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| ttx | o/ | 09:07 |
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| mnaser | hi ttx | 09:21 |
| mnaser | how'd your talk go about open infra? :) | 09:21 |
| ricolin | o/ | 09:31 |
| ttx | mnaser: I think it went relatively well. Got good conversations after it | 09:34 |
| mnaser | i ask myself often the question if people care that the infra they're running on is open/free software | 09:34 |
| mnaser | FOSDEM probably a crowd that cares | 09:34 |
| ttx | I think they do. I got a question from someone who asked "what should I do to go in the right direction if I don't have enough workload to justify running onprem" and I redirected them to openstack-powered public clouds | 09:38 |
| mnaser | yeah i've been feeling lately that private cloud might care about the software that they run, but i dont know if people in public care (enough) what software is used to deliver | 09:43 |
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| ttx | Yeah, the parallel I made in my talk is that for the same reason F/OSS developers should care about using open source in their development infrastructure (i.e. not relying on GitHub) they should care about using open source in their runtime infrastructure | 10:33 |
| ttx | at least if they truly believe that open source is a superior way of building superior software | 10:34 |
| ttx | mnaser: But the normalization of proprietary infrastructure (MacOS laptops, GitHub, AWS) is rampant, so it's really an uphill battle | 10:35 |
| mnaser | yeah, that's the hard thing to balance : | 10:50 |
| mnaser | :\ | 10:50 |
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| gmann | o/ | 13:32 |
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| njohnston | o/ | 13:56 |
| gmann | \o/ oslo dropping py2 break many gate for repo did merge the py2 drop patches. Its time to review and merge those now. | 14:03 |
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| openstackgerrit | Hervé Beraud proposed openstack/governance master: Adding microversion-parse to oslo scope https://review.opendev.org/705756 | 16:47 |
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| openstackgerrit | Thierry Carrez proposed openstack/governance master: Mark long-gone neutron-lbaas legacy https://review.opendev.org/705780 | 17:28 |
| openstackgerrit | Thierry Carrez proposed openstack/governance master: No more releases of networking-ovn https://review.opendev.org/705781 | 17:32 |
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| openstackgerrit | Thierry Carrez proposed openstack/governance master: OpenStack-Helm does not require release management https://review.opendev.org/705783 | 17:36 |
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| zaneb | anybody else have a sudden fear that dropping py27 support for client-side stuff might be a mistake? | 20:32 |
| fungi | only if our client-side stuff needs updating on platforms which use 2.7 (clients on old pre-py3 platforms needing support for newer cloud deployments?) | 20:34 |
| fungi | in my opinion it's dropping python3.5 which is the bigger risk | 20:34 |
| fungi | say a new feature gets added to nova, which needs a newer openstackclient to take advantage of, and a public cloud vendor exposes that feature... a user on ubuntu 16.04 lts who wants to use that feature needs to upgrade to a newer version of openstackclient which implements the client-side support for the feature but can't because it was added after osc switched to not supporting python3.5 | 20:38 |
| fungi | the workaround is to also install/compile a custom python3.6 interpreter | 20:39 |
| fungi | not hard, but maybe not ideal | 20:39 |
| zaneb | there is stuff (like e.g. heat-agents) that run on guest images in clouds... it's fine to say that if you want to run Ussuri OpenStack you should use a recent distro... but by removing the client-side stuff we're also saying you can't run e.g. CentOS 7 guests on it if you need that functionality (unless you use ancient code) | 21:18 |
| zaneb | I realise this is a very bad time to bring this up, but it only just fully occurred to me when I saw the heat-agents review | 21:19 |
| clarkb | centos7 has python3 though | 21:21 |
| gmann | but i am not sure we can manage py2 support there due to dependencies but that is case by case. | 21:24 |
| gmann | we should not have dropped the py3 min minor version or at least py3.5 | 21:28 |
| gmann | to keep supporting py3 distro and break only py2-only distro | 21:29 |
| fungi | zaneb: are heat agents tied to the cloud deployment os and not the guest image os? | 21:35 |
| zaneb | they're tied to the guest image | 21:35 |
| fungi | so what's the risk of using stable point releases of heat agents? | 21:36 |
| fungi | just the failure to support new features which may be provided on newer cloud deployments? | 21:36 |
| zaneb | you're stuck with old code. admittedly it doesn't change very often, so it may not be a big problem in practice | 21:36 |
| zaneb | yeah | 21:36 |
| fungi | well, "old but supported code" | 21:37 |
| fungi | we do backport bug/security fixes to those branches | 21:37 |
| fungi | we just don't backport support for new features | 21:37 |
| zaneb | correct | 21:37 |
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