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| anteaya | #startmeeting third-party | 08:01 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Sep 15 08:01:18 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is anteaya. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 08:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 08:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: third-party)" | 08:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'third_party' | 08:01 |
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| eantyshev | hello! | 08:01 |
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| kaisers | hi | 08:02 |
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| anteaya | hello eantyshev and kaisers | 08:03 |
| anteaya | what shall we talk about today? | 08:03 |
| kaisers | I've a question regarding the manila tempest plugin? | 08:03 |
| eantyshev | i have nothing in particular | 08:03 |
| kaisers | Should i go? | 08:03 |
| kaisers | s/go/start/ | 08:04 |
| anteaya | kaisers: go ahead | 08:05 |
| kaisers | ok, thnx | 08:05 |
| anteaya | somthing so specific I don't know if I can aswer | 08:05 |
| anteaya | but let's hear the question | 08:05 |
| kaisers | Basically i try to follow the manila tempest setup howto: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Manila/docs/HOWTO_use_tempest_with_manila | 08:05 |
| kaisers | (my issue ist most likely general to tempest plugins) | 08:05 |
| kaisers | But i cannot run tests after installation, always get the following error: http://paste.openstack.org/show/462555/ | 08:06 |
| anteaya | or manila | 08:06 |
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| kaisers | :) | 08:06 |
| kaisers | Basically i think i'm doing something wrong during config/setup | 08:06 |
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| kaisers | That final invocation error turns up on pretty much everything i run with tox / tests. | 08:07 |
| kaisers | E.g. just for testing i started the cinder volume tests (i'm more familiar with those) | 08:07 |
| anteaya | that is a long wikipage | 08:07 |
| kaisers | and the result was a similiar error message in the end | 08:08 |
| anteaya | I'm thinking this is a manila issue | 08:08 |
| anteaya | have you asked any mainila developers? | 08:08 |
| anteaya | or attended the manila weekly meeting? | 08:08 |
| kaisers | Not so far, will do today | 08:08 |
| kaisers | meeting is on thursday, i wanted to ask here if somebody has experienced similar things | 08:09 |
| anteaya | #link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/#Manila_Team_Meeting | 08:09 |
| anteaya | ah okay great | 08:09 |
| anteaya | good question | 08:09 |
| anteaya | I personally have not | 08:09 |
| anteaya | nor have I had that question before | 08:09 |
| anteaya | eantyshev: any manila experience? | 08:09 |
| kaisers | ok, that interesting | 08:09 |
| kaisers | I thought i'd seen similiar months ago when setting up the first Cinder CI system but could not remember exactly. That's why i thought of asking here. | 08:10 |
| kaisers | ok, neverming. I'll talk to the manila folks | 08:10 |
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| kaisers | s/neverming/nevermind/ | 08:10 |
| eantyshev | nope, but I would try to list all available testcases, like that: tox -evenv -- testr list-tests | 08:10 |
| kaisers | ok, trying | 08:11 |
| kaisers | hmm, command works, definitely missing the required tests. :) | 08:11 |
| anteaya | eantyshev: nice suggestion, thank you | 08:11 |
| kaisers | so the tests are not added | 08:11 |
| anteaya | kaisers: great | 08:11 |
| anteaya | nice to have that confirmation | 08:12 |
| kaisers | yep | 08:12 |
| kaisers | thanks! | 08:12 |
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| anteaya | do we have anything else to discuss today? | 08:12 |
| kaisers | I'll dig on from here, thanks so far | 08:12 |
| kaisers | not right now | 08:12 |
| anteaya | wounderful kaisers | 08:12 |
| anteaya | okay great | 08:12 |
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| anteaya | do you think I should keep the meeting open? | 08:13 |
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| anteaya | or should I close it? | 08:13 |
| kaisers | Probably not, or close it after a quarter | 08:13 |
| kaisers | (like in 2mins) | 08:13 |
| anteaya | okay | 08:13 |
| anteaya | I can wait 2 minutes | 08:14 |
| anteaya | thanks kaisers | 08:14 |
| kaisers | At least here we call it the 'academic quarter' and you're expected to arrive in the first quarter... :) | 08:14 |
| kaisers | Thank you for hosting! | 08:14 |
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| anteaya | fair enough | 08:14 |
| eantyshev | we have some need in extra tempest testcases, to test something like: https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1486204 | 08:14 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1486204 in OpenStack Compute (nova) "libvirt: user specified volume device names are not ignored" [Undecided,In progress] - Assigned to Maxim Nestratov (mnestratov) | 08:14 |
| anteaya | thank you for participating | 08:14 |
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| eantyshev | Is there any possibility to have such testcaste in upstream? | 08:15 |
| anteaya | eantyshev: is anyone from your team offering new tempest testcases? | 08:15 |
| anteaya | well tempest is a qa project | 08:16 |
| anteaya | but they accept patches | 08:16 |
| anteaya | and someone writing tests is helpful | 08:16 |
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| anteaya | so perhaps either ask in the qa channel about writing a new tempest test | 08:16 |
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| eantyshev | it means that tempest should be discussed in other channel, right& | 08:17 |
| anteaya | or just offer a patch and explain clearly in the commit message the motivation for the patch | 08:17 |
| anteaya | well just that I know very little about it | 08:17 |
| anteaya | but tempest accepts patches | 08:17 |
| eantyshev | ok, I'll contact them when I have the testcase, it is not ready yet | 08:18 |
| anteaya | okay | 08:18 |
| anteaya | or you can contact them to see if they have any thoughts on if you should create the test case | 08:18 |
| eantyshev | just wanted to ask about policies, and it is clear, thanks | 08:18 |
| anteaya | great | 08:18 |
| anteaya | yay for clear policies | 08:19 |
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| eantyshev | nothing else from me today | 08:19 |
| anteaya | you can just post in the qa channel, I'm going to work on a patch to offer this test case for tempest | 08:19 |
| anteaya | and see if someone replies with guidance | 08:19 |
| anteaya | if none, write the test case | 08:19 |
| anteaya | if you get guidance, follow the guidance | 08:20 |
| anteaya | and thanks | 08:20 |
| anteaya | always nice to see you | 08:20 |
| eantyshev | good idea, hope it'll save me time! | 08:20 |
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| anteaya | that is the intent yes :) | 08:20 |
| anteaya | I'll close up the meeting today | 08:20 |
| kaisers | ok, thanks & bye | 08:20 |
| anteaya | thanks for participating | 08:20 |
| eantyshev | bye! | 08:20 |
| anteaya | see you next week | 08:20 |
| anteaya | #endmeeting | 08:20 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 08:20 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Sep 15 08:20:55 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 08:20 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/third_party/2015/third_party.2015-09-15-08.01.html | 08:20 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/third_party/2015/third_party.2015-09-15-08.01.txt | 08:20 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/third_party/2015/third_party.2015-09-15-08.01.log.html | 08:20 |
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| alex_xu_ | #startmeeting nova api | 12:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Sep 15 12:00:18 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is alex_xu_. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 12:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 12:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: nova api)" | 12:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'nova_api' | 12:00 |
| alex_xu_ | who is here today? | 12:00 |
| johnthetubaguy | o/ | 12:00 |
| oomichi | hi | 12:01 |
| alex_xu_ | hello johnthetubaguy oomichi | 12:01 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: Nihao | 12:01 |
| alex_xu_ | waiting one more minutes if more people join in | 12:01 |
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| alex_xu_ | oomichi: Nihao :) | 12:01 |
| gmann_ | hi | 12:02 |
| alex_xu_ | gmann_: hi | 12:02 |
| alex_xu_ | ok, let's get start the meeting | 12:02 |
| alex_xu_ | #topic actions from last meeting | 12:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: nova api)" | 12:02 | |
| alex_xu_ | alex_xu open a bug for fix the hostname | 12:02 |
| alex_xu_ | I created one | 12:02 |
| alex_xu_ | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1495388 | 12:02 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1495388 in OpenStack Compute (nova) "The instance hostname didn't match the RFC 952 and 1123's definition" [Undecided,Incomplete] | 12:02 |
| alex_xu_ | looks like already get some feedback | 12:02 |
| alex_xu_ | is there anyone interesting work in more detail on this? | 12:03 |
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| johnthetubaguy | interested in seeing it fixed, but other than that, worth answering the questions on there I guess | 12:03 |
| johnthetubaguy | maybe link to the IRC meeting | 12:04 |
| alex_xu_ | yea | 12:04 |
| gmann_ | yea that will be nice | 12:04 |
| alex_xu_ | at least I think this isn't release block bug, right? | 12:04 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: the corresponding schema was changed 2 week ago, right? | 12:05 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, I don't think it blocks the release | 12:05 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: yes, maybe one week | 12:05 |
| johnthetubaguy | although still would like it fixed | 12:05 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: the server name | 12:05 |
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| oomichi | alex_xu_: if so, how about reverting the patch and re-doing it only for v2.0? | 12:06 |
| oomichi | as one option | 12:06 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: the server name fixed didn't effect this bug | 12:06 |
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| oomichi | really? I am misunderstanding something | 12:07 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: I guess the schema contains hostname definition as a server name. | 12:07 |
| johnthetubaguy | so we let spaces in for v2.1 compat | 12:07 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: yes, the server name fixing just enable some spaces in the middle, those spaces will strip in the hostname | 12:08 |
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| johnthetubaguy | that kinda re-creates the bug we always had with v2.0 | 12:08 |
| johnthetubaguy | so its not really a regression as such | 12:08 |
| johnthetubaguy | more an un-fixed thing | 12:08 |
| oomichi | the rfc doesn't allow spaces in the middle, right? | 12:09 |
| gmann_ | yea, rfc does not allow | 12:09 |
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| gmann_ | but hostname going to strip those | 12:09 |
| johnthetubaguy | right, its not allowed in a hostname | 12:09 |
| johnthetubaguy | but its totally fine in a display name | 12:09 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: this https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/master/nova/utils.py#L774 will strip out that | 12:10 |
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| johnthetubaguy | we happen to mess that up and it does both | 12:10 |
| alex_xu_ | so with server name fix, we didn't change anything about hostname | 12:10 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah | 12:10 |
| oomichi | but actually, some projects are using it wrongly, so current implementation is fine for me. | 12:10 |
| johnthetubaguy | its not clean, but we are restoring what happens with v2.0, as we have to | 12:10 |
| johnthetubaguy | nova-network adds the name into DHCP, for flat DHCP, if I remember correctly | 12:11 |
| gmann_ | alex_xu_: johnthetubaguy :that hostname is being used for each server in DNS entry etc right? | 12:11 |
| johnthetubaguy | it does some clean up, but not enough | 12:11 |
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| johnthetubaguy | that bug is saying, go fix the rest | 12:11 |
| alex_xu_ | gmann_: yea | 12:12 |
| oomichi | gmann_: yeah, that was the reason why we used the hostname definition for server name | 12:13 |
| gmann_ | oomichi: yea. | 12:13 |
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| alex_xu_ | oomichi: but the spaces in the name is used by actually user | 12:13 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: yeah, nice point. | 12:13 |
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| alex_xu_ | oomichi: so the user code was broken by that | 12:13 |
| gmann_ | as other resource display name | 12:13 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: I was surprised that happened in openstack projects. but the existing users are doing it. | 12:14 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: yea | 12:14 |
| alex_xu_ | so let us fix the hostname | 12:14 |
| alex_xu_ | in that bug | 12:14 |
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| oomichi | gmann_: can we separate these names on API call ? | 12:15 |
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| johnthetubaguy | the ship has sailed here, v2.0 does what it does | 12:15 |
| gmann_ | oomichi: yea but in that case we need to take both as separate input from user | 12:15 |
| johnthetubaguy | we can consider better APIs for later microversions, but I think we should move on | 12:15 |
| alex_xu_ | +1 | 12:15 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: +1 and -1 | 12:16 |
| gmann_ | may be excepting hostname from user along with display name but that should bein mocroversion | 12:16 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: at this time, it is hard to decide it but it did break our microversions contract. | 12:16 |
| gmann_ | oomichi: yea that is my worry also :( | 12:17 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: if reverting it back and doing it only for v2.0, we can revert the contract also | 12:17 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: but that means we will face the same problem again on these projects. | 12:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | I don't remember what we decided on that now | 12:17 |
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| oomichi | so I can accept current implementation | 12:17 |
| johnthetubaguy | as its a relax not a restriction, I am less worried | 12:18 |
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| johnthetubaguy | v2.0 compat mode needs to accept them, beyond that, I can be persuaded either way I think | 12:18 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I thought we only relaxed it for v2.0 compat mode? did we do it for all versions in the end? | 12:19 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: completely agree that v2.0 compatible mode should accept the name contains spaces | 12:19 |
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| gmann_ | johnthetubaguy: yea its all version | 12:19 |
| alex_xu_ | yea, we did it for all version | 12:19 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: but the patch has changed v2.1 also | 12:19 |
| alex_xu_ | because we think it is bug | 12:19 |
| oomichi | without microversion bump | 12:19 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: yeah, right | 12:20 |
| johnthetubaguy | oomichi: it can't have a bump, well a bump makes little sense, because it affects older versions | 12:20 |
| gmann_ | johnthetubaguy: I remember that point for v2.1 was, v2.0 users can move on v2.1 | 12:20 |
| alaski | NestleWhitey! | 12:20 |
| alaski | gah, wrong window | 12:20 |
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| johnthetubaguy | gmann_: yeah, I just remember deciding I don't mind either way for that thing | 12:21 |
| alaski | sorry | 12:21 |
| oomichi | alaski: hi :) | 12:21 |
| alaski | oomichi: hi :) | 12:21 |
| * alaski lurking | 12:21 | |
| gmann_ | johnthetubaguy: but i like your point that its just a relax not restriction | 12:21 |
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| johnthetubaguy | gmann: successfully request keep succeeding, thats the key thing | 12:22 |
| gmann_ | so old v2.1 users are not effected | 12:22 |
| alex_xu_ | the spaces in the name is real use-case,so we think it is bug. | 12:22 |
| gmann_ | johnthetubaguy: yea | 12:22 |
| alex_xu_ | if it is bug, we should fixed both in v2 and v2.1... | 12:22 |
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| oomichi | we are using v2.1 as standard api on the gate. so if reverting back, the reverting will break the other project gate | 12:22 |
| alex_xu_ | I don't we should revert | 12:23 |
| oomichi | yeah, I can accept it as the bug without the bump | 12:23 |
| gmann_ | +1 | 12:23 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: yeah, we cannot do it | 12:23 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: gmann_ thanks | 12:23 |
| alex_xu_ | so we can move on? | 12:23 |
| gmann_ | so i think we should backport that on kilo too (v2.1)? | 12:23 |
| alex_xu_ | gmann_: yes | 12:23 |
| alex_xu_ | let's move on | 12:24 |
| alex_xu_ | gmann_ post patch put v2.1 compat and v2 legacy jobs as experimental | 12:24 |
| alex_xu_ | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/221608/ | 12:24 |
| gmann_ | because i saw device name thing are done for kilo, matt patch | 12:24 |
| alex_xu_ | gmann_: thanks to gmann_ | 12:24 |
| alex_xu_ | is there anyone interesting in the backport? | 12:24 |
| * bauzas waves super late :( | 12:24 | |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: so the report you pointed first should be closed, right? | 12:25 |
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| alex_xu_ | oomichi: I guess, not | 12:25 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: you mean the hostname bug? | 12:25 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: 1495388 | 12:25 |
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| gmann_ | alex_xu_: i can do backport | 12:25 |
| alex_xu_ | gmann_: thanks | 12:25 |
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| gmann_ | alex_xu_: np | 12:25 |
| alex_xu_ | #action gmann_ backport the server name fix | 12:25 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1495388 | 12:26 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1495388 in OpenStack Compute (nova) "The instance hostname didn't match the RFC 952 and 1123's definition" [Medium,Incomplete] | 12:26 |
| johnthetubaguy | thats importnat | 12:26 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: I think the bug still existed | 12:26 |
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| oomichi | alex_xu_: why? | 12:26 |
| johnthetubaguy | when we set the hostname, we need to remove spaces, etc, so we can use it as a hostname | 12:26 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: like only one character 'a' | 12:26 |
| johnthetubaguy | as we discussed in last weeks meeting | 12:26 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: and I think that we need more unittest for the hostname | 12:27 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: the bug just for we won't forget this, we need someone take a look at it more | 12:27 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: that is different from server name? | 12:27 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: yes | 12:27 |
| alex_xu_ | if no one interesting on this bug, I can continue take a look at it | 12:28 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: ok, I also will check it later | 12:28 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: thanks | 12:28 |
| oomichi | np:) | 12:28 |
| alex_xu_ | #action alex_xu_ and oomichi take a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1495388 more | 12:28 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1495388 in OpenStack Compute (nova) "The instance hostname didn't match the RFC 952 and 1123's definition" [Medium,Incomplete] | 12:29 |
| alex_xu_ | so let's move on | 12:29 |
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| alex_xu_ | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/221608/ | 12:29 |
| alex_xu_ | hope everybody can review this ^ | 12:29 |
| alex_xu_ | for gate cleanup | 12:29 |
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| alex_xu_ | the last action was "everyone review kenichi's json schema for 2.0 patch - https://review.openstack.org/221129 as a way to enforce differently for v2.0" | 12:29 |
| alex_xu_ | that patch already merged | 12:30 |
| alex_xu_ | thanks to oomichi work on it | 12:30 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: yeah, thanks everyone ;) | 12:30 |
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| alex_xu_ | oomichi: :) | 12:30 |
| alex_xu_ | #topic API Bug | 12:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "API Bug (Meeting topic: nova api)" | 12:30 | |
| alex_xu_ | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1491511 | 12:30 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1491511 in OpenStack Compute (nova) "Behavior change with latest nova paste config" [Critical,In progress] - Assigned to Alex Xu (xuhj) | 12:30 |
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| alex_xu_ | ok...we back to server name again | 12:30 |
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| alex_xu_ | looks like oomichi still doesn't like it | 12:31 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: yeah still -1, sorry | 12:31 |
