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| hongbin | #startmeeting zun | 02:59 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 8 02:59:56 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is hongbin. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 02:59 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 02:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: zun)" | 02:59 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'zun' | 03:00 |
| hongbin | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Zun#Agenda_for_2016-11-08_0300_UTC Today's agenda | 03:00 |
| hongbin | #topic Roll Call | 03:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:00 | |
| shubhams | shubhams | 03:00 |
| mkrai | Madhuri Kumari | 03:00 |
| kevinz | kevinz | 03:00 |
| pksingh | Pradeep Singh | 03:00 |
| Wenzhi | Wenzhi | 03:00 |
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| flwang | o/ | 03:00 |
| yanyanhu | hi | 03:00 |
| hongbin | Thanks for joining the meeting shubhams mkrai kevinz pksingh Wenzhi flwang yanyanhu | 03:01 |
| hongbin | #topic Announcements | 03:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:01 | |
| hongbin | 1. Welcome Shubham to join the core team | 03:01 |
| hongbin | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106750.html | 03:01 |
| pksingh | congrate shubhams | 03:01 |
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| Wenzhi | welcome | 03:01 |
| mkrai | Congratulation shubhams :) | 03:01 |
| kevinz | congratulations | 03:01 |
| mkrai | Welcome to the team! | 03:01 |
| hongbin | shubhams: welcome. thanks for your contribution to Zun | 03:01 |
| shubhams | Thanks hongbin pksingh mkrai kevinz :) | 03:01 |
| shu-mutou | welcome! | 03:02 |
| hongbin | 2. Plan to be an official OpenStack project | 03:02 |
| hongbin | A requirement of joining OpenStack is to have an elected PTL, so I will find someone to hold a PTL election. | 03:02 |
| mkrai | I have been waiting for this :) | 03:02 |
| hongbin | yes | 03:02 |
| Wenzhi | me too :) | 03:02 |
| pksingh | :) | 03:02 |
| kevinz | :) | 03:02 |
| hongbin | after a ptl is elected, i will apply to be official | 03:02 |
| hongbin | hopefully, everything is fine | 03:03 |
| hongbin | 3. OpenStack Barcelona Summit recap | 03:03 |
| hongbin | * We had a Zun presentation in the main summit. | 03:03 |
| hongbin | #link http://www.slideshare.net/hongbin034/zun-presentation-openstack-barcelona-summit The slide | 03:03 |
| hongbin | #link The video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Go8_G3iLyl4 The video | 03:03 |
| pksingh | hongbin: i watched the video, it is greate :) | 03:03 |
| hongbin | pksingh: i was a bit nervous at that time | 03:03 |
| hongbin | :) | 03:03 |
| yanyanhu | cool | 03:03 |
| hongbin | hope everything is clear | 03:04 |
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| kevinz | well done | 03:04 |
| pksingh | yup | 03:04 |
| hongbin | * We had a Zun session at design summit | 03:04 |
| hongbin | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ocata-zun-worksession The etherpad | 03:04 |
| shubhams | Yes it was a nice session | 03:04 |
| hongbin | * The general public showed high interests in our project | 03:04 |
| hongbin | #link http://www.internetnews.com/blog/skerner/openstack-zun-debuts-new-approach-to-cloud-containers.html An article about Zun | 03:04 |
| hongbin | * Feedback/Wishlist | 03:04 |
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| hongbin | 1. Strong isolation between containers from different tenants | 03:04 |
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| hongbin | 2. Kubernetes integration | 03:05 |
| hongbin | These are the main features that I heard several times | 03:05 |
| hongbin | Will discuss it later in the agenda | 03:05 |
| hongbin | #topic Review Action Items | 03:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Review Action Items (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:05 | |
| hongbin | Discuss with hongbin on features list for release o (In Progress) | 03:05 |
| hongbin | Let's discuss this | 03:05 |
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| hongbin | #topic Plan features for Ocata release | 03:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Plan features for Ocata release (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:06 | |
| hongbin | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zun-ocata-planning The etherpad | 03:06 |
| hongbin | We can either brainstorm ocata features here or work on the etherpad | 03:06 |
| hongbin | What features you want? | 03:06 |
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| shubhams | I think on etherpad we can put our votes for each feature and then decide . What do you say ? | 03:07 |
| pksingh | etherpad +1 | 03:07 |
| flwang | i would say just focus on the current list | 03:07 |
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| flwang | vote is a good idea here | 03:07 |
| hongbin | shubhams: for sure, but let's wait for everything to have a input first | 03:07 |
| hongbin | ok, do anyone want to add to the list at the last monent? | 03:08 |
| pksingh | I think first we should focus on docker runtime, and support all operations | 03:08 |
| eliqiao | hi , I am late | 03:08 |
| hongbin | pksingh: ack | 03:08 |
| hongbin | eliqiao: we are working on the etherpad https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/zun-ocata-planning | 03:09 |
| eliqiao | hongbin: thx | 03:09 |
| hongbin | ok, then let's vote | 03:09 |
| mkrai | Please add any feature which you feel is left | 03:11 |
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| hongbin | So far, it looks k8s integration and functional tests have a lot of votes | 03:11 |
| Qiming | em, what does this mean -- "Kubernetes integration"? | 03:11 |
| mkrai | Yes hongbin | 03:11 |
| Qiming | having zun acting as a proxy to kubernetes? | 03:11 |
| hongbin | Qiming: sort-of | 03:12 |
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| hongbin | Qiming: right now, we have docker + nova as the first driver | 03:12 |
| hongbin | Qiming: I think k8s can be the second driver | 03:12 |
| hongbin | Qiming: you have a concern? | 03:13 |
| Qiming | ... they are different layer things, container engine and container orchestrator | 03:13 |
| Qiming | my concern ^ | 03:13 |
| hongbin | Qiming: In the summit, people said we considered nova as a COE :) | 03:13 |
| Qiming | if nova can be a COE, there won't be zun | 03:14 |
| hongbin | Qiming: Zun is driving nova as a COE (that is what I mean) | 03:14 |
| Qiming | IMO, nova is not suitable for orchestration, and zun is the orchestrator | 03:14 |
| hongbin | Qiming: ok, we could discuss that | 03:15 |
| Qiming | then zun is about a unified COE abstraction, right? | 03:15 |
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| hongbin | Qiming: yes, that is my understanding | 03:15 |
| Qiming | thanks, just for clarification, sorry for interrupt | 03:15 |
| hongbin | Qiming: let me know if you have any concern | 03:16 |
| hongbin | However, we could discuss this offline | 03:16 |
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| hongbin | OK, let's move on | 03:16 |
| hongbin | #topic Support interactive mode (adisky) | 03:17 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Support interactive mode (adisky) (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:17 | |
| hongbin | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/support-interactive-mode The BP | 03:17 |
| kevinz | I've done some investigation , will use dockerpty to realize this. | 03:17 |
| kevinz | https://github.com/d11wtq/dockerpty | 03:17 |
| pksingh | hongbin: i would like to work on this | 03:17 |
| kevinz | Could I re use this library? Or copy its code to Zun. | 03:17 |
| kevinz | I will write a spec before next team meeting. | 03:17 |
| pksingh | if noone is working | 03:17 |
| hongbin | it looks kevinz also wanted to work on this :) | 03:18 |
| hongbin | pksingh vs kevinz | 03:18 |
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| hongbin | pksingh: it looks the BP has been assigned to kevinz | 03:18 |
| pksingh | ok will help kevinz in reviews :) | 03:19 |
| hongbin | kevinz: sure, looking forward to the spec | 03:19 |
| kevinz | pksingh: :-) Thanks～ | 03:19 |
| kevinz | hongbin: OK | 03:19 |
| hongbin | you two can pair up to work on this if you want | 03:19 |
| shubhams | kevinz: I checked github repo of dockerpty and bit worried as last commit on this was in Feb. I am afraid if this repo is maintained well | 03:19 |
| pksingh | kevinz can we work on this? | 03:20 |
| kevinz | shubhams: Yeah I also concerned about that. So maybe we can re realize this in Zun | 03:20 |
| hongbin | ok, let's move on | 03:21 |
| hongbin | #topic Container image store (mkrai) | 03:21 |
| shubhams | kevinz: ok | 03:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Container image store (mkrai) (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:21 | |
| hongbin | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/glance-integration The BP | 03:21 |
| hongbin | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/383678/ Madhuri's patch | 03:21 |
| hongbin | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/380298/ Shubham's patch | 03:21 |
| kevinz | pksingh Thanks~ | 03:21 |
| mkrai | hongbin: the base patches were merged. | 03:21 |
| hongbin | mkrai: any other patches you plan to submit? | 03:22 |
| mkrai | I guess few more patches are required which are just needed for finishing off | 03:22 |
| shubhams | hongbin: mkrai , I will start working on python-magnumclient for image api | 03:22 |
| mkrai | Yes one | 03:22 |
| mkrai | That is to store images in glance when we pull it from docker | 03:22 |
| hongbin | shubhams: ack | 03:22 |
| mkrai | And then we can close this bp | 03:22 |
| hongbin | great | 03:23 |
| flwang | mkrai: store the un-layered image in glance? | 03:23 |
| mkrai | One question | 03:23 |
| hongbin | flwang: yes, it is a tarball | 03:23 |
| flwang | ok, got it | 03:23 |
| mkrai | flwang: Yes. Do we want to support layering in glance also? | 03:23 |
| flwang | mkrai: no, since it's basically impossible :D | 03:23 |
| mkrai | The same way nova-docker does it | 03:23 |
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| flwang | i will take a look the patch this week | 03:24 |
| flwang | putting my glance hat | 03:24 |
| hongbin | flwang: i like your hat :) | 03:24 |
| mkrai | hongbin: What do you think about it? | 03:25 |
| hongbin | mkrai: i agree with flwang that it is hard to work on layering image at this stage | 03:25 |
| mkrai | Ok so I will leave that | 03:25 |
| hongbin | mkrai: it requires a lot of work, maybe a new project | 03:25 |
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| hongbin | yes, it might be a priority in the future, but i don't think it is now | 03:26 |
| mkrai | I meant storing new tarball of changed image which the nova-docker way | 03:26 |
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| flwang | mkrai: that's alright | 03:26 |
| mkrai | I think we can leave it for now as Glare aims to do it | 03:26 |
| flwang | onething we need to do is | 03:26 |
| flwang | using tags or image custom properties to tag the image clearly | 03:27 |
| flwang | Glare is good, but don't expect much at this stage | 03:27 |
| flwang | at the lay off of Mirantis | 03:27 |
| mkrai | Ohh I didn't know about this | 03:28 |
| flwang | I don't think there are people working on that, unless current Glare cores still want to maintain that after got a new job | 03:28 |
| hongbin | marantis is laying off people, this is a hot discussion in the summit | 03:28 |
| hongbin | ok, let's move on | 03:29 |
| hongbin | #topic Container network (hongbin) | 03:29 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Container network (hongbin) (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:29 | |
| flwang | pls take it as rumor | 03:29 |
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| flwang | ;D | 03:29 |
| hongbin | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/neutron-integration The BP | 03:29 |
| hongbin | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/365754/ The proposed spec (merged) | 03:29 |
| hongbin | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/380646/ The patch | 03:29 |
| hongbin | i tried to resolved all the conflicts in the patch and addresses most of hte comments | 03:29 |
| hongbin | i think it is ready for another round of reviews now | 03:30 |
| hongbin | (remind: this is a large patch) | 03:30 |
| mkrai | Yes I will revisit the patch | 03:30 |
| hongbin | mkrai: thx | 03:30 |
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| hongbin | ok, then move to open discussion | 03:30 |
| hongbin | #topic Open Discussion | 03:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: zun)" | 03:30 | |
| hongbin | 1. Multi-tenancy isolation between containers in the same host | 03:31 |
| hongbin | This is the top wishlist in the summit according to the feedback | 03:31 |
| mkrai | hongbin: I am not sure whether it will be feasible or not. But how about adding namespaces concept? | 03:32 |
| hongbin | mkrai: right now, we can hide containers from other tenants | 03:32 |
| hongbin | mkrai: which is basically a namespace | 03:32 |
| mkrai | K8s also has similar concept of namepsace | 03:32 |
| hongbin | mkrai: yes, consider openstack tenant is similar as k8s namespace | 03:33 |
| pksingh | thats i think just for hinding resources from ane and other | 03:33 |
| mkrai | Yes | 03:33 |
| yanyanhu | maybe they are different I think. Currently, namespace only controls the visibility of resources while multi-tenancy is more about isolation? | 03:33 |
| yuanying | How host file systems is hidden by zun? | 03:33 |
| hongbin | yanyanhu: yes, i should say openstack tenant is a stronger than namespace | 03:34 |
| yanyanhu | yes | 03:34 |
| hongbin | yuanying: zun didn't expose the -v flag, so it is impossible to use docker run -v to mount host file system | 03:34 |
| yuanying | hongbin: I got it | 03:35 |
| hongbin | however, the issue is: if there are two containers from two tenants scheduled to the same host, how to do isolation | 03:35 |
| hongbin | this is the concern from people | 03:35 |
| hongbin | there are several ways to solve it | 03:36 |
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| hongbin | 1. using vm as isolators | 03:36 |
| hongbin | 2. use secure container (i.e. hyper, clear container) | 03:36 |
| hongbin | anything else? | 03:36 |
| Qiming | wait for kernel improvement | 03:36 |
| hongbin | Qiming: :) | 03:36 |
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| yanyanhu | or isolating containers by running them on different physical hosts? | 03:37 |
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| hongbin | yanyanhu: yes, that is also an option | 03:37 |
| yanyanhu | although the isolation granularity could be too coarse... | 03:37 |
| mkrai | I may lead to waste of resource yanyanhu | 03:37 |
| yanyanhu | mkrai, yes, that is a big concern | 03:37 |
| mkrai | I think #option 2 is better | 03:37 |
| hongbin | silent.... | 03:38 |
| flwang | if we go for #2, does that mean docker is not welcome at this case? | 03:39 |
| yanyanhu | for option2, it depends on whether users buy in your idea: is "secure" container really secure? | 03:39 |
| yanyanhu | :) | 03:39 |
| yanyanhu | flwang, +1 | 03:39 |
| pksingh | flwang: +1 | 03:39 |
| yanyanhu | if it is 'really' secure, it is 'container' ? | 03:39 |
| hongbin | yanyanhu: it is actually a vm :) | 03:39 |
| Qiming | yes, it is Container NG | 03:39 |
| yanyanhu | yep | 03:39 |
| flwang | let me ask in another way | 03:39 |
| mkrai | one container per vm | 03:40 |
| flwang | why we don't like VM | 03:40 |
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| flwang | just because we're working on container? | 03:40 |
| hongbin | yanyanhu: however, it use the vm to run container image, so it is sort of a *container* | 03:40 |
| Qiming | VM kills almost every benefit you get from a container, :D | 03:40 |
| flwang | without VM, we have not much relationship with OpenStack, IMHO | 03:40 |
| Qiming | flwang, true, that is why they don't care about us | 03:40 |
| flwang | Qiming: hah | 03:40 |
| hongbin | flwang: the key of secure container is that it has optimized for the boot time | 03:41 |
| hongbin | flwang: so compared to vm, secure container boot faster | 03:41 |
| hongbin | flwang: that is the whole point | 03:41 |
| flwang | hongbin: but | 03:41 |
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| mkrai | For clear container I know the container boots up really fast. I have used it | 03:41 |
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| flwang | for that case, we will basically give up docker, right? | 03:41 |
| mkrai | flwang: We can use the same docker cli to run clear containers | 03:42 |
| flwang | or we support docker, but if you want more secure, go for clear container ? | 03:42 |
| hongbin | flwang: yes, i think so. or i should say, for that case, secure container is an alternative to docker | 03:42 |
| mkrai | Yes flwang | 03:42 |
| flwang | ok, fair enough | 03:42 |
| mkrai | #link https://lwn.net/Articles/644675/ | 03:43 |
| mkrai | May be this article will help to understand | 03:43 |
| hongbin | flwang: you don't like secure container? or you have any concern? | 03:43 |
| yanyanhu | mkrai, nice, will read it | 03:43 |
| hongbin | i think we can try secure container, as an experiential driver (i am not sure if it will work) | 03:45 |
| mkrai | +1 hongbin | 03:45 |
| hongbin | any concern for this? | 03:45 |
| pksingh | +1 hongbin | 03:45 |
| flwang | hongbin: i'm happy with secure container | 03:45 |
| shubhams | +1 for secure container trial | 03:46 |
| hongbin | flwang: i just want to know if you see any pitfall for this approach | 03:46 |
| flwang | i just don't want to miss any case which may let some potential user go away | 03:46 |
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| hongbin | ok, if there is no objection, i will create a bp for this | 03:46 |
| hongbin | #action hongbin create a bp for adding support for secure container | 03:47 |
| adisky | +1 hongbin | 03:47 |
| hongbin | Anything else to discuss from our team members? | 03:47 |
| mkrai | k8s integration? | 03:48 |
| hongbin | mkrai: sure , we can discuss that | 03:48 |
| mkrai | Do we want to integrate with Magnum for this? | 03:48 |
| pksingh | hongbin: can we have anything like imagepullpolicy like k8 has? | 03:48 |
| hongbin | mkrai: that doesn't mean integrate with magnum | 03:49 |
| mkrai | Implement the k8s APIs in Zun? | 03:49 |
| hongbin | pksingh: i am not familiar with image pulling policy, but we can investigate it later | 03:49 |
| hongbin | mkrai: simply speaking, implement zun api by using k8s | 03:49 |
| pksingh | hongbin: ok | 03:50 |
| hongbin | here is the long version | 03:50 |
| hongbin | this is a features that has been mentioned by different people in the summit | 03:50 |
| mkrai | Ok got it | 03:50 |
| hongbin | the people don't like to use magnum to boot k8s, because they already has a k8s that is statically there | 03:50 |
| hongbin | however, they want zun to interact with an existing k8s (whether it is provisioned by magnum or not) | 03:51 |
| mkrai | Magnum integration can be later part | 03:51 |
| mkrai | But it is not needed now | 03:51 |
| hongbin | yes, it should be optional as well | 03:52 |
| mkrai | We can use our python-k8sclient :) | 03:52 |
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| pksingh | mkrai: why zun will integrate with magnum? | 03:52 |
| hongbin | yes, we definitely can | 03:52 |
| mkrai | pksingh: To provision host running k8s | 03:52 |
| mkrai | pksingh: But that is optional | 03:53 |
| pksingh | mkrai: do we need that vai zun? | 03:53 |
| mkrai | pksingh: Either the operators can have their own existing k8s cluster | 03:53 |
| mkrai | pksingh: May be in future but not sure now | 03:54 |
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| hongbin | ok, any other comment about the k8s integration? | 03:55 |
| hongbin | maybe i should create a bp for that as well? | 03:55 |
| mkrai | yes | 03:55 |
| pksingh | hongbin: i think bp already exists? | 03:56 |
| hongbin | pksingh: really? let's me check | 03:56 |
| mkrai | hongbin: I will test python-k8sclient this week | 03:56 |
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| mkrai | Not sure whether it is still working or not | 03:56 |
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| hongbin | pksingh: no, i couldn't find any bp about k8s integration | 03:57 |
| pksingh | hongbin: its different, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/k8s-compatible-api | 03:57 |
| hongbin | pksingh: yes, this one is just a brainstormed idea | 03:57 |
| hongbin | #action hongbin create a bp for k8s integration | 03:57 |
| pksingh | hongbin: there is https://blueprints.launchpad.net/zun/+spec/coe-integration | 03:58 |
| hongbin | coe is a bit too general, but yes, we could link to this bp as well | 03:59 |
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| hongbin | ok, it looks time is up | 03:59 |
| mkrai | Thanks all! | 03:59 |
| hongbin | all, thanks for joining the meeting | 03:59 |
| hongbin | #endmeeting | 04:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 04:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 8 04:00:03 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 04:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2016/zun.2016-11-08-02.59.html | 04:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2016/zun.2016-11-08-02.59.txt | 04:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/zun/2016/zun.2016-11-08-02.59.log.html | 04:00 |
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| eranrom | #startmeeting storlets | 07:59 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 8 07:59:54 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is eranrom. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 07:59 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 07:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: storlets)" | 07:59 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'storlets' | 07:59 |
| eranrom | Hi | 08:00 |
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| takashi | o/ | 08:00 |
| eranrom | takashi: Hi! | 08:00 |
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| eranrom | agenda is here: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Storlets | 08:01 |
| eranrom | any other topics? | 08:01 |
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| takashi | eranrom: thanks for updating. no other things from my side | 08:01 |
| eranrom | ok. Does the order seem right? | 08:02 |
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| eranrom | I mean as a merge order | 08:03 |
| takashi | eranrom: you are talking about the order of big tent works? | 08:03 |
| eranrom | yes | 08:03 |
| takashi | eranrom: basically seems corrent for me. Maybe we don't have paricular order about 2 and 3, packaging work and keystone v3 work | 08:04 |
| eranrom | right. I guess it does not matter. | 08:04 |
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| takashi | eranrom: +1 | 08:04 |
| takashi | akihito: around? | 08:05 |
| eranrom | I take it that 370332 is ready for a review. Is it also ready to be merged? | 08:05 |
| takashi | eranrom: no. I still need to rebase that on your devstack change, to get rid of permission problem | 08:05 |
| eranrom | takashi: ok, thanks! | 08:06 |
| takashi | eranrom: I submitted independent patch 393767 to just test that packaging work works on your devstack patch | 08:06 |
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| akihito | hi | 08:06 |
| eranrom | akihito: Hi! | 08:06 |
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| takashi | eranrom: but I currently find timeout issues caused by very slow speed to storlets directory using copy module in ansible | 08:07 |
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| * kota_ is in slow response mode, probably it's read only because of another meeting in paralel | 08:07 | |
| takashi | eranrom: and need to address that. Maybe I need to tar and untar the directory for copying | 08:07 |
| takashi | kota_: np :-) | 08:08 |
| eranrom | kota_: Hi! | 08:08 |
| eranrom | takashi: Just curious, in which partof the installation this happens? | 08:08 |
| takashi | eranrom: When installing storlets code, ansible copies storlets directory to remote host before executing setup.py | 08:09 |
