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| zehicle | OpenStack Core discussion starting in 5 minutes, hangout URL https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/4661a0dc1ea9e2127f00a97cd86fe68d017aae46?authuser=0&hl=en | 00:55 |
|---|---|---|
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| mikal | I'll be there | 00:57 |
| clarkb | will the discussion happen here or must we join the hangout? I am a little confused as to why both things are happening | 00:57 |
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| mikal | clarkb: I think its just that the URL needed to be announced | 00:59 |
| mikal | The meetup itself is in hangouts | 00:59 |
| clarkb | :/ | 00:59 |
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| zehicle | I'd like to use the IRC for questions and discussion | 01:01 |
| mikal | #startmeeting OpenStack core meetup | 01:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 22 01:01:58 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is mikal. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 01:01 |
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| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 01:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: OpenStack core meetup)" | 01:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_core_meetup' | 01:02 |
| clarkb | ++ to using irc for questions and discussion | 01:02 |
| mikal | #info The hangouts URL is https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/4661a0dc1ea9e2127f00a97cd86fe68d017aae46?authuser=0&hl=en | 01:02 |
| zehicle | reference material http://robhirschfeld.com/2013/08/13/openstack-core-positions/ | 01:03 |
| mikal | clarkb: I am not sure that's a battle I can win... | 01:03 |
| mikal | But you can ask questions here if you want and I will try and relay to hangouts | 01:03 |
| reed | it's noisy in my room | 01:04 |
| clarkb | mikal: zehicle mentioned using IRC for questions and discussion | 01:04 |
| clarkb | in any case I will follow along best I can here | 01:05 |
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| mikal | clarkb: fair enough | 01:06 |
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| mikal | Rob is jsut doing an intro at the moment | 01:08 |
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| mikal | Queued question: why do we need core at all? What do core projects get? What does it mean to be core? | 01:12 |
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| clarkb | I am curious about what "designated code frameworks" are and how they differ from the open reference implementations | 01:17 |
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| lifeless | clarkb: AIUI its a circuitous way of saying 'whats in the openstack/' git trees | 01:18 |
| lifeless | clarkb: but we should get clarification of that :) | 01:18 |
| lifeless | mikal: ^ | 01:18 |
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| mikal | Queued question: how do we handle vendor patchsets on top of "designated code"? | 01:28 |
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| mordred | zehicle: I can't join the hangout - non-free software, laptop that needs to be secure for openstack-infra purposes ... BUT | 01:30 |
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| lifeless | mordred: wintendo VM ! | 01:30 |
| mordred | zehicle: I do still want clarification on the point you've got up in there about alternate implementations | 01:30 |
| lifeless | mordred: can you hear us? | 01:31 |
| zehicle | can you hear? | 01:31 |
| mordred | zehicle: which I _believe_ you intend to be referring to the plugin architecture without saying plugin | 01:31 |
| mordred | I cannot | 01:31 |
| mordred | is there a dial-in number? | 01:31 |
| lifeless | mordred: how are you aware of whats being shown ? | 01:31 |
| mordred | I know zehicle's material :) | 01:31 |
| clarkb | for the recent queued question why wouldn't vendor patchsets go through the normal code review process? | 01:31 |
| mordred | lifeless: and http://robhirschfeld.com/2013/08/13/openstack-core-positions/ | 01:31 |
| zehicle | https://secure.join.me/876-719-301 | 01:32 |
| zehicle | try this | 01:32 |
| mordred | zehicle: thanks! | 01:32 |
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| mordred | zehicle: but it reads to me still like you're suggesting that someone can reimplement the API completely clean | 01:32 |
| mordred | ths is in response to "Vendors may substitute alternate implementations" | 01:33 |
| mordred | other than that - I love it | 01:33 |
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| mikal | So to summarize that tangent, "required code" would be somehting like the nova core code, and replacable bits are things like nova hypervisor drivers. | 01:37 |
| mikal | ie. you might be required to run nova-api, nova-scheduler, etc, etc but with your choice of hypervisor | 01:37 |
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| lifeless | mikal: AIUI yes. | 01:38 |
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| lifeless | mikal: but are you running nova-api if you patch it? | 01:38 |
| mikal | I think we dig into that later in the meeting, hence the queued question bit | 01:39 |
| lifeless | mikal: I know :) | 01:39 |
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| mordred | my god. now I'm looking at your faces | 01:42 |
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| clarkb | before I forget, I think it is also worth mentioning that 6.B while noble doesn't seem enforceable | 01:58 |
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| zehicle | there's an expectation that the market will punish people | 02:00 |
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| zehicle | designated upsteam code | 02:12 |
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| reed | I need to go in 3 min | 02:25 |
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| zehicle | #end | 03:50 |
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| mikal | #endmeeting | 04:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 04:12 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 22 04:12:27 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 04:12 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_core_meetup/2013/openstack_core_meetup.2013-10-22-01.01.html | 04:12 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_core_meetup/2013/openstack_core_meetup.2013-10-22-01.01.txt | 04:12 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_core_meetup/2013/openstack_core_meetup.2013-10-22-01.01.log.html | 04:12 |
| mikal | (Sorry I forgot to do that before) | 04:12 |
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| dianefleming | good morning! | 12:59 |
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| AJaeger | Good morning! | 12:59 |
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| annegentle | Ok moving over here! | 12:59 |
| annegentle | It's my birthday! Yay! | 13:00 |
| dianefleming | where the cool kids are | 13:00 |
| annegentle | :) dianefleming | 13:00 |
| dianefleming | HAPPY BIRTHDAY ANNE | 13:00 |
| dianefleming | you don't look a day over 32 | 13:00 |
| * AJaeger sings Happy Birthday, dear Anne, happy Birthday to you... | 13:00 | |
| annegentle | that's right! I'm going to leave it as, I'm a child of the 80s :) | 13:00 |
| annegentle | Thanks AJaeger | 13:00 |
| annegentle | Ok, let's kick this meeting off | 13:01 |
| annegentle | #startmeeting docteammeeting | 13:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 22 13:01:15 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is annegentle. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 13:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 13:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: docteammeeting)" | 13:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'docteammeeting' | 13:01 |
| annegentle | The agenda is at http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/DocTeamMeeting, feel free to add to it. | 13:01 |
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| annegentle | Most of you know this, We use "MeetBot" for IRC meeting note-taking, see http://meetbot.debian.net/Manual.html for a reference for the different hashtags used. | 13:01 |
| EmilienM | hello :) and happy birthday Anne !! (joyeux anniversaire in french) | 13:01 |
| NickChase | Hey, happy birtheday, Anne! | 13:02 |
| annegentle | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/DocTeamMeeting#Agenda_for_next_meeting | 13:02 |
| annegentle | Thanks NickChase and EmilienM! | 13:02 |
| chandankumar | annegentle, Happy Birthday ANNE. :) | 13:02 |
| dguitarbite | happy b'day ANNE | 13:02 |
| annegentle | :) | 13:02 |
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| annegentle | So I think all the Actions should be easy to run through. | 13:02 |
| annegentle | ACTION: shaunm_ testing nova-network on Fedora, DONE | 13:02 |
| annegentle | At least I think so. Shaun's not here | 13:03 |
| annegentle | ACTION: AnneGentle to email the openstack list asking for help, DONE -- got a good response too! | 13:03 |
| annegentle | And that was it for actions | 13:03 |
| annegentle | Next up | 13:04 |
| annegentle | #topic Bug report, DocImpact state | 13:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Bug report, DocImpact state (Meeting topic: docteammeeting)" | 13:04 | |
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| annegentle | So, I think that dianefleming has been moving havana bugs to icehouse when they apply to icehouse, like v3 Compute API | 13:04 |
| dianefleming | yes | 13:04 |
| annegentle | There are a lot of bugs and comments for the install guide, which are havana. | 13:05 |
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| annegentle | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+milestone/havana | 13:05 |
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| annegentle | But I don't think our havana numbers will go down noticeably until say XenAPI gets revisions, that kind of grouping is what I'm seeing. | 13:05 |
| dianefleming | i can take on moving all the bugs if you want (havana bugs) and noting to backport to havana | 13:05 |
| AJaeger | Should we discuss the Install Guide as extra topic? | 13:05 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: I think what the code projects do is move them wholesale through the Launchpad API, but I don't yet know exact details | 13:06 |
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| annegentle | dianefleming: so we might save you some clicks if we can figure out the API way? | 13:06 |
| dianefleming | awesome! | 13:06 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: yes let's have the install guide as another topic | 13:06 |
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| * AJaeger adds it to AGenda | 13:06 | |
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| annegentle | I also think there are keystone doc bugs and vmware doc bugs | 13:07 |
| annegentle | I sense that there are big groups of doc bugs | 13:07 |
| annegentle | Just noting that, not saying we have to take a specific action | 13:07 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: perfect, thanks | 13:07 |
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| annegentle | There are definitely doc bugs that could be easily picked up, triaged, and might already be fixed, such as Nova CLI has new IP parameter, neutron-debug is not documented, Add swift_store_ssl_compression param, those all seem fixable | 13:08 |
| annegentle | So my note on the bug report is to keep fixing doc bugs :) | 13:08 |
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| annegentle | And, I've been entering doc bugs for the install guide when comments indicate a doc bug | 13:09 |
| annegentle | Anything else on doc bugs? | 13:09 |
| annegentle | Ok, next topic | 13:09 |
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| * annegentle hits refresh | 13:09 | |
| annegentle | #topic Install Guide | 13:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Install Guide (Meeting topic: docteammeeting)" | 13:09 | |
| annegentle | AJaeger: just saw your new bug from your QA input, that's good to get, want to discuss? | 13:10 |
| annegentle | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+bug/1243131 | 13:10 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1243131 in openstack-manuals "Comments on Neutron" [High,New] | 13:10 |
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| AJaeger | Just an info: I have one of our QA guys going through the document - and sending me emails with things that are wrong... | 13:10 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: that's great. | 13:11 |
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| AJaeger | I see a lot of patches for the Install Guide and would ask to review these quickly to avoid conflicts | 13:11 |
| annegentle | The comments have been very useful too | 13:11 |
| annegentle | As is the doc bug link | 13:12 |
| NickChase | they seem like pretty straightforward corrections. | 13:12 |
| AJaeger | Should we mark these patches in a special way? | 13:12 |
| NickChase | very helpful | 13:12 |
| annegentle | NickChase: yeah some markup stuff, some duplications | 13:12 |
| AJaeger | The doc bug link is GREAT! | 13:12 |
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| annegentle | AJaeger: Just with backport: stable/havana | 13:12 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: yes! | 13:12 |
| AJaeger | I meant something like say "Install Guide" in the commit header... | 13:12 |
| NickChase | LOVE that you get the source file where the problem is | 13:12 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: yes I agree on reviewing install guide patches quickly, and backporting as soon as they merge | 13:12 |
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| annegentle | AJaeger: oh that would be good, sorry I hadn't used that the last few patche | 13:13 |
| annegentle | patches | 13:13 |
| * AJaeger didn't use it either | 13:13 | |
| annegentle | #agreed Use Install Guide in the commit header when patching the Install Guide so that reviewers can make those patches a priority | 13:13 |
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| annegentle | Anyone else have input on install guides? I wish Shaun was online | 13:14 |
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| annegentle | I don't know when his contract is up | 13:14 |
| nermina | hello all | 13:14 |
| annegentle | Does anyone else want to be a moderator on install guide comments? For Ubuntu it's me, EmilienM, Tom, and Lorin I think. | 13:14 |
| annegentle | hi nermina! | 13:14 |
| nermina | sorry, two different school dropoffs | 13:15 |
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| annegentle | I'm a little irritated with Disqus for forcing loging to see the feed of comments on a particular guide | 13:15 |
| annegentle | I hope to replace Disqus with ask.openstack.org Real Soon Now. | 13:15 |
| dianefleming | yes! | 13:15 |
| annegentle | loging should be logging in | 13:15 |
| dianefleming | what's the blocker from doing it asap? | 13:15 |
| AJaeger | with the bug links, we could also remove everything... | 13:16 |
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| annegentle | sorry just got interrupted in person :) | 13:18 |
| NickChase | How dare they. :) | 13:18 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: it's really just getting that redesign done, from Todd Morey | 13:19 |
| dianefleming | ok! | 13:19 |
| koolhead17 | hi all | 13:19 |
| annegentle | I've got a blueprint now for the redesign: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+spec/redesign-docs-site | 13:19 |
| annegentle | hey koolhead17 | 13:20 |
| koolhead17 | EmilienM: thanks for the tip. birthday wishes annegentle | 13:20 |
| annegentle | and I've asked Todd if he can have a demo ready by the summit | 13:20 |
| annegentle | koolhead17: hee hee thanks! | 13:20 |
| koolhead17 | annegentle: awesome!! | 13:20 |
| annegentle | koolhead17: yes I have high hopes, Todd is incredible | 13:20 |
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| annegentle | Ok, I definitely want to emphasize speedy attention on the install guide bug reports | 13:21 |
| annegentle | Let's move the agenda around a bit to give sarob a chance to join in | 13:21 |
| annegentle | #topic Backports | 13:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Backports (Meeting topic: docteammeeting)" | 13:21 | |
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| AJaeger | I put this on the agenda since dianefleming did a great rework of one my backports. | 13:22 |
| annegentle | We have a nice addition/explanation for backports on the wiki now | 13:22 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: oh nice! | 13:22 |
| AJaeger | I'm under the impression that backports should be cherry-picks (plus resolving conflicts) only | 13:22 |
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| dianefleming | phew! glad it was ok @AJaeger | 13:22 |
| annegentle | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Documentation/HowTo#Git_commit_messages_and_backports | 13:22 |
| AJaeger | So, I split out dianefleming'S patch into a separate patch. | 13:22 |
| dianefleming | thanks! | 13:22 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: yeah, that makes sense to me as a reviewer, otherwise the merging might get too hard | 13:23 |
| AJaeger | dianefleming, text was great - but not as part of the backport | 13:23 |
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| dianefleming | yeah, I didn't notice it was a backport until i was in too deep - sorry about that | 13:23 |
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| AJaeger | dianefleming, easy to solve, still we have to be carefull | 13:23 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: heh :) | 13:23 |
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| annegentle | dianefleming: no worries | 13:23 |
| AJaeger | Do we need the usual 2 approvals for simple backports? | 13:24 |
| dianefleming | i wish there was a way to auto-backport - seems like we do too much work on those | 13:24 |
| AJaeger | Or do we want to do them quicker? | 13:24 |
| dguitarbite | cherry picks +1 easier to avoid accidents | 13:24 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: no, I think we should make it a policy that if the backport merged into master, only one core needs to review it for backport | 13:24 |
| chandankumar | dianefleming, actually how backporting is done, so that i cna help. | 13:25 |
| chandankumar | *can | 13:25 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: we're a little different from other projects in that we don't have a stable team | 13:25 |
| annegentle | dedicated stable team | 13:25 |
| annegentle | so I think core is our dedicated stable team and we can make fast merges | 13:25 |
| AJaeger | chandankumar, see the link above by annegentle | 13:25 |
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| AJaeger | So, if I propose a backport, somebody else give the +2/approval? | 13:26 |
| annegentle | There is a blueprint for automating backports: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+spec/attempt-backport-by-commit-message | 13:26 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: yes that seems safe and sane to me, anyone else think that's crazy? | 13:26 |
| dianefleming | sounds good to me - the +2 approval on backports | 13:26 |
| dguitarbite | annegentle: safer and easier for newbies/non-git-gerrit geeks | 13:26 |
| annegentle | I think backports fade out over time, but yeah, we do a LOT of them especially on install guide | 13:27 |
| NickChase | I'm all for the automated backport | 13:27 |
| AJaeger | It'S only install guide and config reference - and Install Guide needs a bit more testing and fixing | 13:27 |
| annegentle | NickChase: I'm just not convinced it can ever be automated, those have rebase conflicts all the time | 13:27 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: yeah true that | 13:27 |
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| AJaeger | right now I'm checking that patches get proposed for the guides and propose some myself to avoid conflicts | 13:28 |
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| NickChase | annegentle: I'm not a git expert, but seems to me that if it works it'd be helpful, but for those cases where it doesn't we haven't lost anything. | 13:28 |
| annegentle | NickChase: yeah true | 13:28 |
| annegentle | Ok still no sarob but we can start talking about rst to xml so nermina has an idea of where they are | 13:28 |
| NickChase | plus there are people (like myself, admittedly) who just don't know how to do it, but we CAN mark whether it should be done | 13:29 |
| annegentle | NickChase: yep, and that helps too | 13:29 |
| dianefleming | automation would save a lot of time - even if we have to manually merge | 13:29 |
| annegentle | #topic devref rst to xml conversion | 13:29 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "devref rst to xml conversion (Meeting topic: docteammeeting)" | 13:29 | |
| NickChase | and it forces people to think about whether a patch should be backported; I suspect there are lots of changes that should have gone back to grizzly but didn't because people just didn't htink of it | 13:29 |
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| annegentle | NickChase: you know, that's true too | 13:29 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: yeah automating some steps helps | 13:29 |
| annegentle | is that even grammatically correct? Anywho | 13:30 |
| annegentle | We can talk more about automation! | 13:30 |
| AJaeger | NickChase, That's why we demand the "backport: havana" or "backport: none" now for all changes that target guides that we do separately for havana | 13:30 |
| annegentle | So we had several concerns with their original patch | 13:30 |
| annegentle | oh maybe I should back up even further | 13:30 |
| AJaeger | At least it's now a concise decision and not neglect | 13:30 |
| annegentle | The goal for the training manuals is to reuse all they can to reorganize the content into training guides | 13:30 |
| dguitarbite | are you guys working on rst to xml? I believe that sarob is working on it as of now | 13:30 |
| nermina | was that the original patch you sent me, annegentle | 13:31 |
| nermina | ? | 13:31 |
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| AJaeger | annegentle, I agree with your proposal moving forward. | 13:31 |
| chandankumar | annegentle, we can do rst to xml conversion by using rst2xml package provided by docutils. | 13:31 |
| annegentle | nermina: the patch I sent was their attempt at automation manually, bringing in content they felt was missing | 13:31 |
| AJaeger | The question to me is whether we should ask the projects like nova to remove patches and point to the documentation that we write? | 13:31 |
| annegentle | chandankumar: yes that's their patch | 13:31 |
| annegentle | #link http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/openstack-manuals/tree/doc/training-guide | 13:31 |
| nermina | that's what i thought, annegentle | 13:32 |
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| annegentle | The training manuals have four personas in mind: associate, operator, developer, architect | 13:32 |
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| nermina | ok | 13:32 |
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| annegentle | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/50509/ | 13:32 |
| shaunm | annegentle: are there write-ups of those personas yet? | 13:32 |
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| dguitarbite | sarob is working on it, here is the link for it : https://github.com/sarob/openstack-sarob | 13:33 |
| nermina | annegentle, is the audience documented somewhere? | 13:33 |
| annegentle | shaunm: I'm looking | 13:33 |
| dguitarbite | audience in d sense for the associate, operator .. ?? | 13:34 |
| annegentle | Ok, so if you look at "what does this book intend to teach" like http://git.openstack.org/cgit/openstack/openstack-manuals/tree/doc/training-guide/bk004-ch001-architect-what-does-this-book-intend-to-teach.xml | 13:34 |
| annegentle | you see the idea behind their guide | 13:34 |
| annegentle | also | 13:35 |
| annegentle | #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+spec/training-manuals | 13:35 |