| johnthetubaguy | what are the outstanding patches on that, just the server name? | 12:31 |
| alex_xu_ | for the strip leading/trailing spaces part | 12:31 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: for all resource names | 12:31 |
| johnthetubaguy | OK, is that the only one now? | 12:31 |
| alex_xu_ | #link https://review.openstack.org/220791 | 12:31 |
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| alex_xu_ | another one for support that fix | 12:32 |
| alex_xu_ | #link https://review.openstack.org/222032 | 12:32 |
| alex_xu_ | johnthetubaguy: yes | 12:32 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, I see that now, cool | 12:32 |
| johnthetubaguy | oomichi: what fix are you wanting to see here? | 12:33 |
| alex_xu_ | at least, if we don't want to fix that, we should close that critical bug first | 12:33 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: I don't want to strip spaces automatically on nova side | 12:33 |
| johnthetubaguy | but thats what v2.0 was doing, in most cases? | 12:33 |
| johnthetubaguy | so we have to do it for the v2.0 compat mode, right? | 12:34 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: that was wrong behavior on v2.0, and we cannot find the reason | 12:34 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: and actual use cases | 12:34 |
| johnthetubaguy | oomichi: but thats irrelavant, it could be adding "@" for every space, and we would have to copy it | 12:34 |
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| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: but the patch, we are saying "this is a standard way in nova" | 12:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | v2.0 compat needs to be the same as v2.0 right? | 12:35 |
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| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: the first purpose of v2.0 comp was just for relaxing at the summit | 12:35 |
| johnthetubaguy | oomichi: we are making it consistent for the v2.0 compat, I believe v2.1 actually stops those trailing things being passed it, so it doesn't do anything for v2.1 | 12:35 |
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| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: and I hope we can avoid unreasonable code in v2.1. | 12:36 |
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| johnthetubaguy | oomichi: but we need v2.0 compat to work | 12:37 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I just can't see another option here | 12:37 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: for avoiding breaking the existing users | 12:37 |
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| alex_xu_ | oomichi: yes | 12:37 |
| alex_xu_ | at least that patch avoid breaking some users | 12:37 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: so if we can find actual use cases for that, I +1 on it. | 12:37 |
| johnthetubaguy | right, it keeps v2.1 unchanged, and makes v2.0 compatible | 12:37 |
| alex_xu_ | but indeed part of api not strip the spaces | 12:37 |
| gmann_ | i am worried we have lot many cases to fix for v2.0 comp mode | 12:37 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: but we cannot find it yet | 12:37 |
| gmann_ | and due to lack of testing coverage we do not know those yet | 12:38 |
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| johnthetubaguy | oomichi: the use case is not important, its just what the API does, so it needs to keep doing it | 12:38 |
| johnthetubaguy | its sucks, we all agree that, but it has to stay the same to be compatible | 12:38 |
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| oomichi | so how about running current code without the patch and waiting for the bug report? | 12:38 |
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| oomichi | we can see actual use cases after the report | 12:39 |
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| alex_xu_ | when we remove v2 compat mode? | 12:40 |
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| oomichi | alex_xu_: we can not do that forever, I guess | 12:40 |
| johnthetubaguy | in theory, if we ever increase the min_version, we can drop that code | 12:40 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I can't imagine when that would be, but yeah | 12:40 |
| alex_xu_ | yea, I see, it almost forever | 12:40 |
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| oomichi | then I'd like to keep the code clean without unreasonable code | 12:41 |
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| johnthetubaguy | we need to keep the v2.0 contract though, else folks just will never deploy this compat mode | 12:41 |
| gmann_ | alex_xu_: if all user start liking and move to some great useful microversion :) | 12:41 |
| alex_xu_ | gmann_: yea, hope so | 12:42 |
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| johnthetubaguy | allowing trailing spaces, and then storing in the DB is a massive API change | 12:42 |
| alex_xu_ | yea, at least this patch avoid people breaking | 12:42 |
| johnthetubaguy | we had people compain about us blocking the trailing spaces, hence we are looking at this | 12:42 |
| johnthetubaguy | we need to keep the old behaviour | 12:43 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: are there actual users complaining it? | 12:43 |
| alex_xu_ | one more point | 12:43 |
| alex_xu_ | if we are not strip the spaces, that look like problem for people switch to v2.1 api | 12:43 |
| oomichi | if so, we can see actual use case and I can agree with the patch | 12:43 |
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| johnthetubaguy | oomichi: I thought we did get people with breaking tests for the spaces issue, but I honestly don't remember the details now | 12:44 |
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| johnthetubaguy | oomichi: we can't hope to know how our API is used | 12:44 |
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| johnthetubaguy | our python-novaclient and tempest were both sending bad requests, and we only just spotted that | 12:44 |
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| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: ok, I agree with affecting it to v2.0 comp mode. | 12:45 |
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| johnthetubaguy | oomichi: so thats all the patch does | 12:45 |
| johnthetubaguy | as I understand it, anyway | 12:45 |
| oomichi | but I'd like to find the more clean way | 12:45 |
| johnthetubaguy | oomichi: can we merge the behavior fix, then do a refactor then? | 12:46 |
| oomichi | at least, I'd like to say "this behavior is not standard" anyway ;) | 12:46 |
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| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: when is the deadline? | 12:46 |
| gmann_ | johnthetubaguy: how we will find such more cases (v2.0 comp mode), wait for bug report and fix case by case? | 12:46 |
| johnthetubaguy | oomichi: we have a release in a few weeks, I would rather we fixed it before then | 12:46 |
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| johnthetubaguy | gmann_: so liberty turns it on by default, that should help force the issue | 12:47 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: ok, thanks. I will +1 on the patch if I cannot find it this week | 12:47 |
| alex_xu_ | oomichi: thanks | 12:47 |
| johnthetubaguy | gmann_: that switch is how we came across all these | 12:47 |
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| gmann_ | johnthetubaguy: ohk | 12:48 |
| alex_xu_ | ok, so we agree on continue this fix, at least oomichi will take a look at it | 12:48 |
| oomichi | alex_xu_: I agree :) | 12:48 |
| johnthetubaguy | oomichi: 21st september is about the date RC1 is expected | 12:48 |
| oomichi | johnthetubaguy: ok, thanks | 12:49 |
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| gmann_ | johnthetubaguy: rax tried it or after liberty release? | 12:49 |
| johnthetubaguy | so it would be good to get one of those fixes merged by friday | 12:49 |
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| alex_xu_ | #action oomichi will take a look at https://review.openstack.org/220791 more to find out more clean way | 12:49 |
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| alex_xu_ | ok, so the time is tight | 12:50 |
| johnthetubaguy | gmann_: its not been tried yet, mostly as we are waiting for all the known bugs to be fixed first, and then we have to port all our old extensions into v2.0 compat mode, somehow | 12:50 |
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| oomichi | WARN: 10 mins left | 12:51 |
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| gmann_ | johnthetubaguy: ok | 12:51 |
| alex_xu_ | so let's move on | 12:51 |
| alex_xu_ | #link https://review.openstack.org/222033 | 12:51 |
| alex_xu_ | It is broken by changing the object's name field to enum. It is broken after v2.1 release, but I think it's fine, as this API only used by openstack service internal. So I want to fix it without microversion. | 12:51 |
| alex_xu_ | anyway I don't this important bug | 12:51 |
| alex_xu_ | if agree one this, we can move on, and people review it off the meeting | 12:52 |
| alex_xu_ | s/one/on/ | 12:52 |
| johnthetubaguy | alex_xu_: its a 500 error, never a need for a bump | 12:53 |
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| alex_xu_ | johnthetubaguy: it is restrict the name validation | 12:53 |
| alex_xu_ | johnthetubaguy: before it is anytihng in the name. now it is enum. | 12:53 |
| alex_xu_ | anyway I don't it need a bump also | 12:53 |
| johnthetubaguy | alex_xu_: its 500->400 that seems fine | 12:54 |
| alex_xu_ | johnthetubaguy: ok, cool | 12:54 |
| alex_xu_ | so let's move on? | 12:54 |
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| alex_xu_ | #topic Removal of v3 naming from source tree | 12:54 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Removal of v3 naming from source tree (Meeting topic: nova api)" | 12:54 | |
| gmann_ | alex_xu_: yea 500->400 seems fine. | 12:54 |
| alex_xu_ | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/nova+branch:master+topic:bug/1462901,n,z | 12:54 |
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| alex_xu_ | gmann_: thanks | 12:54 |
| johnthetubaguy | so I have an issue with this one: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/223071/3 | 12:54 |
| johnthetubaguy | can we just delete the ViewBuilderV21 classes? | 12:55 |
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| johnthetubaguy | should we not have v2.0 and v2.1 being the same? | 12:55 |
| johnthetubaguy | I guess I am missing something? | 12:55 |
| johnthetubaguy | squashed together extensions maybe? | 12:55 |
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| oomichi | I can dig it later | 12:56 |
| alex_xu_ | johnthetubaguy: good question...at least I know some of extension merged in the v2.1 API, so the viewbuilder will be different. the v2.1 viewbuilder will add some extend attribute which in the v2 | 12:56 |
| gmann_ | but can we do that before we remove extension support for v2.0 | 12:56 |
| alex_xu_ | gmann_: it already did | 12:57 |
| johnthetubaguy | lets dig in that review | 12:57 |
| alex_xu_ | anyway, let us check that more in the review | 12:57 |
| gmann_ | alex_xu_: but only deprecated not removed | 12:57 |
| johnthetubaguy | I want to cover the docs though, since thats the most important thing for us to work on right now | 12:57 |
| alex_xu_ | #topic API Documentation Improvement | 12:57 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "API Documentation Improvement (Meeting topic: nova api)" | 12:57 | |
| gmann_ | yea | 12:57 |
| annegentle | olla | 12:57 |
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| alex_xu_ | I remember we say we need improve the concept doc | 12:57 |
| johnthetubaguy | so where are we ant with the concepts guide update? | 12:57 |
| johnthetubaguy | I know sdauge was hoping to take a look at one point, not sure if he has managed that | 12:58 |
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| johnthetubaguy | I see this as release critical really, more so than the v3 rename patches | 12:58 |
| alex_xu_ | yea, he isn't here today, let me catch him when he online | 12:58 |
| alex_xu_ | yea | 12:58 |
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| alex_xu_ | so let me catch sdague later | 12:59 |
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| alex_xu_ | annegentle: sorry, no more update at here today :( | 12:59 |
| * bauzas hopes noone will say WSME autodocs | 12:59 | |
| annegentle | nope | 12:59 |
| alex_xu_ | bauzas: we have swagger | 13:00 |
| annegentle | I think I owe sdague a publishing job but I can't get the "run across repos" working | 13:00 |
| annegentle | still, we are publishing what we have so far | 13:00 |
| alex_xu_ | let word, we may need begin to thing about summit and the thing for M release | 13:00 |
| alex_xu_ | we may need discussion that in next few meeting | 13:00 |
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| alex_xu_ | annegentle: | 13:00 |
| alex_xu_ | annegentle: ok | 13:00 |
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| alex_xu_ | anything it time to close meeting | 13:00 |
| alex_xu_ | thanks all | 13:00 |
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| oomichi | thanks | 13:01 |
| alex_xu_ | #endmeeting | 13:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 13:01 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Sep 15 13:01:04 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 13:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_api/2015/nova_api.2015-09-15-12.00.html | 13:01 |
| gmann_ | thanks everyone | 13:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_api/2015/nova_api.2015-09-15-12.00.txt | 13:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_api/2015/nova_api.2015-09-15-12.00.log.html | 13:01 |
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| Qiming | #startmeeting senlin | 13:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Sep 15 13:01:37 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is Qiming. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 13:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 13:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: senlin)" | 13:01 | |
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| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'senlin' | 13:01 |
| gongysh | qiming: ping | 13:01 |
| Qiming | hi, gongysh, welcome | 13:01 |
| yanyanhu | hi | 13:02 |
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| haiwei | hi | 13:02 |
| elynn | Hi | 13:02 |
| Qiming | please add topics to the agenda: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/SenlinAgenda | 13:02 |
| yanyanhu | hi, elynn | 13:02 |
| jruano | hello | 13:02 |
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| Qiming | #topic liberty work items | 13:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "liberty work items (Meeting topic: senlin)" | 13:03 | |
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| Qiming | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/senlin-liberty-workitems | 13:03 |
| Qiming | container cluster work | 13:03 |
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| yanyanhu | just cleaned some completed workitems this afternoon | 13:04 |
| Qiming | I think we will get an update from the SUR team tomorrow | 13:04 |
| Qiming | I was contacted by our team there yesterday, however, I was trapped by a two-day long meeting ... | 13:04 |
| Qiming | thanks, yanyanhu | 13:04 |
| gongysh | what is SUR team? | 13:04 |
| jruano | keep me posted with the update from the team | 13:05 |
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| Qiming | it is a Shared University Research project we had with Tongji Univ | 13:05 |
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| Qiming | sure, jruano, will post an update to the team after I get inputs from them tomorrow | 13:06 |
| Qiming | the team has been doing a great job in prototyping a container cluster using senlin | 13:06 |
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| Qiming | it was done in the context of magnum | 13:06 |
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| gongysh | Qiming, it seems you should change your network provider | 13:07 |
| Qiming | if anyone is interested in that work, please let me know | 13:07 |
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| Qiming | gongysh, yep, my network connection just broke | 13:08 |
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| Qiming | also, jruano and I just had a phone call on the TOSCA collaboration | 13:08 |
| Qiming | we will try leverage the standard to make senlin a very generic service for managing clusters | 13:09 |
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| Qiming | that also means we will try support container clusters as one of the killer apps | 13:09 |
| jruano | yes it is very exciting. i will try to see if i can share that work with the team | 13:10 |
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| Qiming | jruano, yes, totally agree | 13:10 |
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| gongysh | qiming, do we have a doc about that? | 13:10 |
| Qiming | maybe we can schedule an online session in senlin channel for this | 13:10 |
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| jruano | sure | 13:11 |
| Qiming | sharing with the team what we have today, what's the mid-term, long-term plan | 13:11 |
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| jruano | gongysh, there is a preliminary document we are working on within tosca. i think that is public. i will double check, and share out what i can | 13:11 |
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| jruano | in terms of an online session for the team, i will schedule something shortly. | 13:13 |
| Qiming | thanks jruano | 13:13 |
| jruano | kind of what we are thinking, and what is the vision | 13:13 |
| jruano | and how it aligns with senlin | 13:13 |
| Qiming | yep, we need to bring anyone onto the same page | 13:14 |
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| Qiming | okay, next topic? | 13:14 |
| Qiming | #topic summit preparation | 13:14 |
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| Qiming | a good news to share with you | 13:15 |
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| Qiming | we were just notified that one of our talk proposals was accepted | 13:15 |
| elynn | cool | 13:15 |
| yanyanhu | great! | 13:15 |
| jruano | awesome | 13:15 |
| Qiming | it was accepted before as "alternative" | 13:16 |
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| haiwei | which one | 13:16 |
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| Qiming | since there was a cancellation, we are now having a timeslot: Thursday October 29th, 9:50am- 10:30 | 13:16 |
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| yanyanhu | haiwei, the one how senlin works with magnum I think | 13:16 |
| Qiming | topic: Exploring Magnum and Senlin integration for autoscaling containers | 13:16 |
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| Qiming | in the Containers track | 13:16 |
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| jruano | very cool | 13:17 |
| haiwei | great | 13:17 |
| Qiming | I'll let the SUR team know that as well | 13:17 |
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| Qiming | it will be the first public show case for the project | 13:17 |
| Qiming | we really need to get it done well | 13:18 |
| yanyanhu | yep, try our best to ensure it's impressive :P | 13:18 |
| Qiming | another thing for the summit prep is some kind of meetup | 13:18 |
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| Qiming | since the number of meeting rooms is very very limited | 13:19 |
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| Qiming | even if we want to schedule something, we can only have a round-table discussion | 13:19 |
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| haiwei | can we do it outside? | 13:19 |
| Qiming | certainly | 13:20 |
| yanyanhu | Qiming, I think this is ok. The most important thing is to have a chance to make a discussion together :) | 13:20 |
| jruano | what day were you thinking. yes outside is another option | 13:20 |
| Qiming | I think most participants to the summit will have their own schedule | 13:21 |
| jruano | i am there monday through friday. although friday probably wanted to do some sightseeing | 13:21 |
| Qiming | in just 4 days, a lot of things to catch up, to watch, to listen, to communicate | 13:21 |
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| Qiming | we will need to find a timeslot that works for most of us | 13:21 |
| yanyanhu | maybe in break time? | 13:22 |
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| yanyanhu | we can have a meal together :) | 13:22 |
| Qiming | #action Qiming to start a poll on the time for team meetup during summit | 13:22 |
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| Qiming | definitely, yanyanhu | 13:22 |
| Qiming | I'll create a poll and send it to the mailinglist | 13:23 |
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| yanyanhu | ok | 13:23 |
| Qiming | I know there are some web apps that can help us do this | 13:23 |
| Qiming | #topic mitaka planning | 13:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "mitaka planning (Meeting topic: senlin)" | 13:24 | |
| Qiming | while I'm still trying to create a POC release for senlin, it's time for the team to think about next cycle | 13:24 |
| Qiming | what are the goals we want to achieve during the next 6 month | 13:25 |
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| yanyanhu | yea, and we need a plan for each 2 month | 13:26 |
| Qiming | something above my head, for everyone to think about | 13:26 |
