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| sgordon | #startmeeting telcowg | 14:00 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Wed May 6 14:00:50 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is sgordon. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: telcowg)" | 14:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'telcowg' | 14:00 |
| sgordon | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/nfv-meeting-agenda | 14:00 |
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| DaSchab | hi | 14:01 |
| aveiga | hello | 14:01 |
| cloudon | hi | 14:01 |
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| matrohon | hi | 14:01 |
| sgordon | hi all, apologies i will be a little distracted just for the start today | 14:01 |
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| dcw | hi | 14:02 |
| sgordon | #topic use cases | 14:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "use cases (Meeting topic: telcowg)" | 14:02 | |
| mkoderer | hi | 14:02 |
| sgordon | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/169201/ | 14:02 |
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| sgordon | #info Ralf updated service chaining use case to integrate feedback. | 14:03 |
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| sgordon | more reviews welcome there | 14:03 |
| sgordon | and similarly | 14:03 |
| sgordon | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/158997/ | 14:03 |
| sgordon | #info Calum updated vIMS use case to integrate feedback. | 14:03 |
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| sgordon | has anyone had a chance to look at these updates | 14:03 |
| DaSchab | but status is Abandoned | 14:03 |
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| sgordon | DaSchab, wrong link? | 14:04 |
| DaSchab | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/169201/ | 14:04 |
| aveiga | sgordon: no, it lists abandoned | 14:04 |
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| DaSchab | sorry copy and paste error | 14:04 |
| DaSchab | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/158997/ | 14:04 |
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| aveiga | ah | 14:04 |
| cloudon | well, certainly didn't mean to abandon it... | 14:05 |
| mkoderer | we can restore the change | 14:05 |
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| cloudon | try https://review.openstack.org/#/c/179142/ | 14:06 |
| aveiga | there's the right link | 14:06 |
| mkoderer | cloudon: ah yep :) | 14:06 |
| cloudon | know I have one set of feedback to consider but more welcome | 14:07 |
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| DaSchab | sorry, I have to leave | 14:09 |
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| mkoderer | sgordon pushed a document for end2end workflow | 14:10 |
| mkoderer | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/178347/3 | 14:10 |
| mkoderer | I think we all have to have a look at this | 14:10 |
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| cloudon | it's just a skeleton at the moment, isn't it? | 14:11 |
| aveiga | so I noticed something missing from that doc and something we never really talked about here | 14:11 |
| cloudon | thought Steve wanted to flesh it out more bfore reivew? | 14:11 |
| aveiga | what if someone comes along with a similar but slightly different use case? | 14:11 |
| mkoderer | aveiga: we should merge things into one | 14:12 |
| aveiga | I was thinking it might be better to add on to the existing use cases as a "separate example" so that we can keep the efforts together | 14:12 |
| aveiga | mkoderer: +1 | 14:12 |
| mkoderer | aveiga: we can use the co/author flag for it | 14:12 |
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| aveiga | does anyone else agree/disagree with the merging method? | 14:14 |
| cloudon | think this overlaps with some feedback I've had on my use cases - that I'm describing a specific instance of an SBC or vIMS rather than general implementations of them | 14:14 |
| aveiga | cloudon: that's ok | 14:14 |
| cloudon | have to say I prefer the model where use cases are as concrete as possible - think it provides greater developer impact | 14:14 |
| aveiga | I don't think anyone would be able to cover fully an entire set of uses around a technology, so we have to start with something | 14:15 |
| cloudon | "a theoretical app might need these things" vs. "I want to run app X and it needs Y and Z" | 14:15 |
| adrian-hoban | +1 to the merging method proposed | 14:15 |
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| rprakash | #info rprakash | 14:15 |
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| sgordon | im down with merging | 14:16 |
| sgordon | #info it might be better to add on to the existing use cases as a "separate example" so that we can keep the efforts together | 14:16 |
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| sgordon | #chair aveiga | 14:18 |
| openstack | Current chairs: aveiga sgordon | 14:18 |
| sgordon | #info use co-author to designate multiple authors | 14:18 |
| sgordon | i think merging them makes sense in terms of the goals of this group | 14:18 |
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| sgordon | speaking with one voice to the wider community when proposing features to support this | 14:19 |
| rprakash | can get the process of converting an use case to from text to gerrit review process? any links? | 14:19 |
| sgordon | i think we can have a breakdown within the document though saying "hey these are specific examples" | 14:19 |
| sgordon | rprakash, https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/TelcoWorkingGroup/UseCases#Contributing_Use_Cases | 14:20 |
| rprakash | thanks | 14:20 |
| aveiga | rprakash: copy the template from that repo and make a new file with your use case | 14:20 |
| sgordon | #action sgordon to highlight in workflow document how/when to collapse use cases into each other | 14:20 |
| aveiga | we follow the same workflow as the specs for regular projects | 14:21 |
| sgordon | yeah, that page is mainly a pointer to the "normal" how to contribute docs | 14:21 |
| rprakash | ok | 14:21 |
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| sgordon | if you need any help please ask in #openstack-nfv - i dont proclaim to be a git master but hey we did at least help cloudon pick up the vIMS patch (eventually ;)) | 14:21 |
| sgordon | :) | 14:22 |
| cloudon | (cough) | 14:22 |
| sgordon | ok so the workflow document was mentioned above | 14:22 |
| sgordon | and yes it is just a skeleton | 14:22 |
| sgordon | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/178347/3/doc/source/workflow.rst | 14:22 |
| sgordon | i think it's important to note i dont want to dictate here though | 14:22 |
| sgordon | so even in skeleton form feedback is important | 14:23 |
| sgordon | the rough process atm is... | 14:23 |
| aveiga | sgordon: I don't mind checking in a patchset, as long as we don't break each others' git again | 14:23 |
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| sgordon | 1) submit use case | 14:23 |
| sgordon | 2) review use case | 14:23 |
| sgordon | 3) approve use case | 14:23 |
| sgordon | 4) raise tracker bugs (telcowg project) | 14:23 |
| sgordon | 5) assign tracker bugs | 14:23 |
| sgordon | 6) create project bug/blueprints | 14:24 |
| sgordon | 7) implement | 14:24 |
| sgordon | 8) verify solution | 14:24 |
| sgordon | EOM | 14:24 |
| mkoderer | sgordon: oh we have to activate the bug tracker then :) | 14:24 |
| sgordon | the key i think is who owns each piece | 14:24 |
| aveiga | mkoderer: yes we do | 14:24 |
| sgordon | and any additional info we want to highlight in each step | 14:24 |
| aveiga | we're going to need to be able to keep track | 14:24 |
| sgordon | yeah | 14:24 |
| mkoderer | ok | 14:24 |
| sgordon | i think it's important as we will invariably have a single gap coming from multiple use cases that in turn has multiple bits and pieces to be implemented across multiple projects | 14:25 |
| sgordon | we need to keep track of that linkage somehow | 14:25 |
| adrian-hoban | Will every telcowg tracker bug need to be related to a use case? | 14:25 |
| aveiga | and be able to refer back to individual gaps if we find the same ones in multiple cases | 14:25 |
| aveiga | file a bug, mark duplicate of another gap bug | 14:25 |
| sgordon | right | 14:26 |
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| sgordon | adrian-hoban, currently yeah | 14:26 |
| aveiga | adrian-hoban: probably, since we need to be able to trace where they came from | 14:26 |
| sgordon | adrian-hoban, but it depends what is presented as a reason to have bugs that aren't | 14:26 |
| sgordon | the only reason we are planning to use the bug tracker at all atm is to trace the linkage between project-specific work items and the original use case | 14:26 |
| sgordon | raising bugs for other reasons isn't part of the workflow atm | 14:27 |
| sgordon | open to proposals | 14:27 |
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| sgordon | adrian-hoban, was there something specific you were thinking of? | 14:27 |
| aveiga | sgordon: do we want a master bug for "Gap analysis on use case X" that gets closed when bugs are filed or the use case is found to be supported by other fixes? | 14:28 |
| sgordon | that actually makes a lot of sense | 14:28 |
| aveiga | I just don't want us to lose a use case and forget to do the analysis | 14:28 |
| sgordon | i have been thinking that step where we take a merged use case and raise the gap bugs is where there is a bit of work to do | 14:28 |
| aveiga | yup | 14:28 |