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| dguitarbite | heras of now its there on the wiki https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Training-manuals | 13:35 |
| annegentle | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Training-manuals | 13:35 |
| dguitarbite | its a tricky thing to get it sorted | 13:35 |
| annegentle | The idea from our perspective (docs) is that we'd offer them guidance, avoidance of pitfalls, a process and tools | 13:35 |
| annegentle | Sort of like incubation within the Docs program, until they can have their own program | 13:35 |
| dguitarbite | we are working on the official version for the intended audience | 13:35 |
| annegentle | dguitarbite: my understanding is that Associates is the first course | 13:36 |
| nermina | thanks, dguitarbite | 13:36 |
| dguitarbite | nps | 13:36 |
| annegentle | dguitarbite: and not devs yet | 13:36 |
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| dguitarbite | yes | 13:36 |
| annegentle | nermina: but apparently they discovered missing info and wanted to bring it in from dev guides | 13:37 |
| nermina | right | 13:37 |
| dguitarbite | annegntle: associate is the first one, we plan to get the alpha version out before end of this year | 13:37 |
| annegentle | so my suggestion is that the info that's missing should find a place in openstack-manuals | 13:37 |
| annegentle | nermina: I think it's great if you can help them, because it'll make the docs better | 13:37 |
| nermina | annegentle, could i get a week to analyze this and come up with some recommendations? | 13:37 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: I'm glad you can double-check my sanity, thanks | 13:38 |
| annegentle | nermina: absolutely fine by me, and if dguitarbite knows their timeline, then it sounds like a week is good | 13:38 |
| AJaeger | can we somehow sync on a common set of persons between training and doc? | 13:38 |
| nermina | annegentle, i'll match it up against the guides | 13:38 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: htinking | 13:38 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: so, the user committee has personas, to me those match more with docs | 13:38 |
| nermina | and see how they can be interlinked, annegentle | 13:38 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: training is more about "what job can I get after completing this" | 13:39 |
| annegentle | nermina: yes... pondering | 13:39 |
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| AJaeger | I see | 13:39 |
| nermina | we could do a blueprint, annegentle | 13:39 |
| annegentle | I'm not sure I'd make a 1:1 match, honestly, because of the "jobs jobs" focus of training | 13:39 |
| dguitarbite | AJaeger: Training will also have quizes, PPT generators etc. etc. which you would not prefer to keep in the manuals | 13:39 |
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| nermina | no, i meant to see how they can relate, annegentle | 13:40 |
| nermina | synchronize, if you will | 13:40 |
| AJaeger | dguitarbite, I agree - but the more we align our goals, the easier we can share. | 13:40 |
| annegentle | nermina: well, I made Sean do a blueprint for automation, and his training manuals, so I don't know if another blueprint is necessary, but it would certainly help if you can study their blueprint | 13:40 |
| annegentle | nermina: and perhaps update their blueprint | 13:40 |
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| annegentle | nermina: for exapmle, their Book structure section | 13:41 |
| nermina | annegentle, no problem, that sounds good | 13:41 |
| annegentle | nermina: ok, excellent | 13:41 |
| dguitarbite | AJaeger: I have proposed this to sean for reusing the training manuals, thats the reason we spent time on xpath ... the basic goal is to reuse as much openstack-manuals as possible | 13:41 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: yeah I agree with goal alignment to a point, but if the goal is to let them eventually run their own program, do we all align with the user committee personas as an overarching organizer? | 13:42 |
| annegentle | AJaeger: and that might just be an academic question more than pragmatic, not sure yet | 13:42 |
| nermina | annegentle, ajaeger, i think their set is more specific and defined within practices | 13:42 |
| AJaeger | annegentle, as far as it makes sense. If we can agree on three out of four it would be better than on none. Might indeed be academic... | 13:42 |
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| AJaeger | nermina, in that case let's move on and ignore me ;) | 13:43 |
| annegentle | Hee | 13:43 |
| annegentle | It's ideal to collaborate and understand each other as much as possible! | 13:43 |
| nermina | i agree annegentle | 13:43 |
| nermina | i see your point too ajaeger | 13:43 |
| annegentle | dguitarbite: I really don't want to slow your progress, and I do think all the docs will be better after this analysis | 13:44 |
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| nermina | i feel like the training team is closer to the user community | 13:44 |
| nermina | and they know their needs | 13:44 |
| annegentle | nermina: yes, I think so too, they are doing working sessions at user groups, which is really cool | 13:44 |
| dguitarbite | annegentle: agree | 13:45 |
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| annegentle | Ok, I think that's it for topics, how about open discussion | 13:45 |
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| annegentle | #Open discussion | 13:45 |
| annegentle | I finally got the sitemap.xml ready, thanks to dwcramer for the help with the XSLT | 13:45 |
| NickChase | Did you want to talk about the licensing thing? | 13:46 |
| annegentle | This is the first release I couldn't do it all manually | 13:46 |
| annegentle | NickChase: yes! | 13:46 |
| nermina | happy birthday, annegentle! | 13:46 |
| annegentle | nermina: thanks! | 13:46 |
| NickChase | annegentle: cool on the sitemap.xml | 13:46 |
| dianefleming | @annegentle - two topics - 1) automation of command ref and 2) removal of API references and introduction of API guide | 13:46 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: sure | 13:46 |
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| NickChase | so regarding the licensing, we have the doc from the lawyer | 13:46 |
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| annegentle | Ok NickChase first | 13:47 |
| NickChase | (sorry, didn't mean to jump in and be rude!) | 13:47 |
| dianefleming | I wrote a blueprint on 2) but I need to write a blueprint on 1) - my main question is, who needs to review/approve the blueprints? | 13:47 |
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| NickChase | the trouble is that the license for the docs is specified in the CLA | 13:48 |
| NickChase | so if we are going to change the license, we need a way for people to acknowledge that change. basically... | 13:48 |
| NickChase | we have to get their agreement that changes they submit are now under this new license. | 13:48 |
| NickChase | For a small team, that's not a big deal; we could conceivably do it manually | 13:48 |
| NickChase | but if we change the CLA, that's a big, big deal. | 13:49 |
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| NickChase | Also, we need to define "attribution" and what we want people to do with our books if they reuse them (ie, keep attribution, remove it, etc.) | 13:49 |
| NickChase | So those are the basic issues. Do we need to actually DO anything or are we going to let the board just make some decisions and THEN talk about it? | 13:50 |
| annegentle | NickChase: we're going to let the board churn on it :) | 13:51 |
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| annegentle | NickChase: that's a great report, thanks for the leg work! | 13:51 |
| NickChase | annegentle: sounds like a plan. :) | 13:51 |
| NickChase | my pleasure | 13:51 |
| annegentle | Ok, dianefleming you're up | 13:51 |
| dianefleming | ok! | 13:51 |
| dianefleming | for the command ref automation (actually command ref content in the user guides), i need to write a blueprint - who needs to review/approve it? | 13:52 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: I found this: https://pypi.python.org/pypi/sphinxcontrib-programoutput | 13:52 |
| dianefleming | for the api refs removal and addition of the api guide, can I assume that's approved or do I need to pass that by dev? | 13:52 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: it's implementation detail, but found it does mean a change to requirements.txt, which would have to go through ci core approval I believe | 13:53 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: so, for automation of command ref output, it might be a blueprint within ci? I dont' mind it being in openstack-manuals though | 13:53 |
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| dianefleming | ok | 13:53 |
| sarob | Sarob here | 13:53 |
| dianefleming | i can put command ref blueprint in ci | 13:53 |
| annegentle | hey sarob! | 13:53 |
| dianefleming | hi sarob | 13:53 |
| NickChase | hi sarob | 13:54 |
| sarob | Sorry late | 13:54 |
| sarob | Just hit sfo | 13:54 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: I can give you more details after the meeting about requirements.txt | 13:54 |
| annegentle | welcome sarob | 13:54 |
| sarob | Thx | 13:54 |
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| dianefleming | thanks - i'll be in the office around 11am | 13:54 |
| nermina | hi sarob | 13:54 |
| annegentle | sarob: you'll see the discussion in the notes, but the gist of it is nermina is going to take this week to analyze the content | 13:54 |
| dguitarbite | hi saob | 13:54 |
| dguitarbite | *sarob | 13:55 |
| dianefleming | as for api ref/api guide, it means removing the repos for the api refs, which would impact dev - right? | 13:55 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: cool | 13:55 |
| dianefleming | so they should approve/reject that blueprint? | 13:55 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: yeah that part is really tough to say how the individual projects would react | 13:55 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: it's nearly a TC level question, since it affects all projects | 13:55 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: I'm averse to removing them, honestly | 13:55 |
| dianefleming | okay, i'll talk to you about that when I come into office | 13:55 |
| annegentle | dianefleming: ok | 13:55 |
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| dianefleming | hmmm - let's talk | 13:55 |
| sarob | I late but | 13:56 |
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| annegentle | dianefleming: not sure if it's just because I created them due to some conflict coming out among core members of nova | 13:56 |
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| sarob | Can we move the devref project rst as well then? | 13:56 |
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| sarob | Or discuss with TC at the same time? | 13:56 |
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| sarob | Cause doing one page move at a time is going to kill our project | 13:57 |
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| annegentle | sarob: pretty sure we're not trying to kill your project :) | 13:58 |
| sarob | Nope I don't think that | 13:58 |
| annegentle | sarob: it's not one page at a time, it's looking at your larger outline and ensuring the pieces fit | 13:58 |
| annegentle | sarob: is this all content needed for associates? | 13:58 |
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| annegentle | sarob: we also talked about persona alignment | 13:59 |
| sarob | Many pages yeas | 13:59 |
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| annegentle | sarob: I think nermina will have a good handle on 4-5 patches (just guessing) that will need to come in | 14:00 |
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| sarob | It is more straightforward to mass convert while still developing the documentation | 14:00 |
| sarob | And flow | 14:00 |
| nermina | sarob, i'll see how the content is organized and how it can communicate with the user guides | 14:00 |
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| annegentle | sarob: I think you'll get conversion but probably not as big as https://review.openstack.org/#/c/50509/ ended up | 14:01 |
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| annegentle | sarob: and I do think some of it is developer, not associate | 14:01 |
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| sarob | True | 14:01 |
| annegentle | sarob: do you you have a timeline? | 14:01 |
| sarob | It will land in the same place | 14:02 |
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| annegentle | sarob: dguitarbite was saying by Dec. | 14:02 |
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| sarob | Yes | 14:02 |
| annegentle | wow it's after 9 | 14:02 |
| annegentle | Ok, I'm going to end this meeting, but please continue in #openstack-doc | 14:02 |
| annegentle | #endmeeting | 14:03 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 14:03 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 22 14:03:01 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:03 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/docteammeeting/2013/docteammeeting.2013-10-22-13.01.html | 14:03 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/docteammeeting/2013/docteammeeting.2013-10-22-13.01.txt | 14:03 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/docteammeeting/2013/docteammeeting.2013-10-22-13.01.log.html | 14:03 |
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| dguitarbite | sarob: we have training-manuals meeting | 14:03 |
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| alaski | garyk: ping | 15:01 |
| garyk | anyone around for the scheduler | 15:01 |
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| garyk | alaski: hi | 15:01 |
| garyk | you want to run it or should i? | 15:01 |
| alaski | go ahead. Just making sure you were here | 15:02 |
| garyk | yeah, thanks for taking care of last week | 15:02 |
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| alaski | sure, np | 15:02 |
| garyk | everyone ready to start | 15:02 |
| garyk | #startmeeting scheduler | 15:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 22 15:02:59 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is garyk. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: scheduler)" | 15:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'scheduler' | 15:03 |
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| garyk | sorry about not making it last week | 15:03 |
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| garyk | do we have any open issues regarding the summit sessions? | 15:03 |
| Yathi | What is the final list? | 15:03 |
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| alaski | The list isn't final yet | 15:04 |
| Yathi | Last week we decided to merge API + smart resource placement sessions into one | 15:04 |
| alaski | but we're looking at 4 slots right now | 15:04 |
| Yathi | after some discussion other pieces were taken out | 15:04 |
| alaski | so API and smart resource placement should get their own sessions | 15:04 |
| alaski | instance group api | 15:04 |
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| Yathi | oh that is sweet | 15:04 |
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| mspreitz | So we got 4 slots? | 15:04 |
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| garyk | is there an updated list of the latest session topics | 15:05 |
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| alaski | mspreitz: yes | 15:05 |
| mspreitz | great | 15:06 |
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| Yathi | are we documenting this final list some where ? | 15:06 |
| alaski | garyk: not yet, some have been refused and preapproved but a lot aren't touched yet | 15:06 |
| garyk | alaski: ok, thanks | 15:06 |
| alaski | but the ones that were discussed last week are looking good for approval | 15:07 |
| garyk | great. thanks! | 15:07 |
| alaski | rethinking scheduler design, extensible metrics, instance group api, amrter resource placement | 15:07 |
| alaski | smarter | 15:07 |
| garyk | ok cool. | 15:07 |
| garyk | i have concerns with the metrics | 15:08 |
| alaski | rethinking design is taking over for performance since boris didn't propose a session | 15:08 |
| alaski | and they seem to have some overlap | 15:08 |
| garyk | not really regarding the session but issues that i stumbled on a few days ago | 15:08 |
| garyk | i think that is logical. i guess that the design considerations should take the performance and scale into account | 15:09 |
| alaski | garyk: are you going to be at the summit? | 15:09 |
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| garyk | alaski: are you familiar with the | 15:09 |
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| garyk | alaski: yes, i will be at the summit | 15:09 |
| mspreitz | BTW, what is the format of the design summit sessions going to be? I heard a suggestion of text chat only. | 15:10 |
| alaski | garyk: okay, it will be good if you can voicethe issue in person | 15:10 |
| garyk | alaski: understood. | 15:10 |
| alaski | mspreitz: it's a discussion, with notetaking in etherpads | 15:10 |
| mspreitz | thanks | 15:11 |
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| garyk | just wanted to ask about the resource tracking - it just seems to ignore all used statistics form the hypervisor | 15:11 |
| mspreitz | garyk: examples? | 15:11 |
| garyk | that is, the hypervisor returns used disk and used memory | 15:11 |
| mspreitz | garyk: no good to ignore, IMHO | 15:12 |
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| garyk | the scheduler is not aware of these as the resource tracker calculate the used memeory and disk by itself | 15:12 |
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| garyk | mspreitz: that is my concern too | 15:12 |
| mspreitz | Do we have evidence of whether or not that dead reckoning falls short in practice? | 15:12 |
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| Yathi | don't we update the host metrics after a scheduling is done | 15:12 |
| Yathi | I am surprised | 15:13 |
| mspreitz | (I have evidence from other systems that it will) | 15:13 |
| garyk | mspreitz: i am not sure. | 15:13 |
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| garyk | my concern is that the scheduler may think that there is enough disk space but a cinder volume may take up space and the resource tracker may not be aware of this | 15:14 |
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| garyk | that is just one case. | 15:14 |
| mspreitz | Yow, that's a really simple example. | 15:14 |
| mspreitz | If it can fail that way, won't we already have reports of problems? | 15:14 |
| garyk | i guess that i need to go back and do my homework | 15:14 |
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| Yathi | well scheduler has this notion of retries.. | 15:15 |
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| toan-tran | I have a problem of updating too | 15:15 |
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| Yathi | I am guessing that is how it works now.. if something is not really available | 15:15 |
| toan-tran | whenI create multiples VMs | 15:15 |
| toan-tran | I got that they are not registered immediately | 15:15 |
| garyk | please look at the comment - https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/master/nova/compute/resource_tracker.py#L576 | 15:15 |
| garyk | toan-tran: not sure i understand your comment. what do you mean by regsitered | 15:16 |
| toan-tran | meaning the scheduler sheduling the second VM does not know see the first in DB | 15:16 |
| toan-tran | sorry, register = update DB | 15:16 |
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| toan-tran | I made a simple weigher that looks for number of VMs in a host instead of available Ram | 15:17 |
| Yathi | garyk: now it makes sense, probably it is just taking into consideration the current instance | 15:17 |
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| alaski | toan-tran: yeah, there's definitely a race condition with muiltiple instances being scheduled in quick succession | 15:17 |
| Yathi | and not the actual hypervisor's state | 15:17 |
| toan-tran | then I found out that DB is not updated among multiple VMs | 15:17 |
| garyk | Yathi: but the hyperviosr has the true picture of the actual state of the host - that is, the actual amount of free memory and disk space. | 15:18 |
| mspreitz | This is one reason I keep talking about scheduling against the union of observed and target state. | 15:18 |
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| alaski | So there was a session proposed about cleaning up the resource tracker. We're passing it over based on there being no contention about cleaning it up. | 15:19 |
| Yathi | something still needs to be done for race conditions I guess, when multiple scheduling calls in parallel or quick succession | 15:19 |
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| alaski | There are likely to be issues with it but I don't think there's resistance to fixing it up | 15:20 |
| mspreitz | Yeah. Take the union of plans and effects as the current usage. | 15:20 |
| toan-tran | Yathi: +1 | 15:20 |
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| garyk | alaski: i am in favor of fixing it up. | 15:21 |
| Yathi | which of our planned sessions covers the resource tracking topic - enhanced metrics ? | 15:21 |
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| mspreitz | I think the other one... that's Boris' topic, right? | 15:21 |
| garyk | alaski: i just think that it would be nice if there were considerations to the actual usage on the hyperviosr | 15:21 |
| alaski | garyk: agreed | 15:21 |
| Yathi | garyk: +1 | 15:21 |
| mspreitz | alaski, garyk: agree. Union the actual usage and the planned usae. | 15:22 |
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| Yathi | how often do we update the db to get the latest hypervisor states.. that matters I guess here | 15:22 |
| alaski | Yathi: enhanced metrics has some overlap with resource tracking concerns | 15:23 |
| mspreitz | If you use the union, latency only affects speed with which you can reclaim freed space | 15:23 |
| toan-tran | garyk: +1 | 15:23 |
| alaski | but overall resource tracking issues are non contentious. the work just needs to be done | 15:23 |
| garyk | resource tracker - http://docs.openstack.org/developer/nova/api/nova.compute.resource_tracker.html | 15:24 |
| toan-tran | Yathi: if I'm not wrong, once per several seconds at best | 15:25 |
| toan-tran | Yathi: if I'm not wrong, once per several seconds at best | 15:25 |
| mspreitz | Maybe somebody could spell out those two current session proposals in a bit of detail, so we know what goes in which? | 15:25 |
| garyk | mspreitz: as far as i recall the one was about ceilometer/accessing the resources directly | 15:25 |
| Yathi | what is part of the "rethinking design" session | 15:26 |
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| garyk | i thin line 63 - https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/IceHouse-Nova-Scheduler-Sessions | 15:26 |
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| toan-tran | there is a blueprint on real resource usage: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/utilization-aware-scheduling | 15:27 |
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| garyk | alaski: Yathi: who will be leading the "rethinking" session? | 15:28 |
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| Yathi | where is the "rethinking" session in our etherpad? | 15:28 |
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| garyk | Yathi: I do not think that it appears. | 15:29 |
| alaski | garyk: I believe it's Mike Wilson(?) | 15:29 |
| alaski | goes by geekinutah in irc, but doesn't appear to be on | 15:29 |
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| alaski | Yathi: it's not in the etherpad, but it took the place of scheduler performance | 15:30 |
| alaski | since there's no propsed session there | 15:30 |
| garyk | alaski: thanks. | 15:30 |