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| Qiming | we will need to do the same, list things on an etherpad page, prioritize them, and track them there | 13:26 |
| elynn | yes | 13:26 |
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| Qiming | em ... why don't we just start input things now ... | 13:27 |
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| yanyanhu | and also BP I think. We still didn't use it well currently | 13:27 |
| Qiming | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/senlin-mitaka-workitems | 13:27 |
| haiwei | Is it mostly the same with the TODO.rst? | 13:28 |
| Qiming | yes, yanyanhu, the reason is that we were not adding big features | 13:28 |
| Qiming | haiwei, you can dump things from TODO list to the etherpad | 13:28 |
| yanyanhu | yes | 13:29 |
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| Qiming | I'm typing in the etherpad | 13:30 |
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| Qiming | em ... done | 13:32 |
| elynn | ok, lots of things need to be done. | 13:32 |
| Qiming | haven't looked at the TODO.rst file and the FEATURES.rst file yet | 13:32 |
| yanyanhu | so one of the most important works is implementing those policies for scaling and HA | 13:33 |
| janonymous | hey senlin group | 13:33 |
| janonymous | Hi Qiming | 13:33 |
| Qiming | elynn, yes, lots of things, we need to work on the list to prioritize things | 13:33 |
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| Qiming | hi, janonymous | 13:33 |
| Qiming | welcome | 13:34 |
| Qiming | we cannot get everything done in a single cycle | 13:34 |
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| yanyanhu | hi, janonymous | 13:34 |
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| janonymous | yanyanhu: hi | 13:34 |
| Qiming | you helps are needed to review the items and prioritize them | 13:34 |
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| Qiming | feel free to add things you think are important | 13:35 |
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| Qiming | for the placement policy, we already have a WIP from Cindia | 13:36 |
| yanyanhu | yea, and sign you name after the workitem you're gonna work on ;) | 13:36 |
| janonymous | Haha. | 13:36 |
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| elynn | : ) | 13:36 |
| Qiming | we need more hands, more eyes, :) | 13:36 |
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| janonymous | you got my eyes :) | 13:37 |
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| Qiming | cool | 13:37 |
| janonymous | I could help review but +1 won't matter i guess :( | 13:37 |
| Qiming | janonymous, it matters | 13:37 |
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| Qiming | we respect all reviews | 13:38 |
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| janonymous | Qiming: I'll try to review things | 13:39 |
| Qiming | thanks | 13:39 |
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| Qiming | please think hard team, what do you want to see in senlin | 13:40 |
| Qiming | it won't be a one night job, let's keep working on that | 13:40 |
| yanyanhu | definitely | 13:40 |
| Qiming | #topic open discussions | 13:41 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussions (Meeting topic: senlin)" | 13:41 | |
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| Qiming | just realized that we need to have Heat resource types for Senlin | 13:42 |
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| elynn | yes | 13:42 |
| elynn | to show capabilities to replace ASG | 13:43 |
| Qiming | yep | 13:43 |
| Qiming | we can place them under contrib if needed | 13:43 |
| Qiming | the earlier the better | 13:43 |
| elynn | I can work on that | 13:43 |
| yanyanhu | cool | 13:43 |
| Qiming | getting some early feedbacks from heat team is very important | 13:44 |
| Qiming | many thanks, elynn | 13:44 |
| Qiming | anything else? | 13:44 |
| elynn | I will prepare a spec for it and you guys need to review it. | 13:45 |
| Qiming | or questsions? | 13:45 |
| yanyanhu | hi, Qiming, about the release of senlin service | 13:45 |
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| Qiming | yes, yanyanhu | 13:45 |
| Qiming | I have been working on that last week | 13:45 |
| yanyanhu | so we need to finish those workitems left in ethpad before that? | 13:45 |
| Qiming | I tried to create a release for senlinclient first, so that it can be published on Pypi | 13:46 |
| yanyanhu | all those ones, right? | 13:46 |
| Qiming | it didn't succeed | 13:46 |
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| Qiming | still tring to figure it out | 13:46 |
| yanyanhu | ok | 13:47 |
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| jruano_ | yeah client is probably best to start with | 13:47 |
| Qiming | I think it is fine to do a POC release at this stage | 13:47 |
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| Qiming | I started from senlinclient because it is needed by the senlin-dashboard project anyway | 13:47 |
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| Qiming | need to find a guru on this | 13:48 |
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| Qiming | maybe there is some infra setup missing | 13:48 |
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| Qiming | anything else? | 13:49 |
| jruano_ | someone from our team just did this last week, but he is out this week | 13:49 |
| jruano_ | for heat-translator | 13:49 |
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| Qiming | jruano_, good to know, need some advices from him | 13:49 |
| yanyanhu | yea | 13:49 |
| jruano_ | ill send him a note, but he most likely won't respond until he gets back | 13:50 |
| Qiming | jruano_, are you talking about Sandev ? | 13:50 |
| jruano_ | yeah sahdev | 13:50 |
| haiwei_ | you are back tomorrow? Qiming | 13:50 |
| Qiming | I know him well, :) | 13:50 |
| jruano_ | he just released tosca parser and heat-translator to pypi | 13:50 |
| jruano_ | cool | 13:50 |
| Qiming | yes, haiwei_, back from a loooooong meeting | 13:50 |
| jruano_ | took him some time, but since it is fresh in his mind he might be a good help | 13:50 |
| Qiming | cool, it will save us a lot of time I believe | 13:51 |
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| jruano_ | so, on another topic... in terms of this notion of openstack "big tent", is that something we are working towards in senlin? | 13:51 |
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| Qiming | jruano_, we need to understand the new criteria ... | 13:52 |
| jruano_ | cool | 13:52 |
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| Qiming | if I'm understanding it correctly, it is mostly about some tags that will be applied on individual projects | 13:53 |
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| Qiming | there won't be stackforge projects anymore | 13:53 |
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| Qiming | if you guys know something on this, please let me know | 13:54 |
| jruano_ | yep... maybe we just ask to tag senlin :) | 13:54 |
| Qiming | right. | 13:54 |
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| Qiming | we can learn from some existing reviews | 13:54 |
| jruano_ | ill ask around see if i can find anything else more about it | 13:54 |
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| Qiming | cool | 13:54 |
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| Qiming | still 5 minutes | 13:55 |
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| Qiming | if nothing else for discussion today, let's end this meeting | 13:56 |
| yanyanhu | nope from me | 13:56 |
| Qiming | I'll send emails to you after reviewing the container cluster thread's progress | 13:56 |
| Qiming | thanks for joining | 13:56 |
| Qiming | #endmeeting | 13:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 13:56 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Sep 15 13:56:41 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 13:56 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2015/senlin.2015-09-15-13.01.html | 13:56 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2015/senlin.2015-09-15-13.01.txt | 13:56 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/senlin/2015/senlin.2015-09-15-13.01.log.html | 13:56 |
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| asselin | #startmeeting third-party | 17:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Sep 15 17:00:42 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is asselin. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: third-party)" | 17:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'third_party' | 17:00 |
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| asselin | anyone here for third party working group meeting? | 17:01 |
| ja2 | hi rami | 17:01 |
| sweston | \o | 17:02 |
| asselin | hi ja2 | 17:02 |
| asselin | hi sweston | 17:02 |
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| sweston | asselin: hi! | 17:02 |
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| asselin | patrickeast you around? | 17:02 |
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| asselin | #link agenda https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/ThirdParty#Agenda_for_next_Working_Group_meeting | 17:03 |
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| asselin | #topic announcements | 17:04 |
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| asselin | #link Upcoming backwards incompatible nodepool change: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-infra/2015-September/003185.html | 17:04 |
| asselin | in case you missed it in the mailing list nodepool is going to be updated as part of the move to common-ci | 17:05 |
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| asselin | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/189762/ | 17:05 |
| ja2 | reading that email, "going to be" happened yesterday | 17:05 |
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| asselin | ja2, well it didn't merge yet....but it should in the near future | 17:06 |
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| asselin | this was based on discussion in yesterday's third party meeting | 17:06 |
| ja2 | interesting, it says "deploying... today", but I believe you ;-) | 17:06 |
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| asselin | I suggest you subscribe to the patch to know when it get's +2 and +A :) | 17:08 |
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| asselin | any other questions on this? | 17:08 |
| asselin | #topic Comparison of CI Dashboards: | 17:08 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Comparison of CI Dashboards: (Meeting topic: third-party)" | 17:08 | |
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| asselin | Last time we met we were looking at comparing difference ci dashboard solutions | 17:09 |
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| asselin | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/third-party-ci-dashboard-comp | 17:09 |
| asselin | a few of us got together and populated this etherpad to help ^^ | 17:09 |
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| asselin | patrickeast, you around to discuss scoreboard? | 17:10 |
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| asselin | ja2, have you used any of these ci dashboards? | 17:11 |
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| ja2 | asselin, only via these mtgs. | 17:11 |
| asselin | sweston, I see you have one up now: http://dashboard.triniplex.com/#!/ | 17:11 |
| sweston | open discussion might be a better time for this, but I would like to query folks on how they like the way the information is presented in the current solutions, since I am currently writing the first queries for radar | 17:12 |
| ja2 | ...still beating mine into working order. comparing multiple is, for my z/vm group, for the moment, a good problem we'd like to mature enough to have | 17:12 |
| asselin | sweston, let's discuss it now as it seems it's just the 3 of us now | 17:12 |
| sweston | yup, right now it's just a list of ci systems, not very exciting, but should soon have some good information | 17:12 |
| sweston | ok | 17:13 |
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| asselin | in my opinion, I like the ci-watch infromation | 17:13 |
| asselin | mostly b/c we have a lot of jobs and I care more to see how each one is doing individually than how my ci is doing as a whole | 17:14 |
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| sweston | ok, what is the time window most important to you? | 17:15 |
| sweston | 24 hours? 7 days | 17:15 |
| asselin | ci-watch has fixed time windows such as 24 hours & 7 days. | 17:15 |
| asselin | scoreboard is more flexible | 17:15 |
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| ja2 | looking at these for the first time, I do like the quantity of info available in one glance with ci-watch | 17:16 |
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| asselin | from operator monitoring, I think 24 hours is a good default. | 17:17 |
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| sweston | I was trying to find a query that would catch ci systems reporting failed on a job which Jenkins reports success on, but when I try to combine the queries together I am getting an or result | 17:17 |
| asselin | for 'policing' or trying to find out when something broke 7 days or longer is helpful | 17:17 |
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| sweston | ja2, asselin ok, that helps a lot, thanks | 17:18 |
| ja2 | asselin's answer might hint at a deeper pattern - the view of interest depends on the role the user is playing, so if you're thinking about adding filtering of some sort maybe role is the basis for that. | 17:18 |
| asselin | sweston, I don't think we need such a query at this time. | 17:18 |
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| asselin | ja2 | 17:18 |
| sweston | ok, I hear you | 17:18 |
| asselin | ja2, yes, so ci-watch as an option to highlight when jenkins -1 | 17:18 |
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| asselin | I suggested to skylar last week it's also useful to highlight when jenkins +1 | 17:19 |
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| asselin | sweston, so I think those overlays are useful | 17:19 |
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| sweston | ok | 17:19 |
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| ja2 | sweston, one thing I see is, for a 3PCI, if I get a failure amongst a sea of successes, no apparent way to see which patch it is... the col headers have long-since scrolled off the top | 17:21 |
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| ja2 | ...independent of that, if I'm going triage my first 'ask' would be tell me where my CI disagrees with Jenkins | 17:22 |
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| ja2 | s/going/doing | 17:23 |
| sweston | ja2: I noticed that as well ... I can put floating headers in the UI to account for this | 17:23 |
| asselin | is http://ci-watch.tintri.com/ down for you guys? | 17:23 |
| sweston | asselin: yes, I cannot get to it | 17:24 |
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| sweston | ja2: ok, I will keep your second comment in mind as well | 17:25 |
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| ja2 | asselin, that's what I'm looking at. | 17:26 |
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| ja2 | ...displayed a few minutes ago, seems to be hung refreshing now that I banged that icon | 17:26 |
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| asselin | sweston, when do you think you'll have some queries running? | 17:26 |
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| sweston | asselin: working on them now .. am pretty busy these days, but I think I should have something useful by the end of the week | 17:27 |
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| asselin | ja2, sweston fyi we were using this room to look at the dashboards offline: #openstack-third-party-ci | 17:28 |
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| asselin | we = folks from last meeting | 17:28 |
| sweston | asselin: ok, good to know | 17:28 |
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| ja2 | asselin, not quite grasping how one looks at them offline but that aside "ok" | 17:29 |
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| ja2 | ...I did look in that channel, but nothing visible | 17:30 |
| asselin | ok, well I don't think we have enough people today to make a decision today | 17:30 |
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| asselin | ja2, offline means not in a recorded meeting | 17:30 |
| ja2 | asselin | 17:30 |
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| ja2 | ... ok got it | 17:30 |
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| asselin | #topic Open Discussion | 17:31 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: third-party)" | 17:31 | |
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| asselin | any other topics to bring up or discuss? | 17:31 |
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| sweston | asselin: that's all I had | 17:32 |
| ja2 | asselin, nothing more from me | 17:32 |
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| asselin | ok thanks for attending | 17:33 |
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| asselin | #endmeeting | 17:33 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:33 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Sep 15 17:33:30 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:33 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/third_party/2015/third_party.2015-09-15-17.00.html | 17:33 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/third_party/2015/third_party.2015-09-15-17.00.txt | 17:33 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/third_party/2015/third_party.2015-09-15-17.00.log.html | 17:33 |
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| sweston | asselin: thanks!! | 17:33 |
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| ayoung | KEYSTONE! | 18:00 |
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| ayoung | ajayaa, amakarov, ayoung, breton, browne, davechen, david8hu, dolphm, dstanek, ericksonsantos, geoffarnold, gyee, henrynash, hogepodge, htruta, jamielennox, joesavak, lbragstad, lhcheng, marekd, morganfainberg, nkinder, raildo, rharwood, rodrigods, roxanaghe, samueldmq, stevemar, tsymanczyk, topol, vivekd, wanghong, claudiub | 18:00 |
| ayoung | Keystone time | 18:00 |
| gyee | KEE SI DON | 18:00 |
| amakarov | o/ | 18:00 |
| lbragstad | yo | 18:00 |
| stevemar | na na na na na na na na na KEY-STONE! | 18:00 |
| bknudson | KEYS-TONE | 18:01 |
| tsymanczyk | o/ | 18:01 |
| htruta | stevemar, lol | 18:01 |
| dstanek | o/ | 18:01 |
| stevemar | *wham* *pow* | 18:01 |
| ayoung | Who wants to run this one? | 18:01 |
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| * geoffarnold lurking, laid low with a chest bug | 18:01 | |
| stevemar | i haven't eaten lunch yet, so if someone else could that would be great | 18:01 |
| lhcheng | o/ | 18:01 |
| henrynash | sorryI’mlate | 18:01 |
| ayoung | stevemar, happy to eat your lunch for you | 18:01 |
| jamielennox | hi | 18:02 |
| SheenaG | o/ | 18:02 |
| stevemar | hehe | 18:02 |
| zaro | o/ | 18:02 |
| stevemar | ayoung: i'll run it i guess | 18:02 |
| henrynash | go for it stevemar | 18:02 |
| stevemar | it's been a while | 18:02 |
| * bknudson lurks | 18:02 | |
| stevemar | #startmeeting keystone | 18:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Sep 15 18:02:39 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is stevemar. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:02 | |
| ericksonsantos | o/ | 18:02 |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'keystone' | 18:02 |
| stevemar | bknudson is not allowed to lurk! | 18:02 |
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| lbragstad | busted... | 18:03 |
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| morgan | o/ | 18:03 |
| stevemar | gotta see if i know all the irc meeting commands | 18:03 |
| morgan | #startmeeting keystone | 18:03 |
| openstack | morgan: Error: Can't start another meeting, one is in progress. Use #endmeeting first. | 18:03 |
| henrynash | no litterin, no divin, no lurkin | 18:03 |
| morgan | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/KeystoneMeeting | 18:03 |
| stevemar | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/KeystoneMeeting | 18:03 |
| bknudson | can you tell the difference between me lurking and not lurking? | 18:03 |
| morgan | damn it slow | 18:03 |
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| stevemar | wow short agenda | 18:03 |
| bknudson | too many ptls | 18:03 |
| ekarlso | missing #endmeeting ? :p | 18:03 |
| samueldmq | hey o/ | 18:03 |
| morgan | anyway | 18:03 |
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| bknudson | it's turning into the republican presidential contest | 18:03 |
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| lbragstad | lol | 18:03 |
| ericksonsantos | lol | 18:03 |
| morgan | stevemar: Liberty Release Management Housekeeping | 18:03 |
| stevemar | #topic Liberty Release Management Housekeeping | 18:04 |
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| dolphm | whoever started the previous meeting needs to end it | 18:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Liberty Release Management Housekeeping (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:04 | |
| david8hu | o/ | 18:04 |
| stevemar | ahhh no | 18:04 |
| dolphm | ah, nvm | 18:04 |
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| morgan | dolphm both steve and I started the meeting at the same time | 18:04 |
| morgan | my client was slow | 18:04 |
| dolphm | i missed steve's :) | 18:04 |
| jamielennox | bah - agenda was full when i looked last night and decided to get up | 18:04 |
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| bknudson | you can #chair | 18:04 |
