18:02:06 #startmeeting trove 18:02:07 Meeting started Wed Mar 23 18:02:06 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is cp16net. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 18:02:08 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. 18:02:11 The meeting name has been set to 'trove' 18:02:17 o/ 18:02:19 hello cp16net 18:02:19 hi 18:02:22 hello flaper87 18:02:27 howdy 18:02:29 o/ 18:02:30 amrith: hey there :D 18:02:31 hi hi 18:02:35 i almost missed it 18:02:38 i got distracted 18:02:45 o/ 18:03:07 doing a rebase 18:03:21 anyways hope everyone is have a good day 18:03:22 * twm2016 is listening 18:03:27 lets get this party started 18:03:39 #topic last week action items 18:03:49 #info [amrith] get more information about creating and distributing a trove wide dashboard 18:03:59 so I sent an email to the ML 18:04:03 and I have a bunch of responses. 18:04:13 there are a couple of projects ongoing in this area. 18:04:24 this does not relate to the item you put on later; 292451 18:04:29 k 18:04:34 these are in effect semi-personal dashboards 18:04:40 I'm looking for a formal dashboard for the project 18:04:55 and one that will help track us to a/the release milestone(s) 18:05:06 I have some information 18:05:12 I will mail to the ML [trove] 18:05:13 alright sounds like there is progress being made on that action tiem 18:05:20 or you can follow the earlier discussions 18:05:27 should we follow up next week on more info? 18:05:45 see thread http://openstack.markmail.org/thread/qh7u3sxmtpwkdzas 18:05:55 I tend to disagree on gerrit dashboards being smi-personal as there are ways to make them very useful for a project but I do agree they are not the prettiest ones and they lack of some useful functionality (like labels/hashtags) 18:05:59 at this point, I'd say no. 18:05:59 I'll bring it back when there is more information 18:06:08 * flaper87 is all for something that represents the needs of the project better 18:06:38 amrith: ok 18:06:49 amrith: good stuff, btw! I had no idea that Swift had that dashboard and it does sound like something we could use elsewhere 18:06:52 flaper87: yeah its usful when everyone can have a simliar view 18:07:04 so everyone knows what others are looking at 18:07:24 ok so next item 18:07:29 #info [amrith] contact Victor Stinner re: python3 session at summit [DONE] 18:07:33 I started using it heavily in Glance in Mitaka and it helped. I can't tell everyone was using it but a good number of people were 18:07:40 looks like that was addressed 18:07:41 * flaper87 stfu 18:07:44 cp16net, with the dashboard as proposed, it is useful for individuals to see what they have to do ... aka, semi-personal. Not something that is useful to administer deliverables for a project, which is what I'm after. 18:07:51 o/ 18:07:56 o/ 18:08:10 the other action items were done 18:08:20 including pmackinn (who's missing today) 18:08:22 #info [amrith] Add new projects discussion topic for summit agenda. [DONE] 18:08:30 #info [pmackinn] I've tagged you on some topics based on mid-cycle, please confirm [DONE, during the meeting] 18:08:38 #info [amrith] get leaders for all sessions that we want to actually conduct ;) [ONGOING] 18:09:09 On the py3 thing 18:09:12 I have an update 18:09:16 Victor won't be at summit 18:09:22 he'll chat with us before summit 18:09:33 I've removed -1s and -2s on all py3 reviews 18:09:52 sounds good we should move forward on those now 18:10:02 In email, "I propose to discuss Python 3 before the summit. For example, prepare a concrete plan to port Trove to Python 3, list technical issues like MySQL-Python, etc." 18:10:06 I will keep team posted. 18:10:17 word 18:10:35 alright thanks for the updates amrith on the action items 18:11:08 #topic Trove pulse update 18:11:14 I have an update 18:11:17 #link http://bit.ly/1VQyg00 18:11:36 i passed on some info to amrith to be able to update this 18:11:46 yup, thanks cp16net 18:12:10 if others are curious on this i made a small blog article so that you can see how its generated as well. 18:12:13 #link http://yunatech.com/openstack-trove-review-stats.html 18:12:15 it took a couple of seconds but ... for the benefit of the rest of the folks here, I'd point you to the wonderful blog post on the subject at http://yunatech.com/openstack-trove-review-stats.html 18:12:23 ah, you beat me to it ;) 18:12:26 :-P 18:12:33 o/ 18:13:12 i have a few other posts related to trove in there 18:13:22 mostly debugging stuff 18:13:25 An update ... I'm going to run through and scrub open reviews and get rid of oldy moldy ones 18:13:39 yeah i've started that as well 18:13:41 the open patches number (third graph) is going up 18:13:43 thanks cp16net 18:13:46 I saw that 18:14:10 If you have a patch set that you intend to resume work on, please put an update in it to that effect so we don't go abandon it under you ... 18:14:11 if any of the abandoned patches looks like something you would like to pick up feel free 18:14:24 #action [all] If you have a patch set that you intend to resume work on, please put an update in it to that effect so we don't go abandon it under you ... 