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| mspreitz | I thought Boris was going to propose a session? | 15:31 |
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| alaski | and it's looking to address similar concerns | 15:31 |
| alaski | mspreitz: I thought so to, but he didn't | 15:31 |
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| garyk | i guess that we should try and sync on this topic so that we can be most affective when we meet up | 15:31 |
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| mspreitz | garyk: sounds good, but what does that mean? | 15:32 |
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| Yathi | Can someone please point me to any written description of this "rethinking" session? | 15:32 |
| alaski | Yathi: http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/34 | 15:33 |
| Yathi | alaski: Thanks | 15:33 |
| garyk | mspreitz: i am not sure. i think that we need to have boris and theguyfromutah talk | 15:33 |
| mspreitz | Session 34 is different from Boris' topic | 15:33 |
| mspreitz | garyk: if we can do that, it would be great | 15:34 |
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| Yathi | There are some overlaps in the "rethinking" session to our "smart resource placement" ideas | 15:34 |
| garyk | #action try and get some talk about ideas of the rethinking prior to the summit | 15:35 |
| mspreitz | Yathi: yes. Smart has to be "good enough" | 15:35 |
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| Yathi | mspreitz: yeah the smart need to always wait for the most optimal solution | 15:35 |
| Yathi | but it need not | 15:35 |
| mspreitz | You mean NOT always wait | 15:35 |
| Yathi | yeah NOT always wait.. sorry | 15:36 |
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| mspreitz | Optimization problems are usually NP hard, you never expect to find the true optimum | 15:36 |
| Yathi | there has to be a cut off as to when to stop the minimization or maximization, as long as the constraints are satisfied, you are good.. | 15:37 |
| mspreitz | So, yeah, I think going smart implies doing what session 34 asks for. | 15:37 |
| mspreitz | yathi: exactly | 15:37 |
| garyk | at the moment i feel that people are dealing with a lot of issues: placement, processing, interactions with databases etc. | 15:37 |
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| garyk | i am not sure that we have one topic or idea that covers it all. | 15:38 |
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| Yathi | I think our idea for the smart placement involves this one piece of a smart resource placement - constraint solver, along with the other aspects | 15:38 |
| alaski | session 34 is also dealing with performance. geekinutah is dealing with a >1000 node cluster iirc and they've had performance issues they want to address | 15:38 |
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| mspreitz | I did not think smart was only for small systems | 15:39 |
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| Yathi | other aspects I mean - common db that covers cross services, suitable for high scale, improved performance over filter scheduling, | 15:39 |
| garyk | alaski: is there any mention of the number of schedulers they are using? | 15:40 |
| Yathi | well we have a bunch of sessions with overlapping concerns | 15:40 |
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| mspreitz | yathi: yes | 15:40 |
| alaski | garyk: it may have come up before but I don't recall, might be 1 though | 15:40 |
| garyk | ok, thanks | 15:41 |
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| mspreitz | His etherpad explicitly suggests parallel schedulers | 15:41 |
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| toan-tran | is SovlerScheduler in smarter placement ? | 15:41 |
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| Yathi | toan-tran - SolverScheduler is one aspect of the smarter placement, but involves other aspects too | 15:43 |
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| toan-tran | Yathi: thanks | 15:43 |
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| Yathi | toan-tran: See line 53 in https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/IceHouse-Nova-Scheduler-Sessions | 15:44 |
| toan-tran | I'm just curious about the choice of LinearProgram | 15:44 |
| toan-tran | is it a little time-consuming? | 15:44 |
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| garyk | the idea proposed is intersting | 15:45 |
| Yathi | The idea is a pluggable constraints-based solver framework.. so any pluggable solvers can be included | 15:45 |
| garyk | i think that the pain points will arise when it comes to the messaging | 15:45 |
| garyk | that is, we need some kind of p2p messaging. | 15:46 |
| mspreitz | garyk: for what? | 15:46 |
| toan-tran | Yathi: ok, so not necessary LP, thanks | 15:46 |
| garyk | for the "rethinking" | 15:46 |
| mspreitz | I'm lost. | 15:46 |
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| mspreitz | p2p = peer to peer | 15:46 |
| mspreitz | ? | 15:46 |
| Yathi | are we talking some kind of mapreduce kind of scheduling ? | 15:46 |
| garyk | mspreitz: i am going over what is written in https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/RethinkingSchedulerDesign | 15:47 |
| Yathi | distributed | 15:47 |
| mspreitz | You mean offline one-on-one discussions? | 15:47 |
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| mspreitz | that etherpad ends with a long list of alternatives | 15:47 |
| mspreitz | one of which is optimization orientation | 15:47 |
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| garyk | i have to go over it in more detail. i am just concerned that the current infrastructure that we have may not be suited for something like this. i guess that when we discuss it we can see what is required, what is missing and then address. | 15:49 |
| Yathi | garyk: mspreitz: if that etherpad has a bunch of alternatives, what is it mainly trying to achieve ? - performance ? | 15:49 |
| mspreitz | garyk: there are many "it" there. My group has done some investigation of some of them. | 15:49 |
| mspreitz | First two bullets say "scalability" to me | 15:50 |
| garyk | but maybe i am being a little conservative - that is, if we are unable to get very simple things in then how can we do something that is non trivial | 15:50 |
| mspreitz | scalability in cloud size, request rate | 15:50 |
| Yathi | not very clear - there could be several alternatives possible that way | 15:50 |
| mspreitz | I would also say we should be explicit about request size | 15:50 |
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| mspreitz | when request is for a whole pattern, not a single resource | 15:51 |
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| garyk | yes, a request should be a whole pattern, only the scheduler can know how to place a collection or resources most optimally | 15:51 |
| mspreitz | We had a summer student with an economics background investigate a bidding approach that can solve joint problems with things like bidding. Takes several rounds of bidding to sort of converge. | 15:52 |
| mspreitz | I mean problems with affinity | 15:52 |
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| mspreitz | Result was not strong enough to make us take that approach. | 15:53 |
| Yathi | garyk: is it now related to instance group apis + the smarter placement taking the whole picture into consideration | 15:53 |
| garyk | i guess that we can all agree - it will be challenging and interesting :) | 15:53 |
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| Yathi | cross-services scheduling is key | 15:53 |
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| garyk | agreed | 15:54 |
| Yathi | we made some progress - combining cinder into nova to schedule based on volume affinity | 15:54 |
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| mspreitz | Agreed too. but it also has the problems in "rethinking" | 15:54 |
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| garyk | yup, i do not think that it was even addressed in the etherpad (but may be wrong here) | 15:54 |
| garyk | are there any additional issues that we would like to address? | 15:55 |
| mspreitz | right now or at the summit? | 15:55 |
| garyk | now - we have ~4 min left | 15:56 |
| mspreitz | I'd like to plead for progress on the API issues before the summit. | 15:56 |
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| mspreitz | No time to do anything now, | 15:56 |
| garyk | mspreitz: +1 | 15:56 |
| mspreitz | but maybe we can agree to do something inML? | 15:56 |
| garyk | mspreitz: that would be great. | 15:57 |
| garyk | maybe if the sessions are closed then next week we can start with discussing the API's | 15:57 |
| Yathi | garyk: mspreitz: I guess the API work we have made significant progress already | 15:57 |
| Yathi | we agreed on the model | 15:57 |
| Yathi | leaving certain minor implementation specifics aside | 15:58 |
| Yathi | now it is about how the list of APIs to support.. | 15:58 |
| Yathi | and what the payload will be like | 15:58 |
| mspreitz | right. My group is implementing right now, I am hoping for convergence | 15:58 |
| Yathi | mspreitz: Good, Debo and I are planning to push updates for the already committed instance group API code | 15:59 |
| Yathi | but this is planned for Icehouse, and not planned to complete before the summit | 15:59 |
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| garyk | ok. i really hope we can get this in in Icehouse and do not miss this opportunity | 16:00 |
| garyk | i guess time is up. | 16:00 |
| mspreitz | It's all provisional, which is why I am concerned about convergence | 16:00 |
| garyk | chat to you guys next week | 16:00 |
| mspreitz | thanks | 16:00 |
| Yathi | ok thanks | 16:00 |
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| garyk | #endmeeting | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 22 16:00:50 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/scheduler/2013/scheduler.2013-10-22-15.02.html | 16:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/scheduler/2013/scheduler.2013-10-22-15.02.txt | 16:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/scheduler/2013/scheduler.2013-10-22-15.02.log.html | 16:00 |
| primeministerp | #startmeeting hyper-v | 16:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 22 16:01:11 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is primeministerp. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: hyper-v)" | 16:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'hyper_v' | 16:01 |
| primeministerp | hi everyone | 16:01 |
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| primeministerp | alexpilotti: hi alessandro | 16:01 |
| alexpilotti | hello guys! | 16:01 |
| ociuhandu | hi all | 16:01 |
| primeministerp | hmm no luis | 16:01 |
| alexpilotti | who's around today? | 16:02 |
| primeministerp | not many | 16:02 |
| primeministerp | no luis or pedro | 16:02 |
| primeministerp | I have only a few things to cover | 16:02 |
| primeministerp | one being the puppet bits | 16:02 |
| primeministerp | considering there's no luis | 16:02 |
| primeministerp | i'll followup w/ him directly | 16:03 |
| primeministerp | so | 16:03 |
| primeministerp | on that note | 16:03 |
| primeministerp | let's quickly talk about the other two items | 16:03 |
| primeministerp | #topic havana release | 16:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "havana release (Meeting topic: hyper-v)" | 16:03 | |
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| primeministerp | alexpilotti: you had some things to add on the topic? | 16:03 |
| alexpilotti | it's a quick one | 16:04 |
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| alexpilotti | today we'll have the installer out for Hyper-V | 16:04 |
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| alexpilotti | a few bugs needs to be added from master | 16:04 |
| alexpilotti | as discussed ectensively on the list lately | 16:04 |
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| primeministerp | alexpilotti: ok | 16:05 |
| primeministerp | alexpilotti: anything more to add here that wasn't already on the list? | 16:05 |
| alexpilotti | so if anybody plans to roll out Hyper-V from the bits available on launchpad / git, please mind this | 16:05 |
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| alexpilotti | no, all good :-) | 16:05 |
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| alexpilotti | unless anybody has questions, that's it | 16:06 |
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| primeministerp | luis_fdez: hi luis_fdez | 16:06 |
| luis_fdez | hi primeministerp | 16:06 |
| primeministerp | we didn't have much to talk about today but I wanted to touch base on the puppet bits | 16:07 |
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| primeministerp | #topic puppet | 16:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "puppet (Meeting topic: hyper-v)" | 16:07 | |
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| luis_fdez | ok | 16:07 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: i've had vijay validate all the changes | 16:07 |
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| luis_fdez | is all ok? | 16:07 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: to the dependancies | 16:07 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: so far | 16:07 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: he had a couple of patches | 16:07 |
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| primeministerp | luis_fdez: all the hyper-v stuff seemed to work | 16:07 |
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| primeministerp | luis_fdez: there is work being done to add the domain controller bits, and domain member bits to windows common | 16:08 |
| luis_fdez | yeps, I saw nick PR | 16:08 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: i know you commented on nick's works | 16:08 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: i haven't checked the new pull request yet | 16:08 |
| luis_fdez | ok | 16:08 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: do you have any outstanding pull requests? | 16:08 |
| luis_fdez | no, last week I was patching other module (puppet-concat) I need for managin our infras | 16:09 |
| luis_fdez | to support windows | 16:09 |
| luis_fdez | I want to take a look this week to: | 16:09 |
| luis_fdez | adding NTP to windows common and | 16:10 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: so i have the existing bits | 16:10 |
| luis_fdez | improving the way we handle differente openstack releases on the openstack_hyper_v module | 16:10 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: we had talked about moving it to puppetlabs-ntp | 16:10 |
| luis_fdez | yes | 16:10 |
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| primeministerp | luis_fdez: do you want to move it to windows_common for the short terms | 16:10 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: the windows ntp bits? | 16:11 |
| luis_fdez | yes, it can be an options, but I'd to improve the puppetlabs-ntp... but I think it's thought for unix os | 16:11 |
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| primeministerp | luis_fdez: we don't have to push everything into single modules | 16:12 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: if it doesn't make sense too | 16:12 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: let's put it in the windows common for now | 16:12 |
| luis_fdez | primeministerp, I agree :) | 16:13 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: is there anything else that you know of that needs to be addressed other than the ntp bits | 16:13 |
| luis_fdez | I think we have all the critical parts managed | 16:13 |
| luis_fdez | well... I didn't take a look to the firewall related modules | 16:14 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: they just disable the firewall | 16:14 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: not actually manage it like a proper type/provider | 16:14 |
| luis_fdez | another one I think you want to improve is the configuration of RDP | 16:14 |
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| primeministerp | luis_fdez: i've started looking at that | 16:15 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: for alternative ways to config it w/o using that 3rd party powershell | 16:15 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: i've already updated the existing to use the registry module | 16:15 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: we need to address the config for older rdp clients | 16:15 |
| luis_fdez | good, I think that one is useful :) | 16:15 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: i was using that 3rd party powershell for that | 16:16 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: need to find an alternative | 16:16 |
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| primeministerp | luis_fdez: ok then, let's continue on the existing path | 16:17 |
| luis_fdez | what's the functionality more difficut to automate without that 3rd party tool? | 16:17 |
| luis_fdez | ok, let's continue :) | 16:17 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: yes, that powershell module basically creates an easy way to configure it | 16:17 |
| luis_fdez | ok | 16:18 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: that's all i have | 16:18 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: anything else? | 16:18 |
| primeministerp | alexpilotti: anything else from your side? | 16:18 |
| luis_fdez | nothing :) | 16:18 |
| alexpilotti | I'd introduce quickly the first round of BPs | 16:19 |
| primeministerp | ok thx luis_fdez | 16:19 |
| primeministerp | ok guys i'm going to end it early | 16:19 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: did you email me your address? | 16:19 |
| alexpilotti | I mean the Icehouse ones :-) | 16:19 |
| luis_fdez | what? | 16:19 |
| primeministerp | luis_fdez: can you email your address, i have something to send you | 16:19 |
| luis_fdez | uooou... ok, I will :) | 16:20 |
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| primeministerp | alexpilotti: do you want to do that now? | 16:20 |
| primeministerp | alexpilotti: before I end it | 16:20 |
| alexpilotti | well, yes :-) | 16:20 |
| alexpilotti | as the objective is to record it in the minutes | 16:20 |
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| alexpilotti | so that if anybody wants to check it later it's there | 16:20 |
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| alexpilotti | can you plz change the topic? :-) | 16:21 |
| primeministerp | #topic icehouse blueprints | 16:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "icehouse blueprints (Meeting topic: hyper-v)" | 16:21 | |
| alexpilotti | tx | 16:21 |
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| alexpilotti | So just a quick rundown: | 16:22 |
| alexpilotti | not many as the main focus this time is going to be the CI | 16:22 |
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| alexpilotti | so | 16:22 |
| alexpilotti | RDP | 16:22 |
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| alexpilotti | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/python-novaclient/+spec/hyper-v-rdp-console | 16:22 |
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| alexpilotti | bits are up for review since, well Havana | 16:23 |
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| alexpilotti | this time the Nova guys should have more time to look at it | 16:23 |
| alexpilotti | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/nova/+spec/hyper-v-remotefx | 16:23 |
| alexpilotti | same discussion for remoteFX | 16:23 |
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| alexpilotti | forgot the link command, sorry | 16:24 |
| alexpilotti | a new one is support for Generation 2 VMs | 16:24 |
| alexpilotti | a feature introduced in 2012 R2 | 16:24 |
| alexpilotti | ok. That's basically it for now! | 16:24 |
| alexpilotti | if anybody has some feature request to add, this is a good moment! | 16:25 |
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| alexpilotti | primeministerp: IMO we can close it here :-) | 16:26 |
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| primeministerp | ok | 16:27 |
| primeministerp | #endmeeting | 16:27 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:27 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 22 16:27:53 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:27 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/hyper_v/2013/hyper_v.2013-10-22-16.01.html | 16:27 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/hyper_v/2013/hyper_v.2013-10-22-16.01.txt | 16:27 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/hyper_v/2013/hyper_v.2013-10-22-16.01.log.html | 16:27 |
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| alexpilotti | bye! | 16:28 |
| ociuhandu | bye all | 16:28 |
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| stevemar | o/ | 17:58 |
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| stevemar | is it keystone time? | 17:58 |
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| dolphm_ | \o/ anyone able to run the meeting? I'm afk / on my phone for a few minutes | 17:58 |
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| stevemar | im sure ayoung will | 17:58 |
| dolphm_ | just want to run through conference schedule | 17:59 |
| dolphm_ | not sure what else was added to the agenda | 17:59 |
| stevemar | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/KeystoneMeeting | 17:59 |
| stevemar | more migration numbers and some code review requests | 17:59 |
| gyee | \o | 18:00 |
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| stevemar | \o/ | 18:00 |
| bknudson | hi | 18:01 |
| atiwari | hi | 18:01 |
| dolphm_ | I'm tempted to try this from my phone lol | 18:01 |
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| joesavak | \hi/ | 18:01 |
| gyee | phone? | 18:01 |
| dstanek | hello | 18:01 |
| dolphm_ | I'm afk | 18:01 |
| dstanek | dolphm_: good luck | 18:01 |
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| topol | hi, sorry for missing past two weeks. I was at conferences giving shout outs to dolphm, and ayoung to folks from their companies | 18:01 |
| morganfainberg | o/ | 18:01 |
| stevemar | dolphm is sorta pre-occupied, any takers for chairing the meeting? | 18:01 |
| jamielennox | hi | 18:02 |
| dolphm_ | topol o/ | 18:02 |
| joesavak | #start-meeting keystone | 18:02 |
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| joesavak | hmm - i don't remember... | 18:02 |
| stevemar | #startmeeting keystone | 18:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 22 18:02:42 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is stevemar. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:02 |
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| dolphm_ | lol honorable attempt | 18:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'keystone' | 18:02 |
| gyee | we usually turn the meeting into a beer bash if the chair is not around | 18:02 |
| morganfainberg | stevemar, haha i was typing that as you did it. | 18:02 |
| stevemar | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/KeystoneMeeting | 18:03 |
| dolphm_ | success | 18:03 |
| stevemar | #topic Reserved migration numbers for havana | 18:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Reserved migration numbers for havana (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:03 | |
| stevemar | looks like it's continuing from last week | 18:03 |
| ayoung | KEYSTONE! | 18:03 |
| dolphm_ | p.s. everyone's homework was to read up on reserved migrations | 18:03 |
| joesavak | whoops. | 18:04 |
| dolphm_ | have we had any migrations merge since last week? | 18:04 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm_, don't think so | 18:04 |
| stevemar | dont think so | 18:04 |
| bknudson | what would require a migration? | 18:04 |
| dolphm_ | slash, since rc1 | 18:04 |
| ayoung | looking | 18:04 |
| bknudson | I thought morganfainberg had some late fixes to migrations... | 18:05 |
| dolphm_ | if we've had anything merge, this this topi is moot | 18:05 |
| dolphm_ | topic* | 18:05 |
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| gyee | since most new features start out as extensions, there should be very little migration if any | 18:05 |