| sgordon | #action sgordon update workflow to include "master bug" for "Gap analysis on use case X" that gets closed when bugs are filed or the use case is found to be supported by other fixes. | 14:29 |
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| sgordon | adrian-hoban, sorry we were asking if you had a specific example | 14:31 |
| sgordon | w.r.t. "<adrian-hoban> Will every telcowg tracker bug need to be related to a use case?" | 14:31 |
| adrian-hoban | Sorry, I got disconnected | 14:31 |
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| sgordon | currently we've focused on creating bugs to track the linkage between use cases and gaps (assuming a M:1 relationship) | 14:32 |
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| adrian-hoban | Nope, not yet, but was thinking about the case where something may come up in OPNFV that may not have a use case yet defined here | 14:32 |
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| aveiga | adrian-hoban: that's more a matter of getting OPNFV reqs down to this group in the form of a use case doc, or updates to one | 14:33 |
| sgordon | yeah, what i had put forward to the opnfv m/l was the idea of them using the same template for defining their use cases | 14:33 |
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| sgordon | and collaborating on any required updates to it | 14:34 |
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| adrian-hoban | aveiga: I think that's an expectation that has to be clarified. | 14:34 |
| aveiga | adrian-hoban: yes, see sgordon's reply. It has to be communicated, but I think he's taking care of that | 14:34 |
| adrian-hoban | aveiga: I think that's an expectation that has to be clarified/set with the OPNFV folks so that the expectations on how to engage are clear. | 14:34 |
| aveiga | agreed | 14:35 |
| sgordon | im just searching to necro that thread again | 14:35 |
| sgordon | but this would be a good item to discuss at the OPNFV day on the monday at summit | 14:35 |
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| aveiga | sgordon: +1 | 14:35 |
| adrian-hoban | sgordon: +1 | 14:36 |
| aveiga | is there a topic list or agenda for that item, btw? | 14:36 |
| aveiga | or is it more of a walk up and ask questions ala pods kind of thing? | 14:36 |
| sgordon | not yet | 14:36 |
| sgordon | #link http://meetbot.opnfv.org/meetings/opnfv-meeting/2015/opnfv-meeting.2015-04-29-13.00.html | 14:36 |
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| adrian-hoban | aveiga: I was going to ask that too. I haven't seen one yet, but there are some proposals in the OPNFV community | 14:36 |
| sgordon | in theory: 30 minutes high level overview, 30 minutes project overview, 30 minutes set the tone for the rest of the week (the session the telco WG asked for) | 14:36 |
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| aveiga | ok | 14:36 |
| sgordon | then breakouts for OPNFV projects | 14:37 |
| sgordon | the timing of the telco wg one is being played with a bit i think | 14:37 |
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| sgordon | as i have a presentation that clashes with the opnfv day start | 14:37 |
| sgordon | (unrelated, one of my nova compute update sessions) | 14:37 |
| cloudon | is the desire still to whizz through the use cases during the TelcoWG slot? | 14:38 |
| sgordon | yeah so we have a 90 minute session effectively again | 14:38 |
| sgordon | (i think 2 x 40 with a 10 min break or something) | 14:38 |
| adrian-hoban | Is there an Etherpad for the TelcoWG slot? | 14:39 |
| aveiga | #topic Vancouver Summit | 14:39 |
| sgordon | atm just the section in https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/YVR-ops-meetup | 14:39 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Vancouver Summit (Meeting topic: telcowg)" | 14:39 | |
| sgordon | line 131 | 14:39 |
| sgordon | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/YVR-ops-meetup | 14:40 |
| sgordon | that was just my notes from an earlier discussion in this meeting | 14:40 |
| sgordon | i think 40 min on updates/process and 40 min on use cases likely makes sense | 14:40 |
| sgordon | possibly in the form of breaking off into smaller groups | 14:40 |
| adrian-hoban | What session is this a part of? | 14:41 |
| sgordon | it's a session in the ops track | 14:41 |
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| aveiga | adrian-hoban: there's a session for Telco WG specifically | 14:42 |
| sgordon | #link https://openstacksummitmay2015vancouver.sched.org/event/e813504daf6df803d90836e8949a0562 | 14:42 |
| sgordon | #info Telco WG Ops session - Wednesday, May 20 ā¢ 9:00am - 10:30am | 14:42 |
| adrian-hoban | Thanks! | 14:43 |
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| sgordon | #action sgordon create session-specific etherpad for ops summit session | 14:43 |
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| sgordon | ok | 14:45 |
| sgordon | thank you all for your time | 14:46 |
| sgordon | i think we will have one last meeting before summit, the goal of which should be to finalize the above and send out a quick email to highlight it imo | 14:46 |
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| aveiga | thanks, sgordon | 14:47 |
| sgordon | #endmeeting | 14:47 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 14:47 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed May 6 14:47:11 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:47 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/telcowg/2015/telcowg.2015-05-06-14.00.html | 14:47 |
| cloudon | thanks | 14:47 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/telcowg/2015/telcowg.2015-05-06-14.00.txt | 14:47 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/telcowg/2015/telcowg.2015-05-06-14.00.log.html | 14:47 |
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| adrian-hoban | Sounds good. Thanks | 14:47 |
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| zongliang_ | hi | 15:30 |
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| zongliang_ | ęęÆ | 15:34 |
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| rkukura | hi ML2āers! | 15:59 |
| Sukhdev | Hello | 15:59 |
| manishg | hi! | 15:59 |
| yalie | hi rkukura | 15:59 |
| yamahata | hello | 16:00 |
| rkukura | weāll start in a moment | 16:00 |
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| rkukura | #startmeeting networking_ml2 | 16:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed May 6 16:01:54 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is rkukura. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)" | 16:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'networking_ml2' | 16:01 |
| rkukura | #topic Agenda | 16:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Agenda (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)" | 16:02 | |
| rkukura | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/ML2#Meeting_May_6.2C_2015 | 16:02 |
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| rkukura | Any questions about the agenda, or would anyone like to add anything? | 16:03 |
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| rkukura | #topic Announcements | 16:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Announcements (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)" | 16:03 | |
| rkukura | kilo has been released - congrats everyone! | 16:04 |
| rkukura | any other announcements? | 16:04 |
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| Sukhdev | Many ML2 drivers were decomposed in this release - so great effort by everybody | 16:05 |
| rkukura | #topic Task Flow Discussion | 16:05 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Task Flow Discussion (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)" | 16:05 | |
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| rkukura | manishg has posted a working doc, and people are starting to provide feedback | 16:05 |
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| rkukura | #link https://docs.google.com/document/d/1aSgTVB7nW_v7lHH0Z0DUgfymEsx0O16k1Jgu7QFXkFA/edit?usp=sharing | 16:06 |
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| manishg | only see Sukhdev's comments there I think. | 16:06 |
| Sukhdev | manishg: Did you have time to review my comments? | 16:06 |
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| manishg | Sukhdev, I noticed them yesterday. looked at them and we can discuss. depending on how many people have reviewed. | 16:07 |
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| Sukhdev | manishg: I was hoping we discuss some of this today - if folks are ready | 16:07 |
| rkukura | Have others had a chance to start reviewing the doc yet? | 16:08 |
| manishg | yep, we can. | 16:08 |
| rkukura | I added a few comments this morning. | 16:08 |
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| manishg | I see your comments from yesterday and rkukura's . shivharis? | 16:08 |
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| rkukura | For those who just joined, we are discussing manishgās working doc on TaskFlow | 16:09 |
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| manishg | Sukhdev, of your comments the one I note that we may want to discuss is the one where you are commenting on queueing, right? | 16:10 |
| shivharis | yes i have read the doc | 16:10 |
| Sukhdev | manishg: I am suggesting an alternate which avoids dealing with queueing issues | 16:10 |
| rkukura | manishg: Meant to mention that I really appreciate you putting this together! | 16:11 |
| manishg | thanks rkukura. Sukhdev: I didn't get what alternative you are proposing? I don't think queuing is orthogonal to db being source of truth | 16:11 |