| bknudson | I think | 18:04 |
| * morgan shrugs | 18:04 | |
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| morgan | anyway so this will be stupidly short | 18:04 |
| bknudson | #chair morgan | 18:04 |
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| morgan | tomorrow is the cut off for library releases | 18:04 |
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| morgan | if we are doing more releases of the libraries tomorrow is when they go out before we have a stable/liberty branch | 18:05 |
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| morgan | this means keystoneclient, middleware, keystoneauth, and pycadf will be released. land anything that needs to land today | 18:05 |
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| morgan | once this revision of keystoneclient is released, session and anything that is moving to keystoneauth is frozen | 18:06 |
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| bknudson | we'll probably wind up backporting a fix for https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystonemiddleware/+bug/1494327 to ksm stable | 18:06 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1494327 in keystonemiddleware "DuplicateOptError intermittently breaks UT" [High,In progress] - Assigned to Dave Chen (wei-d-chen) | 18:06 |
| morgan | no more code unless it is a security flaw will be landed | 18:06 |
| raildo | \o | 18:06 |
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| morgan | keystoneauth will likewise be in a holding pattern until we see some adoption (unless there is a bug) - no new features | 18:06 |
| jamielennox | there is a bug in auth_token tests that i don't think has been sorted out | 18:06 |
| stevemar | bknudson: that would be nice | 18:06 |
| morgan | jamielennox: that is why bug fixes will be landed. | 18:07 |
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| morgan | that specifically is something I wna tbefore we cut 1.0.1 if possible | 18:07 |
| morgan | erm. crud ksa vs auth_token | 18:07 |
| morgan | you know what i mean. | 18:07 |
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| morgan | so lets resolve the bug in keystonemiddlewae.auth_token | 18:07 |
| bknudson | there's a couple of proposed fixes, one from dave chen and one from me | 18:08 |
| morgan | lets see if they are landable | 18:08 |
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| morgan | if we can get them in pre-stable cut, it would be easier | 18:08 |
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| morgan | stevemar: #topic Keystone RC1 tracking | 18:09 |
| stevemar | thx morgan | 18:09 |
| stevemar | #topic Keystone RC1 tracking | 18:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Keystone RC1 tracking (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:09 | |
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| bknudson | when is rc1? | 18:09 |
| stevemar | didn't know if you were done | 18:09 |
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| morgan | Liberty RC1 is around the corner.. as in... next week | 18:09 |
| bknudson | keystone seems pretty stable... let's rc1 now | 18:09 |
| henrynash | what’s the status of any FFEs? | 18:10 |
| morgan | I'm going to drop open BPs from RC1 | 18:10 |
| bknudson | sooner we rc sooner we can work on M | 18:10 |
| stevemar | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Liberty_Release_Schedule | 18:10 |
| morgan | since I don't think we have any FFEs | 18:10 |
| morgan | (please correct me if I'm wrong) | 18:10 |
| morgan | approved FFEs | 18:10 |
| stevemar | week of the 21st if the RC period bknudson | 18:10 |
| morgan | that is | 18:10 |
| bknudson | Here's an easy fix: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/203047/ (has 2 +2) | 18:10 |
| morgan | bugs taged to RC1 need to be gating by thursday this week *or* will be dropped unless they are legitimately RC blockers | 18:11 |
| henrynash | morgan: not arguing with the answer, but had not heard we had decided against all of the proposed FFes | 18:11 |
| morgan | please tag any new bugs that are potential rc blockers as the appropriate rc-potential | 18:11 |
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| stevemar | bknudson: tagging your bug for rc1 | 18:12 |
| morgan | henrynash: i'm find if we have open FFEs just point them out. but they need to land this week | 18:12 |
| morgan | or be dropped | 18:12 |
| bknudson | stevemar: we can always backport the fix, so shouldn't be an rc blocker | 18:12 |
| henrynash | (Unrelated to FFEs) I’d like to push the last of the data driver testing in: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/154485/ | 18:12 |
| morgan | bknudson: if it's high/critical I'd like to land pre-RC | 18:12 |
| henrynash | just needs another +2 | 18:12 |
| morgan | bknudson: if it's lower than high prio we can backport if needed | 18:12 |
| dolphm | has everything feature-y in review been -2'd? | 18:12 |
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| morgan | dolphm: the ones I saw should be -2'd | 18:13 |
| morgan | please feel free to -2 if I missed one | 18:13 |
| morgan | or flag me down | 18:13 |
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| dolphm | morgan: alrighty, i definitely ran into one last night linked to a bp | 18:13 |
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| dolphm | morgan: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/210581/ | 18:14 |
| * morgan nods. | 18:14 | |
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| morgan | dolphm -2 applied | 18:14 |
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| morgan | so, find me if we have any approved FFEs and they can land this week, i can unblock | 18:15 |
| stevemar | aww i liked that one | 18:15 |
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| morgan | otherwise defer until mitaka | 18:15 |
| morgan | I'd like to be RC-ready on friday | 18:16 |
| morgan | if at all possible | 18:16 |
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| morgan | stevemar: #topic Next PTL and Summit Planning | 18:16 |
| * stevemar just realizes he's been calling it Mikata and not Mitaka | 18:16 | |
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| stevemar | #topic Next PTL and Summit Planning | 18:16 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Next PTL and Summit Planning (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:16 | |
| dolphm | Mumble* | 18:16 |
| morgan | So as you know.. I wont be PTL next cycle | 18:16 |
| morgan | soon there will be a new PTL. | 18:16 |
| stevemar | thanks for your service morgan :) | 18:17 |
| morgan | Once the election is finalized I am going to delegate the last of the release responsibilities to the new PTL. I'll be around to unblock things i've -2'd but I have some stuff that I need to take care of | 18:17 |
| lbragstad | ++ | 18:17 |
| henrynash | hear, hear+++ | 18:17 |
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| raildo | ++ | 18:17 |
| dstanek | ++ | 18:17 |
| bknudson | ++ | 18:18 |
| morgan | so it'll be on the new PTL to cover the last of the RC responisbilities and write up releasenotes. (and/or pull people in) | 18:18 |
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| samueldmq | thanks morgan ++ | 18:18 |
| morgan | thanks for having me as the PTL for 2 cycles :) | 18:18 |
| gyee | morgan, those ++ are convertible to beers I think | 18:18 |
| morgan | and I will be taking a step back from keystone (not 100%) for a bit, just need some space to reset after the long haul | 18:18 |
| ayoung | the post PTL black hole Say HI to Joew Heck for me | 18:19 |
| ayoung | and Ziad | 18:19 |
| stevemar | ayoung: hehe | 18:19 |
| stevemar | ayoung: c'mon dolphm escaped | 18:19 |
| morgan | as for the summit planning, I am going to delegate all forward looking planning to stevemar, dstanek, and ayoung as they are running for PTL. We have our spaces lined up. | 18:19 |
| morgan | Please collaborate and start appropriate steps to plan the sessions. | 18:19 |
| gyee | dstanek's running? | 18:19 |
| ayoung | and anyone else that still wants to throw their hat into the ring | 18:19 |
| morgan | gyee: he put is name into the repo | 18:19 |
| ayoung | please do so. | 18:19 |
| gyee | ah, I missed the email then | 18:20 |
| ayoung | yes, dstanek is running, too | 18:20 |
| morgan | no email yet afaik | 18:20 |
| dstanek | gyee: yessir, going to send out an email to the list later, but i'm in the repo! | 18:20 |
| bknudson | do you have to send an email? | 18:20 |
| dolphm | bknudson: not technically | 18:20 |
| morgan | bknudson, no, but probably a good idea if you want a chance to win ;) | 18:20 |
| dolphm | bknudson: new process only dictates a git review | 18:20 |
| lbragstad | dstanek: is trying to be sneaky! | 18:20 |
| morgan | unless running unapposed | 18:20 |
| dolphm | morgan: ++ | 18:20 |
| gyee | looking forward to the big debate | 18:20 |
| stevemar | its gonna be televised | 18:21 |
| morgan | so you three are on the hook to plan the summit sessions since that needs to start before the election is finalized | 18:21 |
| ayoung | henrynash, gyee you guys should run, too | 18:21 |
| dstanek | gyee: who will moderate? | 18:21 |
| morgan | as in.. sending the email to the ML, start getting feedback | 18:21 |
| morgan | etc | 18:21 |
| gyee | first question, what's your view on pagination? :) | 18:21 |
| lbragstad | i'll moderate... | 18:21 |
| stevemar | gyee: ain't gonna happen! | 18:21 |
| morgan | I trust the eventual winner will finalize all the things | 18:21 |
| morgan | gyee: hey no starting the debate here | 18:21 |
| gyee | k, k | 18:21 |
| dstanek | gyee: can't read a book without it | 18:21 |
| * morgan is still PTL and says "NO" | 18:21 | |
| morgan | :P | 18:22 |
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| stevemar | morgan: yes yes, we'll play nice :) | 18:22 |
| morgan | ok | 18:22 |
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| morgan | that is most of everything I had | 18:22 |
| morgan | summary: land things for libraries today, releases tomorrow | 18:22 |
| amakarov | gyee, horizon guys are begging for pagination here | 18:22 |
| morgan | RC1 next week of keystone, any FFEs outstanding need to be in this week or punted | 18:22 |
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| bknudson | there's probably some other lib fixes we should get in. | 18:22 |
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| morgan | amakarov: and we have addressed most of that on the ML. | 18:23 |
| morgan | amakarov: and the stance is fairly universal within the core team afaict | 18:23 |
| amakarov | morgan, ++ | 18:23 |
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| morgan | so. | 18:23 |
| morgan | 23 minutes of meeting | 18:23 |
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| morgan | stevemar: #topic open discussion (make it quick) | 18:23 |
| stevemar | #topic open discussion | 18:24 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:24 | |
| morgan | anything else? | 18:24 |
| dstanek | is there a list of the most important things to get in for the libs? | 18:24 |
| gyee | I was expecting some Donald Trump-ism in the PTL emails, like I will find anyone one karma point per day till the bug is fixed! | 18:24 |
| gyee | s/find/fine/ | 18:24 |
| morgan | dstanek: no specific list atm. | 18:24 |
| henrynash | I don’t understand the problem with pagination, with vitual screens, surely you can just have 100 screens displayes and see all teh users….then you can page youself! | 18:24 |
| morgan | dstanek: but please look over open bugs. | 18:24 |
| lbragstad | dstanek: do you want to generate the report for all bugs since Liberty has opened? | 18:25 |
| morgan | henrynash: it's implementation of pagination for users. the rest of the backends don't matter and we can do pagination | 18:25 |
| stevemar | bknudson: anything? you normally have something :P | 18:25 |
| bknudson | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/155758/ -- client but fix | 18:25 |
| bknudson | I don't have anything in flight | 18:25 |
| henrynash | morgan: twas a joke (!) | 18:25 |
| stevemar | lies | 18:25 |
| dstanek | browsers have builtin pagination and support for the PageUp and PageDown keys | 18:25 |
| morgan | henrynash: ah anyway | 18:25 |
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| * morgan is losing ability to see sarcasm in irc ;) | 18:25 | |
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| henrynash | morgan: :-) | 18:26 |
| stevemar | oh - we had someone setup translation jobs for python-keystoneclient, should we be setting up translation jobs for all the libraries? | 18:26 |
| morgan | ookay please take bug discussions to -keystone and land the final bits so i can generate release reviews tonight/tomorrow | 18:26 |
| morgan | stevemar: there was a fix in flight to set that up | 18:26 |
| morgan | stevemar: not sure the status | 18:26 |
| morgan | stevemar: i'm going to let i18n team drive those | 18:26 |
| henrynash | morgan: who’s running teh RC1 bug list? | 18:26 |
| bknudson | if we ever do get translations we'll need another release. | 18:26 |
| stevemar | well the way it was setup in ksc was broken. we fixed it there, and are adding the infra job now | 18:27 |
| morgan | henrynash: until next week, me, after PTL election the next PTL | 18:27 |
| bknudson | so something isn't lining up. | 18:27 |
| henrynash | ok, thx | 18:27 |
| morgan | bknudson: we wont get i18n stuff this cycle | 18:27 |
| stevemar | ++ | 18:27 |
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| bknudson | it doesn't matter what cycle... | 18:27 |
| morgan | bknudson: the jobs may land but we probably wont get anything in liberty | 18:27 |
| bknudson | we haven't gotten translations for keytsone either | 18:27 |
| ayoung | should we fully support Fernet in Liberty..not make it default, but say it is out of incubation? | 18:27 |
| morgan | bknudson: translation work is on the way and usually land right around RC is cut | 18:28 |
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| morgan | ayoung: I'm open to calling fernet stable | 18:28 |
| morgan | anyone for/against stable fernet in liberty? | 18:28 |
| morgan | before we call the meeting and return 30mins of everyone's time :) | 18:28 |
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| stevemar | lets all get time back | 18:29 |
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| bknudson | fernet is still not passing tempest | 18:29 |
| morgan | bknudson: ok that is enough we don't call it stable | 18:29 |
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| bknudson | so I am against saying fernet is stable | 18:29 |
| morgan | lets aim for first thing in mitaka | 18:29 |
| lbragstad | ++ | 18:29 |
| morgan | as well as making fernet default in devstack around the same time | 18:29 |
| dolphm | ++ if we can't fix it sooner | 18:29 |
| lbragstad | I agree with that | 18:29 |
| ayoung | good enough rationale here. but what if we do pass by release? | 18:30 |
| morgan | ayoung: if it is post RC answer is the same | 18:30 |
| lbragstad | because fixing those tempest test will require removal of sub-second precision in revocation events | 18:30 |
| morgan | unfortunately | 18:30 |
| lbragstad | which will be an api change | 18:30 |
| ayoung | K | 18:30 |
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| ayoung | actually, we can't remove those, it will break other htings | 18:30 |
| morgan | ayoung: we can remove that but it's a bit more work | 18:31 |
| ayoung | subsecond was in there due to the speed the tests run | 18:31 |
| morgan | so we need to fix our testing | 18:31 |
| morgan | which is fine | 18:31 |
| morgan | mock out time.utcnow etc, but it's something to aim for next cycle | 18:31 |
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| morgan | anyway so fernet stable in mitaka, and default in devstack around then too | 18:32 |
| morgan | anything else before we're done? | 18:32 |
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| morgan | 3. | 18:32 |
| morgan | 2. | 18:32 |
| morgan | 1. | 18:32 |
| morgan | stevemar: #endmeeting | 18:32 |
| stevemar | lots of plans for M | 18:32 |
| stevemar | #endmeeting | 18:32 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:32 | |
| dolphm | \o/ | 18:32 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Sep 15 18:32:55 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:32 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2015/keystone.2015-09-15-18.02.html | 18:32 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2015/keystone.2015-09-15-18.02.txt | 18:32 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2015/keystone.2015-09-15-18.02.log.html | 18:33 |
| morgan | have ~30mins back | 18:33 |
| morgan | :) | 18:33 |
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| henrynash | yah! | 18:33 |
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| jeblair | howdy! | 19:00 |
| pleia2 | o/ | 19:00 |
| Clint | o/ | 19:00 |
| crinkle | o/ | 19:00 |
| clarkb | afternoon | 19:00 |
| SotK | o/ | 19:00 |
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| jhesketh | o/ | 19:00 |
| jesusaurus | o/ | 19:00 |
| yolanda | o/ | 19:00 |
| dougwig | O/ | 19:00 |
| Zara | o/ | 19:01 |
| ianw | o/ | 19:01 |
| fungi | howdy | 19:01 |
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| samueldmq | o/ | 19:01 |
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| jeblair | wow, this is a really good cuban sandwich, but it's messy, so running the meeting will be hard. | 19:01 |
| jeblair | #startmeeting infra | 19:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Sep 15 19:02:00 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is jeblair. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'infra' | 19:02 |
| clarkb | jeblair: you need a sacrificial keyboard | 19:02 |
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| jeblair | clarkb: oh, of course, i have a model-m; i can just throw it in the dishwasher | 19:02 |
| pabelanger | o/ | 19:02 |
| jeblair | #link agenda https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/InfraTeamMeeting#Agenda_for_next_meeting | 19:02 |
| jeblair | #link previous meeting http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2015/infra.2015-09-08-19.01.html | 19:02 |
| jeblair | #topic Actions from last meeting | 19:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:03 | |
| jeblair | clarkb see if github api supports transfers yet | 19:03 |
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| clarkb | I did and no | 19:03 |
| clarkb | you ca ndo renames with the edit repo api call but transfers dont appear to be a thing via the api | 19:03 |
| jeblair | #info github api does not support transfers :( | 19:03 |
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| clarkb | there is even an open bug against githubs bug tracker for it | 19:03 |
| jeblair | clarkb: so, post oct 17 we might be in a better place | 19:04 |
| fungi | i suppose we have one month for people to pester that bug asking for the feature | 19:04 |
| zaro | o/ | 19:04 |
| clarkb | well bug is ancient | 19:04 |
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| clarkb | so wouldnt get my hopes up | 19:04 |
| jeblair | mordred look into better version of https://review.openstack.org/105057 or improve it | 19:04 |
| jeblair | mordred isn't here.... | 19:05 |
| jeblair | and it doesn't look like that got improved | 19:05 |
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| jeblair | i missed some of the action on friday; were we able to use ansible at all? | 19:05 |
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| clarkb | we were not, I think jasondotstar was looking at it and said we shouldn't | 19:05 |
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| fungi | just the playbook we already have to clean up slave workspaces | 19:05 |
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| clarkb | we decided the ~6 hours we had was better spent prepping rather than ansible scrambling | 19:06 |
| AJaeger | I'm sorry for beeing late... | 19:06 |
| jasondotstar | o/ | 19:06 |
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| hogepodge | o/ | 19:06 |
| fungi | fell back on my script-creating-script ouroboros | 19:06 |
| jasondotstar | I am working on it | 19:06 |
| fungi | # https://review.openstack.org/222726 | 19:06 |
| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/222726 | 19:06 |
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| jeblair | should we say that ship has sailed and just do our usual for oct 17? | 19:07 |
| * fungi fails at irc today | 19:07 | |
| jasondotstar | wasn't ready by last friday | 19:07 |
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| clarkb | jeblair: ya, and we were taking about testing it against review-dev too | 19:07 |
| clarkb | so that may happen prior to the 17th | 19:07 |
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| jasondotstar | clarkb: +1 | 19:08 |
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| jeblair | k, so keep working on it because it's still useful even after the stackforge move, but not counting on it at this point for that | 19:08 |
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| jeblair | (and maybe we'll be surprised) | 19:08 |
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| jasondotstar | ack. | 19:08 |
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| jeblair | jasondotstar: cool, thanks! | 19:09 |
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| jeblair | #topic Specs approval: Artifact Signing Toolchain (fungi) | 19:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Specs approval: Artifact Signing Toolchain (fungi) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:09 | |
| jeblair | #link Artifact Signing Toolchain https://review.openstack.org/213295 | 19:09 |
| jeblair | #info Artifact Signing Toolchain spec was approved | 19:09 |
| Clint | \o/ | 19:10 |
| jeblair | and it merged | 19:10 |
| fungi | noted, thanks all | 19:10 |