| morganfainberg | bknudson, that was logic to a migration that was already there | 18:05 |
| morganfainberg | bknudson, for sqlite | 18:05 |
| morganfainberg | no new migration(s) | 18:05 |
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| dolphm_ | gyee: interesting point- we'd need reserved migrations for extensions as well | 18:06 |
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| gyee | dolphm_, wait, I thought extensions are different | 18:06 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, if we're putting in reserves for one, we should for the other. | 18:06 |
| stevemar | agreed | 18:06 |
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| ayoung | dolphm_, we could do them like BASIC programs, and number them 5, 10, 15... | 18:06 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, i.. i.. i have no words | 18:06 |
| gyee | k, I am fine with reservation | 18:07 |
| ayoung | then if we need to instert a migration between 10 and 15 make it 12 | 18:07 |
| dolphm_ | ayoung: they need to be sequential | 18:07 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, brilliant! | 18:07 |
| ayoung | poke 53280,1 | 18:07 |
| morganfainberg | unfortunately, what dolphm_ said | 18:07 |
| gyee | low hanging fruit | 18:07 |
| joesavak | 1, 2, 3 - then if we need to insert one; 1.1? | 18:07 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm_, how many reserved numbers do you think we need? | 18:07 |
| joesavak | ;) | 18:07 |
| stevemar | joesavak, if only | 18:07 |
| bknudson | looks like Nova had placeholders in grizzly and never wound up using them. | 18:07 |
| dolphm_ | 3 in extension repos, 5-10 in core? | 18:07 |
| ayoung | dolphm_, what if we have a separate repo for back fixes? | 18:07 |
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| morganfainberg | ayoung, how would that work? | 18:08 |
| dolphm_ | ayoung: that wouldn't be tranparent | 18:08 |
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| bknudson | I don't think it'll hurt anything to add the placeholders, and could potentially come in handy, so why not? | 18:08 |
| dolphm_ | is anyone strongly opposed to reserved migrations? | 18:08 |
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| morganfainberg | dolphm_, not opposed. | 18:09 |
| stevemar | not i | 18:09 |
| dolphm_ | bkhudson: agree | 18:09 |
| morganfainberg | i'd say 3 in extensions, 5 in main max though | 18:09 |
| stevemar | sounds like they'll be handy | 18:09 |
| topol | sounds good | 18:09 |
| ayoung | or...beter yet, a separate repo for Icehouse fixes | 18:09 |
| ayoung | so once we backport a fix to Havana, we adjust the fixes in the Icehouse repo to account for them....just a thought | 18:09 |
| morganfainberg | nova _never_ used them. i don't really think we're going to, but they are mostly harmless if they exist. | 18:09 |
| gyee | I see *each* extension have their own migration_repo dir | 18:09 |
| gyee | so we are saying, 3 reservations per repo? | 18:10 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, i would say at most. | 18:10 |
| morganfainberg | 3. | 18:10 |
| gyee | k | 18:10 |
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| ayoung | I think reservations is the wrong approach. I have a thought...let me collect it and write it up | 18:10 |
| dolphm_ | that works | 18:10 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, ok. | 18:10 |
| stevemar | ayoung, sure send it to ML | 18:11 |
| stevemar | so that gets chalked up as an action item? | 18:11 |
| ayoung | yeah | 18:11 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm_, slightly related, we doing a collapse of the migrations this time around? or? | 18:11 |
| stevemar | any volunteers? :) | 18:11 |
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| ayoung | #action ayoung write up approach to backporting migrations using separate repo | 18:11 |
| gyee | #action ayoung to turn on his light bulb on migration reservation? | 18:11 |
| dolphm_ | I'll do the reservations | 18:11 |
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| dolphm_ | if someone wants to do the work of collapsing, go for it | 18:12 |
| stevemar | #action dolphm to look at reservations | 18:12 |
| stevemar | next topic, way more fun | 18:12 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm_, i'll see if I can make that happen. | 18:12 |
| dolphm_ | stevemar: what's next? | 18:12 |
| stevemar | #topic Reviewing design summit schedule | 18:12 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Reviewing design summit schedule (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:12 | |
| stevemar | #link http://summit.openstack.org/ | 18:12 |
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| stevemar | for my topic | 18:12 |
| morganfainberg | #action morganfainberg look into collapsing migrations | 18:12 |
| stevemar | err, sort* | 18:12 |
| stevemar | sort by topic ... sigh | 18:12 |
| dolphm_ | I left comments on a bunch of sessions | 18:12 |
| ayoung | dolphm_, reservations are not going to work. When the repo says wee are at revsion X we need to know what that means.... | 18:12 |
| gyee | dolphm_, session on fixing service catalog? | 18:12 |
| stevemar | dolphm_ how many session spots do we have? | 18:13 |
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| dolphm_ | 9 | 18:13 |
| gyee | the remaining 20 will be conducted in a pub | 18:13 |
| dolphm_ | I'd like to split federation and the client session | 18:13 |
| dolphm_ | gyee: ++ | 18:13 |
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| morganfainberg | gyee, ++++++++ | 18:13 |
| stevemar | currently there are 11 proposed sessions, so lets try to find some that can be consolidated | 18:14 |
| ayoung | federation and client should be separate. Very different topics | 18:14 |
| gyee | stevemar, we can also try unconference | 18:14 |
| stevemar | gyee: yup, but that gets busy too; and there might be some sessions that are closely related | 18:15 |
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| morganfainberg | if we can set a goal for the extensions one it can be merged with Internal API stabilization topic | 18:15 |
| ayoung | HTML is refused...that gets us down to 10 | 18:15 |
| stevemar | dolphm, i see you refused 2 sessions already | 18:15 |
| morganfainberg | they are both code management / approach | 18:15 |
| ayoung | Extension mechanisms can hang on something else | 18:15 |
| dolphm_ | i think i refused domain scoped tokens | 18:15 |
| stevemar | ayoung: yeah, V3 API Domain Scoped Tokens and HTML for Keystone have been refused | 18:15 |
| dolphm_ | if not, it can be | 18:16 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, that was my thought as well | 18:16 |
| dolphm_ | we've gotten bugs to simply doc that better | 18:16 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, 100% agree with it. | 18:16 |
| ayoung | but lets leave it as is unless any more topics come in | 18:16 |
| morganfainberg | right. | 18:16 |
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| stevemar | okay, if need be, we can merge those 2 sessions, Internal API Stabilization and Extension Mechanisms | 18:17 |
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| stevemar | only as a last resort :) | 18:18 |
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| gyee | there are other session which will have Keystone impacts, i.e. killing pagination | 18:18 |
| topol | Did Auditing AuthN, AuthZ and Policy Decisions get accepted? | 18:18 |
| stevemar | topol, not yet | 18:18 |
| dolphm_ | the client session description is way too big for a single session | 18:18 |
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| morganfainberg | dolphm_, perhaps we should expand the client one to 2 sessions and collapse the extensions and API stabilization ones to a single one? | 18:19 |
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| stevemar | dolphm_ suggest merging (internal API stabilitaion and extension) to get another client session? | 18:19 |
| stevemar | morganfainberg +1 | 18:19 |
| morganfainberg | stevemar, ++ | 18:19 |
| gyee | dolphm_, that's because we have too many client issues to fix :) | 18:19 |
| dolphm_ | sounds good | 18:19 |
| ayoung | works for me | 18:19 |
| morganfainberg | i'll update mine and incorporate the extension stuff ayoung, | 18:20 |
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| dolphm_ | the "ignoring the API, what should the client look like" is perfect for the summit | 18:20 |
| stevemar | #action dolphm, refuse one of the sessions, update the comments and create a new session for client | 18:20 |
| dolphm_ | that should be its own session | 18:20 |
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| ayoung | Sounds good. morganfainberg once you do, tag my session and I'll drop it | 18:20 |
| bknudson | it should be async! | 18:20 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, will be done today. | 18:20 |
| stevemar | awesome | 18:20 |
| ayoung | bknudson, so keystone should respond to AMQP? | 18:21 |
| stevemar | do we need 2 sessions for federation? | 18:21 |
| ayoung | No, one session for federation | 18:21 |
| ayoung | if it is going to take more than one, it is not going to be done in 2 either | 18:21 |
| jamielennox | dolphm_: i'm not sure how much of that client stuff we'll need to cover but i don't mind a seconds session | 18:21 |
| dolphm_ | there's a LOT of material there | 18:21 |
| morganfainberg | stevemar, i think one session should be enough. we can unconference anything else that comes up | 18:21 |
| stevemar | i think if we can schedule it at the end of the day, we can take up any arguments at a pub later :) | 18:21 |
| gyee | yes sir | 18:22 |
| jamielennox | discovery is happening already, everyone hates auth_token, APIClient and Versioning are my two main ones | 18:22 |
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| morganfainberg | dolphm_, i think it'll be more about chopping things and slating for J if we're _that_ full of federation stuff. | 18:22 |
| dolphm | \o/ desk! | 18:22 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, yay! | 18:22 |
| ayoung | We have an approach, and we are, I think tracking. Federation session should be level setting so that we can continue any long term discussions after the conference. But I thik we are finally positioned to implement Federation in the context of the other parts of Keystone, something that was not true until Havana | 18:22 |
| joesavak | ayoung +1 | 18:22 |
| ayoung | What about globally unique IDs, though | 18:23 |
| ayoung | that is not really Federartion, but came up in the context of LDAP | 18:23 |
| ayoung | do we need an LDAP session? Henrynash is not here, topol ? | 18:23 |
| bknudson | sounds like federation. | 18:23 |
| ayoung | bknudson, nope | 18:23 |
| joesavak | federation handles it by user-passed-in-assertion@trusted-idp | 18:24 |
| topol | LDAP seems pretty much under control now from my view | 18:24 |
| ayoung | bknudson, similar, but this is for the case where we have a user store managed by Keysteon as well as a multiple LDAP stores. It ties in with henrynash's assignmnet API talk, though | 18:24 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, i don't think we will ever have a lack of LDAP stuff to talk about, but not sure if we need a session. | 18:24 |
| stevemar | morganfainberg ++ | 18:24 |
| bknudson | LDAP could be refactored into a read-only / read-write / ActiveDirectory implementations. | 18:25 |
| stevemar | dolphm_ sorry, the people have spoke, 1 session for federation | 18:25 |
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| ayoung | dolphm, will get to talk about "The state of Keystone" as the PTL, and can level set on where LDAP is and is going to the community | 18:25 |
| topol | multiple LDAP stores are really cool. but do we need enough steering ont hat to merit a session? | 18:25 |
| bknudson | could also do connection pooling. | 18:25 |
| gyee | agreed, I think we have enough on LDAP already, let the consults make money off integration :) | 18:25 |
| morganfainberg | bknudson, that actually would be a good approach. | 18:25 |
| gyee | consultants | 18:25 |
| stevemar | #action everyone to read the sessions over and provide some comments :) | 18:25 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, lol | 18:25 |
| ayoung | topol, we need a way to figure out which backend to look at for a given user id | 18:25 |
| dolphm | stevemar: i think 1 session is crazy for such a big topic | 18:25 |
| topol | I would +1 gyee statement but then would need to go take a shower | 18:26 |
| ayoung | its a generic problem, but driven home by LDAP | 18:26 |
| ayoung | but Federation will have the same issue | 18:26 |
| dolphm | it'll definitely be the single biggest change for icehouse | 18:26 |
| joesavak | +1 topol's statement | 18:26 |
| ayoung | We can try to cover it in Federation, but I'm afraid it would get lost | 18:26 |
| joesavak | ;) | 18:26 |
| gyee | ayoung, leave some money on the table for the consultants | 18:26 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, i am not opposed to 2 sessions, but i think we will mostly be level setting for J if we have more than 1 | 18:26 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, just unlikely that we'll see all the change by I2. | 18:27 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, there is likely to be value in level setting the federation direction though | 18:27 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: i'm thinking with two sessions to help get everyone on the same page concerning the work that's been done and what we want to accomplish, we're more likely to see it done by i2 | 18:27 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, fair enough, so 2 client, 2 federation, and collapse 2 of the other sessions? | 18:28 |
| stevemar | then we need another volunteer to combine a session | 18:29 |
| ayoung | Extensions goes into API stabilization | 18:29 |
| stevemar | yup | 18:29 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, right, if we expand to a 2nd federation session, we need to collapse another set | 18:29 |
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| stevemar | was centralized quota storage already talked about last summit? | 18:29 |
| ayoung | Do wereally need a Quota talk? I thought that was a done deal? | 18:30 |
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| stevemar | ayoung, yap | 18:30 |
| ayoung | We are doing quotas, it just is not done yet | 18:30 |
| ayoung | design was signed off on, just the develpoer got stuck in the review process | 18:30 |
| morganfainberg | yeah that seems redundant to do that in two subsequent sessions | 18:30 |
| dolphm | ayoung: agree | 18:30 |
| morganfainberg | erm summits | 18:30 |
| morganfainberg | so, we can drop that one. | 18:30 |
| dolphm | ayoung: we weren't quick enough to respond to their patchsets either | 18:30 |
| aguzikova_home | ayoung, we have https://review.openstack.org/#/c/37545/ also for quotas | 18:31 |
| morganfainberg | ok so as long as we get quota stuff reviewed and accepted, we shouldn't need a session on it. | 18:31 |
| gyee | dolphm, ayoung, I think there were some unfinished business with quota, the usage aggregation part | 18:31 |
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| aguzikova_home | not just domaint quota management | 18:31 |
| stevemar | yeah, it seems generally accepted | 18:31 |
| gyee | but I am not sure if it really belong to keystone anyway | 18:31 |
| morganfainberg | aguzikova_home, ah. | 18:31 |
| ayoung | gyee, but it would be really cool if Keystone tokens had the quotas signed in them. | 18:32 |
| stevemar | sounds like the axe is falling on this session topic | 18:32 |
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| morganfainberg | stevemar, sounds like | 18:32 |
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| dolphm | i'm pushing sessions around now, btw | 18:32 |
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| bknudson | are the sessions all on one day? | 18:32 |
| ayoung | yeah, tell them to have a quota unconference and work out the last remaining issues. | 18:32 |
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| bknudson | wasn't there a security track last time? | 18:33 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, ++ | 18:33 |
| gyee | ayoung, sounds good | 18:33 |
| aguzikova_home | +1 | 18:33 |
| stevemar | #action dolphm to refuse quota session | 18:33 |
| morganfainberg | bknudson, i think so… i don't remember | 18:33 |
| dolphm | stevemar: done | 18:33 |
| morganfainberg | sounds like we're doing 2 federation sessions then | 18:33 |
| dolphm | is the Assignments session good as is? | 18:33 |
| dolphm | there's three topics there -- i'm not sure the second one is worthy of summit time | 18:34 |
| bknudson | is there any real argument about what needs to be done for assignments? | 18:34 |
| dolphm | that's just a "yes, we need to clean up the sql impl" | 18:34 |
| gyee | bknudson, lots | 18:34 |
| ayoung | I'll do an unconference on the HTML thing. I really just want a chance to demo it and don't currently have public hosting available. Need to set up one of those Rackspace developer accounts. | 18:34 |
| morganfainberg | pretty much we need to cleanup interfaces controllers, etc | 18:34 |
| dolphm | bknudson: henrynash wants a whole new HTTP API for assignments | 18:34 |
| gyee | like role-service | 18:34 |
| dolphm | gyee: no | 18:34 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, wouldn't that be API version increment? | 18:34 |
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| morganfainberg | or is he saying as an extension? | 18:35 |
| gyee | dolphm, we still have use cases with role assignment need to solve | 18:35 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: if you're dropping support for something, yes | 18:35 |
| gyee | we also need to simplify assignment APIs | 18:35 |
| dolphm | gyee: i'm more interested in the new use cases | 18:35 |
| ayoung | assignments will have enough trickiness in it that it should have its own session, but maybe that can be combined with Federation. | 18:35 |
| bknudson | we also need to simplify identity APIs | 18:35 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, nah. | 18:35 |
| dolphm | if there's a use case for having metadata on an assignment, then a first class collection makes sense | 18:35 |
| ayoung | It really is the ID/Assignment split that allows Federation to work | 18:36 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, don't combine it | 18:36 |
| stevemar | i thought we're good, no need to continue trimming sessions | 18:36 |
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| dolphm | ayoung: -- for combining with federation | 18:36 |
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| stevemar | if we cut domain, then we have room for federation pt 2 | 18:36 |
| atiwari | Guys, I appreciate your focus on #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/37141 again, as the solution proposed by ayoung is not addressing all use case. | 18:36 |
| gyee | dolphm, ayoung, yes, assignment will be heavily impacts with federation as well | 18:36 |
| gyee | especially on the mapping | 18:36 |
| stevemar | ugh, i meant quota | 18:36 |
| morganfainberg | gyee, dolphm, ayoung, the assignment one should just be scheduled around the federation ones… so we are in the same mindset if we can | 18:37 |
| gyee | morganfainberg, sure | 18:37 |
| ayoung | atiwari, we're discussing session for the summit...we'll address that in a few... | 18:37 |
| dolphm | created a placeholder | 18:37 |
| dolphm | http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/346 | 18:37 |
| topol | morganfainberg +1 | 18:37 |
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| gyee | also, the auditing part will be very interesting, especially with mapping | 18:38 |
| atiwari | ayoung, thanks | 18:38 |
| morganfainberg | so back to the original question, dolphm, i think assignment one is good. | 18:38 |
| ayoung | gyee, yeah, but auditing actually is tied with policy , which is not even a Keystone project, and if it were, would be part of the client | 18:38 |
| ayoung | for audit what tokens a user requested is not nearly so important as figuring out what they did with them | 18:39 |
| gyee | ayoung, no, like given a user, tell me what he can do | 18:39 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, we can add atiwari ' | 18:39 |
| gyee | or given a resource, tell me who can do what to it | 18:39 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, ack, you pre-approved the API one, i can't edit it now | 18:39 |
| ayoung | s concerns to the assignments session | 18:40 |
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| topol | ayoung, doesnt auditing need to be done on the server to make sure we catch everything? | 18:40 |
| ayoung | atiwari, are you going to the summit | 18:40 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: crap | 18:40 |
| atiwari | yes | 18:40 |
| gyee | topol, percisely | 18:40 |
| ayoung | topol, auditing needs to be done on each machine, not just Keystone | 18:40 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, lol can you set it back to unreviewed, i'll get the exention stuff added to it and ping you shortly? | 18:40 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: fixed | 18:40 |
| morganfainberg | k | 18:40 |
| topol | ayoung, both Im thinking | 18:40 |
| dolphm | i'll stop pre-approving stuff lol | 18:41 |
| stevemar | dolphm: that is probably a good thing :) | 18:41 |
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| stevemar | so, there sounds like there is interest in auditing | 18:41 |
| jamielennox | dolphm: if you unset the client i'll remove some of those points - there's really just the two in there now i really want at summit the others can be later | 18:41 |
| jamielennox | client summit session | 18:41 |
| gyee | stevemar, the auditing aspect is generally missing :) | 18:42 |
| ayoung | atiwari, we have a session for assignments http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/131 please add your topic to that. I think that it is the right place to discuss it | 18:42 |
| stevemar | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/keystone-sessions-icehouse something i quickly wrote up | 18:42 |
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| atiwari | ayoung, sure | 18:42 |
| stevemar | we have 9 spots, and 9 currently proposed sessions... i think we're good assuming no one is against any session in particular | 18:43 |
| dolphm | jamielennox: working on it | 18:43 |
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| ayoung | if anything else comes up, schedule unconference sessions for it. Everyone should sign up for a twitter account, as that was really useful for tracking who was where at the summit, and posting unofficial announcements | 18:44 |
| stevemar | ayoung +1 | 18:44 |
| dolphm | k, everything is unreviewed or refused | 18:44 |
| ayoung | Og..and everyone make sure your shots are up to date | 18:44 |
| topol | ayoung +1 | 18:44 |
| ayoung | Hep A and Typhoid | 18:44 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, yes | 18:44 |
| atiwari | ayoung and dolphm, this may also be a good topic for session? #link https://blueprints.launchpad.net/keystone/+spec/attribute-access-privilege-based-on-role | 18:44 |
| ayoung | and flu | 18:44 |
| gyee | unreviewed for unconference | 18:44 |
| jamielennox | ayoung: twitter?.... :( | 18:44 |
| topol | ayoung, really??? | 18:44 |
| ayoung | atiwari, in the policy session, I think | 18:44 |
| topol | that wasnt in my brochure | 18:44 |
| atiwari | ok | 18:44 |
| morganfainberg | jamielennox, welcome to the new internet | 18:44 |
| ayoung | topol, according to the CDC | 18:45 |
| dolphm | atiwari: has there been disagreement on the approach? | 18:45 |
| ayoung | get an appointment at a travel clinic. | 18:45 |
| ayoung | AND EVERYONE CHECK YOUR PASSPORTS! | 18:45 |
| atiwari | not yet :) | 18:45 |
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| dolphm | atiwari: then i don't think we need a session | 18:45 |
| gyee | and bring enough cash to buy your way out if you wonder into the wrong hood :) | 18:46 |
| atiwari | dolphm, I don't think someone has looked in to it yet :) | 18:46 |