| Sukhdev | manishg: As I highlighted - there are basically two design models - one is queuing based (where each and every transition is dealt with) | 16:12 |
| Sukhdev | and the second which is state based - | 16:12 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura +1 | 16:12 |
| shivharis | my concern is that what happens when an object is still updating in the back end and a new operation for the same obkect is modified | 16:12 |
| shivharis | by the front en | 16:12 |
| shivharis | end | 16:12 |
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| Sukhdev | shivharis: Well, in a state driven model, it is assumed that the desired state will be programmed evantually | 16:13 |
| Sukhdev | shivharis: For example, if you network name is blue, then red, then green and then yellow - | 16:13 |
| shivharis | how many can you queue up? | 16:14 |
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| Sukhdev | shivharis: do you care to preserve all the intermediate states or you ensure that when system settles down the network name is yellow | 16:14 |
| manishg | Sukhdev: queueing is needed only if you want to "hide" the underlying async nature from the caller. | 16:14 |
| rkukura | In a queing model where each transition is guaranteed to be processed by each MD, wouldnāt we need to store each entire state in the queue until all MDās are done processing it? | 16:14 |
| shivharis | i.e. what is the queue lenght of the ops for a specific object | 16:14 |
| Sukhdev | manishg: Not really | 16:14 |
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| manishg | Sukhdev: alternatives? | 16:15 |
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| rkukura | Should we try to agree on how this looks to the client first? | 16:15 |
| Sukhdev | If you read my proposal, it says the goal of the back-end is to achieve the desired state - | 16:15 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: I think that will help | 16:15 |
| manishg | shivharis: "how many can you queue? " -- maybe we can discuss this at implementation time. not sure if this impacts the design much (i.e. if we do queueing). agree? | 16:16 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: we are kind of jumping into the implementation details here - :-) | 16:16 |
| shivharis | if you queue up, you will have to process the queue one by one | 16:16 |
| shivharis | manishg: agree | 16:16 |
| shivharis | here is the rub: | 16:16 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: Go ahead start with the client's view and then we can dive into the next level | 16:17 |
| manishg | Sukhdev: addressing your statement - where is the state maintained? in db right? (nothing else) | 16:17 |
| Sukhdev | manishg: correct | 16:17 |
| Sukhdev | manishg: basically DB size doubles - but, it cures most of issues | 16:17 |
| manishg | Sukhdev: now, if these operations are done in sequence O1, O2, O3. and backend is still working on O1 | 16:17 |
| shivharis | is the final state that is needed or all the state transitions necessary | 16:18 |
| manishg | then where is O2 O3 end state maintained? | 16:18 |
| Sukhdev | manishg: you will never have that issue - let me give an example | 16:18 |
| rkukura | I think I agree with manishgās statement that āML2 should allow operations regardless of current stateā. Do others have any concerns about this? | 16:18 |
| shivharis | rkukura: i agree with that statement | 16:19 |
| banix | rkukura: manishg +1 | 16:19 |
| manishg | Sukhdev: ok. let's take this one step at a time and understand your statement(s)/ proposal. | 16:19 |
| Sukhdev | say the front end-started with O1, the back end was getting ready to process the O1, but, in the mean time front-end has reached to O3 - the back-end processes the O3 directly and ignores everything in between | 16:19 |
| manishg | hang on. | 16:19 |
| Sukhdev | the premises here is the desired state is true source - which is assumed in ML2 | 16:19 |
| manishg | what do you mean frontend is at O3 ? | 16:19 |
| manishg | what is front end here? db ? | 16:20 |
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| Sukhdev | yes- front end is client, back-end is drivers | 16:20 |
| manishg | you are assuming we do either transition table or we just wipe out previous with latest. and backend sync with the db. is that right?\ | 16:20 |
| Sukhdev | both work with the DB | 16:20 |
| Sukhdev | front-end works/updates with desired state and back-end works/updates actual state | 16:21 |
| manishg | isn't that same as 'state transition' ? | 16:21 |
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| shivharis | manishg: there is a problem, let me explain | 16:21 |
| manishg | that is what happens in that mode. | 16:21 |
| Sukhdev | The task flow manager/ML2 Pluin only sees if both states are in same state or not - if not, action is taken | 16:21 |
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| shivharis | if O? operations are for create port | 16:22 |
| manishg | Sukhdev: can you explain what you do mean by both states in same state ? | 16:22 |
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| shivharis | and O1 and O5 are for create port (but for different networks) | 16:22 |
| shivharis | what do you do? | 16:22 |
| rkukura | Could we move away from passing previous state to the MDs in postcommit? | 16:23 |
| Sukhdev | manishg: If you look at DB record for a network or pot in DB (the way we have it today) - this is the desired state | 16:23 |
| manishg | shivharis: the dependency need to be identified correctly. what if O2 is DELETE ? | 16:23 |
| manishg | Sukhdev: today it is sync ! | 16:23 |
| shivharis | manishg: exactly, you need the intermediate transitions | 16:23 |
| manishg | so there is no question of queueing or state transition. | 16:23 |
| Sukhdev | manishg: If you created a replica of this record (with all values as NONE) and asked the driver to act on that record and update the state of the actual state | 16:24 |
| rkukura | why do we need the intermediate transitions? | 16:24 |
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| Sukhdev | you can then look at both records and say which resource is out-of-sync - | 16:24 |
| manishg | Sukhdev: your proposal seems -- "implement state table OR wipe out state based on latest operation" and "sync backend with this state", correct? | 16:25 |
| Sukhdev | manishg: yes | 16:25 |
| manishg | Sukhdev: so this is same as "state transition" proposed in document, right? All you are saying is that the transition you want | 16:25 |
| manishg | is in any state the latest is allowed. | 16:25 |
| manishg | which is fine if everyone agrees. | 16:26 |
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| Sukhdev | manishg: I am more or less in agreement with what you have written - just trying to give a model that will eliminate the need of complex queuing models and baby-sitting intermediate transaction - therefore, simplifying the design | 16:26 |
| rkukura | If we can get away with it and it simplifies the implementation, Iād think ignoring intermediate transistions would be OK | 16:27 |
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| Sukhdev | Give me sec - let me make a point here | 16:27 |
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| manishg | Sukhdev: consider this . CREATE, DELETE, UPDATE - what should happen? also consider the fact | 16:28 |
| rkukura | Has anyone considered the transition serial number approach from my comment? | 16:28 |
| manishg | that there may be multiple drivers - some faster than others. | 16:28 |
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| shivharis | i think the first imlementation will put this to bed, details matter here | 16:28 |
| manishg | rkukura: comment in doc? | 16:28 |
| rkukura | manishg: The update should be rejected in precommit once delete has been processed in precommit | 16:28 |
| Sukhdev | If you really look at the ML2/Neutron DB - we are saying this is the state of the system | 16:28 |
| rkukura | manishg: yes, in the doc I suggested that ML2 keep a counter of transitions for each resource, and use this to determine for each MD if there are outstanding transitions to process. | 16:29 |
| manishg | rkukura: so there is some state transition table (in some form). Ok, that works. | 16:29 |
| Sukhdev | If anybody is not in sync with this, needs to bring into sync - and this engine (task flow) is simply looking at the DB and triggering notifications/operations | 16:29 |
| manishg | rkukura: didn't look at comments this morning. I'll take a look. | 16:29 |
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| Sukhdev | This really requires a white board discussion with pictures :-):-) manishg wish you were going to Vancouver | 16:30 |
| manishg | Sukhdev: yes, we if implement simple transition states like DELETING -> * : not allowed. *->UPDATE : ok. etc. then we get the desired goal of | 16:30 |
| GLaupre | (hard to follow :p) | 16:30 |
| rkukura | Lets spend a couple more minutes on this topic today, then proceed with the rest of the agenda. | 16:30 |
| manishg | db being latest. | 16:30 |
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| Sukhdev | GLaupre: correct - agree with you - requires a white board with pictures to explain :-) | 16:31 |
| manishg | GLaupre: discussing based on document and previous discussions. there are a couple of key issues which need to be nailed down further. | 16:31 |
| rkukura | manishg: I think those constraints are already implemented | 16:31 |
| manishg | rkukura: yes. | 16:31 |
| manishg | but not async. | 16:31 |
| manishg | some of these problems won't be problems when operating in sync model. | 16:32 |