| eranrom | takashi: Does it happen at the gate or locally? | 08:10 |
| takashi | eranrom: yes | 08:10 |
| takashi | even if the target host is localhost, I find performance issue about copy modules | 08:10 |
| eranrom | takashi: interesting. | 08:11 |
| eranrom | This actually brings me to the next topic: Will we need the ansible scripts once porting to devstack? | 08:11 |
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| takashi | eranrom: I think it is better to make them independent from our repo, but we shouldn't do that in this cycle, considering required time. | 08:13 |
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| eranrom | takashi: agree! Once we are in (the tent) we can add repos. We could add an ansible repo for storlets deployment | 08:14 |
| takashi | eranrom: yes | 08:14 |
| eranrom | ok. Anything else for today? | 08:14 |
| takashi | After solving copy speed problem, and confirming that my package patch can work on your devstack patch, I'll abandon my temporal patch 393767, and rebase my previous patch 370332, to make it in the final shape | 08:15 |
| eranrom | takashi: ok, In the mean time I will have a deeper look at 370332 | 08:16 |
| takashi | eranrom: Fortunately I didn't need so much change when rebasing, so you can see patch 370332 as a starting point | 08:17 |
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| eranrom | takashi: ok. good! | 08:17 |
| takashi | that's all from my side today, about packaging work. I started to read your devstack patch, but still need some time to finish reviewing it. | 08:18 |
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| eranrom | takashi: ok, thanks | 08:18 |
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| eranrom | So unless there is nothing else we get back 40 minutes :-) | 08:19 |
| eranrom | akihito: anything from your side? | 08:19 |
| akihito | I modify python-support. but I don't finish... | 08:20 |
| eranrom | akihito: ok. I started looking at the fds patch, but only half way through. | 08:20 |
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| akihito | please review after finish work. | 08:20 |
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| eranrom | akihito: ok | 08:21 |
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| takashi | eranrom: maybe we need some feedback from you about some points. ex. there are some command types we do not understand totally. | 08:21 |
| takashi | (about the fd validation passed to datagram, about which curretly akihito is working | 08:22 |
| eranrom | takashi: sure. Do you want to bring it up now? | 08:22 |
| takashi | eranrom: not now. maybe after akihito finishes his current work | 08:23 |
| eranrom | takashi: ok. sure | 08:23 |
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| eranrom | allright, so thanks for joining! | 08:24 |
| takashi | eranrom: I'll also have a look about yor testr patch and keystone v3 patch | 08:24 |
| eranrom | takashi: thanks! saw your testr comments, and will be working on the, | 08:24 |
| eranrom | them | 08:24 |
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| takashi | eranrom: thanks | 08:25 |
| takashi | eranrom: maybe with these patches we address all homework for big tent joining, execpt for copy right header, right? | 08:25 |
| takashi | these patches = devstack, packaging, testr and keystonev3 | 08:25 |
| eranrom | takashi: I believe so, I will confirm that with the etherpad page. Also, I will take care of the headers as step 6 | 08:26 |
| takashi | erarnom: thanks! | 08:26 |
| eranrom | and if this is all. I will turn to flaper87 to have a look | 08:27 |
| eranrom | and then get back to the tc | 08:27 |
| takashi | eranrom: makes sense | 08:27 |
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| eranrom | ok. so thanks again for joining! | 08:28 |
| takashi | eranrom: thank you. have a nice day! | 08:28 |
| akihito | thank you! | 08:28 |
| eranrom | #endmeeting | 08:28 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 08:28 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 8 08:28:53 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 08:28 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storlets/2016/storlets.2016-11-08-07.59.html | 08:28 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storlets/2016/storlets.2016-11-08-07.59.txt | 08:28 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storlets/2016/storlets.2016-11-08-07.59.log.html | 08:28 |
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| saggi | #startmeeting | 09:02 |
| openstack | saggi: Error: A meeting name is required, e.g., '#startmeeting Marketing Committee' | 09:02 |
| saggi | #startmeeting karbor | 09:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 8 09:02:41 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is saggi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 09:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 09:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: karbor)" | 09:02 | |
| saggi | Hi everyone | 09:02 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'karbor' | 09:02 |
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| leon_wang | hi | 09:02 |
| xiangxinyong | hello | 09:02 |
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| zengchen | hello guys. | 09:03 |
| saggi | Sorry for being a bit late, was busy looking at patches | 09:03 |
| yuval | hey | 09:03 |
| saggi | Speaking on patches.... | 09:04 |
| saggi | #topic The way to stability | 09:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "The way to stability (Meeting topic: karbor)" | 09:04 | |
| saggi | I spent the last couple of days triaging all the bugs on launchpad | 09:04 |
| saggi | That means setting priorities and deciding what should get in Ocata. | 09:05 |
| saggi | Patch sets that relate to bugs should get a much higher priority in review than other patches. | 09:05 |
| saggi | Also, fixing bugs is of higher priority than cleanups. | 09:06 |
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| saggi | Further more, please open bugs on things that you know are broken. I will triage bugs every morning so we know what we need to do. | 09:06 |
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| xiangxinyong | ok | 09:08 |
| saggi | Currently what is being stable means is only in our heads. It's better that we have a list of things we need to fix. | 09:08 |
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| xiangxinyong | do we need to mark them in the lauchpad? | 09:09 |
| saggi | Please make sure to make the bug reports detailed and easy to understand even out of context since someone else might fix the problem you found | 09:10 |
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| saggi | xiangxinyong: It should be automatic | 09:10 |
| leon_wang | ok | 09:10 |
| saggi | If you set the proper headers in gerrit | 09:10 |
| saggi | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/GitCommitMessages | 09:10 |
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| yuval | btw, chenying and zhonghua-lee here too? | 09:11 |
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| xiangxinyong | they are not available | 09:12 |
| saggi | Just to sum up. If you see a problem and you can't send a patch immediately, open a bug. Otherwise things fall through the cracks. | 09:12 |
| saggi | I will send an email to the mailing list and CC chenying and zhonghua-lee about it | 09:13 |
| xiangxinyong | saggi:great | 09:13 |
| xiangxinyong | do you mean every patch needs a bug or bp? | 09:14 |
| yuval | we have some bugs with inactive assignee, I think | 09:14 |
| saggi | xiangxinyong: It will get higher priority review from me and yuval. Also if a bug exists for the problem you are fixing you will need to set the bug in the commit message. | 09:15 |
| xiangxinyong | saggi: agree | 09:15 |
| xiangxinyong | the Standard commit message is important | 09:16 |
| leon_wang | xiangxinyong:couldn't agree more. | 09:17 |
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| xiangxinyong | :) | 09:17 |
| leon_wang | often be confused with the patch which doesn't contain any commit message :( | 09:18 |
| saggi | Needless to say, working on fixing bugs is top priority. | 09:18 |
| zengchen | totally agree. | 09:19 |
| saggi | #topic Adding Karbor into Kolla and implementing container deployment (xiangxinyong) | 09:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Adding Karbor into Kolla and implementing container deployment (xiangxinyong) (Meeting topic: karbor)" | 09:19 | |
| xiangxinyong | we discuss the feature with kolla team members. zhanglei and caiwei | 09:20 |
| saggi | xiangxinyong: This relates to ease of installation so we might fit in the the O cycle. But I wonder what we need to change code wise for this to work. | 09:21 |
| zhangshuai | zhanglei and caowei | 09:21 |
| xiangxinyong | zhangshuai: are you around? | 09:21 |
| xiangxinyong | zhangshuai is working on it | 09:22 |
| zhangshuai | saggi:no | 09:22 |
| xiangxinyong | I guess we only need to give the installation documents to kolla team | 09:22 |
| saggi | xiangxinyong: can they convert the devstack scripts? | 09:23 |
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| zhangshuai | they make it as a docker image | 09:23 |
| zhangshuai | xiangxinyong:you are right. | 09:23 |
| yuval | I believe working on OpenStack Ansible deployment first could help | 09:23 |
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| xiangxinyong | yeah. caowei from 99cloud is an expert | 09:24 |
| saggi | zaneb: What is the the delta between kolla and openstack-ansible | 09:24 |
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| xiangxinyong | but unfortunately caowei is not here today. | 09:25 |
| xiangxinyong | It is easy for him to submit a patch in kolla to do this work | 09:26 |
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| xiangxinyong | it is very well for karbor and kolla | 09:27 |
| saggi | What will the patch do is it a Dockerfile? | 09:27 |
| xiangxinyong | saggi: not sure. but zhangshuai and caowei are working on it. | 09:28 |
| zhangshuai | like https://review.openstack.org/#/c/374908 | 09:28 |
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| xiangxinyong | zhangshuai: thanks | 09:29 |
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| zhangshuai | :) | 09:29 |
| leon_wang | zhuangshuai:great | 09:30 |
| saggi | zhangshuai, xiangxinyong: Great, Please put me as a reviewer for any patches for Karbor in Kolla. | 09:30 |
| yuval | me too please | 09:30 |
| xiangxinyong | :) no problem. | 09:30 |
| zhangshuai | saggi,yuval: ok, thank you. | 09:31 |
| saggi | #topic Karbor integrated with Freezer Plan (xiangxinyong) | 09:31 |
| xiangxinyong | we could keep touch with kolla's guys | 09:31 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Karbor integrated with Freezer Plan (xiangxinyong) (Meeting topic: karbor)" | 09:31 | |
| saggi | xiangxinyong: sure | 09:31 |
| xiangxinyong | yangyapeng: are you around? | 09:31 |
| yangyapeng | xiangxinyong: yeah | 09:32 |
| xiangxinyong | welcome to join this meeting | 09:32 |
| xiangxinyong | yangyapeng from 99cloud is the freezer's core member | 09:32 |
| yangyapeng | ：） | 09:32 |
| xiangxinyong | he is very kind | 09:32 |
| leon_wang | hi yapeng | 09:33 |
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| saggi | hi yangyapeng | 09:33 |
| yuval | hey yangyapeng | 09:33 |
| yangyapeng | hello guys :) | 09:33 |
| saggi | I have my ideas on how to integrate but I'd much rather hear what yangyapeng has to suggest. | 09:33 |
| xiangxinyong | saggi: do we have some plans to integrate with freezer.? | 09:33 |
| saggi | Yes | 09:34 |
| saggi | It depends on freezer plugins | 09:34 |
| yangyapeng | whether it have a details in etherpad | 09:35 |
| * saggi is looking for the freezer etherpad | 09:35 | |
| xiangxinyong | saggi: may we develop a freezer plugin to connect freezer? | 09:35 |
| saggi | yangyapeng: can't find the etherpads from BCN : https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Design_Summit/Ocata/Etherpads | 09:35 |
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| yuval | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/freezer_other_roadmap_ocata | 09:36 |
| yuval | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/freezer_new_archi | 09:36 |
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| saggi | The last one | 09:36 |
| saggi | So if we look at what we need from freezer. It's guest cooperation. | 09:37 |
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| saggi | File level backups don't really make much since for the Karbor story. So what we want to do is invoke freezer and have it tell the applications to prepare for backup. | 09:38 |
| saggi | Than we create the backup the usual Karbor way. | 09:39 |
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| saggi | The main question is if we can pass configuration about plugins in the API call itself. | 09:40 |
| saggi | Instead of creating plans in freezer | 09:40 |
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| saggi | yangyapeng ^^ | 09:41 |
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| xiangxinyong | saggi: I guess creating plans in freezer is not good | 09:41 |
| chenying2016 | hi | 09:41 |
| chenying2016 | I am | 09:41 |
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| xiangxinyong | :) | 09:41 |
| saggi | xiangxinyong: We would like to user freezer as a stateless entity | 09:41 |
| chenying2016 | I am late | 09:41 |
| saggi | chenying2016: :) | 09:42 |
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| xiangxinyong | saggi: agree with you | 09:42 |
| xiangxinyong | saggi: it seems like we need to do more commuications with freezer team | 09:42 |
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| saggi | xiangxinyong: You are right. I will add an item to their weekly meeting this week to talk about statelessness. | 09:43 |
| xiangxinyong | ^^ | 09:43 |
| xiangxinyong | yeah. yangyapeng and Pierre-Arthur Mathieu could help us. | 09:44 |
| zengchen | saggi: we can simply use freezer to do what it does. just invoke its api. but the question is the configuration of freezer agent is a little complex. | 09:44 |
| xiangxinyong | saggi: thank you. | 09:44 |
| saggi | zengchen: What configuration | 09:44 |
| chenying2016 | install | 09:44 |
| chenying2016 | freezer | 09:44 |
| saggi | Yes, maybe we can also get them to have an agentless option. | 09:45 |
| saggi | We'll see | 09:45 |
| zengchen | saggi:you can see there are a little more configurations for the freezer agent. the user should know how to use them. | 09:46 |
| saggi | chenying2016: In any case, freezer is not a mandatory requirement for karbor. We will only use it for application level consistency. | 09:46 |
| zengchen | saggi:i had writed a plugin of freezer. | 09:47 |
| xiangxinyong | zengchen: great | 09:47 |
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| yuval | this plugin architecture is not yet merged, right? | 09:48 |
| zengchen | saggi:hope to see your detailf of solution. | 09:48 |
| saggi | #action talk to Freezer team about using freezer as a stateless entity preferably without setting up schedulers. | 09:48 |
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| xiangxinyong | saggi: thanks | 09:48 |
| zengchen | yuval:you asked me? | 09:49 |
| yuval | as a general question | 09:49 |
| saggi | yuval: IIRC it's in their roadmap for this cycle | 09:50 |
| saggi | But I'm not sure. | 09:50 |
| yuval | saggi: thumbs up emoji | 09:50 |
| saggi | #topic open discussion | 09:50 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: karbor)" | 09:50 | |
| saggi | Anything else? | 09:50 |
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| zengchen | i have came across a question | 09:51 |
| chenying | I hope the patches about the operationengine could be merged,\. | 09:52 |
| saggi | zengchen: ... | 09:53 |
| saggi | chenying. I'll try and do it today | 09:53 |
| zengchen | about this patch (https://review.openstack.org/#/c/384062/). the unit test can pass if i use 'ostestr' to run, if it failed when i use 'tox - e py27' | 09:53 |
| chenying | The operationengine servcie could not work because of this patches. | 09:53 |
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| saggi | zengchen: You are asking why it fails? | 09:54 |
| chenying | zengchen have a problom about tox -e to run unit test. | 09:54 |
| zengchen | the reason is the 'mock' can not work when the run unit test with 'tox' | 09:54 |
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| saggi | zengchen: It fails all version of python | 09:54 |
| zengchen | saggi:i just want to ask who know the difference between the 'ostestr' and 'tox'. I think if the 'ostestr' can work, the 'tox' can work too. | 09:55 |
| saggi | It might be something in the configuration. I will have to look at it more closely to see what the problem is. | 09:56 |
| zengchen | saggi:yes, both py27 and py34 failed. | 09:56 |
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| zengchen | saggi:thanks. I have spent a lot of time on it. but i failed to fix it. | 09:57 |
| saggi | zengchen: I'll try and squeeze it in my schedule. | 09:57 |
| saggi | Anything else? | 09:57 |
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| zengchen | saggi:thanks very much. | 09:58 |
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| saggi | I would like to just to thank xiangxinyong for his great suggestions for topics for this meeting. And in general trying to get Kolla and Freezer's cooperation. | 09:58 |
| yuval | xiangxinyong: great job! | 09:59 |
| saggi | Good day everyone | 09:59 |
| zengchen | bye bye. | 09:59 |
| saggi | #endmeeting | 09:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 09:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 8 09:59:22 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 09:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2016/karbor.2016-11-08-09.02.html | 09:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2016/karbor.2016-11-08-09.02.txt | 09:59 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/karbor/2016/karbor.2016-11-08-09.02.log.html | 09:59 |
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| leon_wang | bye | 09:59 |
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| xiangxinyong | saggi,yuval: you are welcome | 10:00 |
| xiangxinyong | good bye | 10:00 |
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| yanyanhu | #startmeeting senlin | 13:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 8 13:00:03 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is yanyanhu. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 13:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 13:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: senlin)" | 13:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'senlin' | 13:00 |
| yanyanhu | hello | 13:00 |
| Ruijie | evening :) | 13:00 |
| yanyanhu | hi, Ruijie, evening :) | 13:00 |
| lvdongbing | hi, yanyan, ruijie | 13:01 |
| *** trown|outtypewww is now known as trown | 13:01 | |
| Qiming | hi | 13:01 |
| yanyanhu | hhi, lvdongbing, Qiming | 13:01 |
| yanyanhu | lets wait for a while for other attenders | 13:01 |
| yanyanhu | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/SenlinAgenda#Agenda_.282016-11-01_1300_UTC.29 | 13:01 |
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| yanyanhu | here is the agenda, please feel free to add items you want to discuss | 13:02 |
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| yanyanhu | hi, lixinhui_ | 13:02 |
| elynn | hi | 13:02 |
| lixinhui_ | hi, yanyanhu | 13:02 |
| yanyanhu | hi, elynn | 13:02 |
| lixinhui_ | hi elynn | 13:02 |
| yanyanhu | ok, lets move on | 13:02 |
| Hosam | hi everybody | 13:02 |
| yanyanhu | #topic ocata work items | 13:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "ocata work items (Meeting topic: senlin)" | 13:02 | |
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| yanyanhu | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/senlin-ocata-workitems | 13:03 |
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| yanyanhu | ocata workitems | 13:03 |
| yanyanhu | hi, XueFeng | 13:03 |
| XueFeng | hi,all | 13:03 |
| lixinhui_ | hi | 13:03 |
| yanyanhu | ok, lets first go through the item list | 13:03 |
| yanyanhu | performance test, still no progress, didn't get time to work on it recently | 13:03 |
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| yanyanhu | HA | 13:04 |
| yanyanhu | hi, Qiming, lixinhui_, any update about it? | 13:04 |
| lixinhui_ | I tried mistral | 13:04 |
| lixinhui_ | with basic flow | 13:04 |
| yanyanhu | nice | 13:04 |
| lixinhui_ | and still can not quiet underdtand its definition about flow switch | 13:05 |
| lixinhui_ | will investigate more there | 13:05 |
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| yanyanhu | ok | 13:05 |
| yanyanhu | thanks for the effort on this | 13:05 |
| lixinhui_ | and I am not sure if we will put the actions into senlin or mistral itself | 13:05 |
| lixinhui_ | by "actions", I mean mistral flow actions | 13:05 |
| yanyanhu | you mean? | 13:06 |
| Qiming | it is a question of engine-centric HA solution or workflow-centric HA solution, I guess | 13:06 |
| yanyanhu | using senlin to drive the workflow or using mistral to drive it? | 13:06 |
| lixinhui_ | if put inside senlin, that means senlin will maitain the flow for recovers or some cluster management purpose | 13:06 |
| lixinhui_ | if put them inside mistral | 13:06 |
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| lixinhui_ | then users need to maintain there | 13:07 |
| yanyanhu | ok, so any pro or con for these two choices? | 13:07 |
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| yanyanhu | like a template? | 13:07 |
| lixinhui_ | if we wanna leverage mistral flow as recover of senlin | 13:07 |
| lixinhui_ | seems we should maintain them | 13:08 |
| lixinhui_ | yes | 13:08 |
| yanyanhu | I see | 13:08 |
| lixinhui_ | I assume the flow template should be put together with the actions together | 13:08 |
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| lixinhui_ | and openstacksdk does not support mistral today | 13:08 |
| Qiming | it is like the design choice we were facing when modeling ceilometer alarms | 13:08 |
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| yanyanhu | Qiming, have the same feeling | 13:09 |
| lixinhui_ | so we should leave them inside mistral | 13:09 |
| yanyanhu | if so, maybe maintaining the workflow in mistral is better choice, for it is the service for 'workflow' management :) | 13:09 |
| Qiming | it seems reasonable to manage those workflows in senlin, however it doesn't make a lot senses | 13:10 |
| lixinhui_ | ok | 13:10 |
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| Qiming | if possible, maybe we can have a /contrib directory and get the worflow abstracted there | 13:10 |
| yanyanhu | good idea | 13:11 |
| yanyanhu | as examples for users | 13:11 |
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| elynn | contrib +1 | 13:11 |
| lixinhui_ | :) | 13:11 |
| Qiming | then we discuss whether we want to keep just a reference to the mistral work flow or we keep the whole workflow definition | 13:11 |
| lixinhui_ | what is the reference idea? | 13:11 |
| Qiming | making decision without checking the code would be difference | 13:12 |
| lixinhui_ | I think they are python files and yaml... | 13:12 |
| yanyanhu | make senses. With that, we can better tell whether holding those workflows inside senlin makes sense | 13:12 |
| Qiming | user create a workflow in mistral, we reference it and trigger it when evaluating the health policy | 13:12 |
| lixinhui_ | for example | 13:12 |
| Qiming | if needed, we can provide inputs and grab outputs from those workflows | 13:13 |
| lixinhui_ | how for users to know how many flows they can choose | 13:13 |
| lixinhui_ | yes | 13:13 |
| lixinhui_ | Qiming | 13:13 |
| lixinhui_ | that is what we may need do | 13:13 |
| lixinhui_ | I mean | 13:13 |
| lixinhui_ | to grab recover related flows and list them in senlin | 13:14 |
| Qiming | if we provide those choices to users thru senlin, senlin becomes a proxy of mistral, it buys user nothing other than overhead | 13:14 |
| lixinhui_ | not really | 13:14 |
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| Qiming | the workflow is supposed to be created by the same user | 13:14 |
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| lixinhui_ | please think from the perspective that senlin acts as cluster manager | 13:14 |