| dolphm | jamielennox: want to propose the second client session and break down the descriptions? | 18:46 |
| ayoung | atiwari, that should be discussed here: http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/86 I think. It is not Audit specific, but all of that is based on the policy mechanism | 18:46 |
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| topol | gyee, do you know where I can get Louis Vutton knockoff wallets? My mom keeps asking :-) | 18:46 |
| dolphm | atiwari: i've had several people mention it actually | 18:46 |
| morganfainberg | topol, lol | 18:46 |
| stevemar | i think everyone seems to be fine with the sessions topics .. next topic? | 18:47 |
| gyee | topol, I know a place | 18:47 |
| dolphm | stevemar: ++ | 18:47 |
| dolphm | o | 18:47 |
| ayoung | atiwari, I have, and, while I like the concept, I think only LDAP really has the mechanism to enforce an attribute level approach. | 18:47 |
| stevemar | ya know, before we get off-topic! | 18:47 |
| topol | gyee++ hook me up | 18:47 |
| stevemar | #topic Code reviews for icehouse blueprints | 18:47 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Code reviews for icehouse blueprints (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:47 | |
| dolphm | i'll follow up with people submitting sessions after the meeting | 18:47 |
| stevemar | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/40692/ KDS service | 18:47 |
| bknudson | Is this implementing a PKI server? Why wouldn't we use an existing one? If it's not PKI, why not use PKI? | 18:48 |
| ayoung | dolphm, so different from the Grizzly Summit, when it was You, me and heckj doing all the sessions. I could get used to this level of participation | 18:48 |
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| ayoung | bknudson, long discussion on that | 18:48 |
| jamielennox | bknudson: no it's symettric | 18:48 |
| fabiog | guys, can we please move forward with the shared-secret? | 18:48 |
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| fabiog | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/46771/ | 18:48 |
| ayoung | not PKI, but symetric crypto | 18:48 |
| stevemar | thanks fabiog, that is for shared secret? | 18:48 |
| ayoung | sharing symetric keys for high through put messaging | 18:49 |
| fabiog | stevemar, yes | 18:49 |
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| fabiog | I think we should be close on that one | 18:49 |
| stevemar | yeah, we're close on it | 18:49 |
| atiwari | ayoung, thanks. I think it not going to so complex to implement in Keystone (or Oslo) out of the box | 18:49 |
| fabiog | I did all the requested changes so far :-) | 18:49 |
| jamielennox | bknudson: there was much discussion over the design for KDS, eventually it went symmetric mostly for the speed | 18:50 |
| gyee | ayoung, so once KDS is in, you expect default bind token? | 18:50 |
| ayoung | fabiog, why should shared secret be stored in the clear? | 18:50 |
| bknudson | I thought TLS/etc work by generating symmetric keys after PKI | 18:50 |
| ayoung | gyee, completely different issues | 18:50 |
| jamielennox | gyee: no KDS has nothing to do with binding | 18:51 |
| morganfainberg | ayoung, http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/255 did I cover everything? | 18:51 |
| ayoung | bind token will require Kerberos or X509 support on the remote services, so it will be a rolling implementation | 18:51 |
| jamielennox | bknudson: it does | 18:51 |
| jamielennox | bknudson: the KDS design tracks closer to what kerberos does | 18:51 |
| gyee | but KDS an implementation of Kerberos no? | 18:51 |
| jamielennox | gyee: no, just same principals | 18:51 |
| ayoung | bknudson, that is at transport layer, which MQ can use, but this is end to end message validity and then possibly encryption | 18:52 |
| ayoung | gyee, no, it is like Kerberos, but Kerberos does much more. | 18:52 |
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| ayoung | It would have been easier to user Kerberos but that was deemed to high a bar to set for OpenStack undercloud setup | 18:52 |
| bknudson | and PKI is too slow for end-to-end message validity and encryption? | 18:52 |
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| morganfainberg | dolphm, if ayoung is happy with my edits it can be moved back to approved. [post meeting likely] | 18:53 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: ack | 18:53 |
| ayoung | morganfainberg, looks good to me. dolphm +1 | 18:53 |
| gyee | bknudson, I was thinking SMIME | 18:53 |
| ayoung | gyee, that is what we use for PKI tokens | 18:53 |
| dolphm | morganfainberg: i didn't realize about the no edits policy, i'll review each individually as i schedule them | 18:53 |
| ayoung | CMS is basically another term for SMIME | 18:53 |
| gyee | ayoung, right, SMIME is for message security | 18:54 |
| morganfainberg | dolphm, hehe. i wouldn't have guessed except it was the way it worked. maybe you can edit them? not sure. | 18:54 |
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| gyee | you mentioned securing MQ | 18:54 |
| gyee | that's why I was thinking SMIME | 18:54 |
| ayoung | bknudson, topic has been hashed over fairly thoroughly. THere is an etherpad off the blueprint worth reading through | 18:54 |
| jamielennox | bknudson: the other problem with PKI is we would have to manage all those certificates and do signing, revocation, updating etc | 18:54 |
| stevemar | lets all take another look at fabiog shared secret, it's close to being done | 18:55 |
| bknudson | why would we manage them? there's already tools for it. | 18:55 |
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| gyee | jamielennox, we are doing it for PKI tokens | 18:55 |
| gyee | at least we should be | 18:55 |
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| jamielennox | gyee: no, in that case we only manage one cert | 18:55 |
| jamielennox | the one that does the signing | 18:55 |
| dolphm | p.s. i discovered this recently https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/KeystoneUseCases | 18:55 |
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| jamielennox | this would need to manage a certificate for every host that issues a message | 18:55 |
| stevemar | dolphm, wow | 18:56 |
| ayoung | bknudson, https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/MessageSecurity#A_Key_Distribution_Server_in_Keystone | 18:56 |
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| dolphm | that would be fun to version control | 18:56 |
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| stevemar | #topic open discussion | 18:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 18:56 | |
| stevemar | only a few minutes left | 18:56 |
| dolphm | code review use case -> code review api (if necessary) -> code review implementation of new feature :P | 18:56 |
| topol | dolphm isnt that way out of date | 18:56 |
| dolphm | topol: very | 18:56 |
| dolphm | based on what's written, i'm guessing it was from spring 2012 | 18:57 |
| dolphm | most of it, anyway | 18:57 |
| dolphm | ~essex | 18:57 |
| ayoung | predates me. | 18:57 |
| topol | sounds about right. take it to the pawnstars show to get a history lesson on it | 18:58 |
| morganfainberg | lol | 18:58 |
| gyee | jamielonnx did someone request Keystone to run CA service from the ML? | 18:58 |
| dolphm | i don't know how to get the history out of the wiki, if there is any | 18:58 |
| jamielennox | dolphm, bknudson: i've added the strings only interface to API discovery, can you have another look: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/38414/ | 18:58 |
| stevemar | dolphm, i was trying to do that, but i think the wikis have migrated right | 18:58 |
| jamielennox | everyone else as well ^ but we were discussion this yesterday | 18:58 |
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| ayoung | gyee, I think for a dev CA we can look into using certmaster | 18:58 |
| ayoung | https://fedorahosted.org/certmaster/ | 18:58 |
| ayoung | wouldn't use it in production, I'd recommend dogtag for that | 18:59 |
| jamielennox | gyee: it has been suggested in the past, i don't like it without a REALLY good reason | 18:59 |
| bknudson | it would be interesting to have certmaster configured by devstack | 18:59 |
| jamielennox | i'd prefer to see barbican do that | 18:59 |
| ayoung | bknudson, we are working toward that, jamielennox and I | 18:59 |
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| bknudson | rather than pki_setup | 18:59 |
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| bknudson | and ssl_setup | 18:59 |
| ayoung | bknudson, I want certmonger as the the essential piece | 18:59 |
| stevemar | #endmeeting | 19:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 22 19:00:02 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2013/keystone.2013-10-22-18.02.html | 19:00 |
| ayoung | https://fedorahosted.org/certmonger/ | 19:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2013/keystone.2013-10-22-18.02.txt | 19:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2013/keystone.2013-10-22-18.02.log.html | 19:00 |
| stevemar | and we're done | 19:00 |
| joesavak | <clap> | 19:00 |
| fungi | infra peoples unite! | 19:00 |
| anteaya | o/ | 19:00 |
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| pleia2 | o/ | 19:00 |
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| fungi | #startmeeting infra | 19:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 22 19:01:00 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is fungi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 19:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 19:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'infra' | 19:01 |
| fungi | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/InfraTeamMeeting | 19:01 |
| fungi | #link http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2013/infra.2013-10-15-19.02.html | 19:01 |
| clarkb | o/ | 19:02 |
| fungi | #topic Actions from last meeting | 19:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Actions from last meeting (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:02 | |
| anteaya | zaro around today? | 19:02 |
| clarkb | I think he is travelling to jenkins conf | 19:02 |
| anteaya | ah | 19:02 |
| fungi | jeblair move tarballs.o.o and include 50gb space for heat/trove images | 19:02 |
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| krtaylor | o/ | 19:03 |
| fungi | i assume that will remain in progress for a bit while jeblair is travelling, lest someone else has time to do it sooner | 19:03 |
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| fungi | that's all we had on action items | 19:03 |
| fungi | #topic Trove testing (mordred, hub_cap) | 19:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Trove testing (mordred, hub_cap) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:04 | |
| fungi | hub_cap said he knows how it's going to work and someone else is going to do it rsn | 19:04 |
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| fungi | but that he's on a call right now, so not making the meeting | 19:04 |
| clarkb | and that he wouldn't make it to the meeting to talk about it otherwise :) but excited that there is a plan somewhere :) | 19:04 |
| anteaya | yay for a plan | 19:05 |
| fungi | #topic Tripleo testing (lifeless, pleia2) | 19:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Tripleo testing (lifeless, pleia2) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:05 | |
| fungi | you have the floor | 19:05 |
| pleia2 | we have a super basic experimental test now | 19:05 |
| * anteaya applaudes | 19:05 | |
| pleia2 | it just runs a simple echo script on a tripleo cloud system | 19:05 |
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| fungi | those new images worked out for you then? | 19:06 |
| clarkb | it would be great if https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-ci/+bug/1217815 could be updated. I want to say that tripleo still wants to use toci as it will test different things than the upstream integrated tests | 19:06 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1217815 in openstack-ci "Tripleo ci service account in gerrit" [Undecided,New] | 19:06 |
| pleia2 | fungi: yes! thank you | 19:06 |
| clarkb | fungi: pleia2 lifeless ^ but I am not sure of all the details | 19:06 |
| pleia2 | I'm going through this https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/tripleo-test-cluster - so iteration 1 is completed, and I'm working on 2 now | 19:07 |
| fungi | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/tripleo-test-cluster | 19:07 |
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| pleia2 | lifeless: I don't know the status on https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-ci/+bug/1217815 - any insights? | 19:07 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1217815 in openstack-ci "Tripleo ci service account in gerrit" [Undecided,New] | 19:07 |
| fungi | maybe he's sleeping in the middle of the night for a change | 19:08 |
| pleia2 | he's running the tripleo meeting in -alt :) | 19:08 |
| anteaya | he is chairing in the other channel | 19:08 |
| fungi | oh, or that :/ | 19:08 |
| pleia2 | maybe we come back to this bug later/after meeting | 19:08 |
| pleia2 | that's all the updates I have | 19:08 |
| anteaya | great work, pleia2 | 19:09 |
| fungi | yeah, no worries. i don't think it's a direct action item from this topic, but an update from someone in the bug would be swell | 19:09 |
| fungi | #topic Wsme / pecan testing (sdague, dhellman) | 19:09 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Wsme / pecan testing (sdague, dhellman) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:09 | |
| lifeless | pleia2: clarkb made one. | 19:10 |
| fungi | i know a little about this, but would be better if one of them wants to go into detail | 19:10 |
| pleia2 | lifeless: bug done? | 19:10 |
| clarkb | I didn't make an account | 19:10 |
| pleia2 | saw a the review for this trickle in this morning https://review.openstack.org/#/c/53136/ | 19:10 |
| lifeless | pleia2: oh, then mordred did | 19:10 |
| lifeless | clarkb: ^ | 19:10 |
| clarkb | thanks I will update the bug | 19:10 |
| lifeless | anyhow, bug can be closed, we have a suitable account. | 19:10 |
| lifeless | tripleo-cd-bot IIRC. | 19:10 |
| fungi | okay, well, in absence of sdague and dhellmann, i'll attempt a tl;dr on the current topic | 19:11 |
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| fungi | basically, there is a desire to more tightly couple wsme and pecan gating into devstack, so changes to them can avoid breaking the projects which depend on them | 19:12 |
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| fungi | some of it is in progress already... making devstack use the git master branches of those instead of pypi released versions, and adding the devstack/tempest jobs to those projects | 19:13 |
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| sdague | oh, sorry, stepped out for a sec | 19:13 |
| fungi | there is an additional desire to gate them against stable branches of devstack-integrated projects to avoid breaking stable released versions | 19:13 |
| fungi | oh! sdague can take over | 19:13 |
| sdague | well, I think you are basically completely on target | 19:14 |
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| fungi | dhellmann was also talking about maybe figuring out how to integrate the unit tests of other projects as part of the gating for pecan and wsme, but that would need a little additional engineering design | 19:14 |
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| sdague | I think that once we have this - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/53136/ we can fix it on the devstack / devstack-gate side | 19:15 |
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| sdague | that will make pecan / wsme part of the big happy family | 19:15 |
| clarkb | I am excited for what comes out of this. Is there any concern that we are massively overengineering the whole thing? | 19:15 |
| fungi | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/53136/ | 19:16 |
| fungi | probably special versions of the unit test runner which would munge the requirements and override the target branch (to support backward-compat runs) | 19:16 |
| sdague | I did however also propose a session about a bigger vision | 19:16 |
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| sdague | http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/340 | 19:16 |
| fungi | #link http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/340 | 19:16 |
| fungi | excellent | 19:16 |
| sdague | because I think we might want to build something to more generically attack this for libraries beyond our control | 19:16 |
| sdague | but that's summit material | 19:16 |
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| fungi | i hope it makes it into the schedule, because i want to talk about it too | 19:17 |
| sdague | honestly once https://review.openstack.org/#/c/53136/ is approved, we can probably pull the rest together within a day or two | 19:17 |
| fungi | anything else on the current topic then? | 19:17 |
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| sdague | not from me | 19:17 |
| clarkb | yes | 19:17 |
| clarkb | is the plan to make gating mutual or just one direction? I think one problem that we will run into is openstack breaking wsme | 19:18 |
| clarkb | but we shouldn't be gating openstack on wsme | 19:18 |
| clarkb | something to think about at least | 19:18 |
| sdague | clarkb: how would openstack break wsme? | 19:18 |
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| sdague | I actually think there is a direction flow in dependencies | 19:18 |
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| sdague | so I'm not actually concerned that we could break wsme | 19:19 |
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| clarkb | sdague: if openstack were to continue using deprecated interfaces then wsme can't deprecate them and so on | 19:19 |
| fungi | i think this is at least a little better than the horizon/keystone auth plugin where we had openstack depending on not-openstack depending on openstack (thankfully resolved now) | 19:19 |
| sdague | symetric gating wouldn't solve that though | 19:19 |
| clarkb | sdague: right I think they are both wrong :) | 19:20 |
| clarkb | but need to think about it more | 19:20 |
| sdague | yeh, I think we should do this thing, to solve a problem we know we have, then if we create a new problem, solve that later | 19:20 |
| clarkb | wfm | 19:20 |
| fungi | wfm | 19:20 |
| fungi | anything else on the current topic then? | 19:21 |
| sdague | I think the emergent behavior of these interconnections has shown we often poorly predict the future problems :) | 19:21 |
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| sdague | I'm good | 19:21 |
| fungi | solving future problems is akin to premature optimization, agreed | 19:21 |
| fungi | #topic New etherpad.o.o server and migration (clarkb) | 19:21 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "New etherpad.o.o server and migration (clarkb) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:21 | |
| clarkb | ohai | 19:21 |
| fungi | that happened, ja? | 19:22 |
| clarkb | it did | 19:22 |
| fungi | any new fun there? | 19:22 |
| pleia2 | it's working great | 19:22 |
| clarkb | we are now running etherpad.o.o and etherpad-dev.o.o on almost the latest versions of etherpad-lite with the latest nodejs stable release on 2GB nodes using trove as the backend | 19:22 |
| pleia2 | clarkb: I do have some bugs in the bug day list that I need your eyeballs on related to this (I bolded your nick in the etherpad) | 19:23 |
| clarkb | pleia2: I will look | 19:23 |
| pleia2 | just one for etherpad :) | 19:23 |
| clarkb | but yes overall the move went smoothly and we did an emergency nodejs upgrade Friday night as well | 19:23 |
| fungi | clarkb: and the old etherpad server still exists for the moment, right? | 19:23 |
| clarkb | yes it does, because it has old DB backups that I didn't want ot have to juggle. I plan on deleting the old servers after the summit | 19:24 |
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| fungi | #action clarkb decommission old etherpad server eventually (after the summit) | 19:25 |
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| clarkb | please let us know if you see etherpad acting weird, but it seems to have done just fine | 19:25 |
| fungi | just so we don't frget | 19:25 |
| fungi | i've been using it fairly heavily for things since the upgrade, no sign of broken | 19:25 |
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| fungi | i wish the etherpad the foundation uses for staff meetings were so nice and responsive as this one | 19:26 |
| sdague | fungi: their pads > 700 lines? | 19:26 |
| sdague | that's been an issue for me on my installation, and a know bug | 19:26 |
| fungi | sdague: we need to truncate the main one we use, but almost certainly | 19:26 |
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| sdague | yeh, we rotate out pads every couple of weeks for that reason, keep them < 700 lines | 19:27 |
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| fungi | though i also discovered that part of the issue i was having with theirs was due to timeouts reaching google analytics (gag) | 19:27 |
| sdague | also big +1 for ep_headings add by clarkb :) | 19:27 |
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| sdague | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/icehouse-qa-session-planning - example | 19:28 |
| clarkb | sdague: I like the headings plugin too, wish I had dealt with it sooner :) | 19:28 |
| sdague | heh | 19:28 |
| fungi | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/icehouse-qa-session-planning | 19:28 |
| anteaya | nice | 19:28 |
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| fungi | are we all set on etherpad talk for the moment? anyone have anything else for that? | 19:29 |
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| fungi | #topic Third-party documentation editors (fungi) | 19:30 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Third-party documentation editors (fungi) (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:30 | |
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| fungi | just a quick update from a call i had with annegentle and a group of editors from o'reilly press | 19:30 |
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| fungi | the foundation has a contract, as i understand it, to get one or more of the manuals bookified | 19:30 |
| fungi | so we're trying to figure out a workflow feedback loop between their editors and our authors | 19:31 |
| fungi | current plan is that they're going to clone from git branch tip and at the same time the docs program will announce a freeze | 19:32 |
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| fungi | tentative schedule for the first iteration is to freeze from october 28 through november 5 | 19:32 |
| clarkb | fungi: what will the pushes back to gerrit look like? | 19:32 |
| fungi | they will publish their edits in a git repo which we can import and turn into a gerrit review | 19:32 |
| fungi | that can either happen manually initially or we can script it | 19:33 |
| fungi | i wanted to bring it up here mostly to talk through possible implementation details on our end | 19:34 |
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| fungi | they are open to evolving the process over time as well, so none of this is set in stone | 19:34 |
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| clarkb | worth mentioning the reason that they don't use gerrit directly is they haev their own set of tools backed by git for editing things | 19:35 |
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| fungi | the main issue we were worried about was merge conflicts, but annegentle felt that the documentation community would be amenable to a periodic freeze on specific documents | 19:35 |
| clarkb | so they will edit in that world then push changes back to us | 19:35 |
| fungi | right | 19:35 |
| anteaya | sounds like a very interesting direction | 19:36 |
| fungi | it's called "atlas" but since it's proprietary and we won't need to interact with it (per the current plan) that's somewhat immaterial | 19:36 |