| jeblair | (also, it's going to be someone else's turn to try to remember to do that soon ;) | 19:10 |
| jeblair | #topic Schedule Project Renames | 19:10 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Schedule Project Renames (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:10 | |
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| jeblair | anyone want to talk about oct 17? | 19:11 |
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| jeblair | i don't have anything, but figure we should start talking about next steps soon | 19:11 |
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| fungi | fwiw, the wiki list is a small fraction of what we need to address | 19:11 |
| fungi | at least so far | 19:11 |
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| fungi | we have 331 stackforge repos at the moment | 19:12 |
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| fungi | hopefully projects will step it up | 19:12 |
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| jeblair | maybe we should start sending some targeted emails, to recent contributors or project originators | 19:13 |
| fungi | is gertty moving to git.inaugust.com? | 19:13 |
| fungi | ;) | 19:13 |
| fungi | but yeah, we could automate some sort of mass contact attempt | 19:14 |
| jeblair | probably not :) | 19:14 |
| jeblair | i'll take that one | 19:14 |
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| jeblair | #action jeblair automate some sort of mass contact attempt for stackforge move | 19:14 |
| fungi | cool! | 19:14 |
| jeblair | we have a next step; anything else on this? | 19:15 |
| jeblair | let's say next week we'll look for someone to volunteer for writing some scripts; so heads up. :) | 19:16 |
| jeblair | #topic Priority Efforts (Swift Logs) | 19:16 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Priority Efforts (Swift Logs) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:16 | |
| jeblair | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/214207/ | 19:16 |
| jeblair | "Dynamic folder indexes are ready for review" | 19:16 |
| cody-somerville | \o/ | 19:17 |
| jeblair | which is yay, because i think that was our major blocker for turning it on on more jobs | 19:17 |
| fungi | agreed | 19:17 |
| fungi | and also annoying for some jobs already using that | 19:18 |
| fungi | thanks jhesketh! | 19:18 |
| jhesketh | yeah, some reviews would be good | 19:18 |
| jhesketh | (it's been up a couple of weeks) | 19:18 |
| fungi | i see that. bumping up my list | 19:18 |
| jhesketh | works okay locally.. is a little ugly, but at least functional | 19:18 |
| jeblair | i love functional :) | 19:19 |
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| jeblair | #topic Priority Efforts (Migration to Zanata) | 19:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Priority Efforts (Migration to Zanata) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:19 | |
| fungi | jhesketh: mind if i update the review topic on it to match what's in the logs-in-swift spec? | 19:19 |
| jhesketh | fungi: not at all, thanks | 19:19 |
| pleia2 | so translators are using Zanata now, just wrapping up some things WRT jenkins periodic jobs | 19:19 |
| jhesketh | sorry I forgot to use the topic! | 19:19 |
| * fungi would like to be able to pretend that's the reason he hadn't reviewed it yet, but alas | 19:20 | |
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| jeblair | pleia2: cool | 19:20 |
| pleia2 | nothing else meeting worthy :) | 19:20 |
| clarkb | pleia2: has a change up to give zanata a bit more memory | 19:20 |
| pleia2 | yeah https://review.openstack.org/#/c/223721 | 19:20 |
| jeblair | translate-dev ran out of heap space this morning and got stuck spinning cpu | 19:20 |
| jeblair | i restarted wildfly | 19:20 |
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| pleia2 | jeblair: this patch will fix that | 19:20 |
| jeblair | neat | 19:21 |
| jeblair | also we should probably add them to cacti? | 19:21 |
| pleia2 | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/223687/ | 19:21 |
| pleia2 | yep ^^ | 19:21 |
| jeblair | neat...if i say a third thing, will there already be a change in review for it? ;) | 19:21 |
| fungi | quick, make it something important! | 19:22 |
| pleia2 | haha | 19:22 |
| pleia2 | I do have a docs change WIP, that's important, I hope to finish it this afternoon | 19:22 |
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| jeblair | docs are cool | 19:22 |
| fungi | and important | 19:22 |
| pleia2 | we never had a docs translate page, will soon | 19:22 |
| AJaeger | ;) | 19:22 |
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| jeblair | pleia2: thanks! | 19:23 |
| jeblair | #topic Ansible roles under -infra (pabelanger) | 19:23 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Ansible roles under -infra (pabelanger) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:23 | |
| pabelanger | ohai | 19:23 |
| jeblair | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-September/073857.html | 19:23 |
| pabelanger | so, this one is just starting the discussions around how it would look like moving ansible roles upstream into the OpenStack git workflow. | 19:24 |
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| pabelanger | So, for example, I have ansible-role-nodepool, that I would like to start using downstream. I know of some other people that would also like to consume it. | 19:24 |
| pabelanger | so, I'm looking for a new home for the module | 19:24 |
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| yolanda | from our Gozer team we'd like to give a chance to that ansible roles as well | 19:25 |
| pabelanger | trying to understand if -infra would be a good location for it, or some other place (git.o.o/openstack)? | 19:25 |
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| jeblair | this is a role to deploy nodepool? eg, replace puppet-nodepool? | 19:25 |
| pabelanger | I don't want to convince -infra to use ansible to provision nodepool | 19:25 |
| fungi | in the past we'd approved inclusion of distro packaging repos for infra's software as part of infra even though we weren't expecting to consume said packages immediately (if ever) | 19:25 |
| pabelanger | jeblair: no replacement, just another method to deploy nodepool | 19:25 |
| jeblair | fungi: i think we're still hoping too someday :) | 19:26 |
| fungi | heh, true | 19:26 |
| jeblair | pabelanger: but exclusive with puppet-nodepool, right? they occupy the same space? | 19:26 |
| pabelanger | correct | 19:26 |
| pabelanger | same space | 19:26 |
| SpamapS | config management fight! YAY! | 19:26 |
| pabelanger | basically :) | 19:26 |
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| SpamapS | so productive | 19:26 |
| SpamapS | seems like alt pieces of the puzzle should go in their own repos | 19:27 |
| pabelanger | Personally, I am not sure -infra is the place for it. Since -infra would not consume it. | 19:27 |
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| pabelanger | however, people in infra will use it | 19:27 |
| pabelanger | downstream | 19:27 |
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| asselin | o/ | 19:28 |
| yolanda | if the scope is just for infra components, i think that infra is the place, under a separate project with independent group | 19:28 |
| jeblair | pabelanger: i realize it's not what your asking, but let me just mention this for those who haven't heard it before -- we can definitely discuss replacing our use of puppet in infra with something else, though it needs to be a plan we get consensus on, and it needs to (eventually) be a wholesale replacement. we don't want two config management systems in use at once. | 19:28 |
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| fungi | in our infra puppet modules we have support implemented for platforms we don't (and don't expect to) run. this seems like a similar situation | 19:29 |
| pabelanger | jeblair: Right. And I don't want to do 2 different systems. Honestly, I see some of this moving independent of -infra and don't want to force the issue to replace puppet upstream | 19:30 |
| ruagair | O/ | 19:30 |
| pabelanger | just looking for the best place to get the openstack git workflow, without setting up something external | 19:30 |
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| fungi | so the question is a) openstack-infra, b) openstack-ansible, c) some new project-team, d) unofficial repos in the openstack namespace | 19:31 |
| jeblair | fungi: yeah, i'm sympathetic, though i don't want to do something to damage the progress we've made on actually collaborating on puppet; i'm a little worried about having two infra-official-looking ways of deploying stuff. | 19:31 |
| fungi | that's certainly a legitimate concern | 19:32 |
| clarkb | jeblair: I am also worried that this will also just add to our workload after we hvae said "well we probably won't use this" | 19:32 |
| clarkb | or at least that assertion seems to be out there right now | 19:32 |
| greghaynes | I also wonder who would review it? would current infra cores want to? | 19:32 |
| clarkb | specs, testing, etc | 19:32 |
| fungi | i am unlikely to review changes for things we're not running | 19:32 |
| pabelanger | greghaynes: no, if infra-core is not using it. I don't see them reviewing | 19:32 |
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| jeblair | i'm lucky to review changes for things we are :) | 19:32 |
| fungi | well, which we're not running and not working toward running | 19:32 |
| pabelanger | another reason I don't think -infra is the place | 19:33 |
| greghaynes | yea, so then im not sure what the value is of it being in infra land | 19:33 |
| pabelanger | that leaves openstack name space and possible ansible team | 19:33 |
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| yolanda | how is that going to live with general openstack ansible projects? | 19:35 |
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| pabelanger | they both use ansible I guess | 19:36 |
| fungi | also curious whether there's a downstream that's seriously interested in swapping out all the infra puppet they're using with ansible, in which case that tips the scale a bit for "might use it upstream if we replace everything" since that might already get us to the halfway mark | 19:37 |
| clarkb | well it would be better to justify that a little bit more beyond "bceause we are alergic to puppet" if so | 19:37 |
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| fungi | agreed | 19:38 |
| clarkb | since we actually have to switch in production | 19:38 |
| yolanda | well, in our case, we started some orchestration with infra-ansible, so using ansible for the components looks as a natural step. We don't have a plan to replace puppet, but at least we are curious to test that approach | 19:38 |
| jeblair | my reading is that there is lukewarm reception to hosting them in infra. we're pretty accomodating in hosting some amount of related infrastructure that we aren't directly consuming, but this seems to be a bit too far away from what we're doing with too little potential for collaboration (unless we decide to switch) for some of us to incorporate it into infra | 19:38 |
| jeblair | yolanda: that's the thing... | 19:38 |
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| fungi | i'm certainly allergic to puppet, doesn't stop me from using it. i also might discover i'm allergic to ansible if i used it as much as i use puppet now | 19:38 |
| jeblair | yolanda: as a group, we've said "ansible makes sense for orchestration, but puppet is sufficient, if not better, at configuration management" so that's the direction we're going | 19:39 |
| jeblair | fungi: yeah, few of us are puppet cheerleaders, but we get over it because it lets us work together | 19:39 |
| pabelanger | Ya, I don't think this is at the stage to justify moving from puppet to ansible. But, I do think there is some downstream folks that are interested in ansible. | 19:39 |
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| fungi | sounds like another "when you have a hammer every problem looks like a nail" situation. once you have the tool implemented for something it's good at, there's a temptation to use it to solve other problems too just because you already have it | 19:40 |
| jeblair | pabelanger: we don't have to cover it here, but i'd like to know if, especially after we get rid of the puppetmaster with the ansible-launch-node work, why diverging is better than collaborating | 19:40 |
| jeblair | s/if// | 19:41 |
| pabelanger | jeblair: right, I can go into some details about that, maybe an email, at least explaining why I'm working on ansible stuff ATM | 19:41 |
| fungi | the downstream justification would be interesting, if nothing else | 19:42 |
| pabelanger | Ya, I can get some notes together and continue on ML | 19:42 |
| jeblair | pabelanger: that would be cool if you could send it to the -infra list; we'll get some more eyes on it | 19:42 |
| pabelanger | ack | 19:42 |
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| jeblair | pabelanger: anyway, i'm not getting very strong support for inclusion into infra. but we don't want to lose opportunities to collaborate. so maybe we call this a tentative "doesn't sound like the right place" for right now, but continue exploring on the ml? | 19:43 |
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| pabelanger | sure, that works for me. | 19:44 |
| jeblair | thanks | 19:44 |
| jeblair | #topic Nodepool consuming requirements (ianw) | 19:44 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Nodepool consuming requirements (ianw) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:44 | |
| ianw | hello | 19:44 |
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| ianw | this came up yesterday, i think there might be old discussions around this before my time | 19:45 |
| ianw | "is nodepool a openstack project" | 19:45 |
| anteaya | what is the context for the question? | 19:45 |
| anteaya | I have never asked myself that question that I recall | 19:45 |
| fungi | we could rescope the question to "do all openstack projects participate in global requirements sync?" | 19:45 |
| ianw | anteaya: consuming global requirements | 19:46 |
| anteaya | ianw: thank you, now I understand | 19:46 |
| clarkb | my concern here is I don't want to have to justify Infra's use of every lib we use | 19:46 |
| AJaeger | Oh, that discussion ;( I gave up frustrated with openstack-manuals at one point ;( | 19:46 |
| jeblair | in general, no, we do not hold infra projects to the same standard. our goals and needs are deliberately separate from openstack. | 19:46 |
| clarkb | because we have made some very specific decisions as far as design and deps that don't line up with openstack very well | 19:46 |
| ianw | as of right now, the next dib release will break nodepool, which kind of sucks | 19:46 |
| jeblair | ianw: well, i mean, we're a git commit away from fixing it :) | 19:47 |
| clarkb | though pymysql is now used by everyone else at least (that was the big one) | 19:47 |
| ianw | jeblair: yeah, because we noticed because pabelanger was playing with it. it would suck if puppet autodeployed it at a bad time though | 19:47 |
| fungi | i'm less worried about having to justify choice of dependencies, more worried about maintaining some logical separation between the projects which you install to run an instance of "openstack" (for some definitions thereof) and what we develop and maintain to support our community infrastructure | 19:47 |
| jeblair | i don't think nodepool, or other infra projects, should participate in global reqs sync. we are not intending to be part of the combined deliverable we vaguely call openstack. | 19:47 |
| jeblair | ianw: yeah, though, tbh, it's probably not going to kill us if pbr flaps on nodepool.o.o | 19:48 |
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| greghaynes | AIUI the problem that came up here is that dib does req sync and had an incompatible dep with nodepool | 19:48 |
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| greghaynes | which should be rare, I hope | 19:48 |
| ianw | the other thing is people are packaging nodepool, and version skew is an issue | 19:49 |
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| greghaynes | version skew how? | 19:49 |
| jeblair | greghaynes: yeah, and any lib can cause that. i think the overlap is small enough that we don't need the full power of the requirements repo to address it when it does | 19:49 |
| fungi | well, plenty of nodepool's dependency chain might release versions with incompatible transitive dependencies. dib is little different in that regard | 19:49 |
| * jeblair just lets fungi talk :) | 19:49 | |
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| fungi | heh, after you! | 19:50 |
| greghaynes | agreed | 19:50 |
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| jeblair | and we can definitely broaded requirements ranges as needed for packagers | 19:51 |
| fungi | i think one place we've seen some overlap between vaguely openstack services and openstack infra projects is solum, which was considering using zuul as its scheduler | 19:51 |
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| ianw | so it feels like there's not much love for syncing with global requirements | 19:51 |
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| fungi | i think the situation we engineered requirements synchronization to solve is not a problem we run into often enough in infra projects | 19:52 |
| ianw | maybe we should just ensure we're testing dib from git? that would give us a heads up on issues there, at least? | 19:52 |
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| jeblair | not a bad idea, maybe a non-voting job? | 19:53 |
| greghaynes | Does the nodepool dsvm test not do that? | 19:53 |
| clarkb | greghaynes: it does not | 19:53 |
| clarkb | greghaynes: it pip installs nodepool's source which installs dib from pypi | 19:53 |
| greghaynes | ah | 19:53 |
| fungi | can you elaborate on the degree of impact? is it going to crash nodepoold when we update dib? or keep it from starting when we restart? or keep us from being able to upgrade/reinstall it? | 19:53 |
| jeblair | (i would also like to avoid pulling nodepool into a shared queue with dib, at least at the moment) | 19:53 |
| ianw | fungi: it will be a pbr conflict; i'm not 100% sure but i guess it would be broken on restart? | 19:54 |
| fungi | if the majority of the impact is that our nodepool unit or integration tests begin failing when dib releases, that's more or less working as intended | 19:55 |
| ianw | at least | 19:55 |
| clarkb | I think it would just fail to upgrade nodepool | 19:55 |
| clarkb | but restarts would run the old version | 19:55 |
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| fungi | just want to make sure that we don't implement a solution to this which is even more invonvenient than the problem | 19:56 |
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| ianw | so in summary ; global requirements = no ... testing dib from git = propose something and we can see | 19:56 |
| ianw | ? | 19:56 |
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| fungi | that's my take | 19:57 |
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| jeblair | ianw: ++ | 19:57 |
| ianw | ok, thanks | 19:57 |
| greghaynes | sgtm | 19:57 |
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| clarkb | sounds good, I think you just need a second dsvm job that does dib from source | 19:57 |
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| clarkb | just an extra devstack flag iirc | 19:57 |
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| pabelanger | Ya, that is how I caught the issue, git install and simple dib create | 19:58 |
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| jeblair | ianw: thanks | 19:58 |
| jeblair | #topic Open discussion | 19:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:58 | |
| jeblair | 2 mins! | 19:58 |
| yolanda | so i need reviews for https://review.openstack.org/#/c/206582/ | 19:59 |
| yolanda | anteaya needs that to start using apache logrotation | 19:59 |
| yolanda | it has a +2, but needs more eyes on it | 19:59 |
| anteaya | fewer apache logs on gerrit, yay! | 19:59 |
| fungi | oh, who was looking into vcsrepo updating to upstream and getting off our fork? check in with me | 20:00 |
| jeblair | yes, getting that in soon would be good | 20:00 |
| clarkb | mrmartin? | 20:00 |
| jeblair | thanks everyone! | 20:00 |
| jeblair | #endmeeting | 20:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 20:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Sep 15 20:00:21 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 20:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2015/infra.2015-09-15-19.02.html | 20:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2015/infra.2015-09-15-19.02.txt | 20:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2015/infra.2015-09-15-19.02.log.html | 20:00 |
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| ttx | Anyone here for the TC meeting ? | 20:01 |
| jeblair | ttx: o/ | 20:01 |
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| flaper87 | p/ | 20:01 |
| * Rockyg lurk lurk | 20:01 | |
| ttx | sdague is excused | 20:01 |
| flaper87 | o/ | 20:01 |
| dougwig | does lurking count? | 20:01 |
| lifeless | o/ | 20:01 |
| ttx | lurking is fine | 20:01 |
| markmcclain | o/ | 20:01 |
| * edleafe is in a meeting, but semi-lurking | 20:01 | |
| ttx | russellb, jgriffith, annegentle, mordred, dtroyer, jaypipes, dhellmann: around ? | 20:01 |
| dhellmann | o/ | 20:02 |
| russellb | o/ | 20:02 |
| dtroyer | o/ | 20:02 |
| jgriffith | o/ | 20:02 |
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| ttx | #startmeeting tc | 20:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Sep 15 20:02:19 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ttx. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 20:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 20:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'tc' | 20:02 |