| lixinhui_ | user will wanna to know what kinds of choice we provide for the cluster recover | 13:14 |
| Qiming | just a quick thought, there are many other alternatives | 13:15 |
| lixinhui_ | and do not wanna to jump out and use other tools | 13:15 |
| Qiming | if a workflow-centric solution makes more sense, I'm fine with it | 13:15 |
| Qiming | it means we don't need to provide any additional support to this | 13:15 |
| Qiming | by we, I mean senlin engine | 13:15 |
| Qiming | using openstack is about using a collection of tools | 13:16 |
| Qiming | all those tools are exposed thru horizon (the single web UI) or the openstackclient (the sole command line interface) | 13:16 |
| Qiming | you cannot say you are jumping from one tool to another | 13:17 |
| lixinhui_ | if we wanna sell it, the story may be need more useful experience | 13:17 |
| lixinhui_ | anyway | 13:17 |
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| yanyanhu | lixinhui_, +1 | 13:17 |
| yanyanhu | I think we need more investigation result to help us to make the decision | 13:17 |
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| lixinhui_ | yes | 13:17 |
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| lixinhui_ | yanyanhu | 13:17 |
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| Qiming | users don't care it is mistral or senlin or whatever | 13:17 |
| lixinhui_ | that is the reason why they wanna good entry point | 13:18 |
| lixinhui_ | :) | 13:18 |
| Qiming | the community is not there yet, but I think that is the right direction | 13:18 |
| lixinhui_ | I will investigate more then return here for more discussion | 13:18 |
| yanyanhu | great | 13:18 |
| lixinhui_ | agree, Qiming | 13:18 |
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| yanyanhu | will wait for it, then lets have further discussion on it | 13:19 |
| lixinhui_ | :) | 13:19 |
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| yanyanhu | ok, lets move on? | 13:19 |
| lixinhui_ | yes, please | 13:19 |
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| yanyanhu | Document, no new work here? | 13:20 |
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| yanyanhu | versioned request | 13:20 |
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| yanyanhu | it is in good progress I think | 13:20 |
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| yanyanhu | cluster support has been done by Qiming I think | 13:20 |
| yanyanhu | and node support has been done as well | 13:20 |
| yanyanhu | I'm now working on receiver, Ruijie is working on policy and lvdongbing is working on profile? | 13:21 |
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| Qiming | claim: I'm moving away from that work now | 13:21 |
| yanyanhu | just noticed lvdongbing proposed the patch for versioned request support for profile :) | 13:21 |
| Qiming | guys pls feel free to pick up any other resources/apis to work | 13:21 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, thanks a lot for that concrete basement u built for this job :) | 13:21 |
| yanyanhu | sure | 13:21 |
| XueFeng | OK | 13:21 |
| yanyanhu | hope we can finish it soon since that's the prerequisite of other refactoring/new features | 13:22 |
| Qiming | looking forward, I'm hoping we can rework the common.schema module, use versioned object to define profiles and policies | 13:22 |
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| Qiming | then we get free versioning support | 13:23 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, yes, that should be managed using versioned obj as well | 13:23 |
| Qiming | and we unify all those schemas under json schema | 13:23 |
| yanyanhu | yep | 13:23 |
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| yanyanhu | BTW, guys, plz add an item into etherpad with your name followed before starting work on support for some resources | 13:24 |
| yanyanhu | it will be helpful to avoid conflict and duplicated effort | 13:24 |
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| yanyanhu | ok, next one | 13:25 |
| yanyanhu | container profile | 13:25 |
| yanyanhu | hi, haiwei_ | 13:25 |
| yanyanhu | any new progress? | 13:25 |
| Qiming | seems patch 368539 will never make its way in | 13:25 |
| yanyanhu | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/368539/ | 13:26 |
| yanyanhu | this one | 13:26 |
| Qiming | at the same time, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/394896/ is coming in to remove the dependency | 13:26 |
| Qiming | we discussed about this on at Barcelona | 13:26 |
| haiwei_ | yanyanhu, just made a patch to remove container node infor from cluster dependents as we discussed in the summit | 13:26 |
| yanyanhu | haiwei_, ok | 13:26 |
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| Qiming | the correct dependency is: cluster <-------- profile <--------- container cluster/node | 13:27 |
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| Qiming | the second dependency is already enforced, but the first one is not yet | 13:27 |
| haiwei_ | yes, I am doing it that way | 13:28 |
| Qiming | we can still delete a cluster even if it is referenced by a (container) profile | 13:28 |
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| haiwei_ | patch 368539 will be modified or abandon | 13:28 |
| Qiming | okay | 13:28 |
| Qiming | we can reuse the same db schema | 13:28 |
| yanyanhu | great | 13:29 |
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| XueFeng | Will read and study this | 13:30 |
| Qiming | just that cluster1.dependents['profile'] == a_container_profile now | 13:30 |
| yanyanhu | I see | 13:30 |
| Qiming | that dependency is created when the container profile is created | 13:30 |
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| Qiming | cluster1.dependents can still contain other dependencies later ... | 13:31 |
| haiwei_ | you mean we should input container profile type into 'dependents' of cluster? qiming | 13:31 |
| Qiming | profile id | 13:31 |
| haiwei_ | ok | 13:31 |
| Qiming | when no profile object is created, the dependency doesn't exists | 13:31 |
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| yanyanhu | cool, will help to review the patch as well | 13:32 |
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| haiwei_ | I will do this soon | 13:32 |
| yanyanhu | haiwei_, thanks :) | 13:32 |
| yanyanhu | ok, next one? | 13:32 |
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| yanyanhu | zaqar message receiver | 13:33 |
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| yanyanhu | after sdk 0.9.9 was released, everything is ready now | 13:33 |
| yanyanhu | and the integration test for message receiver works as well | 13:33 |
| yanyanhu | (although it is broken now for zaqar-ui installation problem at gate side...) | 13:33 |
| yanyanhu | but that is not our fault | 13:34 |
| Qiming | cool | 13:34 |
| yanyanhu | will propose patch to project-config to fix it | 13:34 |
| Qiming | so the zaqar receiver item can be completely removed from etherpad? | 13:34 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, yes, I think so | 13:34 |
| yanyanhu | will remove it | 13:34 |
| yanyanhu | maybe some more works will be done in future, but the basic workflow is ok now | 13:35 |
| Qiming | already removed, \o/, I like the feeling of deleting things | 13:35 |
| yanyanhu | thanks :) | 13:35 |
| yanyanhu | hah | 13:35 |
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| yanyanhu | ok, next one | 13:35 |
| yanyanhu | event/notification | 13:35 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, your turn? | 13:35 |
| Qiming | okay, just added link to blueprint | 13:36 |
| Qiming | which needs review and approval | 13:36 |
| yanyanhu | great | 13:36 |
| Qiming | and drafted a spec today, eyes needed for review | 13:36 |
| yanyanhu | sure | 13:36 |
| yanyanhu | guys, please help to take a look at it and leave your comments :) | 13:37 |
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| lvdongbing | ok :) | 13:37 |
| Qiming | would rather not waste time in meeting to go through the idea | 13:37 |
| Qiming | it all in the wine | 13:37 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, sure, will discuss it offline | 13:37 |
| yanyanhu | :) | 13:37 |
| elynn | great | 13:37 |
| yanyanhu | ok, next one. batch policy | 13:37 |
| yanyanhu | I think it has been done by Ruijie ? | 13:37 |
| Ruijie | no really yanyanhu | 13:38 |
| yanyanhu | ok | 13:38 |
| Ruijie | it just support cluster delete and update | 13:38 |
| Ruijie | want to add support to more actions | 13:38 |
| yanyanhu | Ruijie, nice | 13:38 |
| yanyanhu | so lets leave it there | 13:38 |
| Ruijie | okay, will resume it after versioned resource support | 13:39 |
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| yanyanhu | Ruijie, great, and thanks for the hands on versioned req :) | 13:39 |
| yanyanhu | and also lvdongbing as well | 13:39 |
| yanyanhu | ok, nextone | 13:39 |
| yanyanhu | NFV support/baremetal cluster | 13:39 |
| yanyanhu | I guess this job has not been started yet? | 13:40 |
| yanyanhu | we just got some requirement for it in summit | 13:40 |
| Qiming | tacker side, haiwe has proposed a spec for review | 13:40 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, so some guys from huawei have plan to work on it? | 13:40 |
| Qiming | yes, haven't seen any activity yet | 13:41 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, yes, saw those update on spec at tacker side | 13:41 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, I see | 13:41 |
| Qiming | it is meghaa..f.a.swar ? | 13:41 |
| yanyanhu | :P | 13:41 |
| Qiming | cannot spell that project name | 13:41 |
| Qiming | sorry | 13:41 |
| yanyanhu | difficult to spell | 13:41 |
| elynn | ... | 13:41 |
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| yanyanhu | ok, lets focus on the spec proposal to tacker now | 13:42 |
| Qiming | meghdwar | 13:42 |
| haiwei_ | what is that? | 13:42 |
| Qiming | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meghdwar | 13:43 |
| elynn | I'm also curious what is that ... | 13:43 |
| Qiming | edge cloud gateway | 13:43 |
| yanyanhu | will read that wiki as well... | 13:44 |
| elynn | Still has no idea... | 13:44 |
| yanyanhu | :) | 13:44 |
| yanyanhu | because we are lack of knowledge about NFV I think | 13:44 |
| yanyanhu | anyway, hope there will be more progress on it in future | 13:45 |
| yanyanhu | ok, those are all work items in the etherpad | 13:45 |
| Qiming | that wiki contains a lot info | 13:45 |
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| yanyanhu | yep | 13:45 |
| Qiming | including a paste of irc log ... | 13:46 |
| XueFeng | Will research it | 13:46 |
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| yanyanhu | maybe it is a good start point to understand the entire background | 13:46 |
| yanyanhu | me too :) | 13:46 |
| yanyanhu | oh, elynn, XueFeng, you guys are working on lock recently? | 13:46 |
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| elynn | I will try to add db api | 13:46 |
| yanyanhu | elynn, ok | 13:47 |
| yanyanhu | then we can enhance the lock cleaning logic | 13:47 |
| XueFeng | Need reconsider my patch | 13:47 |
| yanyanhu | XueFeng, I think that will be helpful to address those lock issues we met :) | 13:47 |
| Qiming | elynn, that db api can be called when a service is started ... | 13:47 |
| yanyanhu | XueFeng, thanks a lot for bring this issue up | 13:47 |
| yanyanhu | we do need more thinking on it | 13:47 |
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| elynn | Qiming: yes, then will add more codes :) | 13:48 |
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| yanyanhu | elynn, great. will help to review the patch | 13:48 |
| Qiming | elynn, I mean here: http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/senlin/tree/senlin/engine/service.py#n203 | 13:48 |
| elynn | Not sure doing cleanse on engine start is ok or not . | 13:49 |
| Qiming | line 212 | 13:49 |
| elynn | Might bring race codition. | 13:49 |
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| elynn | Since normally we will start multi workers. | 13:49 |
| Qiming | things are still ramping up, it is a good chance to clean the room before moving in | 13:49 |
| elynn | And each worker will do this. | 13:50 |
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| yanyanhu | do we need extra lock here? | 13:50 |
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| yanyanhu | for avoid this race condition? | 13:50 |
| Qiming | I don't think each worker will do this | 13:50 |
| Qiming | at least we can do it before we start the RPC server | 13:51 |
| elynn | yes, might, but need more discuss about it. | 13:51 |
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| yanyanhu | ok | 13:51 |
| Qiming | ok | 13:51 |
| yanyanhu | maybe after the patch is proposed, we can have further discussion based on it | 13:51 |
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| yanyanhu | ok, open discussion | 13:52 |
| yanyanhu | #topic open discussion | 13:52 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: senlin)" | 13:52 | |
| yanyanhu | any more topics you guys want to talk about? | 13:52 |
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| yanyanhu | if no, maybe we can finish the meeting a little earlier | 13:53 |
| Qiming | one thing | 13:53 |
| Qiming | I checked the RDO packaging thing | 13:53 |
| Qiming | it seems https://review.rdoproject.org/ has all of it | 13:54 |
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| Qiming | still no clue how to start it if we want to push senlin into RDO | 13:54 |
| yanyanhu | so this is a gerrit maintained by rdo team? | 13:55 |
| Qiming | yes | 13:55 |
| Qiming | seems so | 13:55 |
| yanyanhu | and we need to propose patch to it if we want to add senlin to it, e.g. | 13:55 |
| Qiming | there is a #rdo channel, where we can ask questions | 13:55 |
| yanyanhu | I see | 13:55 |
| yanyanhu | ok | 13:55 |
| yanyanhu | I checked the latest release of rdo(Newton), senlin is still not there | 13:56 |
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| Qiming | it is not replicated into rdo repo | 13:56 |
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| yanyanhu | yes | 13:56 |
| Qiming | some people got to propose it and promise to maintain it | 13:56 |
| yanyanhu | I see | 13:57 |
| yanyanhu | that is reasonable | 13:57 |
| yanyanhu | like each package in debian has its maintainer | 13:57 |
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| Qiming | just some info collected recently | 13:58 |
| yanyanhu | ok, maybe lets keep paying some attention on it | 13:58 |
| Qiming | we will need to learn more when we get the request | 13:58 |
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| yanyanhu | yes | 13:58 |
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| Qiming | would be good we have a focal from core team to keep an eye on this | 13:59 |
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| Qiming | no more from me | 13:59 |
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| yanyanhu | great, thanks for all those info, Qiming | 13:59 |
| yanyanhu | will keep looking at it | 14:00 |
| yanyanhu | time is over | 14:00 |
| yanyanhu | thanks for joining the meeting | 14:00 |
| yanyanhu | lets move back to senlin channel | 14:00 |
| yanyanhu | #endmeeting | 14:00 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 14:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 8 14:00:17 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2016/senlin.2016-11-08-13.00.html | 14:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2016/senlin.2016-11-08-13.00.txt | 14:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2016/senlin.2016-11-08-13.00.log.html | 14:00 |
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| dasm | o/ | 14:00 |
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| electrocucaracha | o/ | 14:01 |
| ihrachys | #startmeeting networking | 14:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 8 14:01:05 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ihrachys. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:01 | |
| asingh_ | Hi | 14:01 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'networking' | 14:01 |
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| johnsom | o/ | 14:01 |
| dasanind_ | Hi | 14:01 |
| andreas_s | hola | 14:01 |
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| * ihrachys gives a minute for everyone to wake up :) | 14:01 | |
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| ajo | o/ :) | 14:01 |
| hoangcx | Hi | 14:01 |
| ralonsoh | hi | 14:01 |
| bcafarel | hello | 14:01 |
| pc_m | o/ | 14:02 |
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| ltomasbo | hi | 14:02 |
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| lindycoder | hi | 14:02 |
| ihrachys | ok let's run it thru | 14:02 |
| ihrachys | it will be packed today... | 14:02 |
| ihrachys | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Network/Meetings | 14:02 |
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| ihrachys | an attentive reader may notice that the layout of the wiki page, as well as topics covered is changed from the last time we had the meeting; that's all armando's fault :) | 14:03 |
| ihrachys | some topics went away (keystonev3) | 14:03 |
| ihrachys | some transformed (neutron-lib now includes announcements about breaking changes in review) | 14:03 |
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| blogan | o/ | 14:03 |
| ihrachys | and some were added for greater visibility (there is now an explicit no-api-downtime-upgrades subsection in blueprints section) | 14:04 |
| ihrachys | Armando believes the layout will better reflect the priorities of the team for Ocata and will help us focus on what matters | 14:04 |
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| ihrachys | #topic Announcements | 14:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:04 | |
| ihrachys | 1. neutron-lib 1.0.0 is released yay! | 14:05 |
| ihrachys | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106725.html | 14:05 |
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| ihrachys | the version number (1.x instead of 0.x) does not mean the effort is complete in any way | 14:05 |
| dasm | \o/ | 14:05 |
| ihrachys | we have a lot of work to do | 14:05 |
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| ihrachys | we have Ocata-1 in one or two weeks | 14:05 |
| ihrachys | that will, traditionally, not include anything major :) | 14:06 |
| ihrachys | also, in case you haven't noticed, we had a summit a week or two ago | 14:06 |
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| ihrachys | design session chairs were asked to send recap emails to openstack-dev@ [neutron] | 14:06 |
| ihrachys | nova/neutron session: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106478.html | 14:07 |
| ihrachys | neutron-server recap: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106684.html | 14:07 |
| ihrachys | neutron-lib recap: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106719.html | 14:07 |
| ihrachys | ops/end user session: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106903.html | 14:07 |
| ihrachys | neutron-lbaas: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106911.html | 14:07 |
| * HenryG sneaks in late | 14:07 | |
| ihrachys | please review them to stay in sync with reality | 14:07 |
| ihrachys | there are probably more recaps the queue, I hope other session chairs will update the ML on their topics in due course | 14:07 |
| amotoki | I have to send a client one... I had a nasty cold last week. I will send it tomorrow. | 14:07 |
| ihrachys | amotoki: get well! and thanks. | 14:07 |
| ihrachys | finally, the last organization announcement | 14:08 |
| ihrachys | some of you may probably know that I will change my timezone in a month to the one not too comfortable to chair the meeting | 14:08 |
| ihrachys | to anticipate that, armax decided to move the responsibility for the Tuesday meeting to jlibosva starting from the next week | 14:08 |
| ihrachys | (who hasn't showed up today; what a shame!!!) | 14:08 |
| amuller | he's taking a day off due to working when he wasn't supposed to | 14:08 |
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| amuller | I trust in our fearless leader, Jakub :) | 14:09 |
| * ihrachys hoped the number of !!! reflected it was a joke! | 14:09 | |
| dasm | amuller: i believe there is no such thing like "working when wasn't supposed to" in OpenSource ;) | 14:09 |
| ajo | :D | 14:09 |
| ihrachys | I will work with Jakub to make the transition smooth | 14:09 |
| ihrachys | there is a patch for the official change at https://review.openstack.org/#/c/394716/ in case you care to vote | 14:09 |
| amuller | dasm: Unfortunately code monkies are actually humans | 14:09 |
| ihrachys | congrats for everyone tired of me mumbling on the meeting :) | 14:09 |
| amuller | I hear humans need rest | 14:10 |
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| dasm | amuller: rumors :P | 14:10 |
| ihrachys | ok, let's finally switch to more meaningful stuff! | 14:10 |
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| electrocucaracha | thanks ihrachys | 14:10 |
| ihrachys | #topic Blueprints | 14:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Blueprints (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:10 | |
| ihrachys | #link https://launchpad.net/neutron/+milestone/ocata-1 | 14:10 |
| ihrachys | I checked the list an hour ago, and I believe the list of High importance RFEs neatly reflects reality of Ocata | 14:11 |
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| ihrachys | there are some Low importance RFEs in the list that may well slip over into a future release | 14:11 |
| ihrachys | there is not much to say except... | 14:12 |
| ihrachys | #topic OVO/no API downtime | 14:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OVO/no API downtime (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:12 | |
| ihrachys | tl;dr for those lazy to read my neutron-server recap email, we target the feature(s) to Ocata | 14:12 |
| ihrachys | at this point, we are looking at a significant number of transitioning patches that lack reviews | 14:12 |
| ihrachys | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/neutron+branch:master+topic:bp/adopt-oslo-versioned-objects-for-db | 14:12 |
| ihrachys | the link should capture most of relevant patches | 14:13 |
| ajo | lazy or not quick enough ;) | 14:13 |
| ihrachys | it would be wise to give those patches some attention from core and not-yet-core reviewers in next months so that we can make progress on the switch to versioned objects for database interaction | 14:13 |
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| ihrachys | ajo: aren't we all superhumans here? laziness is the only viable explanation. | 14:14 |
| ajo | wow, that's a lot of patches | 14:14 |
| ihrachys | I understand that people are still recovering from the summit, but since the cycle is rather short, it's better not to hang on the patches for too long | 14:14 |
| ajo | in my case assume lazyness :) | 14:14 |
| ihrachys | ajo: right that's a lot, and we need to squash all of them and more! | 14:14 |
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| * ajo takes good note of the URL to do more proactive reviews on that area | 14:14 | |
| ihrachys | sadly some of us were and some are still distracted by other stuff, but we should get back to work, taking each and shaving it until it lands | 14:15 |
| ihrachys | on a relevant note, there is a spec up for review that captures the current thinking around how we plan to deliver no API dowtime upgrades in Ocata | 14:15 |
| ihrachys | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+branch:master+topic:bp/online-upgrades | 14:15 |
| ihrachys | there are no more patches for the topic except the spec atm, but except more actual code changes in near future | 14:16 |
| ihrachys | I don't have anything specific of OVO transitioning patches to point out here, it's just a matter of working on landing those patches in queue at this point | 14:16 |
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| ihrachys | in next meetings, we may run thru specific patches that may be blocking progress; for now, moving on | 14:17 |
| ihrachys | #topic Bugs and Gate failures | 14:17 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Bugs and Gate failures (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:17 | |