| clarkb | so the freeze period is to avoid merge conflicts? do we think that manually resolving the conflicts will be too difficult? | 19:36 |
| anteaya | will they be joining us in -infra and asking questions? | 19:36 |
| anteaya | so I can recognize them and get a sense of how to help? | 19:36 |
| fungi | clarkb: apparently they feel that the way docbook/xml works, diffs become massively painful to properly resolve merge conflicts on | 19:37 |
| fungi | anteaya: probably not, but you never know | 19:37 |
| clarkb | fungi: well, maybe we should be arguing for sane markup >_> | 19:37 |
| anteaya | okay, just if I get a brand new question, it helps to have context | 19:37 |
| clarkb | fungi: but that is a different battle. If the doc team is ok with freezing content I am fine with it | 19:37 |
| clarkb | I think it is a lot easier on them now that they are further ahead of the releases | 19:38 |
| fungi | clarkb: yeah, for the time being i think the desire is to try this out and see where it leads, then adjust if necessary, refine, and semi-automate | 19:38 |
| clarkb | wfm | 19:38 |
| anteaya | I think it is a great idea | 19:39 |
| fungi | my remaining concern is that they heavily use github | 19:39 |
| fungi | it sounds like they're going to want to push to a private github fork (to avoid spiders picking up their edits and making them look official when they're not), so automation will probably mean authenticating to github to pull their patch or patch series, at least at first | 19:40 |
| clarkb | uhm, hmm | 19:40 |
| dhellmann | are they going to want to preserve the history of those imports? or are they going to squash the commits? | 19:41 |
| fungi | i'd love to push them in a direction along the lines of pushing directly to gerrit, but that's probably a down-the-road thing since they want to get rolling on this asap | 19:41 |
| clarkb | private github repos aren't very open... | 19:41 |
| clarkb | and while APL2 doesn't prevent it :/ | 19:41 |
| fungi | dhellmann: i suspect a squashed commit will be fine in this case since it's work for hire | 19:41 |
| clarkb | maybe push to a dev branch instead of master? in any case we can let it evolve. I think the important bit is getting something working | 19:42 |
| dhellmann | ok | 19:42 |
| fungi | clarkb: yes, my concerns as well. however on the call it sounded like they had existing automation around github (its no more proprietary than their editing system after all) and they need t publish their commits somewhere | 19:42 |
| clarkb | particularly with the freeze coming up so quickly | 19:42 |
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| fungi | so while i don't like the thought of depending on github for this, we're also depending on their proprietary commercial editing services for this work anyway | 19:43 |
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| clarkb | fungi: its less the proprietary stuff and more that the dev is closed | 19:44 |
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| dhellmann | it's open to the dev team, right? | 19:44 |
| dhellmann | I mean the docs team | 19:44 |
| dhellmann | it's just not open to the world? | 19:44 |
| clarkb | I assume it depends on how the repo is configured | 19:45 |
| clarkb | or org, I am not super familiar with github ACLs | 19:45 |
| dhellmann | presumably the doc folks are going to need to send them changes | 19:45 |
| dhellmann | but in any case, the publishing toolchain is going to turn into a black box at some point, so I'm not sure it matters whether github is involved or not | 19:45 |
| dhellmann | using it should actually make it easier to have a few people with access to pull changes back out | 19:46 |
| fungi | the end result will land in gerrit. i don't think the interim state where it happens to be temporarily published to $some_proprietary_system will necessarily be accessible except to the editors at o'reilly and automation or whoever's grabbing the patch to stuff into gerrit | 19:46 |
| dhellmann | and put them into our open system | 19:46 |
| dhellmann | how will they be handling copyedits? | 19:46 |
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| fungi | heh. i live with a copyeditor and i still don't understand your question ;) | 19:47 |
| fungi | iterative work? | 19:47 |
| dhellmann | yes | 19:47 |
| fungi | the idea is that by the end of the freeze their change is reviewed and merged | 19:48 |
| dhellmann | the o'reilly editors and compositors are going to want to make changes to the text (typos, phrasing, formatting, whatever) | 19:48 |
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| dhellmann | merged into our upstream repo? | 19:48 |
| fungi | yes | 19:48 |
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| fungi | and then the document is unfrozen and docs editors go into authorship phase for a period before the next freeze | 19:49 |
| fungi | at which point o'reilly updates their clone and starts editing again | 19:49 |
| dhellmann | so oreilly will work in the private repo and something/one will push the changes back upstream | 19:49 |
| dhellmann | ok, I think I've got it | 19:49 |
| fungi | right | 19:49 |
| fungi | this way we can reintegrate their edits | 19:50 |
| dhellmann | ok, this sounds better than what I had to go through with my book :-) | 19:50 |
| fungi | i can only imagine | 19:50 |
| dhellmann | I still have a bunch of latex files with changes I need to merge by hand. So I'm +1 on this plan. ;-) | 19:50 |
| clarkb | Ya I think it will work out and the proposed plan seems like a good place to start. I am just brainstorming around the trouble spots :) | 19:50 |
| fungi | anything else on this? i think dhellmann wanted to come back to pecan/wsme testing during the open discussion portion of the meeting | 19:50 |
| fungi | and we're running tight already | 19:51 |
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| dhellmann | I don't have much | 19:51 |
| fungi | #topic Open discussion | 19:51 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open discussion (Meeting topic: infra)" | 19:51 | |
| fungi | and before i forget | 19:51 |
| fungi | #action jeblair move tarballs.o.o and include 50gb space for heat/trove images | 19:51 |
| pleia2 | bug day continues, don't fall asleep :) https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/cibugreview-october2013 | 19:51 |
| pleia2 | at the top of the file I included a link to New bugs that should be triaged | 19:52 |
| clarkb | quick FYI I upgraded logstash to 1.2.1 and elasticsearch to 0.90.3 yesterday after a week of planning :) and nothing seems to have fallen over. These upgrades better future proof us against the direction es and logstash are moving | 19:52 |
| dhellmann | I just wanted to address the bi-directional gating (I think that's not needed) and mention that we're also going to add test config to pecan and wsme to let us test locally (in addition to the gates) | 19:52 |
| pleia2 | started the day with 190 bugs, down to 185, I'm hoping we can do better | 19:52 |
| clarkb | pleia2: I am slowly working through that :) I am amazed at how much harder this is when jeblair, mordred, and jog0 are busy with other stuff | 19:52 |
| anteaya | good work on bugs pleia2 | 19:52 |
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| pleia2 | clarkb: yeah, jeblair always did a lot :) | 19:53 |
| anteaya | clarkb: did anything on this https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/elasticsearch-optimization-suggestions help or was it just noise? | 19:53 |
| clarkb | dhellmann: cool thanks | 19:53 |
| dhellmann | ryan has some changes in process to let us test the openstack incubated and integrated projects that use pecan already | 19:53 |
| fungi | yeah, i feel bad that i've not contributed as much to today's bugtrawl as i had wanted | 19:53 |
| anteaya | I couldn't pass up three experts on elasticsearch | 19:53 |
| clarkb | anteaya: a lot of it was stuff that I already sorted out | 19:54 |
| anteaya | k | 19:54 |
| anteaya | that's good | 19:54 |
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| clarkb | anteaya: I think a lot of people don't quite understand the restrictions we have when it comes to available hardware, security model, and the amount of data we want to index | 19:54 |
| anteaya | yes | 19:54 |
| anteaya | that was what I kept hitting, because I don't have all that info either | 19:55 |
| anteaya | just small pieces | 19:55 |
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| clarkb | anteaya: I can update that etherpad at some point for completeness with things like we already do X and can't do Y for reason Z | 19:56 |
| anteaya | sure | 19:56 |
| anteaya | since honza and alexb also have that url | 19:56 |
| anteaya | so may respond if they have something to respond to | 19:56 |
| clarkb | cool | 19:56 |
| clarkb | fungi: we forgive you, I may roll bug stuff over into tomorrow depending on how the rest of today goes | 19:57 |
| clarkb | :) | 19:57 |
| pleia2 | oh, I owe some nodepool documentation updates for running a dev version, need to bootstrap sphinx on the nodepool repo | 19:57 |
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| fungi | oh, don't forget i'm semi-afk the next couple days at the all things open conference | 19:57 |
| fungi | but back in full force on friday of course | 19:57 |
| anteaya | cool, happy open conference | 19:57 |
| clarkb | have fun | 19:57 |
| anteaya | is that in raliegh? | 19:58 |
| fungi | (that rhymed!) | 19:58 |
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| fungi | yeah | 19:58 |
| anteaya | hence why mordred is going there after chicago | 19:58 |
| anteaya | great meeting, fungi | 19:59 |
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| pleia2 | thanks fungi | 19:59 |
| fungi | a-the-a-the-a-the-a-that's all, folks! | 19:59 |
| fungi | #endmeeting | 19:59 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 19:59 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 22 19:59:55 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 19:59 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2013/infra.2013-10-22-19.01.html | 19:59 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2013/infra.2013-10-22-19.01.txt | 19:59 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/infra/2013/infra.2013-10-22-19.01.log.html | 20:00 |
| clarkb | fungi: thanks | 20:00 |
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| ttx | PSA: No TC meeting this week | 20:03 |
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| anteaya | ttx does TC meet next week? | 20:05 |
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| ttx | anteaya: ..maybe | 20:06 |
| anteaya | okay, I will stand by | 20:06 |
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| ttx | hm. | 21:00 |
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| ttx | dhellmann, dolphm, notmyname, jd__, markwash, jgriffith, russellb, stevebaker, gabrielhurley, markmcclain, dtroyer, SergeyLukjanov, annegentle, sdague, lifeless, devananda, hub_cap, jeblair, kgriffs: around ? | 21:01 |
| markwash | o/ | 21:01 |
| sdague | o/ | 21:01 |
| stevebaker | \o | 21:01 |
| russellb | o/ | 21:01 |
| notmyname | here | 21:01 |
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| devananda | \o | 21:01 |
| dtroyer | o/ | 21:01 |
| dolphm | o/ | 21:01 |
| eglynn | o/ (deputizing for jd__ ... he's on vacation this week) | 21:01 |
| SergeyLukjanov | o/ | 21:01 |
| gabrielhurley | \o | 21:01 |
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| hub_cap | howdy | 21:01 |
| lifeless | ttx: hi | 21:01 |
| soren | >-|o | 21:01 |
| ttx | #startmeeting project | 21:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 22 21:01:56 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ttx. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'project' | 21:02 |
| ttx | #link http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/ProjectMeeting | 21:02 |
| ttx | A special meeting today, focused on the design summit scheduling | 21:02 |
| lifeless | dum dum dum duuuuuuh | 21:02 |
| russellb | every meeting is special. | 21:02 |
| annegentle | here | 21:02 |
| ttx | But first we'll do a quick release postmortem | 21:02 |
| lifeless | like raindrops falling from the sky | 21:02 |
| ttx | #topic Havana release postmortem | 21:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Havana release postmortem (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:02 | |
| ttx | So... last week we released Havana | 21:02 |
| ttx | In general I think it went well | 21:02 |
| ttx | All processes worked as planned | 21:03 |
| ttx | We were a little too late for my taste | 21:03 |
| ttx | i.e. we didn't switch to anal-rentention mode early enough | 21:03 |
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| ttx | I intend to discuss ways to mitigate that during the release schedule session in HK | 21:03 |
| jgriffith | hey | 21:03 |
| eglynn | also IIRC seemed to be slowness/breakages creeping into the gate towards the end | 21:03 |
| russellb | seemed to happen < 1 week before release? | 21:03 |
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| eglynn | (which slowed down the merge rate significantly) | 21:04 |
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| ttx | russellb: we did some RC2s two weeks before final that were still a bit too significant | 21:04 |
| sdague | well the breakages were all bugs in core projects, it did take a while to nail down those races | 21:04 |
| annegentle | People who followed prior releases of OpenStack said these release notes were good. | 21:04 |
| ttx | For a primer you can read http://fnords.wordpress.com/2013/10/18/getting-to-havana/ | 21:04 |
| annegentle | I can't take credit for them, but docs writers did some real digging to compile those. | 21:04 |
| annegentle | with the ptls | 21:05 |
| ttx | I think we lost a week at the beginning recovering from the intense feature freeze week | 21:05 |
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| russellb | annegentle: yep i got a lot of help, it was great | 21:05 |
| ttx | so we either need to make it less intense, or add a week | 21:05 |
| russellb | ttx: +1, i was fried after that | 21:05 |
| annegentle | I'm not sure you can decrease the intensity, deadlines kind of do that to humans? | 21:05 |
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| dhellmann | o/ | 21:06 |
| eglynn | re. lateness and heavy RCs, reasonable flexibility was shown with FFEs IMHO | 21:06 |
| ttx | Do you have any issue with the release process, or another FAIL to report while you still remember it ? | 21:06 |
| sdague | right, so move the freeze back a week. The mad rush definitely burns up reviewers | 21:06 |
| eglynn | ... said as a benificiary of one of those FFEs ;) | 21:06 |
| ttx | sdague, russellb: that's one of the options yes | 21:06 |
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| gabrielhurley | from the Horizon side, I'd just like to encourage PTLs of other projects to communicate their "banner features" for a release early and often to the Horizon team so we can plan our integration accordingly | 21:07 |
| sdague | ttx: I think my only regret is we didn't get parallel testing in until right near H3, and it shook out a lot of bugs, but would have been nicer earlier | 21:07 |
| markwash | ttx: one improvement, we need to get you a desk so you don't have to fill out your checklists on rocks any longer | 21:07 |
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| russellb | gabrielhurley: good point | 21:07 |
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| annegentle | gabrielhurley: +1 | 21:07 |
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| ttx | gabrielhurley: we might change the format of this meeting to make that more efficient | 21:07 |
| gabrielhurley | ttx: any changes you think would help are welcome | 21:08 |
| russellb | i guess that could help docs, too | 21:08 |
| ttx | gabrielhurley: as in, we might just sync most of the release status offline at some other pre-arranged hour | 21:08 |
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| stevebaker | gabrielhurley: actually same goes for heat, regarding banner features and integration | 21:08 |
| ttx | then use the meeting to communicate about cross-project | 21:08 |
| ttx | and make that part short | 21:08 |
| gabrielhurley | stevebaker: +1 | 21:08 |
| dolphm | and python-openstackclient | 21:09 |
| gabrielhurley | this really goes for all the top-of-stack programs | 21:09 |
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| ttx | most of what happens in this meeting could happen in a 1:1 discussion between me and ptl | 21:09 |
| annegentle | russellb: yep sure would | 21:09 |
| ttx | and then the critical need for cross-project communication is a bit buried in it | 21:09 |
| annegentle | ttx: I like that reformat of the project meeting | 21:09 |
| sdague | ttx: +1 | 21:09 |
| russellb | yeah, sounds interesting | 21:09 |
| ttx | annegentle: I intend to polish a proposal and present it in the release schedule/process session | 21:09 |
| gabrielhurley | +1, I look forward to this proposal | 21:10 |
| russellb | ttx: know when that's going to be yet? | 21:10 |
| ttx | no point in me preparing remarks all day and pasting them in channel while we have everybody's attention | 21:10 |
| ttx | russellb: probably last day, before last slot | 21:10 |
| ttx | last slot would be "the future of design summits" | 21:10 |
| russellb | ah, k | 21:11 |
| russellb | so 2nd to last slot | 21:11 |
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| ttx | OK... we also have a number of known issues to backport to stable/havana | 21:11 |
| ttx | I know of bug 1242855 | 21:11 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1242855 in keystone "Removing role adds role with LDAP backend" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1242855 | 21:11 |
| ttx | Any other really embarrassing bug that crept in ? | 21:11 |
| annegentle | ttx: I have a question about bugs post-release | 21:11 |
| ttx | as in, if it had been discovered last week you would have asked for a new RC to cover for it | 21:12 |
| ttx | annegentle: ask | 21:12 |
| annegentle | ttx: do you mark bugs that didn't get fixed in havana as icehouse targeted? Or untarget them completel? | 21:12 |
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| annegentle | ttx: looking at nova, I think you mass-target to next-release | 21:13 |
| ttx | annegentle: err... what do you mean by icehouse-targeted ? | 21:13 |
| annegentle | ttx: Milestone | 21:13 |
| annegentle | ttx: sorry | 21:13 |
| ttx | icehouse1-milestone-targeted ? | 21:14 |
| annegentle | ttx: right | 21:14 |
| ttx | you mean, bugs that were havana-rc-potential that didn't get fixed ? | 21:14 |
| annegentle | ttx: looking at https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/BugTriage, it doesn't say if any particular thing happens at release | 21:15 |
| ttx | nothing particular happens at release | 21:15 |
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| ttx | you can target some of the deferred fixes to your next milestone | 21:15 |
| ttx | but that would be a manual thing | 21:15 |
| annegentle | ttx: and looking at https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Bugs it looks like a judgement call, Milestone | 21:15 |
| ttx | the only thing I do is untag havana-rc-potential and make them havana-backport-potential | 21:16 |
| annegentle | ttx: ok, so you're not using the launchpad API for moving bugs around? | 21:16 |
| ttx | annegentle: no | 21:16 |
| annegentle | ttx: got it, thanks | 21:16 |
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| ttx | If you have embarassing bugs in havana, would be great to document them all in the Release Notes so that the early upgraders know about all of them. | 21:16 |
| annegentle | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/ReleaseNotes/Havana | 21:17 |
| ttx | and yes, bug 1242855 counts as embarassing :) | 21:17 |
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| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1242855 in keystone "Removing role adds role with LDAP backend" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1242855 | 21:17 |
| ttx | anything to add about havana ? | 21:17 |
| gabrielhurley | I find that bug hilarious :-) | 21:17 |
| annegentle | gabrielhurley: any specific examples for banner features? | 21:17 |
| * dolphm ++ | 21:17 | |
| ttx | gabrielhurley: hiilarious bugs are also release notes material :) | 21:17 |
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| russellb | i don't think i have anything hilarious, or severely depressing, but I think that's good | 21:18 |
| gabrielhurley | annegentle: the one that brought this to the forefront of my mind in Havana was miscommunication around the VPNaaS and FWaaS between myself and the Neutron guys that led to some FFEs and long nights for folks to get them in | 21:18 |
| gabrielhurley | they did a great job getting that done, btw | 21:18 |
| gabrielhurley | props to the devs who worked on those | 21:18 |
| ttx | russellb: that would be one of the first release without a OMG bug discovered +1week | 21:18 |
| gabrielhurley | but we shouldn't have needed to do that | 21:18 |
| markmcclain | gabrielhurley: +1 those sub teams did a great job | 21:18 |
| ttx | OK, time to talk Hong-Kong | 21:19 |
| annegentle | gabrielhurley: good, I think you're ahead of docs there, people do seem confused about VPNaaS and FWaaS docs | 21:19 |
| ttx | #topic Design Summit scheduling | 21:19 |
| eglynn | what's the deadline for PTLs to review and reject/accept design session proposals? | 21:19 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Design Summit scheduling (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:19 | |
| ttx | eglynn: We are trying to produce a schedule before the end of the week. | 21:19 |
| ttx | Does that sound doable for everyone ? | 21:19 |
| sdague | good for me | 21:19 |
| SergeyLukjanov | for me too | 21:19 |
| annegentle | sure | 21:20 |
| ttx | Then we use the following days to fix conflicts | 21:20 |
| russellb | good for me, mostly done (in an etherpad, not on the site yet) | 21:20 |
| eglynn | ttx: well jd__ is on vacation this week, not sure how off-grid he is though | 21:20 |
| ttx | eglynn: all week ? | 21:20 |
| ttx | damn the french with all their vacation time | 21:20 |
| sdague | heh | 21:21 |
| eglynn | ttx: hmm, not 100% sure on that, may only be the the 1st half of the week | 21:21 |
| annegentle | oui oiu | 21:21 |
| eglynn | he's defo out tmrw also | 21:21 |
| annegentle | wah | 21:21 |
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| ttx | eglynn: if not I could give you the keys if necessary | 21:21 |
| lifeless | how do we check conflicts? | 21:21 |
| eglynn | ttx: fair enough | 21:21 |
| lifeless | I mean, do I click 'push to sched' and then ??? | 21:21 |
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| russellb | lifeless: manually and then hope for the best i think | 21:21 |
| ttx | lifeless: we can anticipate them using comments that may have been left by people. Otherwise we just post and wait for complaints | 21:22 |
| sdague | ttx: so how soon will things be in place for us to start pushing things out? I'm mostly done on our schedule, and it would be good to have it out there before the QA meeting on Thurs so we can adjust | 21:22 |
| lifeless | russellb: sure, but I mean in a little more detail... | 21:22 |
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| eglynn | BTW is it clear yet approx. how many sessions will be available to each track? | 21:22 |
| eglynn | (modulo horse-trading or whatever ...) | 21:22 |
| lifeless | eglynn: nowhere near enough! | 21:22 |
| ttx | lifeless: also we can't please everyone, so pleasing all the PTLs as a first step is good | 21:22 |
| dhellmann | can we push to sched more than once, if we do change the schedule? | 21:22 |
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| lifeless | there needs to be a PTL FAQ for this I think ;> | 21:22 |
| ttx | sdague: we need to solve the sched question first. I'll come to it | 21:22 |
| russellb | dhellmann: yep (or i was able to last time) | 21:22 |
| ttx | Everyone: Do you have sessions in your "topic" that you think belong to another ? | 21:22 |
| dhellmann | russellb: cool, I expected as much but wanted to be sure #n00b | 21:23 |
| notmyname | dhellmann: yes, and in the past you can update the schedule even during the event | 21:23 |