| ttx | Agenda for this Technical committee meeting at: | 20:02 |
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| ttx | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee | 20:02 |
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| ttx | #topic OpenStack programming languages resolution | 20:02 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack programming languages resolution (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:02 | |
| ttx | #link https://review.openstack.org/217710 | 20:03 |
| ttx | The latest version tweaks the wording to be clearer, as suggested by annegentle and sdague | 20:03 |
| ttx | This now has enough votes to pass. I'll approve it now unless someone screams | 20:03 |
| russellb | lgtm! | 20:03 |
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| flaper87 | lgtm and it addressed sdague's comments | 20:04 |
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| * ttx leaves 30 more seconds for jeblair to re-register his +1 | 20:04 | |
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| jeblair | ttx: i think i just did? | 20:04 |
| ttx | ah, refreshed | 20:04 |
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| ttx | #topic Cross-project track workgroup: collecting topics | 20:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Cross-project track workgroup: collecting topics (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:04 | |
| ttx | Since we don't have that much on the agenda, I figured we could use some time to discuss the cross-project track, since so many TC members are interested in helping there | 20:05 |
| ttx | Two weeks ago a number of people signed up to help there: | 20:05 |
| ttx | (dhellmann, sdague, mordred, flaper87, lifeless and me on the TC side + thingee & Rockyg) | 20:05 |
| ttx | A few data points first... | 20:05 |
| * dims_ lurks | 20:05 | |
| ttx | Number of slots: We have seven 40-min time slots, and we can use 2 or 3 parallel rooms | 20:05 |
| ttx | (in Vancouver we only used 2 parallel rooms, for a total of 14 slots) | 20:05 |
| ttx | We have a time slot (at 2pm) where the Ops have nothing scheduled, so we can have devs+ops sessions in the track | 20:05 |
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| dhellmann | ttx: when you say 7 slots, is that total or is that 7 times the number of parallel rooms we decide to use? | 20:06 |
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| ttx | Also late afternoon the Ops track is in workgroup sessions so we can have more ops-oriented topics then as well | 20:06 |
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| jeblair | ttx: when you say 2 or 3, do you mean we can adjust as necessary, or do we need to decide on 14 or 21 sessions? | 20:06 |
| ttx | 7 times * number of parallel rooms | 20:06 |
| flaper87 | +1 for dev+ops session | 20:06 |
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| edleafe | +1 | 20:06 |
| ttx | we have 3 rooms available -- whether we use all of them all the time is up to us | 20:07 |
| flaper87 | mmh, I wonder if 21 slotes would make it really difficult for folks that need/want to attend several | 20:07 |
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| lifeless | we have 9 top level items on https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/mitaka-cross-project-session-planning so far | 20:07 |
| jeblair | ttx: gotcha | 20:07 |
| david-lyle | flaper87: ++ | 20:07 |
| ttx | How do you want to handle the track contents ? Should we take suggestions, or just decide what the content should be ? | 20:07 |
| flaper87 | Lets see how many topics we have but I'm afraid 21 will be too many | 20:07 |
| ttx | that etherpad was not communicated that wi | 20:07 |
| ttx | dely yet | 20:07 |
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| jeblair | flaper87: if i'm following, we just leave rooms empty for some sessions to the degree we want to handle that. | 20:08 |
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| dhellmann | I'd like to see what we can come up with as a group, and then fill in with community suggestions. | 20:08 |
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| russellb | i'd suggest putting owner/session-lead names beside each proposal | 20:08 |
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| russellb | before it gets too far | 20:08 |
| ttx | dhellmann: sounds good | 20:08 |
| jeblair | russellb: ++ | 20:08 |
| russellb | bcause that's a pain to chase down later | 20:08 |
| dhellmann | In the past, we've tended to have proposals for sessions that included just 2 projects at a time, though maybe folks understand the intent better now. | 20:08 |
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| flaper87 | jeblair: yup | 20:09 |
| anteaya | I don't see cross-project communication on the list, does anyone know if anne was going to propose a session for it? | 20:09 |
| flaper87 | anteaya: no idea here | 20:09 |
| dhellmann | anteaya: that's a good one, why don't you start and you and annegentle can cooperate? | 20:10 |
| anteaya | I can put it on the list since anne isn't here and let her decide how she wants to proceed | 20:10 |
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| dhellmann | ++ | 20:10 |
| jeblair | anteaya: ttx just signed up for it | 20:10 |
| anteaya | happy to help if anne wishes | 20:10 |
| anteaya | ah great | 20:10 |
| anteaya | ttx: thanks | 20:10 |
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| jeblair | anteaya: at least, something very very similar i think :) | 20:11 |
| anteaya | line 34 looks close enough to me | 20:11 |
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| dhellmann | ttx: it might be interesting to get some input from some of the working groups like API and UX, too | 20:11 |
| Rockyg | anteaya, +1 | 20:11 |
| ttx | One thing lifeless said on the Glance thread made me think -- "goals you've identified are well within our [all OpenStack contributors] power to address during the next cycle" | 20:12 |
| ttx | Wondering whether we should define a few cross-project goals on a given cycle | 20:12 |
| anteaya | ttx we can try and see what happens | 20:12 |
| Rockyg | dhellmann, Yeah. the API group should have a session that pretty much involves all projects | 20:12 |
| ttx | and use the cross-project track to discuss them | 20:12 |
| lifeless | ttx: well - thats what I did with the constraints thing | 20:12 |
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| lifeless | ttx: it wasn't something that needed lots of people pushing on it, but affects /everyone/ | 20:13 |
| Rockyg | would a config session be worthwhile? Getting consistency across configuration would help ops temendously | 20:13 |
| flaper87 | there are some, bigger ones, that have cross-prokject impact and needs some care. User facing notifications, for instance. | 20:13 |
| flaper87 | I believe there's a cross-project spec for that | 20:14 |
| dhellmann | flaper87: is someone signed up to do that work? we've talked about it in the past, but the follow-through hasn't been great | 20:14 |
| dhellmann | flaper87: and you have enough to do, so don't volunteer ;-) | 20:14 |
| ttx | How about we close that brainstorming at the TC meeting next week, and decide if we need to open a CFP for more cross-project topics then ? | 20:14 |
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| flaper87 | dhellmann: LOOL | 20:14 |
| dhellmann | ttx: ++ | 20:14 |
| flaper87 | dhellmann: I know Angus was writing the spec but then no one followed up as you said | 20:15 |
| lifeless | ttx: I think we should ask for inputs now | 20:15 |
| flaper87 | but I kinda think it's important | 20:15 |
| lifeless | ttx: there's no benefit I can see to waiting | 20:15 |
| ttx | lifeless: <dhellmann> I'd like to see what we can come up with as a group, and then fill in with community suggestions. | 20:15 |
| flaper87 | Rockyg: if not in a session, it'd be worth mentioning it in the dev+ops session | 20:15 |
| lifeless | ttx: yes, I saw that. I'm disagreeing :) | 20:15 |
| ttx | ok, flight! | 20:15 |
| ttx | or fight! | 20:15 |
| lifeless | Adrenaline? | 20:15 |
| ttx | Last cycle we used a Google form to take suggestions | 20:15 |
| ttx | I'm fine either way. I agree that there is no harm in taking suggestions anyway | 20:16 |
| flaper87 | I liked the google form, it allowed to comment etc | 20:16 |
| Rockyg | flaper87, notifications definitely are hot -- and how/when they should be logged. jaypipes was also really on that for a while | 20:16 |
| anteaya | for the lines that are just the title of a working group, like API working group, can we get a sense of the burning issue taht what to discuss or is just giving them a room to see each other sufficient? | 20:16 |
| jeblair | flaper87: it did not allow everyone to comment | 20:16 |
| flaper87 | jeblair: oh, mh :( | 20:16 |
| ttx | anyone up for creating the form ? Or should I just copy the old one and start it ? | 20:16 |
| jeblair | didn't we use to have a nice web app just for this? :) | 20:16 |
| lifeless | ttx: Than you for volunteering :) | 20:17 |
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| lifeless | *Thank* | 20:17 |
| * russellb was fond of the web app, personally | 20:17 | |
| jeblair | russellb: me too | 20:17 |
| dhellmann | it didn't have features for commenting, did it? | 20:17 |
| * dhellmann only vaguely remembers | 20:17 | |
| Rockyg | google apps don't get China dev input -- they're blocked | 20:17 |
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| russellb | dhellmann: i think it did ... | 20:18 |
| david-lyle | I remember comments | 20:18 |
| dhellmann | ok, cool | 20:18 |
| * ttx doesn't look forward resurrecting that code | 20:18 | |
| russellb | heh, that's fine | 20:19 |
| dhellmann | it's sort of short notice | 20:19 |
| ttx | Rockyg: maybe we can redirect Chinese users to human proxies that will create entries for them ? | 20:19 |
| flaper87 | I guess it'll be etherpad to allow for everyone to chime in | 20:19 |
| ttx | dhellmann: do you agree with opening up the suggestions pandora box asap ? | 20:19 |
| lifeless | I have no concerns about giving folk the etherpad url | 20:20 |
| jeblair | i'd love to be able to comment this time. i was unable to do so last time. | 20:20 |
| Rockyg | etherpad would work. | 20:20 |
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| dhellmann | ttx: if we really want to, that's fine. Using an etherpad failed at this scale in the past, which is why we used the google form, but if that's an issue for parts of the community we can sort through whatever comes into the etherpad | 20:20 |
| ttx | etherpad is such a mess when we used it for large-scale collection | 20:20 |
| Rockyg | Any way to enforce identification with a color or typed line? | 20:20 |
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| anteaya | Rockyg: you can't enforce anything with etherpad | 20:21 |
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| dhellmann | ttx: want to try a mailing list thread? | 20:21 |
| ttx | Rockyg: trust me, that etherpad we used two cycles ago was a mess | 20:21 |
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| russellb | yeah.. | 20:21 |
| ttx | dhellmann: can be hard to tell what's a suggestiojn and what's not, but I guess we don't need to precisely count anyway | 20:21 |
| Rockyg | ml would be cause a lot of traffic, but it would also refine the topics | 20:21 |
| flaper87 | Then I'd say google form and ask people to send emails if they can't access it | 20:21 |
| dhellmann | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/kilo-crossproject-summit-topics | 20:21 |
| jeblair | i wish we could lead by example here and use a tool that's accessible to everyone in our community | 20:22 |
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| flaper87 | jeblair: we can certainly be prepared for the next summit | 20:22 |
| * dhellmann hesitates suggesting a git repo | 20:23 | |
| anteaya | jeblair: ++ | 20:23 |
| harlowja | https://www.zoho.com/forms/ ? (similar to google stuff?) | 20:23 |
| jeblair | flaper87: we've had since the last one. :( | 20:23 |
| jgriffith | jeblair: do you have anything in mind that is feasible to do now? | 20:23 |
| russellb | yaml2summitsched | 20:23 |
| anteaya | dhellmann: well gerrit can figure out comments | 20:23 |
| dhellmann | anteaya: if all you have is a hammer... | 20:23 |
| Rockyg | dhellmann, would be just like etherpad if you think about it, but with names attached at least | 20:23 |
| anteaya | dhellmann: it is handy | 20:23 |
| ttx | jeblair: suggestions? | 20:23 |
| * jgriffith despises etherpads FWIW (probably not much) | 20:24 | |
| jeblair | jgriffith: it seems the only objection to the previous summit app is cobwebs? | 20:24 |
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| jgriffith | jeblair: ahh... fair point | 20:24 |
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| jeblair | i'm moving house right now, so maybe i'm just used to clearing them out :) | 20:24 |
| Rockyg | jgriffith, ++ | 20:24 |
| jgriffith | jeblair: I personally thought the "old app" worked fine | 20:24 |
| ttx | jeblair: you clearly never had to clear out cobwebs from code I wrote | 20:25 |
| dhellmann | if we're going to move back to that app, it sounds like ttx wants a volunteer to clean up the code and get it running again | 20:25 |
| jgriffith | LOL | 20:25 |
| flaper87 | :P | 20:25 |
| ttx | dhellmann: it's not difficult, it's just a lot of manual pain | 20:25 |
| jeblair | ttx: i think i actually did have to figure out how to modify track leads while you were on vacation once :) | 20:25 |
| jgriffith | I'd volunteer if I had a clue what i was getting int ot :) | 20:25 |
| ttx | since we never got round to properly puppetize it | 20:25 |
| dhellmann | ttx: maybe that's something for the next summit, then | 20:26 |
| jgriffith | s/ot/to/ | 20:26 |
| jeblair | ttx: i will put money where my mouth is and help, but could not do it alone | 20:26 |
| fungi | is the source in gerrit at least, or does it need importing? | 20:26 |
| ttx | jeblair: if you help me and fasttrack any infra hoop, we might be able to pull it off quickly together | 20:26 |
| ttx | fungi: all in gerrit | 20:26 |
| jeblair | ttx: deal | 20:27 |
| * flaper87 volunteers ttx jeblair for this job | 20:27 | |
| flaper87 | sold | 20:27 |
| jgriffith | jeblair: I can offer up some assitance, but not a ton of time to promise | 20:27 |
| fungi | and if memory serves, the server itself exists and has a mostly empty placeholder in our puppet | 20:27 |
| ttx | #action jeblair and ttx to resurrect odsreg | 20:27 |
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| jeblair | whew, ttx remembers the name. that's a good start. :) | 20:27 |
| jeblair | (and will save me some time) | 20:27 |
| ttx | It's just that we need to ignore a lot of what it used to do, like sched.org scheduling | 20:28 |
| * jeblair is excellent at commenting out code | 20:28 | |
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| david-lyle | ttx: ping if I can provide any django assistance | 20:28 |
| ttx | I think I resurrected it once already, but used commenting out heavily to do so, rather than build the config options that would allow to run a light version | 20:29 |
| russellb | what does the sched.org stuff now? | 20:29 |
| * anteaya pats david-lyle on the back | 20:29 | |
| russellb | manual? | 20:29 |
| jgriffith | ttx: jeblair I mentioned as well I'm happy to help out if/where I can | 20:29 |
| ttx | it's the incredible cheddar | 20:29 |
| ttx | russellb: ^ | 20:29 |
| russellb | oic | 20:29 |
| dougwig | HenryG, kevinbenton: what's the long-term plan with db deadlocks? those retry decorators are stinky cheese. | 20:29 |
| dougwig | OOPS, sorry. :) | 20:29 |
| ttx | which is like 10 times better than odsreg ever was, but does not do collection at all | 20:29 |
| ttx | it's stateless and could even run in a container. That's how awesome it is | 20:30 |
| jeblair | dougwig: nice! cheddar to stinky cheese in 5 seconds! | 20:30 |
| russellb | dougwig: timing was interesting | 20:30 |
| dougwig | wow, that's awesome for not even reading the channel. | 20:30 |
| markmcclain | hahah | 20:30 |
| ttx | OK, so let me summarize... We continue to brainstorm on the etherpad, we find a way to start up odsreg for cross-project session collection before end of week, and we discuss it again next week. | 20:31 |
| harlowja | dougwig https://aphyr.com/posts/327-call-me-maybe-mariadb-galera-cluster was a good read | 20:31 |
| jeblair | ttx: and there's a mongodb joke in there somewhere | 20:31 |
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| harlowja | 'In this post, we’ll see MariaDB Galera Cluster allow transactions to read partially committed state.' (oops) | 20:31 |
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| ttx | #topic Communications workgroup report | 20:32 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Communications workgroup report (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:32 | |
| ttx | annegentle, flaper87: o/ | 20:32 |
| flaper87 | o/ | 20:32 |
| flaper87 | The last blog post came out before our lsat week's meeting | 20:32 |
| flaper87 | I don't think we need another one this week | 20:32 |
| flaper87 | but I'll sync w/ annegentle | 20:33 |
| * flaper87 silently goes back to his desk | 20:33 | |
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| ttx | #topic Other workgroups | 20:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Other workgroups (Meeting topic: tc)" | 20:34 | |
| ttx | Any other workgroup with a report ? | 20:34 |
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| ttx | I guess not | 20:34 |
| ttx | #topic Open discussion | 20:34 |
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| ttx | Lots of things to discuss in Open discussion this week ! | 20:35 |
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| ttx | cpallares wanted to mention something about CoC, but is not around currently | 20:35 |
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| ttx | let me find what she told me | 20:35 |
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| ttx | "I have merged the Code of Conduct here https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/CoC" | 20:36 |
| ttx | comments welcome ^ | 20:36 |
| flaper87 | awesome | 20:36 |
| * flaper87 clicks | 20:36 | |
| ttx | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/CoC | 20:36 |
| ttx | * Glance priorities for Mitaka (http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-September/074360.html) | 20:36 |
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| ttx | dhellmann came up with target priorities for the Glance team, from the perspective of the rest of the OpenStack community | 20:37 |
| dhellmann | thanks to everyone who has joined in that conversation | 20:37 |
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| ttx | I think that's great work atht we should do more often | 20:37 |
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| flaper87 | dhellmann: ++ | 20:37 |
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| Rockyg | Bravo! | 20:37 |
| hogepodge | it was great discussion, and helped to clear up some misconceptions that I had also | 20:37 |
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| jeblair | i think it's really good and like the conversations that have come out of it | 20:38 |
| jeblair | and especially the information | 20:38 |
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| ttx | Yeah, at the very least that helps clearing things up, and ideally that would steer the PTL election discussion and the Mitaka cycle in the direction most of the community want Glance to take | 20:38 |
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| flaper87 | From a community perspective, I believe this leaves me with: 1) We need to look after other projects more often 2) We gotta improve our communication and make sure concerns and doubts are properly communicated | 20:38 |
| dhellmann | yeah, the confusion seems in large part to be a communication issue, so I'm glad folks are talking more now | 20:38 |
| jeblair | i feel like a lot of people have a clue what's going on now and what people are talking about. and we're learning real things about how glance is used and not just speculating. :) | 20:38 |
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| flaper87 | Many misconceptions people had about Glance were communicated late or to other folks that probably weren't familiar enough with the API. | 20:39 |
| hogepodge | as the local defcore/interop rep, there's some relevance to capabilities outside of nova that we're working on, particularly with regards to glance, cinder, neutron, and keystone, all of which have cross-project concerns | 20:39 |
| flaper87 | Just to be clear, this is not a complain but an observation for us as a community | 20:39 |
| Rockyg | would a cross-project session be worthwhile for Glance talking to the rest of OpenStack? | 20:39 |
| ttx | I take it as a bit of a reality check, more than as a top-down edict | 20:39 |
| flaper87 | We can't let situations like this to go thus far | 20:39 |
| ttx | and it may cut both ways | 20:40 |
| dhellmann | hogepodge: I'm going to be pushing for us to improve communication between contributors and defcore over the next cycle, going both directions. | 20:40 |
| flaper87 | Rockyg: I'd probably recommend people to attend Glance sessions about what will happen in Mitaka | 20:40 |
| hogepodge | to that end, there are a bunch of iterop reviews in openstack/defcore that it would be nice for the community to review. I can post to the mailing list. | 20:40 |
| flaper87 | not sure what could be said in a cross-project session of Glance folks talking to the rest | 20:40 |
| dhellmann | hogepodge: yes, please start a thread | 20:41 |