| ihrachys | before we bug our bug deputy (pun!) and look at the gate, I'd like to mention something | 14:17 |
| ihrachys | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106906.html | 14:17 |
| ihrachys | tl;dr ^ infra wants all projects to switch to Xenial for both newton and ocata branches in a less than a month | 14:17 |
| ihrachys | which is rather tough I admit | 14:18 |
| ajo | de we try with our jobs?, any issues with xenial? | 14:18 |
| ihrachys | we run some jobs with xenial already | 14:18 |
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| ihrachys | I think tempest based, and unit tests, docs, pep8 are all xenial | 14:18 |
| ihrachys | some jobs are not, like grenade (?), or functional/fullstack | 14:18 |
| ihrachys | and I talk about master at this point | 14:19 |
| ajo | and what's the usual way?, replicating a job with xenial in -nv, and then switching when all is finel? | 14:19 |
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| ihrachys | I think jlibosva was tracking the switch for functional/fullstack | 14:19 |
| ajo | finel=fine | 14:19 |
| ihrachys | ajo: or experimental path | 14:19 |
| ajo | well, experimental right | 14:19 |
| ihrachys | for functional/fullstack, I think we have some experimental jobs that everyone can trigger and debug | 14:19 |
| ajo | who handled the other changes?, are we tracking this somewhere? etherpad/something ? | 14:20 |
| ihrachys | even if we switch ocata to all xenial, there is a non obvious work to identify the needed backports for newton | 14:20 |
| ajo | I'd be glad to help a bit with that matter, I don't have lots of time, but I could try to team up and take a job | 14:20 |
| ihrachys | ajo: yeah, at this point, I believe we need a tracker | 14:20 |
| ihrachys | and etherpad may be a good solution | 14:20 |
| ihrachys | and probably not just a tracker, but a squad team to make it to completion | 14:21 |
| ihrachys | because the time is tight | 14:21 |
| ajo | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/moving-neutron-jobs-to-xenial sounds good? | 14:21 |
| ihrachys | I guess I will ask armax to identify what our next steps are | 14:21 |
| ihrachys | ajo: let's use it, yes! | 14:21 |
| ihrachys | ajo: let's fill it in after the meeting | 14:22 |
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| ihrachys | ok, so that's one high impact thing | 14:22 |
| ihrachys | as for day to day stuff, the gate looks quiet for the most part: http://grafana.openstack.org/dashboard/db/neutron-failure-rate | 14:22 |
| ihrachys | the only suspicious thing is some tempest jobs - linuxbridge and dvr - are a bit higher in the trend, 10% and 15% correspondingly | 14:23 |
| ihrachys | we may want to have someone to take a look, but overall it does not seem critical (just yet) | 14:24 |
| ihrachys | obviously, functional is at 15%, but unless folks step in to fix the job, it won't become better | 14:24 |
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| ihrachys | and that's about it for the gate | 14:24 |
| ihrachys | as for bugs, we had several bug deputies to cover during the summit time and around it | 14:25 |
| ihrachys | I believe it was dasanind, dasm, and dougwig (all d's!) who handled bugs in last three weeks for us. | 14:25 |
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| ihrachys | folks, would you like to give some brief status for weeks you covered? | 14:25 |
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| ihrachys | anything critical to mention? | 14:26 |
| dasm | dasanind_: you first | 14:26 |
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| dasanind_ | ihrachys: there were 31 bugs and 4 RFE's | 14:26 |
| dasanind_ | most of the bugs were medium or low and some were marked as invalid | 14:26 |
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| ihrachys | dasanind_: anything that you could not triage/tag yourself? | 14:27 |
| dasanind_ | there were couple of bugs for fwaas, lbaas and cisco which I could not triage | 14:28 |
| ihrachys | cisco is not our scope, we just move it to networking-cisco and move on | 14:29 |
| johnsom | I can take a pass on the lbaas bugs | 14:29 |
| ihrachys | dasanind_: as long as you tag the bugs with fwaas/lbaas, that should work fine | 14:29 |
| dasanind_ | blogan helped with the lbass bugs | 14:29 |
| johnsom | Yep | 14:29 |
| dasanind_ | lbass=lbaas | 14:29 |
| dasanind_ | njohnston helped with the fwaas one | 14:29 |
| ihrachys | I don't think we necessarily need to triage to completeness all of them; the most important thing is to pull attention of matter experts via tags. | 14:29 |
| ihrachys | ok cool. thanks dasanind_ for covering for us! | 14:30 |
| ihrachys | dasm: your turn | 14:30 |
| dasm | summit week was very calm. just 3 or 4 bugs. | 14:30 |
| dasm | i was expecting to have *plenty* of time, but was buried under pile of other responsibilities, so currently trying to triage all outstanding bugs. | 14:30 |
| ihrachys | lucky you are, but not surprising :) | 14:30 |
| ihrachys | dasm: thanks. dougwig may have swiped through some of them already. but I suspect he won't update just now :) | 14:31 |
| dasm | ack | 14:31 |
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| ihrachys | dasm: let's at least make sure nothing slips thru the cracks, and all bugs are tagged properly. | 14:31 |
| ihrachys | all new bugs I mean | 14:31 |
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| ihrachys | dasm: thanks for working on it | 14:32 |
| ihrachys | we also need new volunteers to serve as bug deputies for next two weeks. anyone? | 14:32 |
| andreas_s | I can take one | 14:32 |
| andreas_s | which doesn't matter | 14:32 |
| electrocucaracha | I can be after andreas_s | 14:33 |
| ihrachys | sold! | 14:33 |
| ihrachys | andreas_s: electrocucaracha: please update the wiki page after the meeting to document you are the deputies for next weeks | 14:33 |
| ihrachys | thanks volunteers for stepping in, that was quick this time, and I appreciate that! | 14:34 |
| ihrachys | #topic Docs | 14:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Docs (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:34 | |
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| ihrachys | anyone to update us on docs? | 14:34 |
| john-davidge | ihrachys: Just a note that the bi-weekly netowkring guide meeting has been removed | 14:35 |
| john-davidge | Networking guide discussion will now take place in the regular documentation team meeting | 14:35 |
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| ihrachys | john-davidge: does it indicate it's too good or it's too bad? :) | 14:35 |
| john-davidge | ihrachys: It was so good everyone was too intimidated to ever join :) | 14:36 |
| ihrachys | haha | 14:36 |
| ihrachys | but now everything will change!! | 14:36 |
| ihrachys | /s | 14:36 |
| ihrachys | thanks john-davidge for the notice | 14:36 |
| amotoki | I think the main purpose of the dedicated meeting is to discuss the reorganization of the guide, but it looks over. | 14:36 |
| ihrachys | amotoki: makes sense. so it seems like it's 'good' in the end. | 14:37 |
| * ihrachys breathes with relief | 14:37 | |
| ihrachys | on a relevant note, we have doc bugs to squash, as usual | 14:37 |
| ihrachys | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bugs?field.tag=doc | 14:37 |
| ihrachys | swipe through the list and take what you can handle (of course if it was your DocImpact patch, everyone expects you to close the loop) | 14:38 |
| ihrachys | I just did assign some to myself | 14:38 |
| ihrachys | #topic Transition to OSC | 14:38 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Transition to OSC (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:38 | |
| ihrachys | rtheis: are you still with us? :) | 14:39 |
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| ihrachys | ok, anyone else to update on the OSC progress? | 14:39 |
| rtheis | around and wrapping up most of my work | 14:39 |
| rtheis | amotoki will take over | 14:39 |
| amotoki | after talking with rtheis, i took over his role of OSC transition. | 14:39 |
| ihrachys | rtheis: thanks a lot for all your work on the topic, we are definitely in a better place now | 14:40 |
| rtheis | yw | 14:40 |
| ihrachys | to the point where we deprecated neutronclient CLI :) | 14:40 |
| amotoki | I was in bad health last week and I am now catching up with his role. | 14:40 |
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| amotoki | no solid report this week. will report next week | 14:40 |
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| ihrachys | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/393903/ neutronclient CLI deprecation patch | 14:41 |
| ihrachys | amotoki: thanks for stepping in | 14:41 |
| ihrachys | #topic Neutron-lib and planned neutron refactoring | 14:41 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Neutron-lib and planned neutron refactoring (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:41 | |
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| ihrachys | as I said, 1.0.0 released lately | 14:41 |
| sindhu | amotoki: rtheis ihrachys : Is there a timeline/deadline for the OSC work? | 14:42 |
| amotoki | the main work will be done by ocata feature freeze | 14:42 |
| ihrachys | sindhu: I guess it's always yesterday; but no new features or even some bug fixes are now allowed in neutronclient | 14:42 |
| ihrachys | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106725.html the 1.0.0 release announcement | 14:42 |
| sindhu | ihrachys: Ok, thanks! | 14:42 |
| ihrachys | since neutron-lib now adopted reno, we have a neat and easy way to advertise new developments in the library | 14:42 |
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| ihrachys | for details, see in the announcement emails | 14:43 |
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| ihrachys | to remind, there was a decision made on neutron-lib design session that we don't want to linger removal of the code moved into neutron-lib for too long in neutron repo, so we change the procedure for maintaining the code. | 14:43 |
| HenryG | And I hope everyone is aware of the faster adoption plan | 14:43 |
| ihrachys | instead of deprecating such code for cycles in neutron repo until removal, we do the following: | 14:43 |
| ihrachys | 1. move the code into neutron-lib | 14:43 |
| ihrachys | 2. release a new version of the library | 14:43 |
| ihrachys | 3. announce changes on the team meeting (in this exact section) | 14:43 |
| ihrachys | 4. in several weeks the least, remove the code from neutron tree | 14:44 |
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| ihrachys | in this way, subprojects are given a chance to switch to the new code without leaving their gates broken | 14:44 |
| ihrachys | and neutron team can proceed with other work instead of maintaining deprecated code | 14:44 |
| ihrachys | questions? critics? concerns? | 14:44 |
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| boden | ihrachys: does that apply to hacking checks as well? | 14:45 |
| ihrachys | subprojects are expected to track new lib announcements, AND read meeting logs to be informed about things that may affect their gates | 14:45 |
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| boden | perhaps thats a topic for the neutron-lib meeting | 14:45 |
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| ihrachys | boden: what do you mean? it applies only to neutron in-tree code that is not supposed to be shared with subprojects. hacking checks from neutron tree are afaik not used by anyone anymore | 14:45 |
| ihrachys | if they are, they do it wrong and should switch to neutron-lib factory/checks asap | 14:46 |
| ihrachys | and honestly I wouldn't cry if they are hit by a gate failure because of that at this point | 14:46 |
| * ihrachys thinks how an 'evil' smiley would look like | 14:46 | |
| boden | ihrachys: the general question is if we can roll out new hacking checks that quickly as well.. and also there are subprojects using neutron hacking check factory | 14:46 |
| boden | we can take this offline; don’t want to derail | 14:46 |
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| HenryG | With the new "faster" plan we must be more aggressive about the hacking checks too | 14:47 |
| ihrachys | boden: the new change in the process is not about how we roll in new things in neutron-lib, but about how quickly we can remove deprecated code from neutron tree | 14:47 |
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| ihrachys | yeah, we can discuss it in neutron-lib venue in more details | 14:47 |
| ihrachys | thanks for bringing it up thoug! | 14:47 |
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| ihrachys | so one thing that is currently in review and that projects should be aware of is the removal of neutron manager code from neutron tree | 14:48 |
| ihrachys | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/386845/ | 14:48 |
| ihrachys | I believe the new neutron-lib now includes the manager, and so all subprojects are advised to adopt it asap | 14:48 |
| ihrachys | or else ;) | 14:48 |
| ihrachys | everyone is silent. stunned by the evil? | 14:49 |
| boden | I like this new process.. “or else” ;) | 14:49 |
| ihrachys | ok, report your complaints to your magnificent PTL | 14:49 |
| HenryG | I get the impression that people actually like the new plan | 14:49 |
| amotoki | ihrachys: is it an announcement? | 14:50 |
| ihrachys | HenryG: haha, until they are hit by the bus :P | 14:50 |
| ihrachys | amotoki: it's in a way an announcement, yes; we don't know for how long the deprecation warning for the manager will stay with us, even though the current patch set leaves some deprecation path. | 14:50 |
| ihrachys | amotoki: or you mean more generally the announcement of the new process? | 14:51 |
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| amotoki | no. i think it is enough. | 14:51 |
| amotoki | one suggestion is to use #info. | 14:51 |
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| dasm | ihrachys: btw "hitting by bus", is it already decided, which projects are not any longer in stadium? https://review.openstack.org/#/c/389397/ | 14:51 |
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| ihrachys | ok cool. obviously, we are not completely evil, and so we will consider impact of our actions on case by case basis when ripping off code from neutron tree. | 14:51 |
| electrocucaracha | ihrachys: just to be precise the point 4, how many weeks are we talking about? | 14:52 |
| HenryG | ihrachys: Make an #info blurb about the new process, then I have one other lib item | 14:52 |
| ihrachys | electrocucaracha: I don't think we set any specific number, but we are all adults here. I guess 2-3 would be a good compromise. | 14:52 |
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| ihrachys | #info new neutron-lib obsolete code process in place, subprojects are to track new library releases and read meeting minutes and adopt accordingly | 14:53 |
| ihrachys | HenryG: your stage | 14:53 |
| HenryG | We need more core reviewer attention in neutron-lib repo patches | 14:54 |
| HenryG | Please. :) | 14:54 |
| ihrachys | I second the gentleman | 14:54 |
| * ihrachys feels guilty himself | 14:54 | |
| blogan | HenryG: im sure you're looking for just more reviews, but are you asking for more +2 power? | 14:55 |
| HenryG | We have plenty of +2 power | 14:55 |
| HenryG | Not enough eyes on the code | 14:55 |
| blogan | ok got it | 14:56 |
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| ihrachys | HenryG: thanks for bringing that to attention | 14:56 |
| ihrachys | #topic Stadium update | 14:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Stadium update (Meeting topic: networking)" | 14:56 | |
| ihrachys | dasm raised a good point | 14:56 |
| ihrachys | as you know we had stadium revisited somewhat lately | 14:56 |
| ihrachys | it's still in progress | 14:56 |
| ihrachys | the relevant patches are in https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:stadium-implosion | 14:56 |
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| ihrachys | armax was assessing all stadium projects to decide which are governed well or not | 14:57 |
| ihrachys | some will go out this cycle | 14:57 |
| ihrachys | we will do changes in governance repos accordingly | 14:57 |
| ihrachys | to reflect the new world | 14:57 |
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| ihrachys | dasm: to answer your question, it's up to PTL to interpret assessments accordingly | 14:57 |
| ihrachys | dasm: but I hope summaries in assessments reflect the upcoming decision | 14:58 |
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| ihrachys | reach out to armax if there are still specific questions | 14:58 |
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| ihrachys | any questions on stadium thing before we close the meeting (sadly without open floor this time)? | 14:58 |
| dasm | ihrachys: just wanted to know, if we're already finishing/finished stadium implosion. thanks | 14:59 |
| ihrachys | dasm: I think we imploded it previous cycles; now we are shrinking it a bit ;) | 14:59 |
| dasm | :D | 14:59 |
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| manjeets | 700 | 15:00 |
| ihrachys | ok thanks all stadium participants who are working on filling in identified gaps lately, it's worth some claps | 15:00 |
| ihrachys | ok we are out of time | 15:00 |
| ihrachys | thanks everyone | 15:00 |
| ihrachys | and may the Force be with you | 15:00 |
| dasanind_ | thanks ihrachys | 15:00 |
| ihrachys | #endmeeting | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 8 15:00:31 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking/2016/networking.2016-11-08-14.01.html | 15:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking/2016/networking.2016-11-08-14.01.txt | 15:00 |
| lindycoder | Thanks ihrachys | 15:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking/2016/networking.2016-11-08-14.01.log.html | 15:00 |
| sindhu | thanks :) | 15:00 |
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| dasm | \o | 15:00 |
| hoangcx | bye | 15:00 |
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| electrocucaracha | bye | 15:01 |
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| amotoki | thanks | 15:04 |
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| radez | HOw are you? | 15:07 |
| radez | sure be happy to talk | 15:07 |
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| stn2 | hi | 15:09 |
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| sripriya | #startmeeting tacker | 16:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 8 16:00:56 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is sripriya. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tacker)" | 16:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'tacker' | 16:01 |
| sripriya | hello tackers! | 16:01 |
| stn2 | hi | 16:01 |
| sripriya | #topic Roll Call | 16:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Roll Call (Meeting topic: tacker)" | 16:01 | |
| tbh | o/ | 16:01 |
| diga | o/ | 16:01 |
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| s3wong | o/ | 16:01 |
| n-harada | o/ | 16:01 |
| stn2 | o/ | 16:01 |
| spzala | o/ | 16:01 |
| sripriya | tbh: diga s3wong n-harada stn2 spzala: hi! | 16:02 |
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| tung_doan | hi all | 16:02 |
| KanagarajM | hi | 16:02 |
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| sripriya | tung_doan: KanagarajM : hi! | 16:03 |
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| sripriya | i have no announcements to make, but welcome back everyone! | 16:03 |
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| sripriya | hope you all had a great summit and it was great meeting you fellow tackers at the summit! | 16:04 |
| sripriya | #chair tbh | 16:04 |
| openstack | Current chairs: sripriya tbh | 16:04 |
| sripriya | #tbh s3wong | 16:04 |
| sripriya | #chair tbh s3wong | 16:04 |
| openstack | Current chairs: s3wong sripriya tbh | 16:04 |
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| sripriya | here is the agenda for today | 16:05 |
| sripriya | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Tacker#Meeting_Nov_7th.2C_2016 | 16:05 |
| sripriya | since we have spzala here, let us start the topics from the reverse order | 16:05 |
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| spzala | sripriya: :) | 16:06 |
| spzala | thanks | 16:06 |
| sripriya | #topic VDU targets scaling policy - nested templates | 16:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "VDU targets scaling policy - nested templates (Meeting topic: tacker)" | 16:06 | |
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| sripriya | KanagarajM: spzala we discussed this topic in cross project design session | 16:07 |
| sripriya | spzala: i believe we now have support in HT for supporting nested templates | 16:07 |
| spzala | Cool, sorry I missed it | 16:07 |
| spzala | though thanks to tbh and bobh I have some idea on the discussion | 16:07 |
| spzala | sripiray: that's correct | 16:07 |
| KanagarajM | sripriya, sure. | 16:07 |
| spzala | sripriya: sorry type | 16:08 |
| spzala | ahh.. typo | 16:08 |
| KanagarajM | sripriya, spzala whats up :) | 16:08 |
| spzala | you can tell not fully recovered yet :) | 16:08 |
| sripriya | KanagarajM: since you implemented the scaling policy, are there any pending items from HT side which they need to take care of? | 16:08 |
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| spzala | so with the multiple template support, I guess the expected support is API driven access to those templates | 16:09 |
| sripriya | spzala: :-) | 16:09 |
| spzala | KanagarajM: we have this patch in progress, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/342675/3 | 16:09 |
| spzala | :-) | 16:09 |
| sripriya | spzala: looking | 16:09 |
| KanagarajM | sripriya, spzala , i am planning to strip of the logics from tacker once HT implement as expected | 16:10 |
| KanagarajM | spzala, sure. i will look into this patch | 16:10 |
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| sripriya | spzala: can you brief a bit about this patch? | 16:10 |
| spzala | not quite clear patch yet but as part of it, we should have an object to access translator vs a flat output | 16:10 |
| spzala | sripriya: :) ^^ Mathiue is working on it, and I also had comment to update the commit message with more detail for folks to understand the changes | 16:11 |
| spzala | sripriya: but overall as I mentioned instead of flat output of yaml file there will be an object to access templates | 16:11 |
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| spzala | it will create a new method that which outputs a map of filenames and their content | 16:12 |
| sripriya | spzala: okay, will the object contain the yaml file? | 16:12 |
| spzala | you can access a single or multiple yaml files (in case of autoscaling) with it | 16:13 |
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| spzala | KanagarajM: sripriya: is that something will work for Tacker? or you have a different need or approach | 16:13 |
| spzala | (suggest different approach) | 16:14 |
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| sripriya | spzala: okay, we will now need to handle the individual files from the object in Tacker | 16:14 |
| KanagarajM | spzala, when nested tmpl is generated, it could be accessed via python api from HT | 16:14 |
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| spzala | KanagarajM: true, that's what it's will be after the patch changes are merged | 16:15 |
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| KanagarajM | once its ready, i am planning to migrate the tacker to adhear to the new change in HT | 16:15 |
| sripriya | spzala: is the scaling patch based on the heat resource group? | 16:15 |
| spzala | KanagajM: sripriya: having an object we can add more apis as well to access programmatically | 16:15 |
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| sripriya | spzala: agree | 16:16 |
| spzala | KanagaraM: that sounds good. | 16:16 |
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| spzala | sripriya: yes, that's true | 16:16 |
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| spzala | sripriya: depending on how you use TOSCA policies in TOSCA yaml, you can have a translated template with Heat AutoScalingGroup or Senlin resource | 16:17 |
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| sripriya | spzala: i thought HT used the scaling policy/scaling group to create the resources | 16:17 |