| jeblair | ttx: yes | 21:23 |
| devananda | I had one, already re-proposed it to Ceilometer | 21:23 |
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| stevebaker | not really | 21:23 |
| sdague | ttx: I mostly kicked those out with comments | 21:23 |
| markwash | ttx: one maybe | 21:23 |
| russellb | just some that we recommended to unconference, mostly | 21:23 |
| markwash | (http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/220) | 21:23 |
| dhellmann | ttx: I've already dealt with that, so not any more | 21:23 |
| lifeless | ttx: I do | 21:23 |
| ttx | jeblair: you can use this meeting to trade | 21:23 |
| ttx | (or try to) | 21:23 |
| SergeyLukjanov | ttx, nope | 21:23 |
| jeblair | markmc is not around; is there an oslo ptl proxy here? | 21:24 |
| dhellmann | I'm here :-) | 21:24 |
| sdague | dhellmann's the ptl now :) | 21:24 |
| ttx | jeblair: that would be dhellmann | 21:24 |
| dolphm | haha | 21:24 |
| jeblair | gah | 21:24 |
| jeblair | wrong wiki page. ;) | 21:24 |
| dhellmann | not a big deal | 21:24 |
| lifeless | markmcclain: ttx: http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/314 | 21:24 |
| dhellmann | oh, which one do I need to update? | 21:24 |
| lifeless | markmcclain: I'm gonig to chat with snaiksnat once my run of meetings are done | 21:25 |
| markmcclain | ok | 21:25 |
| ttx | lifeless: you scheduled it so i suspect you found room for it ? | 21:25 |
| markwash | russellb: do you have any interest in this? http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/220 I think the right technical solution is a nova change rather than a glance change. I'm okay with giving it a glance slot but would love to have relevant nova folks there | 21:25 |
| jeblair | dhellmann: if i deep link to http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/124 can you see that? | 21:25 |
| dhellmann | russellb: I suggested that boris-42 submit some of the db changes he wants to make in the nova track, did you get those? | 21:25 |
| lifeless | ttx: I'm oversubscribed by about 3:1 :P | 21:25 |
| dhellmann | jeblair: yes | 21:25 |
| jeblair | i never know what access people have in the summit app | 21:25 |
| jeblair | coll | 21:25 |
| dhellmann | jeblair: reading | 21:25 |
| russellb | markwash: we'd probably reject it as something we could probably cover on the ML | 21:25 |
| dolphm | jeblair: ++ | 21:25 |
| sdague | actually, russellb, this one seems mostly about nova unit tests - http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/317 | 21:25 |
| lifeless | ttx: but we'll muddle through | 21:25 |
| boris-42 | dhellmann what?) | 21:26 |
| russellb | dhellmann: didn't get that, no, i don't think | 21:26 |
| ttx | lifeless: welcome to hell | 21:26 |
| dhellmann | jeblair: oh, man, why rebuild chef, puppet, etc.? | 21:26 |
| boris-42 | dhellmann we have only one DB session | 21:26 |
| jeblair | dhellmann: and http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/318 | 21:26 |
| lifeless | ttx: heh, so to me the value is not in the discussion but in the face to face | 21:26 |
| dhellmann | boris-42: maybe roman was going to do it? we agreed some of the sub-topics needed a different audience | 21:26 |
| lifeless | ttx: plans don't survive more than a few weeks post summit anyhow | 21:26 |
| dhellmann | boris-42: let's discuss later, if we need to | 21:26 |
| lifeless | ttx: but thats a meta discussion | 21:26 |
| russellb | dhellmann: yeah, though i suppose it applies to some other projects ... but don't think I'd give it nova track time. it's not terribly controversial or anything, and is already well in progress | 21:26 |
| boris-42 | dhellmann Okay | 21:26 |
| jeblair | oh! i can change the topic by clicking on it in the list | 21:27 |
| dhellmann | russellb: ok, I thought the soft delete thing in particular might spark some discussion, since it wants to have nova depend on ceilometer | 21:27 |
| jeblair | so the ui paradigm is 'click on the hyperlink for the aspect of the proposal you want to change' | 21:27 |
| lifeless | markmcclain: so #openstack-neutron after this I guess :) | 21:27 |
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| ttx | sdague: you're not suposed to come up with exciting titles, otherwise you'll attract the crowd (re: "Preemptively Integrate the Universe") | 21:27 |
| markwash | russellb: hmm. . this is just sort of a long-term standstill so far :-( | 21:27 |
| sdague | heh | 21:27 |
| sdague | well I'll let jeblair make the title boring | 21:28 |
| russellb | dhellmann: oops, that was meant for sdague | 21:28 |
| dhellmann | jeblair: I guess http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/318 could fit with oslo | 21:28 |
| russellb | dhellmann: don't think i've seen a session related to what you're saying | 21:28 |
| markmcclain | lifeless: sounds good | 21:28 |
| gabrielhurley | ttx: where would you suggest that up-and-coming Programs (I'm specifically looking at the proposed UX Program) get time allotted to them in the scheduling process? | 21:28 |
| sdague | russellb: heh, yeh honestly, I think 317 doesn't really need a session | 21:28 |
| dhellmann | russellb: I'll leave it for boris-42 to submit | 21:28 |
| russellb | sdague: agreed | 21:28 |
| russellb | dhellmann: ok | 21:28 |
| sdague | but I figured I'd let you know before I punted it entirely in case you disagreed | 21:28 |
| russellb | boris-42: if you are submitting anything, please do it asap | 21:28 |
| russellb | sdague: sure, appreciated | 21:28 |
| boris-42 | russellb okay | 21:28 |
| ttx | gabrielhurley: they don't, unless they are invited by an existing topic -- we can't provide room for all wannabees and the line has to be drawn somewhere | 21:29 |
| boris-42 | russellb 30 min ok? | 21:29 |
| russellb | sdague: unless you think there's some controversy or important discussion to have around it | 21:29 |
| russellb | boris-42: from now? yes | 21:29 |
| lifeless | ttx: so I clicked on push to sched | 21:29 |
| dhellmann | jeblair: did you want me to take http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/124 over? I don't expect I would approve of a system like that | 21:29 |
| boris-42 | russellb yeah from now-) | 21:29 |
| ttx | gabrielhurley: there is an unconference room for random things | 21:29 |
| jeblair | dhellmann: 318 bumped to oslo | 21:29 |
| lifeless | ttx: and it said | 21:29 |
| jeblair | dhellmann: let's ask lifeless | 21:29 |
| ttx | lifeless: that should fail | 21:29 |
| lifeless | Would have pushed to sched.org: | 21:29 |
| sdague | russellb: not really, it's just a getting stuff done thing I think | 21:29 |
| lifeless | ttx: ok | 21:29 |
| gabrielhurley | ttx: I see. Way to make me choose, since http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/111 is submitted to the Horizon track... | 21:29 |
| jeblair | lifeless: want http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/124 ? | 21:29 |
| russellb | sdague: ok agreed | 21:29 |
| ttx | lifeless: until the sched API key field is filled | 21:29 |
| lifeless | ttx: so I'm confused about how we collaborate ;P | 21:29 |
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| sdague | lifeless: via IRC, like always :) | 21:29 |
| ttx | lifeless: we need to solve the one sched / two sched question first | 21:29 |
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| jeblair | dhellmann, lifeless: because i'm not likely to accept 124 in infra) | 21:30 |
| ttx | lifeless: then I'll enter the corresponding sched.org APi key | 21:30 |
| lifeless | jeblair: sheese yeah. | 21:30 |
| russellb | yeah doesn't seem infra related really, heh | 21:30 |
| dhellmann | jeblair: yeah, it doesn't fit there | 21:30 |
| ttx | lifeless: havign a "private" sched would let us push early, push often | 21:30 |
| lifeless | jeblair: uhm, I think there are good aspects to having live configuration | 21:30 |
| lifeless | jeblair: but it's a) not openstack-infra | 21:30 |
| sdague | jeblair: any idea who the proposer for 124 is? honestly the last time that came up on the ML there was some talk about it being a keystone thing | 21:31 |
| russellb | ooh ooh, what's b) | 21:31 |
| lifeless | jeblair: and b) not a library problem per se - there's lots of consequences that that proposal doesn't think about | 21:31 |
| lifeless | like graceful operation in mixed version clouds | 21:31 |
| dolphm | sdague: joe brue | 21:31 |
| dolphm | breu* | 21:31 |
| jeblair | lifeless: oh, yeah, agreed. i'm not evaluating the merits. i'm just saying it's not infra. | 21:31 |
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| russellb | can reject it saying "consensus is we hate it" | 21:31 |
| lifeless | dhellmann: oslo is as good a place as any; it's not a deployment problem per se: I think oslo is a decent place to start the discussion | 21:32 |
| devananda | jeblair: reminds me of issues with the central config mgmt of NDB cluster ... | 21:32 |
| lifeless | dhellmann: deployment can certainly inform the discussion (but so can all the API services) | 21:32 |
| ttx | Another question: is there anyone who has TOO MANY SLOTS and wants to give them out to their neighbour ? | 21:32 |
| dhellmann | lifeless: ok, I'm running out of space but we'll see | 21:32 |
| lifeless | ttx: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA | 21:32 |
| ttx | lifeless: last summit we had Glance and Horizon giving some slots out :) | 21:32 |
| lifeless | ttx: http://summit.openstack.org/scheduling/13 btw | 21:32 |
| devananda | devstack has only 2 proposals? | 21:33 |
| sdague | devananda: it only has 2 slots | 21:33 |
| devananda | ah :) | 21:33 |
| dhellmann | jeblair: I can't edit 124, but if you want to put it in oslo I'll deal with it | 21:33 |
| ttx | lifeless: busy :) | 21:33 |
| jeblair | dhellmann: ok, will punt to you for now then. you can punt it to lifeless later i guess. :) | 21:33 |
| ttx | lifeless: you can edit the common title of those merged sessions fwiw | 21:33 |
| dhellmann | jeblair: hehe | 21:33 |
| ttx | lifeless: see "Help" at the bottom of the page | 21:33 |
| lifeless | devananda: where do you see devstacks sessions ? | 21:34 |
| sdague | it's conference hot potato | 21:34 |
| devananda | lifeless: http://summit.openstack.org/ and click 'topic' to sort | 21:34 |
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| rackerjoe | russellb: http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/124 would probably make more sense in oslo and not infra | 21:34 |
| jeblair | rackerjoe: it just got moved to oslo | 21:34 |
| rackerjoe | cool | 21:34 |
| jeblair | rackerjoe: (for consideration, not approved) | 21:35 |
| rackerjoe | jeblair: understood | 21:35 |
| * ttx likes the session trading fair | 21:35 | |
| lifeless | devananda: thanks | 21:35 |
| dhellmann | rackerjoe: I'll see if I can find space for it, but I was already full | 21:35 |
| devananda | eglynn: since jd__ isn't here, i'd like to point out http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/197 | 21:35 |
| devananda | eglynn: moved from ironic track after talking offline with jd__ about it | 21:36 |
| devananda | eglynn: at the time, you guys still had some free slots :) | 21:36 |
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| eglynn | devananda: yep, I noticed that, we definitely need to discuss those topics in detail | 21:36 |
| devananda | cool | 21:36 |
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| eglynn | devananda: (so it were up to me, that would be a shoo-in ...) | 21:36 |
| lifeless | ttx: thanks! | 21:37 |
| devananda | russellb: anything in the nova track on baremetal? (i'm skimming right now) | 21:37 |
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| ttx | Please continue the session trading fair, but we'll address the question of one or two scheds in parallel | 21:37 |
| ttx | #topic Separate or same sched.org ? | 21:37 |
| russellb | devananda: nothing | 21:37 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Separate or same sched.org ? (Meeting topic: project)" | 21:37 | |
| jeblair | ttx: #vote separate | 21:38 |
| ttx | We need to decide this ASAP, since we want to start pushing stuff before the end of week | 21:38 |
| russellb | #vote separate | 21:38 |
| sdague | #vote separate | 21:38 |
| dhellmann | #vote separate | 21:38 |
| stevebaker | #vote separate | 21:38 |
| ttx | So far, 9 of you said they preferred 2 scheds, and 3 of you preferred one (notmyname, annegentle, SergeyLukjanov) | 21:38 |
| dolphm | #vote separate | 21:38 |
| markwash | #vote separate | 21:38 |
| gabrielhurley | #vote separate | 21:38 |
| dtroyer | #vote separate | 21:38 |
| eglynn | #vote separate | 21:38 |
| ttx | 10 | 21:38 |
| hub_cap | #vote separate | 21:38 |
| ttx | 12 | 21:38 |
| annegentle | #vote oneschedtorulethemall | 21:38 |
| devananda | #vote separate | 21:38 |
| jgriffith | #vote separate | 21:38 |
| jeblair | annegentle: why rule only the mall? | 21:38 |
| lifeless | ok http://summit.openstack.org/scheduling/13 seems sanish now | 21:39 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #vote oneschedtorulethemall | 21:39 |
| annegentle | jeblair: hee hee | 21:39 |
| lifeless | #vote separate | 21:39 |
| dolphm | jeblair: annegentle: castle? | 21:39 |
| gabrielhurley | jeblair: that's where the cinnabon is | 21:39 |
| ttx | SergeyLukjanov, annegentle, notmyname: would separate scheds work for you, or you prefer to die before we do it ? | 21:39 |
| ttx | annegentle voted separate above | 21:39 |
| notmyname | why separate? only to discourage looky-loos from coming by? isn't the whole point to have users and devs come together? | 21:39 |
| russellb | devananda: you want to lead one? could do it on Friday, when we're doing other hypervisor sessions ... up to you. don't mind not having it if nobody wants to talk about it ... | 21:39 |
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| lifeless | notmyname: not 5000 of them | 21:39 |
| notmyname | ttx: yes, we should have either separate or a unified sched | 21:39 |
| russellb | devananda: maybe it makes sense that all the relevant chat is about Ironic | 21:39 |
| dolphm | lifeless: not sure who that link was intended for, but i get a 403 | 21:40 |
| SergeyLukjanov | ttx, sure, it'll work but it doesn't look very useful for attendees | 21:40 |
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| lifeless | dolphm: its the deployment schedule, I don't know who can look at it | 21:40 |
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| devananda | russellb: i think it makes sense to keep it all in ironic, and i've only got one or two to merge so far | 21:40 |
| russellb | devananda: OK, sounds good | 21:40 |
| lifeless | dolphm: ttx: if only ttx + me can, I think that suggests a summit bug | 21:40 |
| devananda | russellb: with the plan of 'stop adding things to noa-baremetal and deprecate it', i think it 's fine not to have a sessiona bout it | 21:40 |
| russellb | devananda: ack | 21:40 |
| dhellmann | notmyname: having separate schedules does not in any way prevent people from coming to the summit sessions, but it does make it easier for ATCs to find summit sessions | 21:41 |
| annegentle | I won't fight long or hard for it but I hate to ask that much work of people this late. It's a known problem, we try to solve it with different solutions, why rush around this week on a second sched.org | 21:41 |
| ttx | notmyname: benefits for separate is: weeding out people, abilityt o use colors to difefrentiate design summit topics, and ability to push schedule early for final tweaking without messing with the "official" one | 21:41 |
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| dolphm | more summit.openstack.org pages need more read-only visibility | 21:41 |
| notmyname | dhellmann: hmm...I didn't think the ATC discovery issue was the problem being solved | 21:41 |
| lifeless | devananda: we've got a couple of small things still to go, but then it really should be stoppable. | 21:41 |
| ttx | notmyname: drawback being obviously having to juggle | 21:41 |
| dhellmann | ttx: can we not use separate colors if we have a single sched? | 21:41 |
| devananda | lifeless: bug fixes notwithstanding :) | 21:41 |
| sdague | dhellmann: you run out of useful colors pretty quick | 21:42 |
| dolphm | dhellmann: can, but colors alone won't be effective | 21:42 |
| ttx | dhellmann: that would make a lot of undistinguishable colors | 21:42 |
| lifeless | devananda: supporting ephemeral partitions for instance; arguable on the wire but really need it :) | 21:42 |
| devananda | and some of us don't see colors the same way .... | 21:42 |
| lifeless | what are colours ? | 21:42 |
| sdague | already 18 used on - http://openstacksummitnovember2013.sched.org/ | 21:42 |
| dolphm | ttx: i did like the "warm colors for technical topics, and cool colors for everything else" thing you suggested | 21:42 |
| ttx | sdague: that would make 38 colors | 21:42 |
| annegentle | yeah I think solving the colors issue just for ATCs is a LOT of work for just colors and just ATCs | 21:42 |
| lifeless | /lots/ of people are partially color blind | 21:42 |
| dolphm | but everyone will quickly look past that | 21:42 |
| dolphm | lifeless: +++ | 21:42 |
| * russellb doesn't feel *that* strongly ... just want to make sure we have the right people, and more importantly, not the wrong people in the room | 21:43 | |
| russellb | so if a separate sched helps that, then +++ | 21:43 |
| sdague | honestly, the big issue is what we saw with nova on day one last year | 21:43 |
| devananda | ++ not the wrong people ... | 21:43 |
| annegentle | ttx: have you re-evaluated the time sink a second sched.org is and come up with it's really not bad? | 21:43 |
| russellb | because it can seriously kill productivity | 21:43 |
| lifeless | there will be about 500 colour blind people in HK | 21:43 |
| markwash | optimize colors for tetrachromats | 21:43 |
| ttx | lifeless: yes, only admins and topic leads can see the scheduling screen | 21:43 |
| devananda | russellb: it wasn't jsut on day one ... | 21:43 |
| russellb | i really don't see why it's painful to have a separate | 21:43 |
| russellb | devananda: ++ | 21:43 |
| ttx | annegentle: it's not really long to set up | 21:44 |
| * notmyname will use whatever is provided | 21:44 | |
| ttx | annegentle: especially if you borrow the artwork from the first one | 21:44 |
| ttx | annegentle: there is a cost though | 21:44 |
| lifeless | so there are many people that are not actually interested in directly contributing to the design work | 21:44 |
| lifeless | they are usually first-time attendees - 2.5K *new* folk this time | 21:44 |
| lifeless | the challenge isn't 'keep people out' it's - help the several thousand new attendees get to things that actually help them | 21:44 |
| ttx | sdague: the space in HK is physically separated from the conference, requires a "full access" pass and the design summit starts on the same day as the conference, so I don't expect that many bystanders | 21:45 |
| sdague | do we know what the physical layout is going to be? | 21:45 |
| russellb | cost of 2nd sched <<<<< cost of disrupted sessions by having the room full of the wrong people | 21:45 |
| notmyname | I don't really think it's an argument worth having. I'd prefer a unified schedule for the appearance of unity, if nothing else. I'll use whatever, and it seems that the majority wants separate schedules | 21:45 |
| ttx | physically as in 500 meters away | 21:45 |
| * notmyname is used to being in the minority ;-) | 21:45 | |
| lifeless | ttx: wow | 21:45 |
| markmcclain | sdague: layout isn't really important… its the titles and topics that attract | 21:45 |
| ttx | lifeless: not the same building, afaik | 21:45 |
| * hub_cap converts that to ft | 21:45 | |
| devananda | ttx: nice. except for when we need to run between them due to scheduling conflicts ;) | 21:45 |
| annegentle | ttx: ok if it's really not hard, it's worthwhile to try to somewhat obfuscate the ATC schedule, but I worry about our "open" claim being a bit disingenous | 21:45 |
| dolphm | with two schedules, i'm still slightly worried that people will come across the "wrong" schedule for them | 21:45 |
| dhellmann | this second sched won't be private or hidden, right? so people can still find the summit | 21:45 |
| lifeless | ttx: I'm so going to be rushing from A to B on tuesday | 21:46 |
| lifeless | OTOH the rest of the week can be drinking 101, so \o/ | 21:46 |
| jeblair | annegentle: wow, i don't think this makes ANYTHING less open | 21:46 |
| markwash | hub_cap: technically its 100 rods, but was rounded | 21:46 |
| devananda | given that it's apparently a separate building (!!) then a separate sched makes even more sense to me. | 21:46 |
| markmcclain | my preference is one schedule | 21:46 |
| hub_cap | markwash :) | 21:46 |
| dolphm | to rule the mall | 21:46 |
| russellb | vote and move on? | 21:46 |
| ttx | yeah | 21:46 |
| annegentle | must rule the mall | 21:46 |
| lifeless | we did... | 21:46 |
| russellb | heh | 21:47 |
| jeblair | annegentle: we're doing everything possible to avoid having to do something that does physically prevent over-attendance | 21:47 |
| ttx | #startvote How many scheds? One, Two | 21:47 |
| openstack | Begin voting on: How many scheds? Valid vote options are One, Two. | 21:47 |
| openstack | Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts. | 21:47 |
| hub_cap | maybe we need a vote to change the previous vote? | 21:47 |
| russellb | #vote Two | 21:47 |
| gabrielhurley | #vote Two | 21:47 |
| markmcclain | #vote One | 21:47 |
| SergeyLukjanov | #vote One | 21:47 |
| markwash | #vote Two | 21:47 |
| devananda | #vote two | 21:47 |
| stevebaker | #vote Two | 21:47 |
| eglynn | #vote Two | 21:47 |
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| sdague | #vote Two | 21:47 |
| jeblair | annegentle: i think that shows quite a commitment to being open | 21:47 |
| lifeless | #vote One | 21:47 |
| lifeless | erm | 21:47 |
| dolphm | #vote Two | 21:47 |
| hub_cap | #vote Two | 21:47 |
| lifeless | #vote Two | 21:47 |
| jeblair | #vote Two | 21:47 |
| dtroyer | #vote Two | 21:47 |
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| dhellmann | #vote two | 21:47 |
| annegentle | #vote One | 21:47 |
| * dolphm unsure of case sensitivity | 21:47 | |
| ttx | Oh, I forgot the abstain option | 21:47 |
| jgriffith | #vote Two | 21:47 |
| dhellmann | #vote Two | 21:48 |
| notmyname | #vote one | 21:48 |
| jgriffith | I vote no more abstain votes | 21:48 |
| notmyname | #vote One | 21:48 |
| ttx | 30 more seconds, you might want to vote with the right capitalization, not sure how dumb the bot is | 21:48 |
| annegentle | jeblair: I didn't realize it's a separate building too? | 21:48 |
| devananda | #vote Two | 21:48 |
| markwash | it complains about invalid votes usually I think? | 21:48 |
| jeblair | annegentle: i belive that was by design to cut down on unintended crossover | 21:48 |
| dhellmann | jgriffith: +1 | 21:48 |
| ttx | reed: around ? | 21:49 |
| ttx | #endvote | 21:49 |
| openstack | Voted on "How many scheds?" Results are | 21:49 |
| reed | yep | 21:49 |
| openstack | Two (14): stevebaker, dhellmann, jeblair, eglynn, russellb, devananda, markwash, sdague, lifeless, gabrielhurley, dolphm, jgriffith, dtroyer, hub_cap | 21:49 |
| openstack | One (4): annegentle, markmcclain, notmyname, SergeyLukjanov | 21:49 |
| gabrielhurley | ttx: so, should we not push the "push to sched" button right now? I have my sessions laid out basically how I like, but want to make sure they go to the right place... | 21:49 |
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| ttx | reed: how far is the design summit from the rest of the conference ? | 21:49 |
| reed | upstairs? | 21:49 |
| ttx | reed: ISTR it's a separate building | 21:50 |
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| hub_cap | gabrielhurley: he said he'd be configuring the proper sched after the vote | 21:50 |
| * ttx tries to access maps | 21:50 | |
| reed | let me check | 21:50 |
| hub_cap | i guess its sometime after that we can push | 21:50 |
| sdague | ttx: I didn't think there were that many buildings on that part of the island | 21:50 |
| gabrielhurley | hub_cap: thanks, I missed that | 21:50 |
| ttx | gabrielhurley: pushing the button will do nothing at this point except show you URLs it would call if only it had an API key | 21:50 |
| gabrielhurley | lol | 21:51 |
| gabrielhurley | okay | 21:51 |