| rkukura | They are implemented in the precommit part. I guess we need to think about whether postcommit processing could happen in a different order. | 16:32 |
| Sukhdev | May I propose that we schedule a google hangout meeting and discuss it there? | 16:32 |
| manishg | Sukhdev: re whiteboard - whiteboarding with hangout works? | 16:32 |
| rkukura | In fact, thatās possible right now with multiple server threads. | 16:32 |
| manishg | rkukura: if we have multiple server threads and if each one doesn't lock db for long (only precommit) then are you | 16:34 |
| manishg | saying we perhaps don't need async model? | 16:34 |
| rkukura | manishg: Is there any chance you could participate remotely in a discussion of this Friday morning of the summit? | 16:34 |
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| manishg | or are we saying we use TF only for proper rollback/ recovery? | 16:35 |
| manishg | rkukura: yes sure. I'd like to. | 16:35 |
| rkukura | manishg: Iām thinking we should use TF to make the postcommit processing async, like you propose | 16:35 |
| manishg | and I'll request Josh to be there. He'll be there. | 16:35 |
| manishg | rkukura: should I put how things are today (in the doc) - and address the multiple threads in there too? | 16:36 |
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| GLaupre | TF? | 16:36 |
| manishg | TaskFlow | 16:36 |
| Sukhdev | manishg: +1 | 16:36 |
| rkukura | Seems we need to agree on how this looks to the client (i.e. is there a new CREATING/READY/UPDATING/DELETING state visible?) and work through the implementation options. | 16:36 |
| manishg | rkukura: any more changes needed in doc? layout? details? etc. ? | 16:36 |
| manishg | I'll go through the comments and address them. | 16:36 |
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| shivharis | we should prepare for this with a state diagram and a few scenarios | 16:37 |
| manishg | maybe add some example flows also, to highlight the issues we're discussing. | 16:37 |
| rkukura | manishg: I think we should continue adding ideas and feedback to the document, either inline or as comments. | 16:37 |
| manishg | shivharis: state diagrams in our case will be simple I think. | 16:37 |
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| Sukhdev | manishg: you were going to look at how midonet uses it, that information will also be helpful | 16:37 |
| rkukura | manishg: yes, Iād really like to identify failure use cases to handle | 16:37 |
| manishg | rkukura: agree. | 16:37 |
| rkukura | like servers dying at various points, multiple servers, ... | 16:38 |
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| rkukura | and restarts | 16:38 |
| manishg | rkukura: ok, will do. | 16:38 |
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| rkukura | lets not worry about format while we are brainstorming | 16:38 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: Do you want to take an action to add to the fishbowl topics to discuss this? | 16:38 |
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| manishg | Sukhdev: midonet - I started looking at it. at least for network create etc. it seems to be straight forward and doesn't have the issues with multiple drivers and such. but will look at other calls | 16:38 |
| manishg | to see if some of it give us any ideas. | 16:39 |
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| rkukura | #action rkukura to add TaskFlow discussion to Friday summit fishbowl session etherpad | 16:39 |
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| rkukura | manishg, Sukhdev: What is the relevance of midonet to the TF discussion? | 16:39 |
| manishg | Sukhde: I'll continue to explore midonet's other API calls. | 16:40 |
| Sukhdev | manishg: Is Josh going to Vancouver? | 16:40 |
| manishg | rkukura: someone had suggested midonet plugin may have some async stuff or similar cases to handle. | 16:40 |
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| Sukhdev | manishg: if he is, can you have him participate in this discussion? | 16:40 |
| rkukura | manishg: OK, thanks | 16:40 |
| manishg | Sukhdev: yes, JOsh will be at the summit. I'll request him to get in touch with you to join the discussion. | 16:40 |
| rkukura | Lets continue this discussion in the doc, and move on with the agenda | 16:41 |
| manishg | I already talked to him earlier last week and he had agreed. | 16:41 |
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| rkukura | anything else on sync/TF now? | 16:41 |
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| rkukura | #topic Liberty Design Summit Discussion | 16:42 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Liberty Design Summit Discussion (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)" | 16:42 | |
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| rkukura | So my understanding is that no ML2-specific sessions are scheduled for Monday thru Thursday, but we can have an āML2 cornerā at the Friday morning session. | 16:43 |
| Sukhdev | shivharis: had added some items on ehterpad - those need to be moved to the fishbowl topics under ML2 | 16:43 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: correct | 16:43 |
| shivharis | i am not familar with fishbowl .. somebody bring me to speed? | 16:44 |
| banix | link if handy? donāt seem to find it | 16:44 |
| rkukura | I believe this is the etherpad for this Friday session: | 16:44 |
| rkukura | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/YVR-neutron-contributor-meetup | 16:44 |
| banix | rkukura: thanks | 16:44 |
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| Sukhdev | shivharis: I think it is similar to PODs in Paris | 16:44 |
| rkukura | So Iāve got the action to add something on sync/TF | 16:44 |
| shivharis | got it | 16:44 |
| rkukura | shivharis: I think fishbowl just means its a big room (~200 people) | 16:45 |
| rkukura | What other ML2 items do we want to cover? | 16:45 |
| banix | with a few fish in it | 16:45 |
| shivharis | Sukhdev, rkukura: thx | 16:45 |
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| Sukhdev | banix: ha ha - it should actually be whalePond, if it is big enough to hold 200 people :-) | 16:46 |
| rkukura | some of the items from the original neutron topics etherpad are candidates | 16:47 |
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| shivharis | i'll sort it and put there is the fishbowl | 16:47 |
| shivharis | s/there/these/ | 16:47 |
| rkukura | We could certainly discuss the state of the DVR cleanup Iāve been doing, and generalizing distribute port support | 16:47 |
| rkukura | And there are several ideas related to extension drivers. | 16:48 |
| banix | rkukura: distribute port? | 16:48 |
| rkukura | distributed port, like DVR, but for DHCP, ā¦ | 16:48 |
| Sukhdev | I had added only one item on the original etherpad - and I got a session for this (Ironic Integration with neutron) - who else added topics to original etherpad - we need to bring those into this new fishbowl etherpad | 16:48 |
| banix | i see | 16:48 |
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| rkukura | So the same port can be bound on multiple hosts. | 16:48 |
| yamahata | enhancement to extention driver? | 16:48 |
| banix | yes yes | 16:48 |
| shivharis | rkukura: distributed dhcp? | 16:49 |
| rkukura | Sukhdev: I think ironic is covered in other sessions, right? | 16:49 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: yes | 16:49 |
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| rkukura | shivharis: maybe, or any service that wants to be replicated | 16:49 |
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| shivharis | rkukura: for HA? | 16:49 |
| rkukura | shivharis: possibly | 16:50 |
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| shivharis | rkukura: ok | 16:50 |
| rkukura | Iāll add it to the list | 16:50 |
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| rkukura | Is there any interest in making security group enforcment pluggable and/or MD-specific in ML2? | 16:50 |
| shivharis | all, please feel free to update the fishbowl | 16:50 |
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| rkukura | Right, if there is anything ML2-specific youād like to discuss at the summit add it to the fishbowl etherpad | 16:51 |
| Sukhdev | shivharis rkukura : I was hoping we nail down the topics for fishbowl - so that we can plan/prepare for it | 16:51 |
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| rkukura | Sukhdev: Can we pare down / organize the topics next week? | 16:52 |
| shivharis | Sukhdev: ideally yes. | 16:52 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: ah ha - I was going to ask if we want to meet next week - you just answered my question :-):-) | 16:52 |
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| rkukura | If you care about something and are willing to lead a discussion, please add it to the list and we can go over it next Wednesday at this meeting. | 16:52 |
| rkukura | lets move on with the agenda | 16:53 |
| rkukura | #topic Mid-Cycle Sprint | 16:53 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Mid-Cycle Sprint (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)" | 16:53 | |
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| Sukhdev | Assuming we nail down/agree on the design of Task Flow, this is best place to get it done | 16:53 |
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| rkukura | main thing is that ML2 sync/TF is on the agenda | 16:54 |
| rkukura | Sukhdev: right | 16:54 |
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| rkukura | also āreference plugin decompā | 16:54 |
