sunday, Monday or Friday ? | 17:04 |
| cdent | sunday | 17:04 |
| cmurphy | if the next PTG is anything like the last one I will be busy monday-friday | 17:05 |
| smcginnis | Any would likely work for me. | 17:05 |
| cdent | cmurphy: ditto | 17:05 |
| smcginnis | cmurphy: Good point, Monday might not be the best. | 17:05 |
| dhellmann | sunday | 17:05 |
| dtroyer | I'd prefer Sunday | 17:05 |
| * dhellmann wonders why we keep having this come up as a question, since we always want it to be a separate day | 17:05 | |
| smcginnis | :) | 17:06 |
| ttx | dhellmann: cost mostly | 17:06 |
| * ttx wonders if we really need to meet, too | 17:06 | |
| ttx | Sydney feels just around the corner from Denver to me | 17:07 |
| EmilienM | sunday | 17:07 |
| cdent | it’s fair to want to limit costs, but if we want to meet, it needs to be dedicated time, otherwise we can’t do the PTG justice | 17:07 |
| dhellmann | maybe skip the meetings at the ptg and only meet at summits? | 17:07 |
| ttx | dhellmann: right, my thought exactly | 17:07 |
| cdent | I _like_ having the meetings, but they are perhaps not _necessary_ | 17:07 |
| EmilienM | sunday with guinness as post-meeting | 17:08 |
| cdent | I feel, however, that if we don’t have them, we miss a lot of opportunity for brainshare | 17:08 |
| smcginnis | cdent: Same here. | 17:08 |
| pabelanger | ttx: sunday | 17:08 |
| cdent | anothr way to put it: if we don’t have the meetings then my interaction with the board will drop to pretty much nothing, and that seems bad | 17:09 |
| smcginnis | I agree. It's soon after Denver, but I do think the time together face to face is useful. | 17:10 |
| ttx | ok, will communicate our (usual) preference | 17:10 |
| ttx | we still don't have an agenda for Sydney meeting :) | 17:11 |
| dhellmann | cdent : yeah; I think I would prefer to go ahead and have them, too. These groups meet so infrequently as a body, and I think it's useful. We (all) need to be very active about managing the agenda, though, to ensure that. | 17:11 |
| cdent | dhellmann: yes. ttx: as (I think) I said before: I can have a very small bit prepared based on the ptg questions about “satisfaction” | 17:12 |
| ttx | cdent: ok | 17:13 |
| pabelanger | Is flattening of git namespaces something that could be talked about? I admit, I am unsure the current status of that | 17:13 |
| ttx | will add it to the wiki page if you don't beat me to it | 17:13 |
| cdent | ttx: if you could, that would be great please and thank you, I’m holding a lot of code state atm | 17:14 |
| ttx | pabelanger: I expect it will be discussed as a consequence of the bucketing, yes | 17:14 |
| dhellmann | pabelanger : do the board and uc have input into that in some way? or interest? | 17:14 |
| dhellmann | it probably fits into the discussion of new project areas, so it might come up there | 17:14 |
| pabelanger | dhellmann: I am not sure to be honest | 17:15 |
| ttx | dhellmann: yes it may come up as an aside | 17:15 |
| dhellmann | pabelanger : ok, I was mostly looking for your perspective on why that might be an interesting topic (not suggesting that it isn't) | 17:15 |
| * ttx dinners | 17:16 | |
| pabelanger | dhellmann: Yah, I find it an interesting topic, mostly because of the infra changes that will be needed. However, I wasn't sure if that given the green light yet or not from board. I do recall reading some slights at PTG about it, and wasn't sure what the follow up was. | 17:19 |
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| mugsie | is there any info on that bucketing anywhere? I seem to remember reading a high level overview powerpoint, but I can't find it | 17:25 |
| cdent | mugsie: you mean the “new projects that are not openstack but in the foundation” thing? or something else? | 17:26 |
| mugsie | yeah | 17:26 |
| cdent | That powerpoint is all I’ve seen | 17:27 |
| cdent | It feels, however, like the plan has advanced from there somewhat, but I don’t know of any documents | 17:28 |
| cdent | An email has been promised, prior to summit, with more information | 17:28 |
| cdent | in part to forestall any “how will this impact _me_” concerns | 17:28 |
| pabelanger | https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1qQ1oCjhEE3bjtjkPydGhyeR6vFyuyFeOhbwc-WueddI/edit#slide=id.g253ac459b6_0_208 | 17:30 |
| pabelanger | Yah, I should have used 'buckets' over flaten namespaces | 17:30 |
| cdent | that’s different from the one I was talking about, but seems more likely to be the one that mugsie was thinking about | 17:31 |
| cdent | I was thinking of | 17:31 |
| cdent | https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1vhBRo7jLG0fmzktdnG1EhHwE5L7eYdIFkuxYXmGZ_Hg/edit#slide=id.g2634b3cd1a_0_14 | 17:32 |
| pabelanger | cdent: I don't think I have seen this one yet. Will read shortly | 17:34 |
| mugsie | yeah - I had just seen the first one | 17:40 |
| TheJulia | ttx: I prefer Sunday as well. | 17:43 |
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| dhellmann | pabelanger : sure. I thought it was basically an implementation detail but maybe there's more to it. | 17:51 |
| dhellmann | pabelanger : ah, the buckets thing is definitely something that will come up. | 17:51 |
| * dhellmann has finally caught up with scrollback | 17:52 | |
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| fungi | ttx: sunday before ptg in dublin has my vote as well, for all the usual reasons | 21:24 |
| fungi | pabelanger: i have some ideas on ways we can make significant perceptual impact hiding namespaces in prominent places now with relatively minimal infra effort (i.e. not having to pull the trigger on repo renames in gerrit/jobs/et cetera until later) | 21:26 |
| fungi | though it also furthers my not-so-secret agenda of getting the infra team out of being particularly responsible for gh integration | 21:27 |
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