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| spzala | sripriya: ^ the translation will be to Heat resources either ASG or Senlin related | 16:18 |
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| spzala | sripriya: I have this doc update created yesterday https://review.openstack.org/#/c/394673/ | 16:18 |
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| spzala | sripriya: to help little bit on what to expect with autoscaling translation | 16:19 |
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| sripriya | spzala: okay, it is clear now | 16:19 |
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| spzala | sripriya: cool | 16:19 |
| sripriya | spzala: so scaling is supported for both senlin and auto scaling group | 16:19 |
| sripriya | spzala: thanks for the doc link | 16:20 |
| spzala | sripriya: that's true | 16:20 |
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| spzala | sripriya: yrw | 16:20 |
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| sripriya | KanagarajM: i guess once this is merged, i think in tacker we can implement multiple policies with this feature right? | 16:21 |
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| sripriya | spzala: any rough estimate on when this will be merged since tacker is dependent on this patch | 16:22 |
| spzala | KanagarajM: once the merge conflict is resolved for https://review.openstack.org/#/c/342675/3 if you can please review it that would be great. | 16:22 |
| KanagarajM | spzala, sure | 16:22 |
| KanagarajM | sripriya, yes hope so. i need to see how HT will expose the feature | 16:22 |
| spzala | sripriya: I actually just talked to Mathiue this morning and we have that discussion in the patch itself, we are shooting for around two weeks | 16:23 |
| spzala | KanagarajM: cool, thanks!! | 16:23 |
| sripriya | KanagarajM: spzala: thanks! | 16:23 |
| spzala | sripriya: yrw | 16:24 |
| sripriya | spzala: while you are here, i wanted to ask quickly on NSD support in TP, we touched a bit on the NFV profile 1.0 for NSD to integrate VNFFG | 16:24 |
| sripriya | spzala: in tacker design session | 16:25 |
| spzala | sripriya: sure | 16:25 |
| sripriya | spzala: i remember trozet (who implemented the VNFFG feature) discussed about the inconsistency in tosca doc vs what is implemented in TP | 16:25 |
| trozet | hi sripriya | 16:26 |
| spzala | sripriya: ahhh.. | 16:26 |
| sripriya | spzala: did you happen to have more information on this? | 16:26 |
| spzala | sripriya: trozet: it would be great if you can open a bug against TP with detail on it | 16:26 |
| sripriya | trozet: hello! | 16:26 |
| sripriya | trozet: i was just discussing with spzala on NSD support for VNFFG | 16:27 |
| sripriya | trozet: spzala: we plan to implement NSD in this current cycle, and right now node types for VNFFG are hosted in tacker's nfv defs | 16:27 |
| spzala | sripriya: trozet: a bug with more on current inconsistency would be very helpful | 16:28 |
| sripriya | trozet: feel free to provide more information on this | 16:28 |
| sripriya | spzala: sure | 16:28 |
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| sripriya | trozet: as spzala requested, please create a bug for this in TP, hopefully we can move the node types from Tacker to TP | 16:29 |
| spzala | sripriya: trozet: great, we will fix it with priority or please feel free to provide/update solution if you can | 16:29 |
| trozet | sripriya, spzala: is "TP" tosca parser? | 16:29 |
| sripriya | spzala: thanks | 16:30 |
| spzala | trozet: that's true | 16:30 |
| sripriya | trozet: yes :-) | 16:30 |
| spzala | :-) | 16:30 |
| spzala | TP and HT .. lol | 16:30 |
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| spzala | can be confusing | 16:30 |
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| sripriya | spzala: it will be great if you can let us know any significant features coming up on this cycle | 16:30 |
| trozet | spzala, sripriya: i think i fixed one bug already | 16:31 |
| sripriya | trozet: link? | 16:31 |
| spzala | sripriya: sure I will be updating on it. On the same line, from Tacker side any new feature requests can be documented or opened up a blueprint that would be great | 16:31 |
| trozet | spzala, sripriya: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/321312/ | 16:32 |
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| spzala | trozet: I guess that was some long time back | 16:32 |
| sripriya | spzala: right | 16:32 |
| trozet | sripriya, spzala: i think the problems we faced with VNFFG were centered around that we are not providing a full NSD to TP | 16:33 |
| spzala | sripriya: yup, so if it's already fixed that's great | 16:33 |
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| trozet | sripriya, spzala: so when we provided a VNFFG with members, TP had no idea where the VNFD and VL definitions were | 16:33 |
| trozet | sripriya, spzala: so it would error | 16:33 |
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| sripriya | trozet: does substitution mapping help here? | 16:34 |
| trozet | sripriya: i'm not sure. I think we just need to implement full NSD in tacker and then see what we hit with TP | 16:35 |
| spzala | sripriya: I doubt | 16:35 |
| sripriya | trozet: spzala okay | 16:35 |
| spzala | I agree .. sub mappings is more general abstraction | 16:35 |
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| sripriya | trozet: okay, are you dependent on the NSD spec which dkushwaha is working on | 16:37 |
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| trozet | sripriya: my thought was leave vnffg as it is and add the NSD layer on top of it. | 16:38 |
| trozet | sripriya: then parsing NSD will just result in VNFM calls and the vnffg NFVO calls | 16:38 |
| sripriya | trozet: i'm trying to see how we can identify the NSD requirements for VNFFG to let TP know on the gaps | 16:40 |
| sripriya | trozet: NSD spec is going to take some time to implement | 16:40 |
| trozet | sripriya: it should be fairly easy right? All the underlying pieces are there, just more up front parsing and calls to existing methods | 16:40 |
| sripriya | trozet: well NSD spec needs mistral integration and we plan to build a workflow generator for the same | 16:42 |
| sripriya | trozet: it may be go through few more iterations even though the actual NSD feature implementation is straight forward | 16:42 |
| sripriya | trozet: the more i think of this, we can try to have a version 0.1 without the mistral support and see where we stand, we can then continue to iterate over the feature to bring in mistral support hopefully with minimal impact | 16:45 |
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| sripriya | moving on to next topics... | 16:46 |
| tbh | sripriya, I think that's the better approach | 16:46 |
| sripriya | dkushwaha, mike_m ping? | 16:46 |
| sripriya | tbh: yes | 16:46 |
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| sripriya | i do not see them here in the channel, i will sync up with them offline | 16:47 |
| sripriya | #topic Barcelona Summit Roundup | 16:48 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Barcelona Summit Roundup (Meeting topic: tacker)" | 16:48 | |
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| sripriya | thank you for attending the tacker design sessions, we had some good discussions around specific topics we outlined in the etherpad | 16:49 |
| sripriya | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/tacker-ocata-summit | 16:49 |
| sripriya | the etherpad is updated with high level notes that were captured in the design sessions | 16:49 |
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| sripriya | i plan to send a ML summary as well on the design sessions soon | 16:50 |
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| sripriya | did anyone have followup questions based on the discussions we had in the summit? | 16:51 |
| sripriya | i think the major action item for supporting VMware infra as a VIM in tacker is to refactor our VIM module | 16:53 |
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| sripriya | currently we have openstack keystone related attributes exposed at the API level, we need to revisit that to make it more generic and consumable for any VIM | 16:54 |
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| sripriya | on the other topics, esp. on containers, we need to evaluate further on zun or go with specific container plugins | 16:55 |
| sripriya | tbh: did you want to add more on this? | 16:55 |
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| tbh | sripriya, regarding zun, I think they are planning to redesign the container-create process | 16:56 |
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| sripriya | tbh: i see, is this on the API level? | 16:56 |
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| tbh | sripriya, nope, mostly implementation part | 16:57 |
| tbh | sripriya, I couldn't see the API changes in the design | 16:57 |
| sripriya | tbh: okay | 16:57 |
| sripriya | tbh: let us continue to evaluate further on zun project and see if we can consume it in tacker | 16:58 |
| tbh | sripriya, sure | 16:58 |
| sripriya | #topic open discussions | 16:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussions (Meeting topic: tacker)" | 16:58 | |
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| sripriya | folks, please continue to review and contribute on the minor RFEs as we chug along for these major features in ocata cycle | 16:59 |
| sripriya | it is a wrap for today | 16:59 |
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| sripriya | thanks for joining the meeting | 16:59 |
| sripriya | #endmeeting | 16:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 8 16:59:30 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tacker/2016/tacker.2016-11-08-16.00.html | 16:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tacker/2016/tacker.2016-11-08-16.00.txt | 16:59 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tacker/2016/tacker.2016-11-08-16.00.log.html | 16:59 |
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| stevemar | o/ | 17:57 |
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| stevemar | ping ajayaa, amakarov, ayoung, breton, browne, crinkle, claudiub, davechen, david8hu, dolphm, dstanek, edmondsw, gagehugo, gyee, henrynash, hogepodge, htruta, jamielennox, jaugustine, jgrassler, joesavak, jorge_munoz, knikolla, lbragstad, MaxPC, morgan, nishaYadav, nkinder, notmorgan, raildo, ravelar, rodrigods, rderose, roxanaghe, samleon, samueldmq, shaleh, stevemar, tsymanczyk, topol, vivekd, wanghong, xek, Stefa | 17:58 |
| stevemar | nPaetowJisc | 17:58 |
| lbragstad | stevemar o/ | 17:58 |
| gagehugo | o/ | 17:58 |
| lamt | o/ | 17:58 |
| rderose | o/ | 17:58 |
| ayoung | Ayuh | 17:58 |
| lbragstad | stevemar looks like we need to prune our list :( | 17:58 |
| stevemar | #startmeeting keystone | 17:58 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 8 17:58:24 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is stevemar. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:58 |
| rodrigods | hello | 17:58 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 17:58 | |
| stevemar | lbragstad: yeah | 17:58 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'keystone' | 17:58 |
| knikolla | o/ | 17:58 |
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| edtubill | o/ | 17:59 |
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| breton | to early! | 17:59 |
| lbragstad | stevemar we did that through a roll call over the course of a couple meetings the last time we pruned the list didn't we? | 17:59 |
| stevemar | lbragstad: i'll trim the list soon | 17:59 |
| breton | it's :59 | 17:59 |
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| stevemar | breton: :O :O | 17:59 |
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| stevemar | breton: i wanted to give a few extra minutes to the people who will inevitably be caught by daylight savings time change | 17:59 |
| breton | ok, we're good to go, it's :00 now | 18:00 |
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| bknudson | hi | 18:00 |
| crinkle | o/ | 18:00 |
| browne | o/ | 18:00 |
| gagehugo | dst is rough | 18:00 |
| srwilkers | o/ | 18:00 |
| stevemar | lbragstad: i'll look at the logs, anyone who hasn't said anything in the last 4 meetings will be cut | 18:00 |
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| jgrassler | Hello | 18:00 |
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| stevemar | alright, let's get the show on the road | 18:01 |
| samueldmq | hi all | 18:01 |
| stevemar | #topic announcements | 18:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "announcements (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:01 | |
| henrynash_ | (hi) | 18:01 |
| stevemar | New keystone/horizon meeting | 18:01 |
| dstanek | o/ | 18:01 |
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| samueldmq | stevemar: weekly meeting ? | 18:02 |
| stevemar | theres a new meeting that'll take place (it's on tuesdays just after this one or an hour after) | 18:02 |
| samueldmq | nice | 18:02 |
| stevemar | samueldmq: today is the kick starter | 18:02 |
| stevemar | we'll see how it goes | 18:02 |
| * samueldmq nods | 18:02 | |
| knikolla | great! | 18:02 |
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| stevemar | but basically we want to form a squad to take down these long standing keystone/horizon integration issues | 18:02 |
| stevemar | if you're interested, let me know | 18:03 |
| lbragstad | stevemar is that one proposed to the openstack meeting tracker? | 18:03 |
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| stevemar | lbragstad: probably | 18:03 |
| lbragstad | so that people can grab the .ics file? | 18:03 |
| stevemar | lbragstad: link? | 18:03 |
| lbragstad | stevemar looking | 18:03 |
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| stevemar | what will be discussed is here: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ocata-keystone-horizon | 18:03 |
| ayoung | nice | 18:03 |
| rodrigods | nice effort | 18:03 |
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| stevemar | it'll be nice to either a) get patches up for the issues, or b) create an undertstanding between the teams on things that can't be fixed | 18:04 |
| stevemar | the whole thing is in the spirit of more cross team communication | 18:04 |
| ayoung | that is a good time for the meeting | 18:04 |
| dstanek | I think that's a real good idea. Is the first one right after this? | 18:05 |
| edtubill | nice, so there's a keystone/horizon meeting today at 19:00 UTC? | 18:05 |
| david-lyle | stevemar, just noticing that's at the same time as the TC meeting, thinking may need to move the meeting time | 18:05 |
| stevemar | david-lyle: i can live with it, meh | 18:05 |
| stevemar | david-lyle: but we can bring that up at the kick off | 18:06 |
| david-lyle | stevemar, fair enough | 18:06 |
| stevemar | dstanek: sounds like the first one is in an hour after keystone ends | 18:06 |
| breton | where will it be? | 18:06 |
| stevemar | keep an eye on the #openstack-meeting-cp channel | 18:06 |
| stevemar | breton: ^ | 18:06 |
| breton | ok | 18:06 |
| lbragstad | we should propose it here - https://github.com/openstack-infra/irc-meetings | 18:06 |
| stevemar | if you're interested, add your name to the keystone meeting etherpad, i'll make sure you get pinged | 18:07 |
| stevemar | so far it's just rderose :) | 18:07 |
| rderose | I like to be firs6t | 18:08 |
| rderose | *first | 18:08 |
| samueldmq | stevemar: nice. that will also help us in UX aspects | 18:08 |
| stevemar | samueldmq: yep | 18:08 |
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| ayoung | ok, hold Horizon issues until that meeting. | 18:08 |
| stevemar | second announcement is #What we agreed to do for Ocata-ish | 18:08 |
| stevemar | i tried to recap all the items from the various work sessions | 18:09 |
| stevemar | #link https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dCJyP2bfXIWoQK_wWALU83EF3G-2fJSMaFgNGCJsIhs/edit?usp=sharing | 18:09 |
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| stevemar | please comment on it, i'm trying to figure out a way to best represent and track the items | 18:09 |
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| stevemar | i can see folks are already commenting on it :) | 18:10 |
| stevemar | i'm done announcements | 18:10 |
| stevemar | we can switch gears to spec reviews | 18:10 |
| stevemar | oh i guess on more announcement | 18:11 |
| stevemar | i added the keystone specific dates to https://releases.openstack.org/ocata/schedule.html | 18:11 |
| stevemar | the first one is "Keystone Spec Proposal Deadline" -- next week | 18:11 |
| stevemar | the dates were decided at the summit | 18:11 |
| stevemar | so if you want to propose a spec, get it up soon! | 18:12 |
| jgrassler | Regarding the Google doc: Cannot edit, vimperator conflicting with Google docs... :-/ | 18:12 |
| breton | jgrassler: press insert | 18:12 |
| breton | jgrassler: or shift-escape | 18:12 |
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| stevemar | jgrassler: breton you guys are too leet for me, i just use chrome | 18:13 |
| jgrassler | breton: Ah, the latter did the trick. Thanks :-) | 18:13 |
| dstanek | jgrassler: turn it off for that site | 18:13 |
| gagehugo | that looks interesting | 18:13 |
| ayoung | anyone have anything to propose that is not on the list yet? | 18:13 |
| jgrassler | breton: I'll have to try that for the Horizon console, too, one of these days | 18:13 |
| stevemar | dstanek: did you want to propose the pysaml middleware for ocata? | 18:13 |
| knikolla | i will cough up a spec that details the overall plans for the devstack plugin and how it ties with integration/functional tests | 18:14 |
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| stevemar | knikolla: cool | 18:14 |
| dstanek | stevemar: unless there is a tangible reason not to finish, I'm going to finish anyway. better that it's tracked | 18:15 |
| stevemar | dstanek: eh? i'm asking for a spec for it. do you already have a patch proposed? | 18:16 |
| stevemar | dstanek: did you name it something funny like "nteresting idea" or "do not review me" | 18:16 |
| * stevemar pokes dstanek | 18:17 | |
| dstanek | stevemar: mostly written but not submitted. I wanted to hear if it was talked about at summit and what the response was... | 18:17 |
| lbragstad | stevemar i found an open time slot and a room for the cross project horizon/keystone meeting https://review.openstack.org/#/c/395106/ | 18:18 |
| stevemar | dstanek: oh, it was talked about, and the ops in the room think it'll be nice to not have to restart apache | 18:18 |
| dstanek | stevemar: then I shall button up my draft and submit | 18:19 |
| stevemar | \o/ | 18:19 |
| stevemar | lbragstad: thanks! | 18:19 |
| stevemar | alright | 18:20 |
| stevemar | #topic spec discussion | 18:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "spec discussion (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:20 | |
| stevemar | this should take up the bulk of the meeting | 18:20 |
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| stevemar | PCI-DSS Reason in Notifications | 18:20 |
| stevemar | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/381302/ | 18:20 |
| stevemar | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/381302/ | 18:20 |
| gagehugo | yes | 18:20 |
| stevemar | it's got 2x +2s | 18:21 |
| stevemar | anyone against it? | 18:21 |
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| stevemar | has anyone not been given enough time to review it...? | 18:21 |
| ayoung | push it on ahead | 18:21 |
| rodrigods | looks good to me | 18:22 |
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| rodrigods | and makes total sense | 18:22 |
| ayoung | I'll +2...one sec | 18:22 |
| bknudson | do we have versioning of notifications? | 18:22 |
| stevemar | yeah, the notification ones are rarely contentious | 18:22 |
| stevemar | bknudson: no | 18:22 |
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| stevemar | do we have 2 people that have the bandwidth to review it? | 18:23 |
| stevemar | i can probably do it, but need one other person | 18:23 |
| ayoung | which one? | 18:23 |
| ayoung | just +2A https://review.openstack.org/#/c/381302/ | 18:23 |
| knikolla | ayoung +2/+A-ed | 18:23 |
| ayoung | Next | 18:24 |
| stevemar | ayoung: i'm assuming you will help me review it then :) thanks for volunteering :) | 18:24 |
| stevemar | next | 18:24 |
| stevemar | PCI-DSS Expired Password Users | 18:24 |
| stevemar | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/383832 | 18:25 |
| stevemar | this one is a bit weird | 18:25 |
| gagehugo | yeah | 18:25 |
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| stevemar | i keep mixing the terms enabled/disabled and expired | 18:25 |
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| gagehugo | yeah it is confusing | 18:25 |
| stevemar | but expired users can still be enabled and should be allowed to reset their password | 18:25 |
| bknudson | user has a new attribute? | 18:26 |
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| gagehugo | password_expires_at | 18:26 |
| stevemar | what this spec does it allow an admin to get a list of users who have expired passwords | 18:26 |
| bknudson | although unlikely, somebody could be using that already | 18:26 |
| stevemar | the other funny funny about this is the query string | 18:27 |
| gagehugo | the ewwwwww comment? | 18:28 |
| stevemar | "password_expires_at=gt:2016-10-14T15:30:22Z" | 18:28 |
| stevemar | :) | 18:28 |
| stevemar | gagehugo: its better now! | 18:28 |
| gagehugo | yes, much better | 18:28 |
| bknudson | it's not clear if every user now has a new attribute. | 18:28 |
| rderose | yeah, that would be weird | 18:28 |
| rderose | most likely on greater than, less than | 18:28 |
| gagehugo | bknudson: that spec doesnt add a new attribute | 18:29 |
| gagehugo | if that's what you mean | 18:29 |
| rderose | bknudson: every user now already has the password_expires_at attribute | 18:29 |
| bknudson | it says that when you list users you get back a new attribute | 18:29 |
| bknudson | ok | 18:29 |
| bknudson | I thought we already supported querying by attribute values | 18:29 |
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| rderose | bknudson: me too | 18:30 |
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| rderose | bknudson: I think it is only partially implemented | 18:30 |
| stevemar | bknudson: it'll be a little different since it's a timestamp | 18:30 |
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| lamt | I don't think it allows for inequality match | 18:31 |
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| knikolla | i see more value to this being a relative timestamp. like 'expires_in=1d' | 18:31 |
| dstanek | no, the gt,inequality,etc needs to be done | 18:31 |
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| rderose | dstanek: ++ | 18:31 |
| ayoung | We don't need a generla puproe comparator language | 18:32 |
| ayoung | make it part of the URL: all_after etc | 18:32 |
| bknudson | I thought we already had a general purpose comparator language | 18:32 |
| dstanek | api-wg defined one | 18:32 |
| stevemar | sounds like no one is really against it. do we have people who are willing to review the code ? | 18:32 |
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| ayoung | password_expires_after | 18:32 |
| knikolla | ayoung: ++ | 18:33 |
| stevemar | i think the use case is "i want to list all users that are expired as of now" | 18:33 |
| dstanek | I will review | 18:33 |
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| stevemar | dstanek: thanks, anyone else? | 18:33 |
| knikolla | stevemar: for that case is it not enough a expired=True? | 18:34 |
| bknudson | http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/keystone/tree/keystone/common/driver_hints.py#n85 | 18:34 |
| rderose | stevemar: I've already reviewed it | 18:34 |
| gagehugo | no because a user can be expired but their enabled field does not change | 18:34 |
| stevemar | rderose: i mean, someone who is willing to review the implementation :) | 18:34 |
| * rodrigods can review | 18:34 | |
| stevemar | good enough for me | 18:34 |
| dstanek | knikolla: nope. I need to notify users that expire in 7 days | 18:34 |
| rderose | ah | 18:34 |