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| rkukura | I think this means moving the OVS and LB agents and MDs to a different repo. Is that right? | 16:55 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: what do you have on mind regarding plugin decomp? | 16:55 |
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| rkukura | Sukhdev: Wasnāt my agenda item, just noticed it | 16:55 |
| rkukura | Five minutes left | 16:55 |
| shivharis | i believe that had to do with the inconsisteny in the way folks do decomp. | 16:55 |
| Sukhdev | rkukura: Oh I see | 16:55 |
| shivharis | some folks remove most of the driver, some have minimal stuff in it | 16:56 |
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| rkukura | shivharis: coud be, but it does say āreference pluginā and there has been talk of moving things to other repos. Lets see what happens at the summit on this. | 16:56 |
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| rkukura | #topic Bugs | 16:56 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Bugs (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)" | 16:56 | |
| shivharis | ah.. plugin | 16:56 |
| rkukura | shivharis: Any update? | 16:56 |
| rkukura | shivharis: āpluginā seems to be used generically to mean plugin or ML2 driver these days. | 16:57 |
| shivharis | not much to report on bugs things seem stable | 16:57 |
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| rkukura | shivharis: thanks | 16:57 |
| shivharis | i did have issues witht the master branch not coming up yesterday | 16:57 |
| rkukura | You should see a patch for the DVR MD issues and UTs in the next day or so. | 16:58 |
| shivharis | there was a bug fixed in kilo - needs ported to master | 16:58 |
| shivharis | but has nothing to do with ML2 | 16:58 |
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| rkukura | anything else on ML2 bugs? | 16:58 |
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| shivharis | anyone has anything to add to the bugs topic | 16:58 |
| rkukura | #topic Open Discussion | 16:58 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: networking_ml2)" | 16:58 | |
| rkukura | Weāve got just one minute | 16:59 |
| yalie | Hi rkukura, I want to do some work on 'convert the sec-group/address-pair into extension driver', would that be one of Ml2's object. | 16:59 |
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| yalie | ? | 16:59 |
| rkukura | yalie: probably - any details available? | 16:59 |
| yalie | I am writeing a bp | 16:59 |
| rkukura | I was also suggesting we make SGs more MD-specific so options other than L2 agent are possible | 17:00 |
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| yalie | https://review.openstack.org/#/c/169223/ but in draft | 17:00 |
| rkukura | OK, we can see if we want to cover this during the fishbowl | 17:00 |
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| rkukura | maybe put the link in the etherpad | 17:00 |
| yalie | thanks | 17:00 |
| GLaupre | I need directions for SR-IOV support with ML2 plugin. With whom can I chat on that topic offline someday? | 17:00 |
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| rkukura | GLaupre: Iād just ask on #openstack-neutron | 17:01 |
| rkukura | a number of people were involved | 17:01 |
| GLaupre | ouki | 17:01 |
| rkukura | we are out of time | 17:01 |
| rkukura | Thanks everyone! | 17:01 |
| rkukura | #endmeeting | 17:01 |
| GLaupre | :) | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:01 | |
| shivharis | bye | 17:01 |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed May 6 17:01:47 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:01 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_ml2/2015/networking_ml2.2015-05-06-16.01.html | 17:01 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_ml2/2015/networking_ml2.2015-05-06-16.01.txt | 17:01 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/networking_ml2/2015/networking_ml2.2015-05-06-16.01.log.html | 17:01 |
| Sukhdev | bye | 17:01 |
| Kiall | #startmeeting Designate | 17:01 |
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| openstack | Meeting started Wed May 6 17:01:54 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is Kiall. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 17:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 17:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: Designate)" | 17:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'designate' | 17:01 |
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| Kiall | Hey folks - Who's about? | 17:02 |
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| timsim | o? | 17:02 |
| mugsie | o/ | 17:02 |
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| vinod1 | o/ | 17:02 |
| jmcbride | o/ | 17:02 |
| bharath | o? | 17:02 |
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| ducttape_ | hey | 17:02 |
| Kiall | Cool :) So, the agenda looks somewhat out of date.. considerng we've already shipped Kilo! So.. I'm going to go ahead and ignore that one :) | 17:02 |
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| Kiall | #topic Design Summit Sessions | 17:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Design Summit Sessions (Meeting topic: Designate)" | 17:03 | |
| Kiall | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/designate-liberty-proposed-sessions | 17:03 |
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| rjrjr | o/ | 17:03 |
| Kiall | We have a bunch of possibles in there, with I'm sure more to come.. Has everyone had time to fill out any they wanted to discuss? | 17:03 |
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| timsim | Yep | 17:04 |
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| mugsie | i think so | 17:04 |
| Kiall | Okay, cool.. Should we have a look at those now and see which we think are useful etc? | 17:05 |
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| Kiall | ah.. lots more being filled out as we speak.. lets give it 2 or 3 mins for people to flesh out | 17:05 |
| elarson | o/ | 17:05 |
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| ducttape_ | I'll be there / interested to talk about horizon stuff with others for designate | 17:05 |
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| mugsie | ducttape_: cool. I have a few ideas I want to flesh out for it | 17:06 |
| Kiall | Okay, looks like the editing has stopped.. | 17:06 |
| bharath | yup | 17:07 |
| Kiall | So, there's 8 40 min "workrooms", 1 1 hr 40min "Fishbowl", and 1 longer "Meeup" | 17:07 |
| Kiall | Some of these are back to back, and can be combined.. or not.. up to us | 17:08 |
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| mugsie | Input/feedback/questions from non-contributors -> meetup maybe? | 17:08 |
| mugsie | but it is late on the friday | 17:08 |
| Kiall | mugsie: ++ | 17:08 |
| timsim | mugsie: +1 | 17:08 |
| Kiall | Well, We can always use a workroom session for that too.. | 17:08 |
| Kiall | friday is always a terrible summit attendance day | 17:08 |
| mugsie | yeah, especailly the late sessions | 17:08 |
| mugsie | as people tend to get flights etc | 17:08 |
| timsim | Maybe the early sessions on wednesday then? | 17:09 |
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| Kiall | Okay, Let's start at the top then, eh? | 17:09 |
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| ducttape_ | will there be a free form room where any team can grab a table too? that might help as well | 17:09 |
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| mugsie | ducttape_: there shouod be | 17:09 |
| Kiall | ducttape_: I actually think those are gone this year? | 17:09 |
| mugsie | *but* it does fill up | 17:09 |
| mugsie | Kiall: oh, i thought the lounge was still there | 17:09 |
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| ducttape_ | we will need to find a designate sign, and place it at the closest bar then | 17:10 |
| Kiall | lounge yes - but that's usually different / smaller to last time ;) | 17:10 |
| Kiall | Okay - First up - Revisit DNSSEC.. | 17:10 |
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| mugsie | ++ | 17:10 |
| mugsie | need it. | 17:10 |
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| timsim | Seems like we have more of the pieces needed for that now. | 17:10 |
| Kiall | I'd say No here, we should sync up with Barbican to get some commitment on integration.. But.. I'm not sure we have a session out of it.. We have a 90% plan together, and just need to act on it | 17:10 |
| Kiall | (At least, that's my take on it based on last time :)) | 17:11 |
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| mugsie | true | 17:12 |
| Kiall | timsim: Yea, we have lots of the pieces in place where we can go do it now, while we just didn't have it ready to go last time IMO | 17:12 |
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| Kiall | So - Others in the room? Let's give things "Priority".. "Low" for this one? | 17:12 |
| Kiall | (Then we full out based on priority) | 17:12 |
| Kiall | fill* | 17:13 |
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| timsim | ++Low | 17:13 |
| Kiall | Silence means acceptance | 17:13 |
| Kiall | Next up.. Blueprint/Spec Reviews (IXFR, transaction support, granular access, more?) | 17:13 |
| Kiall | Yep, I this this is a great one for day 1 .. Quick overview/rehash of what's been talked about etc | 17:13 |
| bharath | we should definitely discuss things we want to do in Liberty and so this would be high | 17:14 |
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| timsim | Seems like those should be broken up into their own sessions. | 17:14 |