| Rockyg | flaper87, the only problem with that is when the other projects' important sessions conflict... | 20:41 |
| flaper87 | hogepodge: ++ | 20:41 |
| flaper87 | Rockyg: yup, that's unfortunate | 20:42 |
| ttx | ok, another topic I wanted to discuss now is: | 20:42 |
| ttx | * Convergence on common deprecation policy | 20:42 |
| ttx | I wanted to quickly discuss convergence on a common deprecation base policy, following the thread at: | 20:42 |
| jgriffith | or just have consistent API's and missions | 20:42 |
| dhellmann | Rockyg, flaper87 : as long as we get the nova/glance and cinder/glance sessions we need, that should be good for right now | 20:42 |
| jgriffith | AKA don't break crap | 20:42 |
| ttx | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-September/073576.html | 20:42 |
| ttx | we also discussed it at the cross-project meeting last week | 20:43 |
| ttx | As I posted recently on the thread, it looks like there is convergence on: | 20:43 |
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| ttx | "config options and features will have to be marked deprecated for a minimum of one stable release branch and a minimum of 3 months" | 20:43 |
| Rockyg | dhellmann, ++ | 20:43 |
| lifeless | yeah | 20:43 |
| ttx | with some language to encourage major features to be marked deprecated for at least two stable release branches | 20:43 |
| lifeless | so I want to call out in particular that libs and clients have had different rules | 20:43 |
| ttx | So I'll post a new patchset to https://review.openstack.org/207467 along those lines | 20:43 |
| dhellmann | ttx: have you compared the API deprecation timelines proposed against what defcore expects? we might need to call out defcore explicitly in that document | 20:43 |
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| annegentle | dhellmann: good q | 20:44 |
| dhellmann | perhaps hogepodge can look at it and comment | 20:44 |
| hogepodge | dhellmann: will do | 20:44 |
| ttx | dhellmann: well, the doc says you need to do a survey before deciding on the deprecation timeframe | 20:44 |
| dtroyer | lifeless: that's one reason for the time-based components | 20:44 |
| dhellmann | we should be fine to use a shorter time frame for something that isn't used by defcore, but we need to make sure we know how to tell what is/isn't | 20:44 |
| lifeless | specifically clients for a long time didn't break anything ever | 20:44 |
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| lifeless | that changed with the branching stuff relatively recently | 20:45 |
| ttx | so somethign that is part of a defcore capability would certainly have a longer deprecation time to account for that | 20:45 |
| dhellmann | ttx: I'd like for there to be explicit language mentioning defcore, since we've identified that as a thing projects don't know enough about | 20:45 |
| lifeless | libs have been somewhat unclear about what they can and can't do | 20:45 |
| hogepodge | dhellmann: we have two active standards at any time, which can cover different versions but still fit in a deprecation window, but we should make sure everything matches up and makes sense | 20:45 |
| lifeless | dtroyer: yes | 20:45 |
| ttx | lifeless: should we say that the proposed rule is for services ? | 20:46 |
| dhellmann | hogepodge: we need a way to say that clearly | 20:46 |
| lifeless | dtroyer: I'm advocating discussion around not branching clients or libs this summit | 20:46 |
| hogepodge | dhellmann: agree | 20:46 |
| ttx | and keep the discussion opened for libs ? | 20:46 |
| dtroyer | lifeless: ++ | 20:46 |
| hogepodge | dhellmann: we also need to make sure that deprecation takes into account cross project concerns | 20:46 |
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| dhellmann | hogepodge: ++ | 20:46 |
| ttx | hogepodge: the rule is just one of the things the tag mandates | 20:46 |
| ttx | See https://review.openstack.org/207467 | 20:47 |
| lifeless | ttx: I don't want to exclude clients and libs from backwards compat - its important there. I think though that the expression may be different | 20:47 |
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| lifeless | ttx: I'm still working up the discussion - as long as we can revisit the tag I think its fine today | 20:47 |
| ttx | lifeless: would you care to propose something on that ML thread ? | 20:47 |
| lifeless | ttx: nope :) | 20:47 |
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| flaper87 | lifeless: mmh, if we're following semver in libraries, shouldn't we just stick to that ? | 20:48 |
| fungi | lifeless: part of the issue with the client-libraries is that they're both application developer/api user client implementations and also cross-service communication libraries between openstack server components, and those use cases have clashed spectacularly in the past | 20:48 |
| lifeless | ttx: in that - I don't think I've got a cogent holistic case to present yet | 20:48 |
| lifeless | fungi: yes, I get that | 20:48 |
| ttx | ok, I'll make the poilicy service-specific and say something is cooking for libs | 20:48 |
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| lifeless | flaper87: this is orthogonal to semver | 20:48 |
| lifeless | flaper87: we should totally still be following semver | 20:48 |
| dhellmann | ttx: ++, we can amend the policy to add lib stuff when we work out the details | 20:48 |
| flaper87 | ttx: ++ | 20:48 |
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| flaper87 | lifeless: sorry, I probably just missed the context of what you were saying | 20:49 |
| fungi | lifeless: so the client libraries didn't actually avoid breaking anything ever, they just avoided user-facing breakage (and basically changed anything they wanted for server-to-server communication) | 20:49 |
| lifeless | fungi: by user I think you mean CLI | 20:49 |
| lifeless | fungi: anyhow, I'm familiar with the debate | 20:49 |
| fungi | cli and "cloud application development" | 20:49 |
| EmilienM | §b dmacpher-afk | 20:50 |
| * dhellmann squints at EmilienM | 20:50 | |
| ttx | OK, last thing I wanted to mention is: | 20:50 |
| ttx | * No/Low/Danger-diversity tag name bikeshedding (https://review.openstack.org/218725) | 20:50 |
| EmilienM | dhellmann: sorry | 20:51 |
| Rockyg | PUce! | 20:51 |
| ttx | Another WIP tag, the one to signal fragile affiliation diversity, which has turned into a name bikeshedding contest | 20:51 |
| ttx | The argument is not really about the tag itself or how it was defined, but mostly on how much negative the name should be | 20:51 |
| lifeless | fungi: dhellmann: and thers - started a etherpad at https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/branchless-clients-and-libs : I haven't put content in yet but will be doing so today | 20:51 |
| dhellmann | EmilienM: np, I just couldn't make out what that was, my client didn't like some of the unicode :-) | 20:51 |
| ttx | feel fre to weigh in, it's fun | 20:51 |
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| flaper87 | ttx: </sarcasm> (?) | 20:51 |
| annegentle | ttx: I do not think you know what fun means :) | 20:52 |
| * dhellmann hands ttx a teddy bear | 20:52 | |
| ttx | personally I think it's ok to be slightly negative, but apparently YMMV | 20:52 |
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| annegentle | ttx: small teams can be nimble and quick | 20:53 |
| ttx | anyway, that one is driven by jogo, to whom I extend my encouragements and thanks | 20:53 |
| russellb | i've been thinking about it a lot, and coming around to the thinking that negative tags may be more harmful than helpful | 20:53 |
| annegentle | ttx: but yeah | 20:53 |
| ttx | annegentle: this is not a question of small, or fast. It's a question about the risk of not being there at all tomorrow. | 20:53 |
| lifeless | russellb: +1 | 20:54 |
| russellb | mostly because i want to be a more friendly and welcoming community, not one where you show up and get a set of "you're bad" labels | 20:54 |
| lifeless | russellb: sorry, I mean -(-1) | 20:54 |
| russellb | heh | 20:54 |
| ttx | Those projects can be killed by the will of a single person, and it's not fair to expose our users to that risk without a warning sign | 20:54 |
| edleafe | all projects are safe, but some are safer than others :) | 20:54 |
| lifeless | ttx: hang on | 20:54 |
| lifeless | ttx: Not all our users are equally sophisticated | 20:54 |
| lifeless | ttx: Not all our users use things from git etc | 20:54 |
| ttx | edleafe: ++ | 20:55 |
| lifeless | ttx: we have distributors and vendors who have direct relations with a huge fraction of our users | 20:55 |
| * jeblair wonders which person has this power... | 20:55 | |
| markmcclain | russellb: I think welcoming also means taking on the challenge of us openly acknowledging a team is danger without making it too difficult to dig out of the hole we created by labeling them as at risk | 20:55 |
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| anteaya | I have osdreg up and breathing | 20:55 |
| ttx | jeblair: the CEO of the company who owns 99% development of a project can kill it. It happened before and will happen again | 20:55 |
| annegentle | ttx: right, right | 20:55 |
| lifeless | ttx: a very diverse project with deprecation periods stable releases and puppet guides may still be a bad choice for a user | 20:56 |
| fungi | "killed" is used liberally here. the project ceases to have development resources, but can be picked up by new contributors as soon as anyone cares | 20:56 |
| edleafe | lifeless: but not for that reason | 20:56 |
| ttx | lifeless: it's not the only warning sigh. It's just "a sign" | 20:56 |
| Rockyg | anteaya, you go, grrl! | 20:56 |
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| jeblair | anteaya: nicely timed, btw :) | 20:56 |
| ttx | fungi: is anyone picking up MagnetoDB ? | 20:56 |
| edleafe | lifeless: this is just another data point for them to evaluate | 20:56 |
| fungi | i think the projects which die because of a change in availability of development resources also had little to no user community | 20:56 |
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| ttx | if that project did not have diversity before, it's unlikely to get it once it's killed ? | 20:57 |
| lifeless | edleafe: so, I'm not debating *that* | 20:57 |
| jeblair | anteaya: will resurrect any important dead projects | 20:57 |
| annegentle | is it like guns don't kill people people kill people fungi ttx? | 20:57 |
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| lifeless | ttx: projects have had diversity and lost it | 20:57 |
| flaper87 | well, users don't necessarily means devs | 20:57 |
| anteaya | jeblair: not sure about that | 20:57 |
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| lifeless | ttx: I've been involved in one such... | 20:57 |
| edleafe | fungi: so how about a "lack-of-community-support" tag? :) | 20:57 |
| fungi | outside openstack, at least, it's not unusual for some company to stop development on an open source application and then the community forks or resumes development on it themselves | 20:57 |
| lifeless | here's a suggestion | 20:57 |
| ttx | lifeless: not to the point of getting that tag, right ? | 20:57 |
| edleafe | that's less negative | 20:57 |
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| david-lyle | the brought-to-you-by sponsorship tag? | 20:58 |
| edleafe | david-lyle: ha! | 20:58 |
| lifeless | ttx: I have't checked the stats, but suspect its due to a couple of the spin-out tools keeping diversity, not the $project | 20:58 |
| fungi | flaper87: any sufficiently advanced free software user is indistinguishable from a developer ;) | 20:58 |
| lifeless | The issue AIUI is that we want to say 'has not earnt tag X' | 20:58 |
| lifeless | and make that discoverable | 20:58 |
| flaper87 | fungi: lol | 20:58 |
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| edleafe | no matter how you wrap it, it's a negative condition | 20:59 |
| lifeless | I know, the rule for 'danger' was going to be lower than the rule for 'diverse' - but fundamentally we want to surface that there is a badge they haven't earnt. | 20:59 |
| lifeless | so why don't we do that | 20:59 |
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| ttx | lifeless: I don't think so. There is a space where the project is not diverse and still is not in danger | 20:59 |
| lifeless | in the UI | 20:59 |
| annegentle | ttx: I agree | 20:59 |
| ttx | those are different questions | 20:59 |
| lifeless | show earnt and unearnt badges | 20:59 |
| thingee | 1 minute warning | 20:59 |
| flaper87 | I kinda feel what we're discussing here is how to make it less negative when the condition itself is just bad | 20:59 |
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| flaper87 | not necessarily the project's fault | 20:59 |
| lifeless | I don't think its bad | 20:59 |
| dtroyer | edleafe: exactly, and recognizing that should be ok | 20:59 |
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| lifeless | I think its the starting point for things | 20:59 |
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| lifeless | start small and ramp up | 20:59 |
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| ttx | anyway, more on that review! | 21:00 |
| flaper87 | lifeless: no one is arguing about that but rather that as lon as you're small, we need to commuicate that | 21:00 |
| ttx | time is up | 21:00 |
| * flaper87 hugs everyone | 21:00 | |
| ttx | #endmeeting | 21:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 21:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Sep 15 21:00:46 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:00 |
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| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2015/tc.2015-09-15-20.02.html | 21:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2015/tc.2015-09-15-20.02.txt | 21:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2015/tc.2015-09-15-20.02.log.html | 21:00 |
| thingee | #startmeeting crossproject | 21:00 |
| russellb | o/ | 21:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Sep 15 21:00:58 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is thingee. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: crossproject)" | 21:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'crossproject' | 21:01 |
| dhellmann | o/ | 21:01 |
| thingee | #link Agenda: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/CrossProjectMeeting | 21:01 |
| jroll | \o | 21:01 |
| lifeless | lets see if I get tagged :) | 21:01 |
| ttx | thingee: heh, looks like we'll have to talk tomorrow | 21:01 |
| tpatil | Hi | 21:01 |
| EmilienM | o/ | 21:01 |
| smcginnis | Hi | 21:01 |
| jokke_ | o/ | 21:01 |
| thingee | courtesy ping for david-lyle flaper87 dims dtroyer johnthetubaguy rakhmerov | 21:01 |
| thingee | courtesy ping for smelikyan morganfainberg adrian_otto bswartz slagle | 21:01 |
| thingee | courtesy ping for adrian_otto mestery kiall jeblair thinrichs j^2 stevebaker | 21:01 |
| thingee | courtesy ping for mtreinish Daisy Piet notmyname ttx isviridov gordc SlickNik | 21:01 |
| thingee | courtesy ping for cloudnull loquacities thingee hyakuhei redrobot dirk TravT | 21:01 |
| thingee | courtesy ping for vipul lifeless annegentle SergeyLukjanov devananda boris-42 nikhil_k | 21:01 |
| stevebaker | \o | 21:01 |
| Piet | Howdy | 21:01 |
| j^2 | o= | 21:01 |
| TravT | o/ | 21:01 |
| loquacities | o/ | 21:01 |
| j^2 | o/ | 21:01 |
| johnthetubaguy | o/ | 21:01 |
| kzaitsev_mb | o/ | 21:01 |
| docaedo | o/ | 21:01 |
| mestery | o/ | 21:01 |
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| david-lyle | o/ | 21:01 |
| thingee | Looks like I'll be running the show today! | 21:01 |
| Rockyg | I'm stil heee-eeere! | 21:02 |
| lifeless | thingee: \o/ I did! | 21:02 |
| gordc | o/ | 21:02 |
| mestery | lifeless: lol :) | 21:02 |
| thingee | #topic review past action items | 21:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "review past action items (Meeting topic: crossproject)" | 21:02 | |
| thingee | johnthetubaguy to add string freeze description into project team guide | 21:02 |
| lifeless | mestery: I am *so* easily made happy | 21:02 |
| thingee | johnthetubaguy: how'd that go johnthetubaguy | 21:02 |
| mestery | lol | 21:02 |
| SheenaG | o/ | 21:02 |
| johnthetubaguy | I have a patch up, let me get the link | 21:02 |
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| johnthetubaguy | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/223011/ | 21:03 |
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| johnthetubaguy | got some fix ups, but its mostly there | 21:03 |
| johnthetubaguy | updated the wiki | 21:03 |
| johnthetubaguy | and send a note on the ML about it | 21:03 |
| thingee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/223011/ | 21:03 |
| ttx | johnthetubaguy: I'll review it, it's on my TODO list | 21:03 |
| johnthetubaguy | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/StringFreeze | 21:04 |
| redrobot | o/ | 21:04 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: thanks | 21:04 |
| rbradfor | 0/ | 21:04 |
| thingee | #action ttx to review string freeze to Common Cycle with milestones doc update | 21:04 |
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| ttx | wow such pressure | 21:04 |
| ttx | much work | 21:04 |
| thingee | holding you to it | 21:04 |
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| johnthetubaguy | :) | 21:05 |
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| thingee | Base feature deprecation policy | 21:05 |
| thingee | no sean dague though | 21:05 |
| thingee | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-September/073576.html | 21:05 |
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| thingee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/207467/ | 21:05 |
| ttx | yep, will propose a new patchset based on discussion asap | 21:06 |
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| ttx | we just wrapped it at the TC meeting before | 21:06 |
| ttx | and on the thread | 21:06 |
| thingee | ttx: excellent | 21:06 |
| thingee | #info base feature deprecation policy discussed being wrapped in last TC meeting | 21:07 |
| thingee | #action ttx to propose new patch set for base feature deprecation policy | 21:07 |
| thingee | #topic Centralized Code Coverage Index/Stats | 21:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Centralized Code Coverage Index/Stats (Meeting topic: crossproject)" | 21:07 | |
| thingee | rbradfor: hi | 21:07 |
| rbradfor | Hi. | 21:08 |
| thingee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/221494/ | 21:08 |
| ttx | thingee: you skipped announcements ? | 21:08 |
| thingee | ttx: you're right | 21:08 |
| * ttx stands by | 21:08 | |
| thingee | rbradfor: give me a second | 21:08 |
| thingee | we'll circle back | 21:08 |
| ttx | you can #undo twice | 21:08 |
| thingee | #undo | 21:08 |
| openstack | Removing item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Link object at 0x9c02210> | 21:08 |
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| thingee | #undo | 21:08 |
| openstack | Removing item from minutes: <ircmeeting.items.Topic object at 0xa34c0d0> | 21:08 |
| ttx | magic | 21:08 |
| ttx | Orwellian | 21:09 |
| thingee | #topic Team announcements (horizontal, vertical, diagonal) | 21:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Team announcements (horizontal, vertical, diagonal) (Meeting topic: crossproject)" | 21:09 | |
| ttx | On the release management front, we are one month before the end of the liberty dev cycle | 21:09 |
| ttx | At this stage, projects using the milestones should have implemented the remaining FFEs | 21:09 |
| ttx | And be working actively on their RC1 bug lists | 21:09 |
| ttx | Most projects are, some are late though | 21:09 |
| ttx | goal is to start tagging RC1s early next week | 21:10 |
| ttx | In other news, we now have a website clearly describing deliverables in each release cycle, with version numbers and all | 21:10 |
| ttx | #link http://docs.openstack.org/releases/ | 21:10 |
| ttx | That's kind of useful in the big tent with denormalized versioning across components | 21:10 |
| ttx | If you're more the YAML type or want to write your own tool, that data lives in openstack/releases | 21:10 |
| thingee | #info For release management goal is to start tagging RC1s early next week | 21:10 |
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| ttx | #info projects must wrap up the remaining FFEs in the coming days and start bruning their RC bugs lists | 21:11 |
| thingee | #info we now have a website clearly describing deliverables in each release cycle, with version numbers and all | 21:11 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: that website is quite beautiful, top job | 21:11 |
| thingee | #link http://docs.openstack.org/releases/ | 21:11 |
| bknudson | what's the difference between deprecated and eol? | 21:11 |
| ttx | johnthetubaguy: credits: dhellmann | 21:11 |
| ttx | bknudson: good question, that was impotred from the wiki page | 21:11 |
| thingee | #info projects must wrap up the remaining FFEs in the coming days and start bruning their RC bugs lists | 21:11 |
| bknudson | I assume deprecated means it's still supported | 21:11 |
| ttx | hmm, probably mean the same, we should mark them all EOL | 21:12 |
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| ttx | I think "deprecated" meant "nobody in his sane mind would run this" | 21:12 |
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| * jroll glances at the feature deprecation policy with that in mind :) | 21:12 | |
| ttx | yeah, it's copied from https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Releases | 21:13 |
| ttx | A-C should just be EOL as well | 21:13 |
| ttx | that's all I had | 21:13 |
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| thingee | anyone else with their team announcements? | 21:14 |
| * jokke_ really likes the releases page | 21:14 | |
| thingee | alright lets move on! | 21:14 |