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| lbragstad | bknudson you want to use hints to get that information? | 18:35 |
| bknudson | lbragstad: isn't that what it's for? | 18:35 |
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| stevemar | approved it | 18:35 |
| dstanek | knikolla: just like your employer probably does for your corporate account | 18:35 |
| stevemar | the implementation detail can change while we review the impl. | 18:35 |
| gagehugo | yeah we can fine tune it | 18:36 |
| lbragstad | bknudson yeah - we'd have to enrich the hints functionality though - it has bugs | 18:36 |
| stevemar | gagehugo: do you mind if we review https://review.openstack.org/#/c/345113/ before the project/props one? | 18:36 |
| bknudson | that sounds like a useful thing to do anyways | 18:36 |
| gagehugo | stevemar: yeah go for it | 18:36 |
| stevemar | Next spec is https://review.openstack.org/#/c/345113/ | 18:36 |
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| stevemar | good ol MFA | 18:36 |
| dstanek | it's a good idea | 18:37 |
| stevemar | i like it | 18:37 |
| stevemar | and adriant already has the impl. up | 18:37 |
| stevemar | it just didn't make the cut off last cycle, but i think it's good to go | 18:37 |
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| stevemar | there are limitations (won't be enforced in v2 only deployments), but i'm still OK with it | 18:38 |
| stevemar | there will be some issues with the client side work too, but we'll need to work that out separately | 18:38 |
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| dstanek | stevemar: I thought client side was a non-issue | 18:39 |
| lbragstad | i thought i remember that, too | 18:39 |
| lbragstad | wasn't the client just going to concatenate the code and password together? | 18:39 |
| stevemar | dstanek: the issue there was that the user would need to get a new token every time and keep retyping their passcode | 18:40 |
| dstanek | you just combine the code and password | 18:40 |
| stevemar | since passcodes are only good for a few seconds | 18:40 |
| knikolla | but code expires, and user will have to resource the rc file | 18:40 |
| dstanek | Ah, I see | 18:40 |
| stevemar | we need to do a better job of caching tokens and getting new ones on the client side | 18:40 |
| bknudson | user could get an oauth token or something | 18:40 |
| lbragstad | ah - so this is a different usability issue | 18:40 |
| dstanek | looks like we need client side token caching | 18:40 |
| knikolla | yeah | 18:41 |
| bknudson | you can cache the token but it's going to expire | 18:41 |
| stevemar | dstanek: which has been an osc issue for a while | 18:41 |
| lbragstad | ++ that would be good overall | 18:41 |
| stevemar | given that limitation, i think we're still OK for approving it on the server side | 18:41 |
| dstanek | stevemar: I wanna discuss that offline with you... If I can remember | 18:41 |
| stevemar | dstanek: sure, pull in jamielennox too | 18:42 |
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| dstanek | sure | 18:42 |
| stevemar | dstanek: lbragstad bknudson i'll let you guys approve it if you agree to review the impl. | 18:42 |
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| dstanek | already been! | 18:43 |
| ayoung | stevemar, better job caching tokens where? | 18:43 |
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| knikolla | client side | 18:43 |
| stevemar | ayoung: on the client side | 18:43 |
| knikolla | openstackclient doesn't cache tokens | 18:43 |
| ayoung | I'm gonna mess that up | 18:43 |
| dstanek | ayoung: ? | 18:44 |
| ayoung | if we merge role validation into the token validation, caching is not going to be worth much | 18:44 |
| ayoung | same token, different call, will have to be reauthenticated | 18:44 |
| stevemar | that definitely messes things up | 18:44 |
| dstanek | client will still be able to use the same token more than once right? | 18:44 |
| lbragstad | dstanek maybe, maybe not | 18:44 |
| lbragstad | depends on the call the user is making | 18:45 |
| bknudson | it was just getting the token that required the code | 18:45 |
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| lbragstad | a token might be valid for one call and invalid for another depending on the operation | 18:45 |
| ayoung | heh | 18:45 |
| ayoung | glad I could derail this | 18:45 |
| stevemar | yeah lets put the train back on the tracks | 18:45 |
| dstanek | so we wouldn't support OS_TOKEN anymore? | 18:46 |
| stevemar | comment on the spec if need be | 18:46 |
| ayoung | so..yeah, its going to wreak total havoc with caching | 18:46 |
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| stevemar | ayoung: the fallout from your spec is independent of this new one | 18:46 |
| ayoung | heh | 18:46 |
| stevemar | it'll break caching everywhere | 18:46 |
| stevemar | so reviewers: do not treat the two as related... | 18:46 |
| lbragstad | we probably need to set aside time to talk about that one again | 18:47 |
| dstanek | ayoung: which spec is that? | 18:47 |
| bknudson | ayoung: I think it'll depend on if the server returns a 401 or 403 error | 18:47 |
| ayoung | but if you are talking about having the client reuse tokens, that is different, and yes, we should do that | 18:47 |
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| bknudson | not having role should return 403 | 18:47 |
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| knikolla | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/391624/ | 18:47 |
| bknudson | invalid token should return 401 | 18:47 |
| lbragstad | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/391624/ | 18:47 |
| stevemar | dstanek: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/391624/ | 18:47 |
| dstanek | :) thx all | 18:47 |
| stevemar | ayoung: you added everyone to that review | 18:48 |
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| ayoung | stever, well, not EVERYONE, but yeah | 18:48 |
| dstanek | if OS_TOKEN stops work than my personal automation will stop working :-( | 18:48 |
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| stevemar | dstanek: a lot of automation would stop working | 18:48 |
| bknudson | dstanek loves the admin token | 18:49 |
| stevemar | bknudson: different than admin token | 18:49 |
| dstanek | yeah, but i'm mostly worried about mine | 18:49 |
| ayoung | OS_TOKEN should and will die | 18:49 |
| ayoung | die die die die | 18:49 |
| stevemar | 10 minutes left, lets jump to the last spec | 18:50 |
| stevemar | Projects and properties! | 18:50 |
| ayoung | Mazes and Monsters! | 18:50 |
| stevemar | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/388886/ | 18:50 |
| stevemar | i posted this to the mailing list | 18:50 |
| stevemar | Mailing List Discussion: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106806.html | 18:50 |
| ayoung | Yeah, this is a bad idea | 18:50 |
| gagehugo | There was good discussion on the mailing list | 18:50 |
| bknudson | the response on the mailing list was that we hate quotas | 18:51 |
| lbragstad | i thought we got some good feedback from other developers | 18:51 |
| ayoung | Youthought HMT was hard to solve... | 18:51 |
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| ayoung | anyone care to summarizethe feedback? | 18:51 |
| stevemar | ayoung: ops are for it | 18:52 |
| stevemar | nova folks are saying to watch out for a few things | 18:52 |
| stevemar | make sure you use a strict set of valid keys | 18:52 |
| bknudson | there's an extra metadata call for projects? | 18:52 |
| lbragstad | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106822.html | 18:52 |
| stevemar | jaypipes said to use tags | 18:52 |
| dstanek | i'm definitely not a fan of this yet | 18:53 |
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| bknudson | horizon already has panels for editing metadata | 18:53 |
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| stevemar | bknudson: keystone metadata? | 18:53 |
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| stevemar | well.. extras? | 18:53 |
| bknudson | no, volume and instance | 18:53 |
| ayoung | here is one way to think of it | 18:53 |
| gagehugo | s/metadata/properties | 18:53 |
| stevemar | so should be copy/paste for keystone projects :D | 18:54 |
| ayoung | from a Keystone perspective, no service is special | 18:54 |
| bknudson | I don't know what it has for projects | 18:54 |
| ayoung | Nova is no more special than Neutron | 18:54 |
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| ayoung | and that goes out into the things floating around the big tent | 18:54 |
| ayoung | and off into the sunset | 18:54 |
| stevemar | dstanek: why are you against it? | 18:54 |
| ayoung | we are not making a clearing house of project specific information, because if the project can't figure out how to deal with the type of info, ofbbing it off on Keystone will not solve the problem | 18:55 |
| ayoung | it will exacerbate it | 18:55 |
| ayoung | if we need a sound approach to quotas, solve quotas | 18:55 |
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| ayoung | don't solve it in a project specific manner, but make sure the solution works for cinder and neutron | 18:55 |
| breton | lets not talk quota yet | 18:55 |
| dstanek | stevemar: well, i think it's an interesting usecase, but in implementing it we open a can of worms | 18:55 |
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| gagehugo | project properties is not for quotas | 18:55 |
| stevemar | breton: ++ this isn't for quotas | 18:56 |
| ayoung | breton, this is all about quotas | 18:56 |
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| ayoung | it is the same damn thing | 18:56 |
| breton | ayoung: no it isn't, and it is different :) | 18:56 |
| ayoung | quota is a specific instnace of a type of data specific to nova, neutron | 18:56 |
| dstanek | for instance, i commented on the spec that it was broken because it allowed people with the ability to create projects to edit the metadata | 18:56 |
| lbragstad | this sounds like extras v2 | 18:56 |
| stevemar | ayoung: read adriant's use case: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106839.html | 18:56 |
| ayoung | and the billing info tags etc | 18:56 |
| gagehugo | lbragstad: yes, more or less | 18:56 |
| dstanek | that makes sense unless you real the usecase which is really wanting only the cloud admin to edit | 18:56 |
| gagehugo | which is what we want | 18:57 |
| dstanek | so does this mean we are opening ourselves to have multple levels or metadata controlled by permissions? | 18:57 |
| lbragstad | so - i know everyone here pretty much hates the idea of extras and we've been trying to get rid of it for a while... if we move forward with properties we need to make sure we don't reimplement the things we hate about extras | 18:57 |
| stevemar | we already have to support "extras", may as well make a decent API for it | 18:57 |
| ayoung | we have not even solved basic RBAC. We can't do what they want. | 18:57 |
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| dstanek | lbragstad: it is formalizing extras in a way, but their usecase limits who should have the ability to modify the metadata | 18:57 |
| dstanek | (at least some of the metadata) | 18:58 |
| ayoung | stevemar, we make NO guarnatees about that data. AAnd if people realized just how easy it was for that data to be something other than what they want it to be, they will freak | 18:58 |
| dstanek | stevemar: this isn't an api for metadata. | 18:58 |
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| stevemar | dstanek: eh? | 18:59 |
| dstanek | the original spec made it seem that way, but i was not aligned with the usecase | 18:59 |
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| lamt | metadata might be an overloaded term - it is more storing properties (or tags) and associate it with keystone entities | 18:59 |
| lamt | right now the user table's stores emails in the extra column | 18:59 |
| stevemar | i dunno, i can't believe we're arguing over what seems like a basic use case | 18:59 |
| stevemar | times up | 19:00 |
| stevemar | #endmeeting | 19:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 8 19:00:13 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2016/keystone.2016-11-08-17.58.html | 19:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2016/keystone.2016-11-08-17.58.txt | 19:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2016/keystone.2016-11-08-17.58.log.html | 19:00 |
| fungi | infra team, assemble! | 19:00 |
| bknudson | don't forget to vote | 19:00 |
| clarkb | hello | 19:00 |
| crinkle | o/ | 19:00 |
| fungi | this week's topics proposed by dhellmann, fungi | 19:00 |
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| dhellmann | o/ | 19:01 |
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| Zara | o/ | 19:01 |
| ianw | o/ | 19:01 |
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| jhesketh | Morning | 19:02 |
| fungi | infra-root: courtesy ping, i know timezones have changed for at least a few of you | 19:02 |
| bkero | o/ | 19:02 |
| mordred | o/ | 19:02 |
| pabelanger | Oooh | 19:02 |
| pabelanger | thanks | 19:02 |
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| fungi | #startmeeting infra | 19:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 8 19:03:01 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is fungi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'infra' | 19:03 |
| fungi | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/InfraTeamMeeting#Agenda_for_next_meeting | 19:03 |
| fungi | #topic Announcements | 19:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:03 | |
| fungi | #info Our "Ocata Cycle" [2048R/0x8B1B03FD54E2AC07] signing key has been generated; infra-root admins are requested to follow our attestation process as soon as possible. | 19:03 |
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| fungi | #link https://sks-keyservers.net/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=0xd47bab1b7dc2e262a4f6171e8b1b03fd54e2ac07&fingerprint=on OpenStack Infra (Ocata Cycle) <infra-root@openstack.org> | 19:03 |
| fungi | #link http://docs.openstack.org/infra/system-config/signing.html#attestation Attestation process | 19:03 |
| fungi | as always, feel free to hit me up with announcements you want included in future meetings | 19:03 |
| SotK | o/ | 19:03 |
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| fungi | #topic Actions from last meeting | 19:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:04 | |
| fungi | #link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2016/infra.2016-11-01-19.03.html | 19:04 |
| fungi | fungi send summit session summary to infra ml | 19:04 |
| fungi | your terrible ptl is backlogged, but it is at least in the process of being drafted | 19:04 |
| fungi | #action fungi send summit session summary to infra ml | 19:04 |
| fungi | pabelanger announce upcoming wheel-less pep8 job transition to openstack-dev ml | 19:04 |
| fungi | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106668.html important changes to pep8 python jobs | 19:04 |
| fungi | thanks pabelanger! you want to do the follow-up one next week as well? | 19:04 |
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| pabelanger | fungi: Yup, I was going to send that out later today | 19:04 |
| fungi | #action pabelanger send followup announcement for wheel-less pep8 job transition | 19:05 |
| * fungi predicted that response, being all prescient and ptl-like | 19:05 | |
| fungi | fungi generate and sign ocata cycle signing key | 19:05 |
| fungi | that's done (see above link in this week's announcements) | 19:05 |
| fungi | #topic Specs approval | 19:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Specs approval (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:05 | |
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| fungi | #info APPROVED "Neutral governance website" spec | 19:05 |
| fungi | #link http://specs.openstack.org/openstack-infra/infra-specs/specs/neutral-governance-website.html "Neutral governance website" spec | 19:05 |
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| fungi | ttx: ^ in case you missed that it merged | 19:06 |
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| fungi | #topic Specs approval: PROPOSED "Automate Creating Branches" spec (dhellmann) | 19:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Specs approval: PROPOSED "Automate Creating Branches" spec (dhellmann) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:06 | |
| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/369643 "Automate Creating Branches" spec review | 19:06 |
| dhellmann | hi! | 19:06 |
| fungi | looks like you and jhesketh have given it a council thumbs-up already | 19:06 |
| zaro | o/ | 19:06 |
| dhellmann | so far the comments on this look positive, so I would like to start working on implementation | 19:06 |
| dhellmann | before I do, I wanted to get the official sign-off | 19:07 |
| fungi | oh, that was tonyb and jhesketh who have it a council thumbs-up actually | 19:07 |
| fungi | dhellmann: yep, sounds good! | 19:07 |
| fungi | #info The "Automate Creating Branches" spec is open for Infra Council vote until 19:00 UTC Thursday, November 10. | 19:07 |
| dhellmann | cool, thanks | 19:07 |
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| jeblair | dhellmann: are you thinking about automating deletion? | 19:08 |
| dhellmann | jeblair : not in this go-round, but eventually tonyb wants to automate the eol process | 19:08 |
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| fungi | yeah, we talked about it on summit friday, in the release management room i think | 19:08 |
| jeblair | cool. i think the baby steps approach is good. just wondering if it was a twinkle in your eye. | 19:08 |
| jeblair | glad to hear it is :) | 19:08 |
| fungi | seemed there was general agreement on the idea | 19:08 |
| fungi | it would be a big help both to stable maint and infra | 19:09 |
| dhellmann | I'm not sure about "delete" but definitely "eol" | 19:09 |
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| dhellmann | something like a feature branch might have a different process for "delete", I guess | 19:09 |
| fungi | right, generally we "delete" branches by eol'ing them, so that sounds like enough of what we want | 19:09 |
| dhellmann | anyway, yes, baby steps :-) | 19:09 |
| jeblair | ++ | 19:09 |
| dhellmann | ok, that would cover both cases then | 19:09 |
| fungi | but as you say, that's a topic for another day! ;) | 19:10 |
| dhellmann | and tonyb volunteered, so he owns that ;-) | 19:10 |
| fungi | heh, perfect | 19:10 |
| fungi | anything else you need to squeeze in about this spec before we move on to other meeting topics? | 19:10 |
| dhellmann | that's it from me. I'll look for questions on the review. | 19:10 |
| fungi | thanks! | 19:10 |
| fungi | #topic Priority Efforts | 19:11 |
| dhellmann | thank you! | 19:11 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Priority Efforts (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:11 | |
| fungi | nothing is called out on the agenda this week, but i did approve rcarrillocruz's change to move infra-cloud to implemented | 19:11 |
| fungi | and have removed it from the priority efforts subtopics on our weekly meeting agenda as well | 19:11 |
| clarkb | fungi: did the zanata change to make that implemented get pushed/merged too? | 19:11 |
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| fungi | clarkb: ooh, i think? lemme check real fast | 19:12 |
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| fungi | oh, i think it already was in implemented | 19:12 |
| fungi | at any rate, it's there now | 19:13 |
| clarkb | ah ok ianychoi mentioned that we needed to update it but I didn't check if it was already done | 19:13 |
| fungi | if memory served, the upshot was that he was confused by the fact that it was still in the index, but turned out it was in the implemented section of the index | 19:13 |
| clarkb | gotcha | 19:14 |
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| fungi | also asselin has one up to mark the openstackci spec as implemented | 19:14 |
| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/393492 Mark openstackci spec as complete | 19:14 |
| fungi | looks like that's been up for almost a week | 19:14 |
| pabelanger | +1 | 19:15 |
| rcarrillocruz | ++ | 19:15 |
| fungi | if anybody objects that it's complete, say so on the review, otherwise i'll merge it on thursday as well | 19:15 |
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| asselin | ++ thanks! | 19:16 |
| fungi | #topic Ensuring projects adhere to the Consistent Testing Interface (fungi) | 19:16 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Ensuring projects adhere to the Consistent Testing Interface (fungi) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:16 | |
| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/394620 Make sure opportunistic DB use in unit tests works | 19:16 |
| fungi | i was collaborating with notmyname on a change to get an xfs tempdir available in swift unit test jobs | 19:17 |
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| fungi | there had been pushback against them only running their unit tests like that, concerned that it might violate the consistent testing interface mandated by the tc | 19:17 |
| fungi | when looking for examples to follow there, it dawned on me that this is already exactly the case for projects whose unit tests are only run with special mysql and postgres databases prevonfigured | 19:18 |
| jeblair | fungi: oh, i thought the swift thing was for a new job | 19:19 |
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| jeblair | it's meant to replace the existing py27 job? | 19:19 |
| fungi | so i pushed this up as a sort of straw-man for whether we think this is equivalent, and whether it's something we think needs to be done as well, or whether i should put forward an amendment to the cti that would make deviations like these acceptable | 19:19 |
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| fungi | in swift's case they're adding an xfs variant of their unit test job, but they'd rather just run it with xfs available because the only difference is that without an xfs filesystem to use a subset of their unit tests are disabled | 19:20 |
| jeblair | gotcha | 19:20 |
| fungi | they only made it a separate, additional job because concerns were voiced that doing otherwise may violate the cti | 19:21 |
| fungi | but if it does, then probably so do all these unit tests that only get run with special db configs present | 19:21 |
| ianw | sorry if this sounds silly, but why would we run with preconfigured databases at all then? shouldn't every test know how to set itself up? | 19:21 |
| clarkb | fungi: I had previously used the database example for why I thought swifts thing was fine... | 19:21 |
| fungi | for example, we don't test that nova's unit test jobs work without mysql and postgres databases set up for them in advance | 19:21 |
| jeblair | well, the *intent* of the pti was so that we are able to maintain the roughly 5000 standardized jobs | 19:21 |
| jeblair | it's not to be arbitrary -- it's just to set a standard | 19:22 |
| jeblair | so i think if we need to adjust it to accomodate a more flexible idea of preconfiguration, that's fine. but it probably should entail some thinking about how that would look in the project-config repo. because if the outcome is that every project has their own py27 variant and they don't share builders, etc, then we've lost our ability to do things like "change run-tox.sh" or "upgrade os distros" | 19:23 |
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| jeblair | (perhaps modularity and reuse of jjb builder macros -- in the way that notmyname was constructing that job -- would solve those problems) | 19:24 |
| fungi | yeah, in the swift xfs case, it would just have been a separate job template basically identical to the python27 one except adding a builder immediately before revoke-sudo | 19:24 |
| fungi | that does teh xfs setup step | 19:24 |
| jeblair | that seems like a sensible way to approach it. it stays out of the way of the parts of the interface we need to make assumptions about. | 19:25 |
| fungi | so i guess the first question, does anybody feel like custom job templates that add some database permissions or mount a special filesystem before running, say, `tox -e py27` is out of line with the cti? | 19:25 |