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| bharath | yeah, more than 1 would be good | 17:14 |
| timsim | Those 40 minute sessions go by real quick. | 17:14 |
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| Kiall | timsim: True, I think some of those deserve a full session.. But I suspect we should use 1 slot to recap on things that don't get a slot? | 17:15 |
| timsim | Sounds good | 17:15 |
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| Kiall | (e.g. IXFR, We're closer on that .. I believe I saw an updated spec come in from rjrjr, but digging into that without him and the summit seems counter productive) | 17:15 |
| rjrjr | yes, it is being updated. | 17:16 |
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| Kiall | I'd say "High" here - with the specific set of things being open, and being those that don't get a slot of their own. | 17:16 |
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| elarson | I won't be at the summit, but if the hook point api is discussed, I'm happy to hop on a chat / hangout | 17:16 |
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| Kiall | elarson: I'm sure that can be arranged :) | 17:17 |
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| timsim | ++High | 17:17 |
| Kiall | Again, silence means agreement ;) But I'd prefer to see Yay or Nay's ;) | 17:17 |
| mugsie | ++ | 17:17 |
| bharath | ++high | 17:17 |
| Kiall | Thanks :) | 17:17 |
| mugsie | I think we need to dig into the hook point stuff, and in person would be better | 17:17 |
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| Kiall | Next up, Input/feedback/questions from non-contributors - I'd go with Medium here? | 17:18 |
| mugsie | med/high | 17:18 |
| mugsie | it is a good place to get people | 17:18 |
| jmcbride | high | 17:19 |
| Kiall | Yep | 17:19 |
| timsim | Yeah remember how many randos we hadn't met showed up at our things last year. High | 17:19 |
| bharath | Yay !!! | 17:19 |
| Kiall | Okay.. Sounds like it's leaning towards High.. Who's bringing the weed for everyone, that's legal in Vancouver, right? | 17:19 |
| elarson | "informally" legal | 17:19 |
| timsim | A+ | 17:19 |
| * Kiall watches the tumbleweek pass ;) | 17:19 | |
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| mugsie | Kiall: its only legal about 50 miles south ;) | 17:20 |
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| Kiall | And IRC seems dead | 17:20 |
| Kiall | Next up Hackathon | 17:20 |
| Kiall | ? - I reckon that fits into the last day Meetup session, or other gaps | 17:20 |
| Kiall | Oh great. IRC seems to have died | 17:20 |
| * ducttape_ is glad he joined this room today | 17:20 | |
| Kiall | Ah.. there we go! | 17:21 |
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| bharath | haha :) | 17:21 |
| mugsie | Kiall: use a real IRC client :p | 17:21 |
| Kiall | Psh | 17:21 |
| elarson | yeah, like in emacs | 17:21 |
| Kiall | Next up Hackathon.. | 17:21 |
| timsim | yeah i'd like to see a Friday Hackathon | 17:21 |
| Kiall | I think that's a Low, in that we can fit that in around sessions / in the last day meetup | 17:21 |
| mugsie | elarson: irssi 4 lyf | 17:21 |
| mugsie | Kiall: ++ | 17:21 |
| rjrjr | definitely low | 17:22 |
| timsim | As long as it gets in there somewhere | 17:22 |
| Kiall | "You have been disconnected." from etherpad -_- | 17:22 |
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| Kiall | and.. connected again | 17:22 |
| Kiall | seems my ISP hates me | 17:22 |
| Kiall | Next up - Database Interactions / Rework | 17:22 |
| Kiall | I added this one, so my vote is clearly for High ;) | 17:22 |
| mugsie | high | 17:22 |
| mugsie | our DB is .... in an interesting state | 17:23 |
| bharath | very high | 17:23 |
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| timsim | ++High | 17:23 |
| Kiall | organic growth is the word.. What used to be nice a simple, has turned into an annoying crutch we have to workaround | 17:23 |
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| Kiall | High it is | 17:23 |
| Kiall | Metering & Billing / Ceilomemter Integration | 17:23 |
| mugsie | med | 17:23 |
| timsim | Low/Med | 17:24 |
| mugsie | I am not sure there is a huge amount of stuff we need to do, and most of it needs to be talking to celiometer | 17:24 |
| Kiall | I'd actually say High - Not because of M&B, but because the underlying infrastructure we need to support it at scale will be new - and will underpin other future work too | 17:24 |
| mugsie | oh, true | 17:25 |
| Kiall | e.g. every 60 mins or so, we have to emit a "Yes, this domain still exists" event.. With 5mil domains, that becomes a interesting challenge to manage and ensure we only send 1 out etc, and that it can scale out horizontally | 17:25 |
| Kiall | (timsim will remember my mention of "tooz" a week or two back ;)) | 17:25 |
| timsim | Alright, sounds like fun. | 17:25 |
| Kiall | It also plays into active/active pool managers, and not double double work on the sync's etc | 17:25 |
| Kiall | (i.e. it's foundational) | 17:25 |
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| Kiall | not doing double work* etc | 17:26 |
| mugsie | if it brings in the sharding stuff, high | 17:26 |
| Kiall | So - My vote is High, others? | 17:26 |
| mugsie | but that could probably be separated out | 17:26 |
| jmcbride | high | 17:26 |
| timsim | I'm fine with high | 17:26 |
| Kiall | Settled - Next.. Horizon / OpenStack Client Integrations | 17:26 |
| mugsie | high | 17:26 |
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| rjrjr | +1 | 17:27 |
| Kiall | I'm open on this one.. It's somewhat vague.. do we have specific ideas in mind? | 17:27 |
| ducttape_ | high for me, I can probably tackle a few things others might like | 17:27 |
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| Kiall | e.g. getting into a room with a topic of "Horizon" seems a bit wide open :P | 17:27 |
| mugsie | its split out below it ;) | 17:28 |
| ducttape_ | I'd think something like additional features for cloud admin type users might be of interest? | 17:28 |
| Kiall | That said, I know we can fill the hour )Oh.. True.. I write the first bullet there but forgot | 17:28 |
| Kiall | lol | 17:28 |
| * mugsie says nothing | 17:28 | |
| mugsie | :D | 17:28 |
| Kiall | timsim / jmcbride etc? :) | 17:28 |
| Kiall | Also.. Horizon / OpenStack Client Integrations | 17:28 |
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| Kiall | that seems like 2 things to me | 17:28 |
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| bharath | ++ | 17:28 |
| timsim | Yeah those do seem separate | 17:28 |
| timsim | Horizon isn't a priority for us, so much. | 17:29 |
| mugsie | the concepts should be similar, but they can be split np | 17:29 |
| ducttape_ | client integrations first, then those can support GUI | 17:29 |
| Kiall | timsim: I figured that would be your answer :D | 17:29 |
| rjrjr | it is a priority for us however. | 17:29 |
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| Kiall | I'd say it's a Medium, but majority is leaning towards High | 17:29 |
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| timsim | +1 seems more than worth of a short session or two | 17:30 |
| Kiall | Heat Resources for Designate? .. I threw it down, and consider it a Low.. Esp as someone from Heat seems to be working on it. | 17:30 |
| timsim | Agreed, Low | 17:30 |
| rjrjr | +1 | 17:30 |
| rjrjr | +1 | 17:31 |
| Kiall | Next - OpenStack Client Integrations .. | 17:31 |
| Kiall | I kinda think it's a Low? We have tonnes of things we know can do better.. names rather than UUIDs etc, getting to that point, then revisiting for extra makes sense | 17:31 |
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| mugsie | ok, low | 17:32 |
| Kiall | Others? | 17:32 |
| timsim | Low | 17:32 |
| Kiall | Moving on quickly! | 17:32 |
| Kiall | Nova/Neutron Integration | 17:32 |
| mugsie | high, super high | 17:32 |
| timsim | Everybody gonna want that | 17:32 |
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| Kiall | High from me, and I'd like to grab the Nova/Neutron folks into the session too ;) | 17:33 |
| mugsie | ++++ | 17:33 |
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| Kiall | Seems an obious High then ;) | 17:33 |
| Kiall | Non MiniDNS Backends as 1st class citizens | 17:33 |
| bharath | ++high | 17:33 |
| mugsie | high | 17:33 |
| Kiall | Yea, we need to fix that story once and for all | 17:33 |
| Kiall | High | 17:33 |
| bharath | oops, ++high for nova/neutron | 17:33 |
| timsim | High | 17:33 |
| Kiall | (We're running out of slots to even handle all the "High" .. lol) | 17:34 |
| Kiall | bharath: oh, too late ;) I recorded your vote :P | 17:34 |
| bharath | :) | 17:34 |
| Kiall | Designate Sink - Multiple handlers with different topics | 17:34 |
| Kiall | I can guess who says High here :P | 17:35 |
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| rjrjr | high | 17:35 |
| bharath | I had put this up based on our experience here but we can discuss this offline too | 17:35 |
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| rjrjr | not a session worthy subject though. | 17:35 |
| Kiall | Yep, I'd call it a Medium.. Not because it's something we shouldn't do, but because it's something we can do outside a session | 17:35 |
| Kiall | rjrjr++ | 17:36 |
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| bharath | yeah | 17:36 |
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| bharath | med then | 17:36 |
| Kiall | Okay.. Seems stuff is still coming in :D | 17:36 |
| Kiall | root domain redirect.. | 17:36 |
| Kiall | I see this as being aligned with geo/weighted round robin/etc | 17:37 |