| dolphm | i'd like to start seeing other track's schedules as soon as possible, to try and avoid competing for audience in the same time slot | 21:51 |
| * gabrielhurley pushes it just to be ornery | 21:51 | |
| ttx | I'll try to get the sched set up tomorrow, but will depend how fast Lauren can pay for one | 21:51 |
| reed | can't find the maps :( | 21:51 |
| ttx | dolphm: yeah, that's actually a benefit of "Two sched", being able to push WIP | 21:51 |
| * reed digging deeper | 21:52 | |
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| ttx | since we don't have to make that URL very well known just yet | 21:52 |
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| * ttx looks | 21:52 | |
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| ttx | you can continue trading sessions while I look for conference maps | 21:53 |
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| SergeyLukjanov | ttx, I have a question about empty slots | 21:54 |
| SergeyLukjanov | due to the https://docs.google.com/a/mirantis.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AmUn0hzC1InKdDdPRXFrNjV4SW91SWF5N2gwYnRHYWc&usp=drive_web#gid=1 | 21:54 |
| SergeyLukjanov | there is an empty slot after savanna slots, currently we have about 14 proposals, I'm merging them now, but it'll be great to have one more slot to cover more questions | 21:54 |
| SergeyLukjanov | if it's still empty :) | 21:55 |
| russellb | how about we auction off the free slots | 21:55 |
| ttx | SergeyLukjanov: it is. i don't want to make any jealous though :) | 21:55 |
| dolphm | russellb: for what, bug fixes? dev time on bp's? what can you offer | 21:56 |
| russellb | any last trading talk with nova? i really need to go by end of hour | 21:56 |
| hub_cap | lets draw straws! | 21:56 |
| russellb | dolphm: heh i don't know' | 21:56 |
| markwash | I could probably keep a slot free for. . other. . considerations | 21:56 |
| lifeless | lol | 21:56 |
| reed | ttx, the sessions will be under the same roof, different floors from the rest of the Summit | 21:56 |
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| ttx | reed: where can you see that ? | 21:56 |
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| hub_cap | reed: one floor for all summit sessions as well? you say different floors.. | 21:57 |
| reed | ttx, checked with Lauren :) she saw that | 21:57 |
| dhellmann | eglynn: do you know if we have room for http://summit.openstack.org/cfp/details/318 in the ceilometer track? | 21:57 |
| ttx | reed: ah. ok | 21:57 |
| reed | hub_cap, one floor for the Summit, one for the Design sessions | 21:57 |
| hub_cap | awesome | 21:57 |
| reed | https://www.dropbox.com/s/at4wj81f84jfaqh/May%202013%20Marketing%20Meeting.pptx slides 5 and 6 | 21:57 |
| dhellmann | eglynn: I want to make sure it's discussed, but I think it makes sense to continue the work they started in ceilometer before bringing it into oslo | 21:57 |
| sdague | so the first QA slot we're going to actually all pile into the Neutron room to do Neutron / QA crossover, so that will be physically available as long as no one schedules something that would draw QA folks | 21:58 |
| eglynn | dhellmann: I don't know | 21:58 |
| dhellmann | eglynn: I'll email jd__ | 21:58 |
| reed | #link https://www.dropbox.com/s/at4wj81f84jfaqh/May%202013%20Marketing%20Meeting.pptx | 21:58 |
| eglynn | dhellmann: (but agreed it would be preferable) | 21:58 |
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| reed | #info the Design summit will have its own floor with restaurant in the same building as the rest of the Summit though | 21:59 |
| russellb | reed: thanks! | 21:59 |
| reed | #info slides 5 and 6 have the floorplan | 21:59 |
| russellb | OK, I have to go. ping me via email or on irc tomorrow if anyone needs to chat about nova sessions | 21:59 |
| dolphm | anyone know if we can edit session titles / descriptions after pushing to sched | 22:00 |
| russellb | dolphm: you can re-push later | 22:00 |
| eglynn | dhellmann: currently 14 proposals for 11 ceilo slots, but with some obvious opportunities for merging proposals | 22:00 |
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| dolphm | i discovered that once you set pre-approved, session proposers are no longer able to edit anything | 22:00 |
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| reed | #info its a good 8-10 minute walk from the design summit to the breakout rooms in SkyCity Marriot, and about a 5 minute walk from the Design Summit to the Expo Hall which is also where 2 of the largest breakout rooms are located (we built these rooms inside the hall) | 22:00 |
| eglynn | dhellmann: (so there may be some scope ...) | 22:00 |
| dhellmann | eglynn: ok, thanks, I emailed jd__ | 22:00 |
| reed | #info it's a huge huge space, get ready to walk a lot or pack a scooter | 22:00 |
| ttx | reed: so it's the same roof, but a very large roof | 22:01 |
| sdague | dolphm: you have to pop it back off the schedule, or click the pencil | 22:01 |
| reed | ttx, as far as I understand it, yes | 22:01 |
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| reed | we really need a scooter | 22:01 |
| sdague | edit modes seem to be a bit interesting | 22:01 |
| devananda | reed: distance between breakout rooms in the Marriot and the Expo Hall? | 22:02 |
| hub_cap | maybe they have moving walkways like in airports | 22:02 |
| ttx | ok we need to leave room | 22:02 |
| jgriffith | pneumatic transport tubes | 22:02 |
| markwash | mortars and trampolines | 22:03 |
| reed | hub_cap, nope :( chmouel will be able to train for the marathon in there | 22:03 |
| ttx | we can continue this in #openstack-dev if necessary | 22:03 |
| ttx | #endmeeting | 22:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 22:03 | |
| hub_cap | thx ttx | 22:03 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 22 22:03:14 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 22:03 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/project/2013/project.2013-10-22-21.01.html | 22:03 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/project/2013/project.2013-10-22-21.01.txt | 22:03 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/project/2013/project.2013-10-22-21.01.log.html | 22:03 |
| SergeyLukjanov | ttx, thx | 22:03 |
| david-lyle | #startmeeting Horizon | 22:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue Oct 22 22:03:37 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is david-lyle. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 22:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 22:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Horizon)" | 22:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'horizon' | 22:03 |
| david-lyle | #topic Overview | 22:03 |
| lsmola | hello | 22:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Overview (Meeting topic: Horizon)" | 22:03 | |
| david-lyle | Hello everyone | 22:03 |
| jtomasek | hi | 22:03 |
| lblanchard | hi all! | 22:03 |
| jpich | hey | 22:03 |
| david-lyle | Gabriel's tied up again this week, so I return | 22:04 |
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| * david-lyle promises to stay on target | 22:04 | |
| jcoufal | o/ | 22:04 |
| julim | hi | 22:04 |
| david-lyle | Horizon RC3 published on Wed. Fixing | 22:04 |
| david-lyle | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/horizon/+bug/1239896 | 22:04 |
| lcheng | hi | 22:04 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1239896 in horizon "Launching Instance Boot from image (creates a new volume)" [Critical,Fix released] | 22:04 |
| david-lyle | Thanks to all who participated in getting that one escalated, fixed and merg ed. Just made the deadline -- well, sort of. That bug was a fairly serious r egression in instance launch, so I'm really glad it made it in. And now Hav ana is officially released. Now, we need to consider if bugs have backport potential and tag them havana-backport-potential. Also, major regressions th at would be RC worthy that we f | 22:04 |
| david-lyle | ind now may have time to be documented still. I haven't seen anything that alarming. | 22:04 |
| jpich | Cool | 22:05 |
| david-lyle | lots of spaces | 22:05 |
| david-lyle | Anyone seen any other issues that would be RC worthy, that need to be documented? | 22:05 |
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| david-lyle | I'll consider that a no, for now. Bring them up if you think of any as we move on. | 22:07 |
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| david-lyle | The summit is coming up quickly, just 2 away. Design Summit topics | 22:07 |
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| david-lyle | #link http://summit.openstack.org/ | 22:08 |
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| david-lyle | We had 9 proposals for 8 slots. | 22:08 |
| david-lyle | gabrielhurley is finalizing the schedule. There shouldn't be any topics that need to be excluded. And jcoufal is going to move the OpenStack UX session to an unconference session and advertise it in the Horizon sessions. | 22:08 |
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| david-lyle | is that your understanding jcoufal? | 22:09 |
| jcoufal | david-lyle: exactly | 22:09 |
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| david-lyle | excellent | 22:09 |
| david-lyle | If I understood the program meeting before this, there was a vote on having a separate schedule for the design summit sessions.. So the pretty color blob schedule would have one for the main conference and one for the design summit part. One of the driving factors is that will reduce the number of non-participants that get lured by a fancy topic name. I know the nova sessions last summit were especially hard hit on the first da | 22:10 |
| david-lyle | y. Making the actual design work harder to do. Getting the tooling up for a second schedule will be some work. | 22:10 |
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| david-lyle | should also be easier to find the more important sessions for ATCs | 22:11 |
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| david-lyle | Last piece of general info | 22:11 |
| david-lyle | UX | 22:12 |
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| david-lyle | jcoufal has been busy getting the OpenStack Program up and running. While, not officially blessed by the TC, he's been getting the tools in place and discussions started. In case you missed it on the mailing list: | 22:12 |
| david-lyle | #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2013-October/017163.html | 22:12 |
| david-lyle | Thanks jcoufal for your hard work there. | 22:12 |
| jcoufal | thanks david-lyle for bringing this up | 22:13 |
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| jcoufal | we are in pretty good shape with tools, the only missing tool is git repo and processes around that which might take a bit (but it's not that urgent) | 22:13 |
| david-lyle | I think it will take a little time to transition completely from the G+ group, but should be an improvement. | 22:13 |
| lblanchard | one question I have for people…do people feel like it's a good idea to split UX out from Horizon? I'm very used to working closely with developers while I work on UX so I want to be sure we remain in close contact with all of the UX work that is happening. | 22:14 |
| lblanchard | my main concern is blueprints and conversations via meetings…do we need something to make sure we stay in sync? | 22:14 |
| jcoufal | just a note, having UX separate program doesn't mean us being distant from Horizon development | 22:15 |
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| lblanchard | agreed, I definitely want to stay as close as possible to Horizon dev :) | 22:15 |
| david-lyle | I think it's important to keep the ties close, but UX reaches beyond just Horizon. | 22:15 |
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| lblanchard | agreed. | 22:15 |
| lsmola | lblanchard, blueprint should have a link to conversation about UX | 22:16 |
| jcoufal | want to discuss the best way of being in sync with devel teams at summit | 22:16 |
| lblanchard | jcoufal: sounds good | 22:16 |
| jcoufal | but as lsmola said, I see it similar way | 22:16 |
| david-lyle | I definitely think there will be some blueprint overlap, but with slightly different focus | 22:16 |
| lblanchard | okay sounds great, thanks for the thoughts…we can also do a retrospective after a few months or something | 22:17 |
| lblanchard | see what is working and what could be improved | 22:17 |
| david-lyle | sounds great to me | 22:17 |
| jcoufal | +1 | 22:17 |
| julim | +1 | 22:18 |
| lsmola | +2 | 22:18 |
| david-lyle | #topic Bugs | 22:18 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Bugs (Meeting topic: Horizon)" | 22:18 | |
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| david-lyle | I want to remind reviewers that if you haven't yet, you'll need to set up a watch on openstack/django_openstack_auth | 22:20 |
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| david-lyle | nothing overly long in the tooth there, but just a PSA | 22:20 |
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| david-lyle | any bugs we should talk about? | 22:21 |
| david-lyle | I do want to mention one review | 22:22 |
| david-lyle | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/51234/ | 22:22 |
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| lcheng | In openstack_auth, we fetch the Project List for each request. https://bugs.launchpad.net/django-openstack-auth/+bug/1241838 | 22:22 |
| uvirtbot | Launchpad bug 1241838 in django-openstack-auth "Project list is fetched from Keystone for each request" [Undecided,New] | 22:22 |
| lcheng | Not sure why are we doing it, planning to cache the project list per token. | 22:23 |
| lcheng | Let me know if anyone has concerns of caching it. | 22:23 |
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| david-lyle | if the openstack/requirements review ever hits that bumps the troveclient version, currently in recheck spin. If that hits, Horizon tests will be broken until the above review lands in some form. So just a timing issue. | 22:24 |
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| david-lyle | lcheng: as long as the cache gets updated on each token rescope, I think it should be fine | 22:24 |
| lsmola | lcheng, seems like a good idea | 22:24 |
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| lsmola | lcheng, seems like it will invalidate the cache correctly | 22:25 |
| david-lyle | your local keystone servers thank you | 22:25 |
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| lcheng | when the user logout the entry in the cache will be invalidated. | 22:26 |
| david-lyle | Seeing as the summit's around the corner and hopefully we'll talk blueprints there... | 22:26 |
| david-lyle | #topic Open Discussion | 22:26 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: Horizon)" | 22:26 | |
| jtomasek | I'd like to bring up the issue with Lesscpy not being able to compile bootstrap 3 | 22:26 |
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| jtomasek | This blocks https://blueprints.launchpad.net/horizon/+spec/bootstrap-update and it's dependent | 22:26 |
| jtomasek | blueprints. | 22:26 |
| jtomasek | I have sent latest info here today: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2013-October/017155.html | 22:27 |
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| jtomasek | basically I'd like to ask If there is anyone willing to help with getting lesscpy up to speed with bootstrap 3, it would be awesome | 22:28 |
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| david-lyle | jtomasek, it was unclear, to me, from the email is the lesscpy project active and open to the pull requests or is the process stalled out? | 22:28 |
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| jcoufal | yeah, I have to second that, if there is anybody who can help to move lesscpy to support bootstrap syntax compilation, would be very helpful to join this effort | 22:29 |
| jtomasek | david-lyle: there has been some activity from saschpe, but honestly it is not as frequent... also there are no pull requests from him to original repository | 22:29 |
| jcoufal | david-lyle: should be active and open, but not that much activity | 22:30 |
| jcoufal | sry jtomasek :) | 22:30 |
| jtomasek | and the founder of the lesscpy seems not to respond to issues at all | 22:30 |
| lsmola | :-) | 22:30 |
| david-lyle | jtomasek: if there other maintainers then? | 22:31 |
| david-lyle | s/if/are/ | 22:31 |
| jtomasek | david-lyle: I am not aware of any. https://github.com/robotis/Lesscpy lists just 2 of them afaik | 22:31 |
| jcoufal | david-lyle: honestly that's what a bit worries me, that we moved to library which seems not to have very strong support in the background | 22:32 |
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| david-lyle | that is concerning, but it looks like saschpe has has serveral pull requests merged | 22:34 |
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| david-lyle | we may have to revisit, but hopefully we can get there | 22:35 |
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| jtomasek | david-lyle: I'd really like to see saschpe's view on this, but it is quite hard to get his attention lately | 22:35 |
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| david-lyle | let's take this up at the summit and hope more interested parties are present | 22:37 |
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| lsmola | david-lyle, I have just quick one | 22:37 |
| david-lyle | the current alternative to falling back to node-less will not be popular | 22:37 |
| jtomasek | david-lyle: would be great thanks! maybe somebody willing to help wouls show up | 22:37 |
| jcoufal | david-lyle: I can mention lesscpy topic in my session | 22:37 |
| david-lyle | jcoufal: that would be great and probably the best audience | 22:38 |
| david-lyle | lsmola: sure | 22:38 |
| lsmola | david-lyle, I need to pick some library for unit-conversions https://blueprints.launchpad.net/horizon/+spec/ceilometer-api-statistics-decorators-and-convertors | 22:38 |
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| david-lyle | jtomasek: thanks for you continued efforts on updating bootstrap | 22:39 |
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| lsmola | so if anybody have any experience with unit conversion in python.. please help me pick :-) | 22:39 |
| david-lyle | lsmola: might be a good thing to ask on openstack-dev | 22:40 |
| jtomasek | david-lyle: np! | 22:40 |
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| lsmola | david-lyle, ok, will do | 22:40 |
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| jpich | FYI, OpenStack will be participating again in the Outreach Program for Women in December, there are a few applicants showing an interest in contributing to Horizon. They might pop by the horizon channel, please say hi :-) | 22:42 |
| jpich | See https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/OutreachProgramForWomen for more info, if you're curious or potentially interested in mentoring | 22:42 |
| lblanchard | yay!! | 22:43 |
| lsmola | yaaay | 22:43 |
| david-lyle | jpich: that's great | 22:43 |
| jcoufal | jpich: nice:) | 22:43 |
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| david-lyle | jpich: how long is the program? and much time do they invest? | 22:44 |
| jpich | lsmola: Thanks for your help finding project ideas with horizon+ceilometer :-) | 22:44 |
| * david-lyle promises to read link after meeting | 22:44 | |
| lsmola | jpich, you are welcome | 22:44 |
| jpich | david-lyle: It's a 3 months internship meant to be full time (~40h/week), especially meant to help people starting out contributing to open-source | 22:45 |
| jpich | part of the application involves fixing a small bug and submitting a patch so if you see easy tasks, please tag them as low-hanging-fruit :) They're hard to find | 22:45 |
| lblanchard | there could be some small UX things... | 22:46 |
| * jcoufal is also searching for some design topics for interns | 22:46 | |
| jpich | vkmc participated in the December round last year with Horizon, you may have worked with her and/or met her in Portland | 22:46 |
| lblanchard | jpich: I'm happy to help out again in the UX area as I did with vkmc | 22:46 |
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| jpich | lblanchard: That'd be awesome! Re: small UX improvements + helping out in general :) | 22:46 |
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| jpich | jcoufal: Thanks!! Non-coding tasks are also welcome | 22:47 |
| jpich | I believe there's funding confirmed for 3 interns atm (for the whole of openstack, not just horizon) | 22:47 |
| david-lyle | and they pick their area of interest once accepted? | 22:48 |
| jpich | david-lyle: There's a list of project ideas on the wiki, they should pick one and get in touch with the mentor | 22:48 |
| jpich | The mentor will help them find a suitable small task for the application + work out a rough timeline together for the main task | 22:48 |
| lsmola | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/OutreachProgramForWomen/Ideas | 22:49 |
| david-lyle | ok, so the mentor and intern are linked before acceptance into the program | 22:49 |
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| jpich | david-lyle: Yes, exactly | 22:50 |
| jpich | There's a #openstack-opw channel if you're interested in helping out people interested in OpenStack in the context of OPW, help troubleshoot first devstack woes, send urls to the appropriate wiki pages etc :) | 22:51 |
| jpich | In any case, if you have questions or project ideas or want to chat about it, feel free to get in touch :) I mentored vkmc as part of OPW earlier in the year | 22:52 |
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| * terriyu was an OpenStack intern this past summer and even though jpich wasn't her official mentor, terriyu says she rocks | 22:53 | |
| jpich | :D Thanks terriyu | 22:54 |
| lsmola | :-) agree | 22:54 |
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| david-lyle | jpich: Thanks for bringing this up. Sounds like a great program. I'll see what ideas we have. | 22:54 |
| jpich | :-) | 22:54 |
| jpich | david-lyle: Cool! There's a summer and winter round, hopefully openstack will continue participating | 22:55 |
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| david-lyle | Last call... | 22:55 |
| * lsmola prepares his another 100 topics | 22:56 | |
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| lblanchard | heh | 22:56 |
| david-lyle | lsmola: it's about time :_ | 22:56 |
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| david-lyle | :) | 22:56 |
| lsmola | hehe | 22:56 |
| lblanchard | 4 minutes might not be enough for lsmola :) | 22:57 |
| lsmola | :-) | 22:57 |
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| jpich | \o\ /o/ | 22:57 |
| david-lyle | I could talk policy :P | 22:57 |
| jcoufal | david-lyle: close it until you have a chance, when lsmola starts it never ends :) | 22:57 |
| jtomasek | i can confirm that^ :D | 22:58 |
| lsmola | true that | 22:58 |
| lblanchard | lol | 22:58 |
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| david-lyle | Alright. Havana's released with awesome updates to Horizon that we can all be very proud of. Thanks for all the hard work and we'll chat next week. | 22:58 |
| david-lyle | #endmeeting | 22:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 22:58 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue Oct 22 22:58:45 2013 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 22:58 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/horizon/2013/horizon.2013-10-22-22.03.html | 22:58 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/horizon/2013/horizon.2013-10-22-22.03.txt | 22:58 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/horizon/2013/horizon.2013-10-22-22.03.log.html | 22:58 |
| jcoufal | thanks all | 22:58 |
| jpich | Yay. Thanks everyone, have a good day/night | 22:58 |
| lcheng | thanks | 22:59 |
| lsmola | thank you all, good night | 22:59 |
| lblanchard | thanks all! Great job on the Havana release! | 22:59 |
| jtomasek | thanks all, bye! | 22:59 |
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| julim | thanks all, bye. | 23:02 |
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