| fungi | #link http://governance.openstack.org/reference/cti/python_cti.html#specific-commands Consistent Testing Interface: Python (Specific commands) | 19:26 |
| mordred | I tihnk those are fine in the way described above - where the actual invocation of the CTI portion is unchanged | 19:26 |
| fungi | if there's no general disagreement on that point, then we can probably forego amending the cti in governance unless it becomes more contentious | 19:27 |
| jeblair | i don't disagree. i think clarifying it would be fine though. | 19:27 |
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| clarkb | fungi: I don't think they are as long as the test suite can still run on my laptop without root | 19:28 |
| clarkb | so swift should handle the no xfs case and nova should handle the no db case | 19:28 |
| jeblair | ya | 19:28 |
| clarkb | I know nova does this, I dunno if swift does | 19:28 |
| fungi | if that's the case, do we need to _test_ that upstream? | 19:28 |
| clarkb | we haven't had to test it upstream so far because enough people seem to run the tests locally that this is covered | 19:28 |
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| fungi | that's what the current swift job addition and my db jobs change linked above would do | 19:28 |
| jeblair | clarkb: well, i disagree that projects need to test the null case. | 19:28 |
| jeblair | clarkb: we can talk about that if you want, however, it's not at issue here, so we could skip it. :) | 19:29 |
| clarkb | ok :) | 19:29 |
| jeblair | i don't think we need to run the tests twice, without the db. | 19:30 |
| clarkb | ya it hasn't been an issue so far in the few years we have only tested with the db | 19:30 |
| mordred | ++ | 19:31 |
| fungi | #agreed Infra consensus is that jobs adding custom database configuration or special filesystems prior to running CTI-mandated test commands do not necessarily violate the CTI as worded; clarification in the CTI on this point and that projects should try to make some of their tests viable even without such setup (even if that case is not tested upstream) would be a welcome addition. | 19:31 |
| fungi | i struggled at finding a less-wordy distillation of the position there | 19:31 |
| fungi | anyone have suggestions? | 19:31 |
| jeblair | well, i still disagree with the last part. | 19:32 |
| fungi | #undo | 19:32 |
| openstack | Removing item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Agreed object at 0x7fac55465ed0> | 19:32 |
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| jeblair | if swift, hypothetically, chose *only* to support xfs, i don't think it would be sensible for us to say that its unit tests must work without it | 19:32 |
| fungi | okay, so we should test that they're runnable even without te db setup or filesystem mounted? | 19:32 |
| fungi | aha, so other way around | 19:32 |
| jeblair | fungi: right -- other way around :) | 19:33 |
| fungi | and yes, it sounds like it's pretty close to that in the swift case | 19:33 |
| persia | To help express complex cases in policy, the use of a Statement; Rationale; Implications structure (as in https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/open-standards-principles/open-standards-principles) can be useful. Note that this doesn't help the wording above unless someone wants to redraft everything. | 19:33 |
| fungi | basically their advanced attribute support only works on xfs | 19:33 |
| jeblair | also, i think it's insane that nova tests with sqlite (it has caused *no end* of problems over the years) | 19:33 |
| clarkb | jeblair: oh swift doesn't only support xfs | 19:33 |
| clarkb | which is why I think their tests should still work on ext4 for example | 19:33 |
| clarkb | or btrfs | 19:33 |
| jeblair | clarkb: agreed. i was postulating a hypothetical | 19:34 |
| clarkb | gotcha | 19:34 |
| jeblair | to illustrate why i think it's okay for unit/function tests to, in some cases, require this kind of setup | 19:34 |
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| fungi | #agreed Infra consensus is that jobs adding custom database configuration or special filesystems prior to running CTI-mandated test commands do not necessarily violate the CTI as worded; clarification in the CTI on this point would be a welcome addition. | 19:34 |
| fungi | better? | 19:34 |
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| jeblair | basically, i think we need to not let the tail wag the dog here -- we should test what makes sense for the project and developers. but we should push back on projects that go overboard in their tests and require crazy things (like root). | 19:35 |
| jeblair | fungi: agreed | 19:36 |
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| clarkb | jeblair: +1 | 19:36 |
| fungi | yeah, i think a fundamental element here may be that the prerequisite steps requiring root access be clearly defined somewhere by the project | 19:36 |
| jeblair | "this project is useless without a database" okay, install the db. "this project can do cool stuff with a giant ceph cluster" maybe don't require that for the unit tests. :) | 19:37 |
| fungi | so, for example, packages need installing with root access... a bindep.txt and readme paragraph satisfies that | 19:37 |
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| fungi | that is a case we've heavily automated because it's a shared divergence across many/most projects | 19:38 |
| jeblair | fungi: ++ | 19:38 |
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| fungi | things like database and filesystem setup are just slightly less common prerequisites root has to satisfy | 19:38 |
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| fungi | thanks, that gets me a good place to start from, i think | 19:39 |
| fungi | #action fungi propose clarification about project-specific test preconditions (databases, filesystems) for cti | 19:39 |
| fungi | i'm tapped out on this topic, thanks for entertaining my existentialist whims here | 19:39 |
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| fungi | #topic Open discussion | 19:40 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:40 | |
| fungi | anything else? | 19:40 |
| fungi | we have 20 minutes left over for a change | 19:40 |
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| jeblair | i promise i haven't forgotten about the zuulv3 spec updates | 19:40 |
| clarkb | today is election day, does that make tomorrow an unofficial recovery holiday? | 19:40 |
| fungi | hangover day? | 19:40 |
| clarkb | fungi: tahts the more direct way of putting it :) | 19:41 |
| ianw | pholio is up ... fungi did you look into removing the other hosts i mentioned? | 19:41 |
| fungi | ianw: yep, those are cleaned up | 19:41 |
| zaro | i forgot to set topic for gerrit upgrade, a spec is in review. #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/388190/ should we go over it next week? | 19:41 |
| clarkb | zaro: lets | 19:41 |
| fungi | i have not purchased a cert for pholio.o.o though | 19:41 |
| ianw | fungi: thanks | 19:41 |
| fungi | #action fungi purchase cert for pholio.openstack.org | 19:41 |
| jeblair | i have a bunch of notes on the 'secrets' one. when i type that up, i'll ask folks to take another look. | 19:41 |
| fungi | ianw: also i spotted that the vhost seems to think it's pholio01.o.o, have you adjusted that in puppet yet? | 19:42 |
| fungi | it may have a baked-in assumption that the vhost name is ==$::fqdn | 19:42 |
| jeblair | on the afs-docs thing, i hope that https://review.openstack.org/394658 will correct the problems we saw with some jobs publishing | 19:42 |
| jeblair | that needs to be approved and we need a zuul-launcher restart | 19:42 |
| ianw | fungi: ahh, ok, i have not. i think it idoes | 19:42 |
| fungi | jeblair: the pycrypto vs pyca/cryptography thread on the -dev ml might also be relevant to that spec addition | 19:43 |
| jeblair | fungi: ah thanks, i'll take a look. | 19:43 |
| clarkb | I sent the first You need to use Xenial email | 19:43 |
| pabelanger | I've started taking a stab at fixing our abort loop issue with zuul, 395056. Looking for some initial feedback. | 19:43 |
| clarkb | intend to send one every monday until our switchover | 19:43 |
| fungi | a lot of openstack is switching functions over to use the cryptography lib, though that would cause zuul sdist installs to need to link against openssl-dev headers | 19:44 |
| clarkb | fungi: already does | 19:44 |
| fungi | oh, in that case we may want to strongly prefer pyca/cryptography | 19:44 |
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| clarkb | I had to update the devstack gate reproduce.sh header to reflect that | 19:44 |
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| fungi | the implementation rcarrillocruz was looking into though (pkcs#1 with oaep) would still be effectively the same | 19:45 |
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| fungi | there's methods to supply that in cryptography, and it also lacks pkcs#7 support just like pycrypto | 19:46 |
| rcarrillocruz | good call, thanks | 19:46 |
| fungi | difference would be that it would be handled by libssl directly rather than custom forks/backports of rsa code in pycrypto | 19:46 |
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| mordred | I like things when libssl handles them | 19:47 |
| jeblair | fungi: wow. don't oversell it. :) | 19:47 |
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| fungi | heh | 19:47 |
| jeblair | fungi: 'local, hand-made, artisnal backports' | 19:47 |
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| fungi | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2016-November/106827.html pycrypto vs cryptography | 19:48 |
| fungi | that's teh start of the thread | 19:48 |
| mordred | jeblair: I think you just gave someone a business idea ... | 19:48 |
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| jeblair | mordred: was it you? | 19:49 |
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| bkero | mordred: I believe some of our employers are already in that racket. | 19:49 |
| mordred | jeblair: oh golly no | 19:49 |
| * bkero looks at his kernel. | 19:49 | |
| fungi | touché | 19:49 |
| mordred | if I were starting this business, it would not include "hand-made" anywhere in its remit | 19:49 |
| fungi | my hands are too delicate for hand-rolled crypto | 19:50 |
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| fungi | anyway, as is pointed out in that thread, a good reason to consider dropping pycrypto is that it's been effectively dead upstream for 2-3 years | 19:51 |
| fungi | which is not the sort of thing you want in a security-sensitive library | 19:51 |
| jeblair | yeah, so maybe i'll throw the words "python" "crytpography" and "library" into that spec update too. | 19:51 |
| jeblair | possibly in that order. | 19:51 |
| flaper87 | o/ | 19:52 |
| fungi | seems like we've even run out of open discussion. i give you all 7 minutes of your week back | 19:53 |
| flaper87 | quick one | 19:53 |
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| flaper87 | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/391588/ | 19:53 |
| fungi | oh! | 19:53 |
| flaper87 | I thought I'd give a quick update on the badges thing I brought up 3 weeks ago | 19:53 |
| fungi | please do! | 19:53 |
| flaper87 | I've implemented the badges generation as part of the governance repo CI jobs | 19:53 |
| flaper87 | no need to host another service or doing other changes | 19:53 |
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| fungi | yeah, i looked at one of the rendered svg images. neat stuff | 19:54 |
| flaper87 | I just have one question | 19:54 |
| jeblair | nice! | 19:54 |
| flaper87 | it'd be great if we could make the 404 response for the `/badges/` subdir a badge | 19:54 |
| fungi | i was trying to figure out if there's a good way to overlay those on the git.o.o webui (maybe some javascript tricks) without getting in the way too much | 19:55 |
| flaper87 | That is, if someone tries to load a badge for a non-official project, the response will be 404 and I'd like to return a "project: unofficial" badge along with that response | 19:55 |
| clarkb | flaper87: we should be able to configure the web server to do that | 19:55 |
| flaper87 | would that be possible ? | 19:55 |
| flaper87 | awesome | 19:55 |
| mordred | yah. good old apache | 19:55 |
| fungi | flaper87: a custom 404 page would probably be able to do that? or we could just to a pattern-based redirect | 19:55 |
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| fungi | er, just do a | 19:55 |
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| flaper87 | we might want to just do this for the /badges/ subdir/path | 19:55 |
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| fungi | right, i think either method should be able to be restricted by location | 19:56 |
| mordred | all 404s across all of infra should become the unofficial badge ;) | 19:56 |
| flaper87 | I'll add the 404 badge generation to this sphinx plugin too | 19:56 |
| flaper87 | mordred: :D | 19:56 |
| fungi | will need to play around with it a little. if you have time to fiddle with apache configuration locally and work out the syntax, i'm happy to point you at where we would need to add it | 19:56 |
| ianw | flaper87: .htaccess might work? | 19:57 |
| flaper87 | fungi: yes, point me at it | 19:57 |
| flaper87 | ianw: it might, I just didn't know if we were using apache | 19:57 |
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| clarkb | we are apacheing | 19:57 |
| fungi | #link http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack-infra/system-config/tree/modules/openstack_project/templates/static-governance.vhost.erb erb template for governance.o.o site | 19:58 |
| fungi | flaper87: ^ | 19:58 |
| flaper87 | I'll optimize the badges layout next but that doesn't impact any of this work | 19:58 |
| ianw | we are, so it might make sense to keep in the repo. anyway, plenty of options | 19:58 |
| flaper87 | fungi: awesome, thanks | 19:58 |
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| flaper87 | I'll try with .htaccess first. if it doesn't work, I'll change apache's config | 19:58 |
| fungi | flaper87: thanks for using up our otherwise wasted last 7 minutes! | 19:59 |
| jeblair | if we want to use htaccess, we may need to allow setting the 404 page | 19:59 |
| flaper87 | :D | 19:59 |
| fungi | we're out of time--thanks everyone! | 19:59 |
| flaper87 | I think htaccess would be better in this case because it isolates the work in one place | 19:59 |
| * flaper87 stfu | 19:59 | |
| jeblair | flaper87: thanks! | 19:59 |
| fungi | #endmeeting | 19:59 |
| flaper87 | my pleasure | 19:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 20:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 8 19:59:59 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 20:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2016/infra.2016-11-08-19.03.html | 20:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2016/infra.2016-11-08-19.03.txt | 20:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2016/infra.2016-11-08-19.03.log.html | 20:00 |
| ttx | o/ | 20:00 |
| * fungi opts to stick around and see what meeting comes next | 20:00 | |
| flaper87 | o/ | 20:00 |
| stevemar | o/ | 20:00 |
| mordred | o/ | 20:00 |
| mordred | fungi: that's clearly a mistake | 20:00 |
| ttx | dhellmann, dims, dtroyer, johnthetubaguy: around ? | 20:00 |
| dhellmann | o/ | 20:00 |
| ttx | sdague, EmilienM, thingee and mtreinish are excused | 20:00 |
| * flaper87 is happy for being able to enjoy the TC meeting w/ daylight | 20:00 | |
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| jroll | \o | 20:01 |
| dtroyer | o/ | 20:01 |
| dims | o/ | 20:01 |
| ttx | #startmeeting tc | 20:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Nov 8 20:01:12 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ttx. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 20:01 |
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| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 20:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'tc' | 20:01 |
| * edleafe lurks in the back | 20:01 | |
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| * mordred hands edleafe some popcorn | 20:01 | |
| ttx | Hi everyone | 20:01 |
| * Rockyg slinks into back of room | 20:01 | |
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| johnthetubaguy | o/ | 20:01 |
| ttx | Our agenda for today | 20:01 |
| * flaper87 right-clicks on edleafe and selects "Bring to front" option | 20:01 | |
| ttx | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee | 20:01 |
| mordred | Rockyg: you'll have to share edleafe's popcorn | 20:01 |
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| mordred | flaper87: nice | 20:01 |
| edleafe | Rockyg: help yourself! | 20:01 |
| ttx | (remember to use #info #idea and #link liberally to make for a more readable summary) | 20:01 |
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| ttx | #topic Adjust TC and PTL election timeframes | 20:02 |
| edleafe | flaper87: heh | 20:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Adjust TC and PTL election timeframes (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:02 | |
| * sigmavirus lurks with edleafe | 20:02 | |
| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/385951 | 20:02 |
| * edleafe thinks we'll need more popcorn | 20:02 | |
| ttx | OK so the deadline is up for this one | 20:02 |
| ttx | We got a lot of PTLs to chime in, which is great | 20:02 |
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| ttx | Any last minute objection to getting this merged now ? | 20:02 |
| ttx | At this point I'd rather keep the votes and do wording tweaks in a separate change. | 20:02 |
| flaper87 | ++ | 20:02 |
| johnthetubaguy | +1 for merge now | 20:02 |
| dtroyer | ++ | 20:03 |
| mordred | ++ | 20:03 |
| dims | ttx ++ | 20:03 |
| stevemar | mege it! | 20:03 |
| stevemar | or merge even | 20:03 |
| Rockyg | Thanks, edleafe ! | 20:03 |
| sigmavirus | stevemar: either one works really | 20:03 |
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| ttx | done | 20:03 |
| edleafe | merge now | 20:03 |
| ttx | #topic remove expired entries for extra-atcs | 20:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "remove expired entries for extra-atcs (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:03 | |
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| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/388170 | 20:04 |
| ttx | This one seems ripe as well. Objections ? | 20:04 |
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| fungi | one concern | 20:04 |
| fungi | though i don't object | 20:04 |
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| fungi | this guts the ux team electorate | 20:04 |
| ttx | People can still re-add themselves | 20:05 |
| fungi | yep | 20:05 |
| fungi | which is why i don't object | 20:05 |
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| fungi | just want to make sure people are aware that there are effectively no ux team contributors once this merges, until they ask to add some again | 20:05 |
| dhellmann | I did add the PTLs as reviewers | 20:05 |
| ttx | I suspect removing them will be a strong incentive | 20:06 |
| ttx | to refresh it in time for elections | 20:06 |
| ttx | fungi: or you could take an action to reach out more directly :) | 20:06 |
| dhellmann | should I try to contact Piet directly? | 20:06 |
| johnthetubaguy | +1 fungi and ttx on the ux project | 20:06 |
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| johnthetubaguy | yeah, we should reach out | 20:06 |
| ttx | dhellmann: I don't think that should block the patch though | 20:06 |
| ttx | those entries are expired | 20:07 |
| flaper87 | I'd probably reach out, yeah | 20:07 |
| flaper87 | ++ ttx | 20:07 |
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| dhellmann | ttx: ack | 20:07 |
| flaper87 | I mean, let's merge it and reach out anyway | 20:07 |
| fungi | same, they'd need to submit a change to governance to either readd or update expirations either way | 20:07 |
| ttx | so let's approve now + reach out | 20:07 |
| johnthetubaguy | +1 | 20:07 |
| ttx | #info we merge this one now but should reach out to UX directly so that they refresh their list before elections | 20:07 |
| ttx | ok done | 20:08 |
| fungi | i can write something to the -dev ml using their mailing list tag unless someone else was already planning to do so | 20:08 |
| dhellmann | I'll do it | 20:08 |
| fungi | thanks dhellmann! | 20:08 |
| dhellmann | #action dhellmann contact the ux team about their electorate | 20:08 |
| ttx | #action dhellmann will reach out to UX for extra-atc refresh | 20:08 |
| ttx | #undo | 20:08 |
| openstack | Removing item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Action object at 0x7fac554663d0> | 20:08 |
| ttx | #topic Add project Tricircle to OpenStack big-tent | 20:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Add project Tricircle to OpenStack big-tent (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:08 | |
| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/338796 | 20:09 |
| joehuang | hi | 20:09 |
| mordred | look it's a joehuang | 20:09 |
| ttx | joehuang: hi! | 20:09 |
| ttx | Quick intro... this project team was proposed back in July | 20:09 |
| ttx | Back then it was rejected, in part because making it an official project created confusion as to what the top API for an OpenStack cloud is | 20:09 |
| ttx | in part because the proxying approach sounded a bit brittle | 20:09 |
| ttx | joehuang worked with mordred to limit the scope of the team, which resulted in a split of Tricircle repos | 20:09 |
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| ttx | Tricircle is now focused on providing Network automation across region boundaries | 20:09 |
| ttx | The "top cell" proxying stuff has been renamed to trio2o is kept unofficial/separate | 20:10 |
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| ttx | which removes most of my "slippery slope" concerns | 20:10 |
| mordred | yup. same here | 20:10 |
| mordred | I think this is a great split | 20:10 |
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| joehuang | yes, one second, 3 thanks:) | 20:10 |
| ttx | joehuang, mordred: anything to add ? | 20:10 |
| joehuang | Thank you for your time to talk with most of TCs (and also Russell and Armando) for a while in Barcelona summit, but missed the chance to talk with some TCs due to session overlapping. | 20:10 |
| mordred | I'd just like to say that I think the goals of the new slimmer tricircle are things that would be quite useful to end users | 20:11 |
| joehuang | Thanks to Monty for helping Tricircle move forward, and learned that Tricircle and Shade/Oaktree in OpenStack-Infra can compliment each other for multi-clouds. Thanks to Thirrey for allocating summit venue and session slots. | 20:11 |
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| joehuang | Thank you for your insistance in API, which makes Tricircle being more focused and better and better. | 20:11 |
| mordred | joehuang: thanks for working with us on getting this to a good place! | 20:11 |
| ttx | joehuang: thanks for your patience ! | 20:11 |
| joehuang | thank you all again | 20:11 |
| ttx | Questions, comments ? | 20:11 |
| joehuang | Similar requirements could also be found in the ops session in OpenStack Barcelona summit "Control Plane Design (multi-region)" Line 25~26, 47~50: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/BCN-ops-control-plane-design | 20:11 |
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| joehuang | they need tricircle networking capability across region | 20:12 |
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| dims | joehuang : any feedback from neutron cores/ptl on this? (just curious) | 20:13 |
| sigmavirus | 1 comment: I've seen more tricircle activity on the mailing list than even some official projects (glance, security, etc.) and I think that bodes well | 20:13 |
| joehuang | I talked with Armando in Barcelona | 20:13 |
| dhellmann | so tricircle is limited to only networking functions now? | 20:13 |
| mordred | sigmavirus: ++ | 20:14 |
| ttx | yes, and nice organizational diversity on the project too | 20:14 |
| dims | sigmavirus ++ | 20:14 |
| joehuang | to dhellmann yes | 20:14 |
| dims | joehuang : cool | 20:14 |
| ttx | dhellmann: it facilitates bridging networking functions across cloud regions | 20:14 |
| joehuang | talked to Armando in Barcelona | 20:14 |
| dhellmann | joehuang : and the implementation is through a neutron plugin, and not a substitute neutron API? | 20:14 |