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| thingee | #topic Centralized Code Coverage Index/Stats | 21:15 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Centralized Code Coverage Index/Stats (Meeting topic: crossproject)" | 21:15 | |
| thingee | rbradfor: hey lets try this again, no hard feelings? | 21:15 |
| rbradfor | thingee, thanks | 21:15 |
| rbradfor | np | 21:15 |
| rbradfor | following my discussion a few weeks ago I posted to ML. Thanks to fungi: for great feedback. I have written a spec I would like feedback on. | 21:15 |
| thingee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/221494/ | 21:15 |
| rbradfor | My spec includes a link for a working prototype at http://demo.ronaldbradford.com/cover/ which has auto populated over the last week 38 projects run in Zuul. | 21:15 |
| jroll | the demo is really nice, btw | 21:16 |
| rbradfor | additional suggestion from dhellmann: was to enable a project rollup. | 21:16 |
| bknudson | projects should be ranked by coverage so we can see who's winning. | 21:16 |
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| rbradfor | jroll, thanks. The next step is posting stats to graphite and being able to show graphs over time. | 21:17 |
| rbradfor | bknudson, we need greater participation having a post gate check for coverage in project-config/tree/zuul/layout.yaml | 21:17 |
| thingee | #info working prototype available | 21:17 |
| thingee | #link http://demo.ronaldbradford.com/cover/ | 21:17 |
| rbradfor | anybody on individual projects that could facilitate that will help it's later inclusion. | 21:18 |
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| fungi | rbradfor: by the way, the fix for our log indexes is proposed, which should allow simplification and dropping your present json scraping mechanism | 21:18 |
| annegentle | ok I'll ask, what's coverage in this context? | 21:18 |
| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/214207 | 21:18 |
| rbradfor | bknudson, I feel adding some sorting filters woul enable users to filter as they like. | 21:18 |
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| rbradfor | annegentle, this is the tox -e cover report for a project | 21:19 |
| annegentle | rbradfor: ok thanks | 21:19 |
| bknudson | so if keystonemiddlware isn't in the list it's because we're missing the post job? | 21:19 |
| fungi | annegentle: the result of running the "cover" utility against a python-based repo's unit tests | 21:19 |
| rbradfor | however a {project}-coverage gate is needed in either check: or post: gates to be captured | 21:19 |
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| rbradfor | bknudson, checking, if there have been no zuul jobs in past week it would also not show | 21:19 |
| rbradfor | fungi, thanks. The process will be simplified with log indexes fix. It's not a pre-requisite, but a much nicer to have | 21:20 |
| Rockyg | rbradfor, have you looked at sonarqube for the dashboards? It's gpl | 21:20 |
| thingee | #info next step is posting stats to graphite and being able to show graphs over time | 21:20 |
| fungi | it's also possible the coverage job runs are broken for some projects. since they run after merge they're often not really looked at closely and do sometimes just fall apart | 21:20 |
| rbradfor | the added benefit is I can then generate data back 4 months (fungi: is that right amount) | 21:20 |
| fungi | rbradfor: at the moment, yes | 21:20 |
| rbradfor | fungi, however I cannot post to graphite with a historical date/time I suspect. | 21:21 |
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| thingee | rbradfor: when is the plan for post gate check? | 21:21 |
| rbradfor | current layout.yaml for Zuul | 21:21 |
| rbradfor | #link http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack-infra/project-config/tree/zuul/layout.yaml | 21:21 |
| johnthetubaguy | I have a feeling the nova one got killed due to lack of love | 21:21 |
| thingee | #link http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack-infra/project-config/tree/zuul/layout.yaml | 21:21 |
| fungi | rbradfor: not sure whether we could fake that to backpopulate or would just need to start injecting trending metrics into graphite going forward | 21:21 |
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| rbradfor | bknudson, keystonemiddleware has post gate for coverage now. | 21:22 |
| bknudson | ok | 21:22 |
| rbradfor | fungi, I think just going forward, but we could look at them for novelty factor. | 21:22 |
| bknudson | maybe it's just we haven't been able to merge anything for a while | 21:22 |
| thingee | rbradfor: ok so you're asking for individuals within projects to submit the changes to layout.yaml for their project? | 21:23 |
| rbradfor | thingee, the spec can more forward regardless, but interested parties here that like the report can request changes | 21:23 |
| rbradfor | thingee, the impact is if it fails as fungi: has stated it's likely blocking merge. | 21:24 |
| rbradfor | however there are non-voting gates for various projects in check: | 21:24 |
| rbradfor | Question is, should the default {project}-coverage be non-voting always, and you need to override that for voting. Thats outside of this spec scope but something to promote more projects listed. | 21:25 |
| fungi | well, lots of projects don't gate on coverage jobs because they can take a long time to run. this is why most of it is happening after changes merge at the moment | 21:25 |
| rbradfor | ^^ | 21:25 |
| bknudson | voting post job seems useless | 21:25 |
| clarkb | and the timing differences can make the jobs fail | 21:25 |
| fungi | there's no voting post-merge, just publication of results | 21:25 |
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| thingee | #info waiting for patch to land to fix post gate checks | 21:26 |
| clarkb | which are arguably good to catch the problem is that they are not determinisitic so hard to debug | 21:26 |
| thingee | #link #link https://review.openstack.org/214207 | 21:26 |
| thingee | whoa | 21:26 |
| fungi | i heard you like links so i put a link in your link | 21:26 |
| thingee | #info Question is, should the default {project}-coverage be non-voting always, and you need to override that for voting. Thats outside of this spec scope but something to promote more projects listed. | 21:26 |
| thingee | rbradfor: anything else we should check on for next week? | 21:26 |
| thingee | rbradfor: actions | 21:27 |
| rbradfor | thingee, I'm just hoping for feedback, and approval so I can look at getting this implemented. | 21:27 |
| jokke_ | rbradfor: will we have that same week limit after this is implemented or is it just your demo page? | 21:27 |
| bknudson | I like it since I like to keep the coverage up when doing reviews | 21:27 |
| rbradfor | link is as infra defines. | 21:27 |
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| rbradfor | it will likely be logs.openstack.org/something | 21:28 |
| thingee | rbradfor: great thanks, we have the spec in the logs so we'll check back next week on the status. | 21:28 |
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| rbradfor | thingee, thanks | 21:28 |
| bknudson | competitors will use this info to say that openstack is immature and not tested | 21:28 |
| thingee | #topic Return request ID to caller | 21:28 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "Return request ID to caller (Meeting topic: crossproject)" | 21:28 | |
| rbradfor | bknudson, there are a lot of things we can discuss about coverage, it's uses, benefits etc. | 21:29 |
| tpatil | Hi | 21:29 |
| thingee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/156508/ | 21:29 |
| tpatil | This spec has gone through several iterations and it’s ready for the approval | 21:29 |
| tpatil | Got one +2 from ttx, need one more +2 from core reviewer | 21:29 |
| tpatil | We are ready with the implementation code as per the proposed spec design. So as soon as spec is approved, we can start uploading the patches for review | 21:29 |
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| * thingee notes that doing a diff from his last on ps12 shows the whole thing new | 21:29 | |
| bknudson | is there sample code? | 21:29 |
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| tpatil | bknudson: not uploaded yet, but we can do that soon if you would like to check it | 21:30 |
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| bknudson | tpatil: sure, I'd take a quick look. | 21:30 |
| tpatil | bknudson: ok | 21:30 |
| thingee | I think with the current approvals, we can be close to wrapping this up again, ttx? | 21:30 |
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| tpatil | Request everyone to please review the spec so that we can move one step ahead | 21:31 |
| ttx | looking | 21:32 |
| ttx | yep, we could place it on the docket for final approval at the TC next week, if it continues on the consensual trends | 21:32 |
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| * ttx makes a note | 21:32 | |
| tpatil | ttx: thanks | 21:33 |
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| thingee | #info currently has one +2. will be placed on the docket for final approval with TC next week assuming it continues consensual trends | 21:33 |
| thingee | ttx: thanks | 21:33 |
| thingee | tpatil: thank you | 21:33 |
| tpatil | thingee: Thank you | 21:33 |
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| thingee | #topic Refactoring testr and tox | 21:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Refactoring testr and tox (Meeting topic: crossproject)" | 21:34 | |
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| thingee | lifeless: hi | 21:34 |
| thingee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/218070/ | 21:34 |
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| lifeless | hi | 21:35 |
| lifeless | so testr is currently run within each venv | 21:35 |
| bknudson | does tox -e py27 still work? | 21:35 |
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| lifeless | bknudson: so thats one of the discussion points | 21:36 |
| lifeless | bknudson: we could say 'testr run -p py27' | 21:36 |
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| lifeless | bknudson: or 'tox -e testr -- run -p py27' | 21:36 |
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| lifeless | bknudson: and separately, what should 'tox -e py27' do - should it run the tests in subunit mode, which is what testr needs | 21:37 |
| fungi | though in either case, only after installing testr manually on your system | 21:37 |
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| lifeless | bknudson: or should it run them in testtools.run mode | 21:37 |
| lifeless | fungi: no | 21:37 |
| lifeless | fungi: I think you misread the spec | 21:37 |
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| * fungi reads again | 21:37 | |
| lifeless | fungi: testr will be installed by a tox environment | 21:37 |
| lifeless | fungi: 'tox -e testr' will get a venv with testr in it | 21:38 |
| dhellmann | o_O | 21:38 |
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| jroll | there's still a cognitive overhead for devs to switch | 21:38 |
| dhellmann | that solves the dev setup issue | 21:38 |
| dhellmann | what's the benefit of changing this? | 21:38 |
| jroll | which we should not ignore | 21:38 |
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| fungi | ahh, i did indeed misread. i thought you wanted to preinstall testr on our job workers, not install it at job runtime via tox | 21:39 |
| ttx | jroll: ++ | 21:39 |
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| bknudson | if we could make it even less typing, e.g, tox py27 that would be nice... e.g., if the default venv is the testr one. | 21:39 |
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| bknudson | and it handled the argument handling. | 21:40 |
| jroll | thinking about it more, if testr is just calling back into the tox, is there any reason 'tox -e -py27' wouldn't continue to work? | 21:41 |
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| lifeless | jroll: yes, we can't ignore it | 21:41 |
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| lifeless | jroll: so - for testr to be in a constant python environment (which it should be) | 21:42 |
| jroll | (maybe the tox.ini file is changing significantly in a way that doesn't allow 'tox -epy27' to continue working, hard to tell from the spec) | 21:42 |
| lifeless | jroll: we need tox targets that run the tests and output subunit | 21:42 |
| lifeless | jroll: so either new targets, this becomes a parallel infrastructure | 21:42 |
| lifeless | jroll: or we repurpose things and its a refactoring | 21:42 |
| lifeless | jroll: right now its in draft mode - we need more input and thoughts on it | 21:42 |
| ttx | I missed that "tox -e py27" wouldn't work anymore | 21:43 |
| jroll | lifeless: I tend to like the former, so the current method keeps working for devs while they migrate to the new thing | 21:43 |
| jroll | lifeless: maybe a subunit-py27 is what testr calls into | 21:43 |
| clarkb | keep in mind some projects do not trstr | 21:43 |
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| lifeless | jroll: and eventually subunit-py27-constraints | 21:43 |
| jroll | and then we can deprecate or whatever if we feel the need, if the cost of maintaining both is too high | 21:43 |
| clarkb | this effectively doubles infras supported interface count | 21:44 |
| lifeless | jroll: per clarkb's point, we have to consider that some projects aren't yet, or can't yet, or don't want to, use testr | 21:44 |
| jroll | sure. | 21:44 |
| lifeless | so there's cognitive overhead there | 21:44 |
| jroll | lifeless: right, additional overhead that doesn't exist today | 21:44 |
| clarkb | horizon and swift for example | 21:45 |
| fungi | are they both using nose, or using separate things? | 21:45 |
| lifeless | django and testr have not been fully glued together | 21:45 |
| lifeless | swift is still nose | 21:45 |
| clarkb | horizon uses a wrapper thing and swift is nose | 21:45 |
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| clarkb | I think horizon is nose under the covers | 21:46 |
| david-lyle | indeed | 21:46 |
| dhellmann | at least one of the oslo libs is still using nose, too. stevedore or cliff or both. | 21:46 |
| lifeless | it may be useful to remember that testr is both a data store (testr load, testr failing etc) and the meta-runner (testr run, testr list-tests) | 21:46 |
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| jroll | right, so in general (IMHO) 'tox -e py27' should always work, because best I can tell it works in most/all projects | 21:47 |
| lifeless | so I've got some good feedback here. I need to iterate on the spec | 21:47 |
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| thingee | lifeless: great :) | 21:47 |
| lifeless | I don't know if its possible to make tox -e py27 indirect via another tox instance | 21:47 |
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| lifeless | please do all provide thoughts on the spec | 21:47 |
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| lifeless | I'll update it later this week | 21:48 |
| lifeless | aiming for another discussion next meeting | 21:48 |
| thingee | #info good thoughts in today's meeting with this, we'll bring this up next week again | 21:48 |
| jroll | cool, thanks :) | 21:48 |
| thingee | #action lifeless to follow through with another iteration | 21:48 |
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| thingee | lifeless: thanks | 21:48 |
| thingee | #topic open discussion | 21:49 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: crossproject)" | 21:49 | |
| kfox1111 | I've got a topic. | 21:49 |
| kfox1111 | I posted the email as we talked about the other week: | 21:49 |
| thingee | kfox1111: you have the floor | 21:49 |
| kfox1111 | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-September/074126.html | 21:49 |
| thingee | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-September/074126.html | 21:49 |
| kfox1111 | no responses. | 21:49 |
| kfox1111 | I also moved the spec from nova-specs to the cross project repo here: | 21:50 |
| kfox1111 | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/222293/ | 21:50 |
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| redrobot | kfox1111 I think it's an important problem to solve. | 21:50 |
| johnthetubaguy | kfox1111: I think I have quite a few comments on the original Nova spec | 21:50 |
| redrobot | kfox1111 it's on the security team radar as well... | 21:50 |
| johnthetubaguy | redrobot: +1 to the security team radar | 21:51 |
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| kfox1111 | If nothing else, if you think your project is affected by the lack of this feature, please weigh in. | 21:51 |
| thingee | #info Instance Users for Cloud Interaction - sometimes instance need to interact with cloud serivces | 21:51 |
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| thingee | #info spec was moved from nova spec to cross project | 21:51 |
| thingee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/222293/ | 21:51 |
| kfox1111 | johnthetubaguy: I tried to address the comments when I moved it over. Hopefully I didn't drop any. | 21:51 |
| lifeless | oo yes | 21:52 |
| lifeless | this is an important tricky issue | 21:52 |
| johnthetubaguy | kfox1111: I still think the best way forward is to not work on Nova changes, and first agree the mechanism, in general | 21:52 |
| thingee | #info original nova spec comments should be addressed in cross project spec | 21:52 |
| thingee | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/186617 | 21:52 |
| kfox1111 | it would be really nice if we can get as many affected groups in the same room at the summit if we can. | 21:52 |
| johnthetubaguy | kfox1111: I should probably write up my comments better I guess | 21:52 |
| jroll | this would be a great summit topic | 21:52 |
| thingee | kfox1111: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/mitaka-cross-project-session-planning | 21:53 |
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| kfox1111 | johnthetubaguy: Like I commented, I'm ok with it being out of nova, but the final solution must meet all the issues raised in the spec. | 21:53 |
| redrobot | I'm hoping the TC will pick it up for the cross-project-session | 21:53 |
| johnthetubaguy | kfox1111: agreed with that | 21:53 |
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| kfox1111 | so far folks are mostly proposing solutions that aren't viable. :/ | 21:53 |
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| thingee | kfox1111: my bad, you already have it listed | 21:54 |
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| thingee | #info instance users for cloud interaction is proposed to cross project sessions at the summit | 21:54 |
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| lifeless | redrobot: we're going to do a call for topics soon for that, but I"ll add it now | 21:55 |
| kfox1111 | thanks. :) | 21:56 |
| Rockyg | thingee, kfox1111 -- I added it to the cross project session planning proposals with kfox1111 as the presenter. You gonna be in Tokyo? | 21:56 |
| lifeless | ah its already there | 21:56 |
| thingee | lifeless: should be on the etherpad | 21:56 |
| thingee | :) | 21:56 |
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| kfox1111 | Rockyg: thanks. yeah, I'll be there. | 21:56 |
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| thingee | kfox1111: excellent | 21:56 |
| jokke_ | o/ | 21:56 |
| thingee | kfox1111: viable solutions needed, anything else? | 21:57 |
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| kfox1111 | nope. just eyes on the problem. Thanks. :) | 21:57 |
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| thingee | kfox1111: thank you | 21:57 |
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| thingee | anything else before we come to a close? | 21:57 |
| jokke_ | o/ | 21:58 |
| jokke_ | quick one | 21:58 |
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| thingee | jokke_: go for it | 21:58 |
| jokke_ | Big hand to dhellmann for digging into the Glance situation and hallway discussions here http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-September/074360.html | 21:58 |
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| thingee | jokke_: +1 thank you dhellmann | 21:58 |
| Rockyg | ++ | 21:58 |
| jokke_ | If you're affected by glance, please please read and chip in | 21:58 |
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| jokke_ | now we need all the feedback we can to make the right decisions | 21:59 |
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| thingee | #info glance contributors please read discussion with dhellmann's priority proposal | 21:59 |
| thingee | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2015-September/074360.html | 21:59 |
| johnthetubaguy | yes, +1, I have promised to respond from the Nova side, given the impact on what we are doing | 21:59 |
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| thingee | ok thanks everyone!! | 22:00 |
| dhellmann | yes, please also consider the similar ramifications for your project and defcore | 22:00 |
| thingee | #endmeeting | 22:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 22:00 | |
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| ttx | thingee: thx for chairing ! | 22:00 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Sep 15 22:00:20 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 22:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/crossproject/2015/crossproject.2015-09-15-21.00.html | 22:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/crossproject/2015/crossproject.2015-09-15-21.00.txt | 22:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/crossproject/2015/crossproject.2015-09-15-21.00.log.html | 22:00 |
| * thingee bows | 22:00 | |
| * ttx jumps in bed | 22:00 | |
| jokke_ | thnx | 22:00 |
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