| mugsie | ALIAS type | 17:37 |
| Kiall | mugsie: yea | 17:37 |
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| mugsie | I think it is distinct from them, but may share some simlar implementations | 17:37 |
| Kiall | I'm not sure alias/geo/wrr/etc is something we have time this cycle to tacle.. | 17:38 |
| mugsie | many sites need it, but not as part of dns load balencing | 17:38 |
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| Kiall | Yea, Implementation wise, I think they all end up very very similar.. "Do stuff with DNS your DNS server doesn't do out of the box" kinda sums the group up | 17:38 |
| mugsie | yeah | 17:39 |
| Kiall | Discussing ALIAS without Geo/WRR etc would miss a large chunk of 99% identical requirements etc | 17:39 |
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| Kiall | So - I think I'd say Low for this summit, High for next kinda thing | 17:39 |
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| Kiall | Others? | 17:39 |
| jmcbride | high | 17:40 |
| Kiall | dooh.. stalemate ;) | 17:40 |
| jmcbride | actually, medium | 17:40 |
| mugsie | med | 17:40 |
| Kiall | Okay, sounds like leaning towads mediym | 17:40 |
| Kiall | medium* | 17:40 |
| Kiall | ptr records in multi? I'm not quite sure what this one is | 17:41 |
| Kiall | Who's purple? ;) | 17:41 |
| jmcbride | my bad | 17:41 |
| timsim | jmcbride is finishing that off, one sec | 17:41 |
| jmcbride | should be: in multi-tenant untrusted environments (e.g. public cloud) | 17:41 |
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| Kiall | jmcbride: specifically for Public IPs, or private overlapping Neutron IP space? | 17:42 |
| mugsie | that exists does it not? | 17:42 |
| timsim | Public IPs. | 17:42 |
| jmcbride | I'm thinking public ips first. | 17:42 |
| Kiall | Right.. that should in theory work todetay, but I don't think anyone has taken it to production y | 17:42 |
| Kiall | et | 17:42 |
| mugsie | the v2 API has a reverse endpoint | 17:42 |
| * ducttape_ just found out there will be open tables at the conference to borrow | 17:42 | |
| jmcbride | use case: I don't want anyone to claim a ptr record for an ip they don't potentially use | 17:43 |
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| timsim | mugsie: really? | 17:43 |
| Kiall | Oh .. I see what's happening here.. RAX's deploy model is different to "normal" :) | 17:43 |
| timsim | :P | 17:44 |
| Kiall | RAX does the older nova-network model - every instances gets a "fixed" public IP, while others use FLoatingIPs you have to ask for etc | 17:44 |
| Kiall | I'm not sure if the current stuff works for that model or not.. it certainly does for Floating IPs | 17:44 |
| Kiall | (BTW - I prefer the RAX model when you have unlimited IPs ;)) | 17:45 |
| Kiall | Let's park this one, and revisit once timsim or someone can poke at the existing stuff? ;) | 17:45 |
| timsim | Agreed | 17:45 |
| jmcbride | Can you point us to the v2 endpoint? | 17:45 |
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| Kiall | https://github.com/openstack/designate/blob/master/designate/api/v2/controllers/floatingips.py | 17:45 |
| Kiall | (I had it open ;)) | 17:46 |
| timsim | Ok, that's what I thought | 17:46 |
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| Kiall | There actually is a missing piece now that I think about it, it's not a required piece, as cleanup will happen eventually, but a sink handler listing to Neutron to activy clear out stale PTRs | 17:46 |
| jmcbride | ok, I'm good with tabling this for now. | 17:46 |
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| Kiall | actively* | 17:47 |
| Kiall | wow - I can't type at all today. | 17:47 |
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| Kiall | 7 high, 2 medium, 4 low, 1 parked | 17:47 |
| Kiall | I'll take a stab at scheduling those after this meet, keep an eye on that etherpad. | 17:48 |
| bharath | ok | 17:48 |
| mugsie | kk | 17:49 |
| Kiall | (I'll need to try find slots without talk conflicts, other teams we want to kidnap etc etc) | 17:49 |
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| Kiall | #topic Open Discussion | 17:49 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: Designate)" | 17:49 | |
| Kiall | 10 mins left. | 17:49 |
| Kiall | Anyone have any other items? | 17:49 |
| mugsie | i am good | 17:50 |
| timsim | mugsie already commented on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/180203/ but I'd love any other feedback. | 17:50 |
| vinod1 | fyi - I will not be able to make it to the summit this time because of some other scheduling conflicts . | 17:50 |
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| Kiall | vinod1: :( | 17:51 |
| jmcbride | I'm working on vinod1's replacementā¦ but it just might be me! | 17:51 |
| Kiall | Oh, we'll want a leader for each session.. Someone with a vested interest in each topic ;) | 17:51 |
| * elarson would like to make it but has a new baby to make silly faces at | 17:52 | |
| Kiall | BP's to present at the work sessions IMO are Optional.. | 17:52 |
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| Kiall | elarson: Ah, just bring the new baby :) | 17:53 |
| mugsie | elarson: thats a terrible exucse :) | 17:53 |
| mugsie | kids can learn python at like 2 weeks old, right? | 17:53 |
| Kiall | Probably better than any of us by age 4 ;) | 17:53 |
| Kiall | <-- Soon to be unemployed | 17:53 |
| * elarson is focusing on elisp first ;) | 17:54 | |
| timsim | Child abuse | 17:54 |
| Kiall | Yea, that (elisp) really is.. | 17:54 |
| Kiall | Okay, If nobody else has anything else, we can wrap up.. | 17:54 |
| Kiall | Thanks all :) | 17:54 |
| timsim | o/ | 17:54 |
| mugsie | o/ | 17:54 |
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| elarson | o/ | 17:54 |
| Kiall | keep an eye on the etherpad | 17:54 |
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| Kiall | will fill out over the next hour or 2 | 17:54 |
| Kiall | #endmeeting | 17:54 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 17:54 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed May 6 17:54:48 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:54 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/designate/2015/designate.2015-05-06-17.01.html | 17:54 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/designate/2015/designate.2015-05-06-17.01.txt | 17:54 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/designate/2015/designate.2015-05-06-17.01.log.html | 17:54 |
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| SlickNik | #startmeeting trove | 18:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed May 6 18:01:22 2015 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is SlickNik. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 18:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 18:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: trove)" | 18:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'trove' | 18:01 |
| peterstac | o/ | 18:01 |
| vgnbkr | o/ | 18:01 |
| sushilkm | Hello all mates | 18:01 |
| pmalik | #/ | 18:01 |
| georgelorch | o/ | 18:01 |
| schang | 0/ | 18:01 |
| SlickNik | Giving folks a couple of minutes to trickle in | 18:01 |
| atomic77_ | \\o | 18:01 |
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| SlickNik | Meeting agenda at: | 18:02 |
| SlickNik | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TroveMeeting | 18:02 |
| vkmc_ | o/ | 18:02 |
| SlickNik | #topic Trove pulse update | 18:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Trove pulse update (Meeting topic: trove)" | 18:02 | |
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| SlickNik | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/trove-pulse-update | 18:03 |
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| dougshelley66 | o/ | 18:03 |
| SlickNik | From the latest numbers, it looks like the number of reviews + patches proposed have gone down this last week (almost by half) | 18:04 |
| SlickNik | Probably because people are gearing up for the summit? | 18:04 |
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| SlickNik | I know that's at least partially true in my case. :) | 18:05 |
| dougshelley66 | hangover from Kilo? | 18:06 |
| SlickNik | Also, I know that folks are working on getting specs lined up to propose for Liberty | 18:06 |
| SlickNik | dougshelley66: lol | 18:06 |
| SlickNik | So I'm looking forward to see a barrage of new specs over then next couple of weeks. :P | 18:07 |
| vkmc_ | the summit is in less than ten days :) | 18:07 |
| vkmc_ | certainly getting ready for it | 18:08 |
| sushilkm | is there any cut-off date for specs for Liberty-1 | 18:08 |
| dougshelley66 | vkmc_ which summit? | 18:08 |
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| dougshelley66 | it is in 12 days | 18:08 |
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| peterstac | #link https://www.openstack.org/summit/vancouver-2015/ | 18:09 |
| peterstac | ^^^ top left corner ;) | 18:09 |
| SlickNik | sushilkm: No ā the feature proposal freeze only happens during Liberty-3 for _all_ of Liberty. | 18:09 |
| vkmc_ | dougshelley66: ah well, I'm having a problem with the calendar | 18:09 |
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| SlickNik | Unless there are any further questions, let's move on. | 18:10 |
| SlickNik | sushilkm: Also the dates for FPF get set during the summit, so not sure of the exact date for FPF yet. | 18:10 |
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| SlickNik | #topic Updates taskamanager to use datastore specific timeouts | 18:11 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Updates taskamanager to use datastore specific timeouts (Meeting topic: trove)" | 18:11 | |