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| ttx | (not finished yet afaict) | 20:14 |
| joehuang | to dhellmann, yes plugin, no api substitue | 20:15 |
| dhellmann | joehuang : great, thanks for confirming that | 20:15 |
| stevemar | sounds like most of the concerns have been addressed | 20:15 |
| dtroyer | will users see the regions similarly to how they appear for Compute operations? ie, user's only see one region setup | 20:15 |
| flaper87 | indeed | 20:15 |
| * dims steps out to answer the door | 20:15 | |
| joehuang | thank you | 20:15 |
| joehuang | to dtroyer, yes | 20:15 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I think the scope is *much* improved, totally see the need for the network orchestration, but I would love a +1 from armax on that | 20:15 |
| joehuang | see multi-region | 20:15 |
| dtroyer | joehuang: thanks | 20:16 |
| dhellmann | joehuang: I'm curious about how your interactions with the neutron team have been going. I know they are decomposing the stadium. Was there any interest in adopting the driver you've written? | 20:16 |
| ttx | armax's +1 wouldn't hurt the proposal, but I'm fine with it as it stands | 20:16 |
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| joehuang | Armax said he will review it, but I don't know he finished it or not after back from summit | 20:17 |
| flaper87 | dhellmann: was about to ask that +1 | 20:17 |
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| joehuang | to dhellmann, there are tricircle's database, standalone API service, and XJOB | 20:17 |
| joehuang | it's not simply a plugin, including local and central plugin | 20:18 |
| ttx | I'm fine waiting for at least a comment from armax before finally approving | 20:18 |
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| dhellmann | joehuang : ah, I see. | 20:18 |
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| flaper87 | ttx: we'll have to wait till next week anyway, there's no quorum on the patch yet | 20:19 |
| dhellmann | as long as there is no proxy api for neutron itself, I think it's fine to move ahead. Especially since the neutron team is dissolving the stadium. | 20:19 |
| mordred | dhellmann: ++ | 20:19 |
| dhellmann | but yeah, wait for quorum, of course :-) | 20:19 |
| mordred | dissolving a stadium seems like it would take much longer than using explosives to implode it ... | 20:19 |
| mordred | unless it's some really strong acid | 20:19 |
| flaper87 | lol | 20:20 |
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| ttx | #info No objections so far, but some TC members would really much like to get armax's opinion on it before final approval | 20:20 |
| joehuang | would like to know when Amando can give feedback? He was added to reviewer since july | 20:20 |
| ttx | We'll reach out to him and proceed next week with or without his comment | 20:21 |
| dhellmann | ++ | 20:21 |
| ttx | I don't want to hold it to some other PTL approval | 20:21 |
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| joehuang | ok, thank you all | 20:21 |
| flaper87 | joehuang: thanks for the work and the patience | 20:21 |
| ttx | Also lots of TC members off today, won't hurt to let them ask a few more questions | 20:21 |
| joehuang | my pleasure :) | 20:21 |
| ttx | Sorry that may mean crazy hours for you next week as well | 20:21 |
| joehuang | slepless night:) | 20:22 |
| ttx | #info Tricircle shall be finally approved (barring any objection) next week meeting | 20:22 |
| joehuang | but my pleasure anyway:) | 20:22 |
| dtroyer | joehuang: thanks for making the personal time sacrifice to be here, it is really helpful | 20:22 |
| ttx | next topic, small reordering upon request | 20:22 |
| dhellmann | ++ | 20:22 |
| dims | joehuang : thanks! | 20:23 |
| joehuang | thanks bye | 20:23 |
| ttx | #topic Add "Assume Good Faith" to OpenStack principles | 20:23 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Add "Assume Good Faith" to OpenStack principles (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:23 | |
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| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/365590 | 20:23 |
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| ttx | We discussed that one last week | 20:23 |
| ttx | in flaper87's absence nobody felt strongly for or against it, lots of +0s | 20:23 |
| ttx | personally I think that for something to make it into our principles list there needs to be enough people caring strongly about it | 20:23 |
| flaper87 | ++ | 20:23 |
| ttx | otherwise I fear we'll end up with a very long list of "sure, why not" principles | 20:23 |
| dhellmann | the current version feels more like an admonition than a principle | 20:23 |
| ttx | so we waited until flaper87 was back | 20:23 |
| dtroyer | I am still struggling with this, it just doesn't feel right to be _here_. | 20:23 |
| dhellmann | yeah, it's definitely something I like, I'm not sure it fits with the other items we've put in this category so far, though | 20:24 |
| flaper87 | dtroyer: where would you put it ? | 20:24 |
| ttx | My position is that we don't have a critical mass of people that think it should definitely be a part of our principles | 20:24 |
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| ttx | I'm fine with it if there is such a critical mass, but I just don't see it | 20:24 |
| dhellmann | flaper87 : last week we talked about adding a "communication guidelines" section to the PTG | 20:25 |
| dtroyer | flaper87: I'm not sure | 20:25 |
| flaper87 | dhellmann: mmh, I guess that could help | 20:25 |
| edleafe | How would adding this change anything? That's what I don't understand | 20:25 |
| armax | ttx: I can have a pass at it today | 20:25 |
| ttx | armax: that would be awesome thank you | 20:25 |
| dtroyer | flaper87: I agree with the ideal | 20:26 |
| flaper87 | If folks feel more comfortable having it in the PTG, then I'll move it there. I'm, of course, ok with it being in the principles reference doc | 20:26 |
| sigmavirus | edleafe: as I understand it, the principles documentation is meant to document what are our principles today | 20:26 |
| flaper87 | but I can see why peopl may not feel as comfortable with it | 20:26 |
| sigmavirus | edleafe: not so much "what does this fix?" or "what does this do to change things?" | 20:26 |
| dims | flaper87 : dhellmann : y "communication guidelines" would seem better | 20:26 |
| jroll | sigmavirus: +1 | 20:26 |
| * sigmavirus wasn't around last week but supports this being documented somewhere | 20:26 | |
| dims | sigmavirus ++ | 20:26 |
| fungi | i was in favor of dhellmann's suggestion last week for 'a "how to communicate successfully" section of the project team guide' | 20:27 |
| ttx | yeah, I would be much more comfortable if personal behavior guidelines like this were in the Project Team Guide or the CoC | 20:27 |
| sigmavirus | I don't have particularly strong feelings as to where, although I think it could fit there | 20:27 |
| edleafe | sigmavirus: IMO, it's more of a "where do we _want_ to be", not "where are we now" | 20:27 |
| dhellmann | edleafe : it will become that, but we've said at this point we're still trying to write down where we are | 20:27 |
| ttx | because I don't think we should have 100 principles and I can see us having a 100 personal behavior guidelines :) | 20:27 |
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| smcginnis | +1 | 20:27 |
| dhellmann | ugh, I hope not 100 of those, either | 20:28 |
| sigmavirus | ttx: so it's not just about personal behaviour, in my opinion. Yes communication is the primary place where we should be assuming good faith, but it also applies in patches | 20:28 |
| flaper87 | Ok, I'll move it... I don't feel strongly about this being a principle | 20:28 |
| ttx | dhellmann: figure of speech | 20:28 |
| dtroyer | edleafe: I hope the majority of the community already does this… but maybe not given the kinds of comments made during the last election cycle | 20:28 |
| * flaper87 really thought it was, though. | 20:28 | |
| sigmavirus | I think that a lot of the mailing discussions about mass sending of patches are missing this point | 20:28 |
| dhellmann | ttx: :-) | 20:28 |
| fungi | sigmavirus: code is speech ;) | 20:28 |
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| edleafe | dtroyer: exactly. It's aspirational, but not where things are today | 20:28 |
| stevemar | sigmavirus: or mass bug subscriptions :) | 20:28 |
| sigmavirus | fungi: fair, I think most people distinguish between "code" and "email" where they view email more as communication | 20:28 |
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| sigmavirus | stevemar: right, these are things that are annoying, but I suspect the people are doing it in good faith | 20:29 |
| ttx | edleafe: it's also difficult to mandate | 20:29 |
| fungi | i expect as a community we communicate more through code review comments than e-mail | 20:29 |
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| edleafe | ttx: that too | 20:29 |
| ttx | #agreed this should be put in the Project Team Guide instead | 20:29 |
| jroll | 1/b 40 | 20:29 |
| sigmavirus | fungi: absolutely. I'm just thinking of events on the mailing where people felt they were being attacked instead of assuming good faith | 20:29 |
| jroll | oops. | 20:29 |
| dhellmann | fungi : that's certainly my goal | 20:29 |
| sigmavirus | jroll: don't use irssi :P | 20:29 |
| flaper87 | would people feel comfortable with this being in the principles doc once we start adding "where we want to be" ? | 20:29 |
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| ttx | #info no critical mass of members agree this should live as a principle at this stage | 20:29 |
| jroll | sigmavirus: I would never (weechat) :D | 20:30 |
| dtroyer | flaper87: yes | 20:30 |
| flaper87 | Or is the concept of assuming good faith that folks are not comfortable with ? | 20:30 |
| fungi | sigmavirus: i agree it's just as possible to crop up in bug triage, code review, irc channels... we have lots of means of communication | 20:30 |
| flaper87 | I mean, comfortable with having it in the principles file | 20:30 |
| flaper87 | mmh | 20:30 |
| ttx | flaper87: sounds like a "vision" rather than a "principles list" :) | 20:30 |
| sigmavirus | flaper87: that's a good question | 20:30 |
| dhellmann | flaper87 : possibly phrased differently | 20:30 |
| edleafe | flaper87: I don't think it's possible to tell people how to feel | 20:30 |
| flaper87 | dhellmann: what would be your suggestion? Asking because the last wording came out of feedback | 20:30 |
| ttx | I don 't think "where we want to be" belongs in the principles doc | 20:31 |
| dhellmann | flaper87 : maybe something more general about taking open and clear communication seriously | 20:31 |
| flaper87 | The feedback was to make it more asperational | 20:31 |
| fungi | however, it's possible to explain that certain positions in communication are more effective at getting your point across than others, and at understanding the points made by others | 20:31 |
| sigmavirus | edleafe: that's not how I read flaper87's review in the slightest | 20:31 |
| flaper87 | edleafe: it's not how ppl should feel but how they should communicate | 20:31 |
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| flaper87 | Ok, I'll abandon this path or reword it entirely to not mention good faith but focus on communication | 20:32 |
| fungi | "assuming good faith" is less about feeling a certain way, and more about making conscious vs unconscious choices when interpreting personal communication, private or public | 20:32 |
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| ttx | edleafe: I still think it's valuable that we document expected communication behavior -- just think it's not a "principle", and should live in the Poject Team Guide instead | 20:32 |
| Rockyg | Well, the principle is we act in good faith. | 20:32 |
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| sigmavirus | fungi:++ | 20:32 |
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| sigmavirus | Rockyg: right | 20:33 |
| dhellmann | flaper87 : I have some ideas about the communication angle, if you'd like to work together on that | 20:33 |
| edleafe | Positive communication is a great angle, even if you don't assume someone is acting in good faith. Always rise above. | 20:33 |
| flaper87 | dhellmann: I'd appreciate your help on this, thanks | 20:34 |
| dhellmann | flaper87 : cool, maybe early next week we can chat | 20:34 |
| flaper87 | sounds perfect, this week would be impossible for me | 20:34 |
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| ttx | ok, let's move on ? | 20:34 |
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| flaper87 | yup, I'm good | 20:35 |
| ttx | #topic Create a project tag for zero-downtime upgrades | 20:35 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Create a project tag for zero-downtime upgrades (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:35 | |
| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/372686 | 20:35 |
| ttx | This one looks pretty close. | 20:35 |
| ttx | There is a one-word change suggested by Doug that we might want to add before or after we approve it | 20:35 |
| stevemar | getting the testing going on that one is going to be hard, but i appreciate the high target/goal that dolphm is setting | 20:36 |
| ttx | unless dolphm is around to fix it, we can approve this and then change the word in a subsequent change ? | 20:36 |
| fungi | sounds fine to me | 20:36 |
| mordred | stevemar: ++ | 20:36 |
| mordred | I like the phrase "continuous tempest" | 20:37 |
| dolphm | i am around | 20:37 |
| ttx | stevemar: yes. I like that it's not ready to apply but sets the vision | 20:37 |
| dolphm | i'm happy to make the change, but wanted to wait for any additional feedback before doing a minor revision | 20:37 |
| ttx | dolphm: we can either approve it now or you fix it and we reapply our votes | 20:37 |
| ttx | dolphm: it has majority support already | 20:38 |
| dhellmann | ttx: I'm OK with changing that word later | 20:38 |
| dolphm | ttx: just submitted the revision :) | 20:38 |
| ttx | yes, it's not as if people would apply that tag tomorrow | 20:38 |
| ttx | ok, reapply votes | 20:38 |
| ttx | I'm first | 20:38 |
| ttx | stevemar: ? | 20:39 |
| ttx | last call | 20:40 |
| johnthetubaguy | were we going to also discuss the follow on change? https://review.openstack.org/#/c/389300 | 20:41 |
| ttx | ok, approving now | 20:41 |
| stevemar | sorry, double booked... | 20:41 |
| stevemar | ttx: +1 from me :) | 20:42 |
| ttx | hmm, now I'm confused | 20:42 |
| dolphm | stevemar: i proposed a minor revision and cleared your vote | 20:42 |
| ttx | Somehow I missed that there were two of those | 20:42 |
| stevemar | dolphm: yes, i see that, re-adding it now (even if it's approved) | 20:42 |
| fungi | zero downtime is less restrictive than zero impact | 20:42 |
| dolphm | the subsequent change (zero-impact upgrades) was proposed substantially more recently (in case we want more time to socialize it) | 20:43 |
| ttx | johnthetubaguy: so yes we should | 20:43 |
| dolphm | fungi: other way around | 20:43 |
| dolphm | fungi: zero-impact is the ultimate goal | 20:43 |
| johnthetubaguy | the session on these at the summit was good, there is *down* and a bit degraded, and *no* degredation | 20:43 |
| fungi | i think that's what i said? | 20:43 |
| dolphm | fungi: oh wow, i misread :) | 20:44 |
| ttx | zero-impact looks ok to me | 20:44 |
| dolphm | fungi: you were totally correct | 20:44 |
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| fungi | okay, just making sure i was reading the specs the right way 'round ;) | 20:44 |
| ttx | I propose we approve it too unless someone objects | 20:44 |
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| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/389300 | 20:44 |
| ttx | even if it wasn't formally on the agenda | 20:44 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, I think approve both, I like the completeness that gives us | 20:45 |
| ttx | alright then, last chance to vote on it | 20:46 |
| fungi | it's been up and had the formal-vote tag for a few weeks at this point, so seems like plenty of time | 20:46 |
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| ttx | annnd... approved | 20:46 |
| ttx | Thanks dolphm for painting that shiny picture | 20:46 |
| dolphm | \o/ | 20:46 |
| ttx | #topic Add "servant leadership" to principles | 20:46 |
| johnthetubaguy | +1 | 20:46 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Add "servant leadership" to principles (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:46 | |
| fungi | now we just need some projects to start buying the reprints | 20:46 |
| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/390864 | 20:46 |
| ttx | checking out the last rev | 20:47 |
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| jroll | ohai | 20:47 |
| mordred | jroll: will you kill me if I nitpick two words at this point? | 20:47 |
| stevemar | mordred: :) | 20:47 |
| mordred | oh - nevermind - it's consistent with other principles | 20:47 |
| ttx | We are not allowed to pass a principle without nitpicking anyway | 20:47 |
| jroll | mordred: I've had patches in flight for nine months in the past, this is nothing | 20:47 |
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| edleafe | ttx: You should add "nitpicking" as a principle | 20:48 |
| ttx | I like it | 20:48 |
| ttx | edleafe: maybe an expected behavior | 20:48 |
| jroll | lol | 20:48 |
| * mordred was going to quibble about the word "should" | 20:48 | |
| dhellmann | edleafe : I think we call that bike shedding, don't we? ;-) | 20:48 |
| mordred | jroll: I have patches still open from 2014 | 20:48 |
| ttx | mordred: you want "shalt" ? | 20:48 |
| fungi | it's slightly disjoint with the respective electorates, but i'm okay with the assertion that leaders serve more people than merely those who are able to vote to elect them | 20:48 |
| Rockyg | well, wouldn't it really be bikeshedding :-) | 20:48 |
| mordred | ttx: I just wanted to remove the word should | 20:49 |
| jroll | mordred: I purge sometimes :) | 20:49 |
| mordred | "OpenStack leaders should hold their positions only in order to serve" to "OpenStack leaders hold their positions in order to serve" | 20:49 |
| ttx | I think we can refine the wording but I think it is a key principle we have | 20:49 |
| fungi | mordred: yeah, an ietf reading of "should" there waters it down, agreed | 20:49 |
| Rockyg | dang dhellmann totally type faster... | 20:49 |
| mordred | fungi: yah. the ietf infects my brain | 20:49 |
| fungi | i prefer an ietf "must" | 20:49 |
| ttx | mordred: yes, I kind of agree with you here | 20:49 |
| mordred | I think it's great though - maybe that's a follow up patch? | 20:50 |
| jroll | mmm, yeah, that's a good point | 20:50 |
| dhellmann | mordred : ++ to removing | 20:50 |
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| ttx | maybe jroll can ninja it | 20:50 |
| mordred | same with the TC line - the PTL line is good | 20:50 |
| jroll | I could | 20:50 |
| * dhellmann makes sound effects to go with jroll's ninja-ing | 20:50 | |
| ttx | clickety click | 20:50 |
| jroll | ninja'd | 20:51 |
| dhellmann | ttx: I didn't know you were a foley artist | 20:51 |
| ttx | jroll: stopped the wallclock, ninja time 8.33Sec | 20:51 |
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| jroll | ttx: I'm slow today because sitting on the couch | 20:52 |
| ttx | reapply votes ad lib | 20:52 |
| dims | jroll : "contributors to and users"...sounds slightly off | 20:52 |
| dtroyer | dims "and users of" | 20:52 |
| ttx | "contributors to and users of" | 20:52 |
| jroll | dims: "contributors to and users of" | 20:52 |
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| jroll | contributors to the project and users of the project | 20:53 |
| ttx | I did a double read on that one too | 20:53 |
| jroll | would be the long form | 20:53 |
| dims | kk | 20:53 |
| jroll | happy to do grammar-y things in a follow-up if this is hard to read :) | 20:53 |
| dhellmann | I think you want some commas: contributors to, and users of, ... | 20:53 |
| ttx | dims: nitpicking accepted, we can now proceed | 20:53 |
| ttx | the check queue is on fire today | 20:54 |
| dims | hehe, i already voted | 20:54 |
| ttx | approved | 20:54 |
| ttx | #topic Open discussion | 20:54 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:54 | |
| ttx | One change I wanted to attract your attention on is the Neutron project cleanup patch | 20:54 |
| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/392010/ | 20:54 |
| ttx | In particular I was wondering if neutron-vpnaas can be un-officialized this fast, since it was assert:follows-standard-deprecation | 20:54 |
| ttx | I wonder if we should not mandate a longer path for that one | 20:54 |
| jroll | quick note, I'll have a patch to clean up a couple ironic governance things sometime this week | 20:55 |
| ttx | (otherwise there is a risk of depreciating the protection supposedly offered by this tag) | 20:55 |
| mordred | I think we should ... HOWEVER ... it apparently has no humans | 20:55 |
| mordred | so we may be finding ourselves in a tricky spot | 20:55 |
| jroll | (ironic clarified what does and doesn't belong, and also has a dead project or two) | 20:55 |
| ttx | yeah... hopefully it doesn't have any user either | 20:55 |
| dhellmann | if it's going to bypass the deprecation period, we need to make a lot of noise about that so any users do know | 20:56 |
| ttx | mordred: in an ideal world the thread on -ops that the deprecation process would raise would confirm that there is no user | 20:56 |
| ttx | and if there are, could trigger them to actually take it over | 20:56 |
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| fungi | similar questions were raised in one of the teams' driver removal discussions | 20:56 |
| dhellmann | we have a nice long list of patches related to the cycle goal already | 20:56 |
| dhellmann | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:goal-remove-incubated-oslo-code | 20:56 |
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| ttx | mordred: though in all fairness they are not removing the feature | 20:57 |
| ttx | so /technically/ nothing is deprecated or removed | 20:57 |
| ttx | just left to bitrot | 20:58 |
| fungi | i guess at some point ttx will just fast-approve the topic:goal-remove-incubated-oslo-code changes that have sufficient roll-call +1 right? | 20:58 |
| amrith | to all new TC members, I offered to post this PSA in the TC meeting today for gothicmindfood who isn't able to attend. Would you please let her know what your schedule looks like to attend the TC training similar to the one which was conducted earlier this year. Thanks! | 20:58 |
| ttx | fungi: yes | 20:58 |
| ttx | anyway, if you carte one way or another, please chime on the patch. We'll likely review that one next week | 20:58 |
| ttx | care* | 20:58 |
| dtroyer | amrith: I heard her say 'next year' in BCN, do you know if that is still the case? | 20:59 |
| ttx | "2017" | 20:59 |
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| ttx | FYI PTG registration should officially open today or tomorrow | 20:59 |
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| ttx | depending on how much energy I have left to review forms and web pages | 20:59 |
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| ttx | and time is up | 21:00 |
| amrith | dtroyer, I believe that you are correct. let me check if she provided me with some dates. | 21:00 |
| dhellmann | fungi : yes, the approval rules are at http://governance.openstack.org/reference/house-rules.html#goal-updates-from-ptls | 21:00 |
| amrith | I don't think so though | 21:00 |
| amrith | one second, will catch you | 21:00 |
| ttx | Thanks everyone! | 21:00 |
| amrith | on some other channel if not this one | 21:00 |
| jroll | thanks ttx | 21:00 |
| ttx | #endmeeting | 21:00 |
| amrith | thx ttx | 21:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 21:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Nov 8 21:00:32 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2016/tc.2016-11-08-20.01.html | 21:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2016/tc.2016-11-08-20.01.txt | 21:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2016/tc.2016-11-08-20.01.log.html | 21:00 |
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