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| schang | The details is pretty much in the agenda | 18:12 |
| SlickNik | From the agenda: | 18:12 |
| SlickNik | We need to discuss this patchset, vote for an implementation option, and move forward: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/164640/9 | 18:12 |
| schang | so I'll just let you guys to read through it and we'll discuss | 18:12 |
| SlickNik | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/164640/9 | 18:12 |
| schang | I want to expedite it | 18:12 |
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| SlickNik | During our last discussion, I believe we had a slight preference for option #1 | 18:13 |
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| SlickNik | Option 1: Define a default usage_timeout setting at the global level, the setting is optional at the datastore level, used only for the purpose of overriding the global default value. | 18:13 |
| SlickNik | Option 2: Define a mandatory usage_timeout option for each datastore. | 18:13 |
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| vkmc_ | option one sounds good | 18:13 |
| vkmc_ | we avoid defining extra options if there is no need | 18:14 |
| schang | I also prefer option 1 | 18:14 |
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| peterstac | SlickNik: Yeah, however the action that Amrith entered didn't reflect that ... | 18:14 |
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| peterstac | Plus neither did the implementation ;) | 18:14 |
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| SlickNik | peterstac: Yes, I see that at least a couple of -1's on that patch are for that reason. | 18:16 |
| SlickNik | sushilkm: So we have a way forward with this, yes? | 18:16 |
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| sushilkm | so, last time when we discussed it was to include both at datastore level and default level which was implemented | 18:17 |
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| dougshelley66 | so is there more discussion or should we just have an official vote | 18:18 |
| SlickNik | sushilkm: I believe the idea was to only have a datastore level timeout if the default level timeout needed to be overridden. | 18:18 |
| peterstac | sushilkm: You implemented a default, and then datastore-specific entries that had the same value ... | 18:18 |
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| pmalik | let's vote | 18:19 |
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| SlickNik | pmalik / dougshelley66: I'm not hearing anyone who is a proponent of Option 2. | 18:19 |
| sushilkm | yeah i kept the values same because i did not know the differing values for other datastores | 18:20 |
| edmondk | Yeah option 1 is preferred | 18:20 |
| dougshelley66 | SlickNik ok sounds like a plan | 18:20 |
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| edmondk | has the best of both worlds | 18:20 |
| sushilkm | and for mysql i have witnessed that it takes more than 400secs on gates | 18:20 |
| peterstac | pmalik and I voted for opt 2 in the patchset, but I'm ok to switch | 18:20 |
| edmondk | still can override or provide a default | 18:20 |
| pmalik | am ok with option 1 as well | 18:20 |
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| sushilkm | option 1 is my vote | 18:20 |
| dougshelley66 | seems like a decision has been made...onward | 18:20 |
| vkmc_ | option 1 +1 | 18:21 |
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| SlickNik | sushilkm: If so, let's open a separate bug to fix that concern and up the timeout value in that case. | 18:21 |
| SlickNik | but for this bugfix, let's just implement the datastore specific timeout, and fallback. | 18:22 |
| SlickNik | That would give us better tracking of the fixes as well ā better separation of concern. | 18:22 |
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| sushilkm | okies, but that fix also needs to go in same patch because if we go with datastore specific timeouts and mysql has already a value of 400 which is less than what it takes on gate :) | 18:23 |
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| SlickNik | Also FWIW, I'm not entirely convinced that we should change the default for the gate. If we need to change the gate value, we can probably update the config file that the gate uses in devstack. | 18:23 |
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| peterstac | SlickNik +1 | 18:24 |
| vkmc_ | SlickNik +1 | 18:24 |
| sushilkm | okies | 18:25 |
| schang | ok, option 1 it is. thanks :) | 18:25 |
| peterstac | #action sushilkm to implement default usage_timeout, with overriding values on datastores (where the value is different) | 18:25 |
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| peterstac | hope that sums it up | 18:25 |
| sushilkm | was not aware if we have a different config for gate :) | 18:25 |
| sushilkm | yup, got my action item :) | 18:26 |
| SlickNik | thanks peterstac ā looks good to me | 18:26 |
| SlickNik | #topic Open Discussion | 18:26 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: trove)" | 18:26 | |
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| vkmc_ | I wanted to ask about the design sessions for the summit | 18:27 |
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| vkmc_ | can we add proposals to the Etherpad, and then vote? | 18:27 |
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| vkmc_ | or how do you guys are used to manage this? | 18:27 |
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| SlickNik | vkmc_: so far we have 3 proposals on the Etherpad. | 18:28 |
| * SlickNik goes to find a link to the etherpad | 18:28 | |
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| SlickNik | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/trove-liberty-proposed-sessions | 18:29 |
| vkmc_ | cool! | 18:29 |
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| * SlickNik pulled that from the meeting agenda history. | 18:30 | |
| SlickNik | I just found out the new procedure for updating the sched site with the info | 18:30 |
| SlickNik | So I was planning to do that and propose these sessions as fishbowls. | 18:31 |
| vkmc_ | I wanted to propose something too but it needs some polishing... hence my question | 18:31 |
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| SlickNik | vkmc_: Please add it to the etherpad ā you can always polish as we go along (plenty of time till the summit). | 18:32 |
| vkmc_ | k :) | 18:32 |
| vkmc_ | thanks SlickNik | 18:32 |
| johnma | and SlickNik, do we know when these sessions are going to happen - THursday? | 18:32 |
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| SlickNik | johnma: great question ā that info was published on the sched site recently as well. | 18:33 |
| SlickNik | one sec, let me grab a link. | 18:33 |
| johnma | thanks SlickNik | 18:33 |
| SlickNik | #link https://libertydesignsummit.sched.org/overview/type/design+summit/trove | 18:34 |
| johnma | great, thanks | 18:34 |
| SlickNik | So the three fishbowl sessions are on Wednesday, the work sessions are on Thursday, and the contributors' meetup is on Friday. | 18:34 |
| SlickNik | (Wednesday afternoon p.m.) | 18:35 |
| SlickNik | Please feel free to add more proposals to the etherpad page at: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/trove-liberty-proposed-sessions | 18:36 |
| SlickNik | I'll be looking at this when coming up with the agenda for the work sessions. | 18:36 |
| johnma | so what kind of topics will be discussed during the work sessions? | 18:37 |
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| johnma | or do we just make proposals on the etherpad and then we decide what a good candidate for a fishbowl session vs the work sessions | 18:38 |
| SlickNik | Examples of some sessions I'm thinking about: Clustering, OpenStack testing, integration with other projects, overflow from the fishbowls, | 18:39 |
| SlickNik | Ideally folks can propose what topics are interesting to them to bring in front of the community. | 18:40 |
| SlickNik | And I'm happy to fill in places in the agenda with what I think is important / makes sense for Trove. | 18:41 |
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| SlickNik | johnma: Yes we have leeway on what we think would be more effective as a fishbowl session vs. a work session. | 18:42 |
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| johnma | sounds good. Thanks SlickNik | 18:42 |
| SlickNik | Okay, I'll get a tentative schedule done on the sched site for sessions, and let folks know. We can revisit and make any changes if needed at next week's meeting. | 18:43 |
| SlickNik | Any other questions / comments for open discussion? | 18:44 |
| SlickNik | . | 18:44 |
| SlickNik | #endmeeting | 18:44 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 18:44 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed May 6 18:44:47 2015 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 18:44 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/trove/2015/trove.2015-05-06-18.01.html | 18:44 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/trove/2015/trove.2015-05-06-18.01.txt | 18:44 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/trove/2015/trove.2015-05-06-18.01.log.html | 18:44 |
| SlickNik | Thanks all! | 18:44 |
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| vkmc_ | thanks o/ | 18:46 |
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| banix | alee_afk: alex: Alex do yo plan o attend the OpenStack Summit? | 21:33 |
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