18:14:37 #action [all] if any of the abandoned patches looks like something you would like to pick up feel free 18:14:50 making sure you add that action? 18:14:51 :-P 18:15:34 ok anything else on the pulse update? 18:15:52 #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/is:watched+is:abandoned+%28project:openstack/trove%20OR%20project:openstack/trove-integration%20OR%20project:openstack/trove-dashboard%20OR%20project:openstack/python-troveclient%29 18:16:12 #link http://bit.ly/22whQNM 18:16:19 that's list of recently abandoned patches 18:16:35 yeah nice 18:17:05 i'm sure some of the patches are good ideas but due to no activity we have purged them 18:17:19 anyone can feel free to pick up something 18:17:24 from that list 18:17:28 ++ 18:17:45 FWIW, we abandoned many patches in Glance during Mitaka. It turned out to be something good 18:17:46 it is spring, and in spring we do spring cleaning 18:17:50 no one got offended and some were picked up 18:18:03 :-D 18:18:14 i feel refreshed 18:18:27 minus the ~4 hours of sleep i get a night... 18:18:37 ok moving on... 18:18:42 yeah, a long (stalled) review list has a way worse effect than some patches being abandoned 18:18:52 #topic Announcements 18:19:03 I have announcement re: mitaka 18:19:04 #link http://releases.openstack.org/mitaka/schedule.html 18:19:19 go ahead amrith 18:19:27 we will do an RC2 for trove-dashboard for strings 18:19:30 only one change 18:19:36 then we'll be done with Mitaka 18:19:41 on to Newton! 18:19:56 I think StringFreeze was last week. Is this a string exception? 18:20:02 and it is good that (next item on agenda) https://review.openstack.org/#/q/starredby:amrith+status:open is the empty list. 18:20:11 string freeze was a long time ago 18:20:17 a bug fix required a new sting 18:20:18 translations 18:20:19 string 18:20:24 and therefore translations were required 18:20:31 and Andreas requested RC2 18:20:31 soft string freeze was a long time ago 18:20:35 hard freeze was last week 18:20:42 gotcha 18:21:20 I propose that we don't attempt to backport the test that we disabled in stable/mitaka (the reenable change went into master) 18:21:36 yeah i dont think that necessary 18:21:38 if anyone wants to know more, we can discuss on #openstack-trove later as it is likely a long conversation. 18:22:08 #info mitaka is now stable/mitaka branch 18:22:17 #info master is now netwon 18:22:35 please triage your bugs accordingly 18:22:40 cp16net they already changed the name? 18:22:45 i thought it was newton :) 18:22:52 one last thing on the RC2 for translations 18:22:57 (sp) 18:23:09 * cp16net has fat fingers apparently 18:23:32 Stable branch rules now in effect for stable/mitaka branches on trove, trove-dashboard, and python-troveclient 18:23:34 give the man a break, he's been sleeping 2+ hours a night and looked wide awake last week ... 18:23:36 :) 18:23:37 netwon is a cooler na e 18:23:41 Akihiro sent out a message on the horizon ML asking if the trove team is ok with the RC2 sched. Can the PTL reply to that? 18:23:53 amrith: i'm surprised i played it off so well :_p 18:24:13 oh i saw that i will do that 18:24:36 #action cp16net reply to trove-dashboard ML question for RC2 18:24:48 Other announcements? 18:25:22 alright moving on 18:25:25 #topic Health check on outstanding blueprints and features for Mitaka 18:25:31 #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/starredby:amrith+status:open 18:25:44 no patches :) 18:26:00 either amrith got lazy starring patches or we completed them :) 18:26:10 no, the empty set here is a good thing 18:26:11 :) 18:26:17 heh great 18:26:29 so we managed to clear out the backlog we had for mitaka 18:27:00 btw great work everyone all around for making mitaka a success 18:27:08 we've completed a ton of work! 18:27:27 its all thanks to you. 18:27:59 #topic Do we really need these two fixes in stable/liberty 18:28:06 Do we want these changes backported to stable/liberty? 18:28:06 https://review.openstack.org/#/c/262289/ 18:28:06 https://review.openstack.org/#/c/262287/ 18:28:06 #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/262289/ 18:28:07 In the interst of time, if anyone feels strongly about this, please update the reviews. If I get no answers in 1 day I'll abandon them ... 18:28:08 I believe that these have been discussed at fair length and at this point, I'm not sure there are new points of view that are likely to emerge, but I promised to have the team look at them one more time. 18:28:11 At this point, the changes are on track for abandonment. 18:28:20 copy paster... :-P 18:28:36 #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/262287/ 18:28:38 * amrith mumbles "they call that being prepared" 18:28:52 do we really want to spend effort to get those tests running in liberty? 18:28:53 amrith, cp16net: as I wrote on the list, I think that the patch should be merged 18:29:08 * pmackinn has to drop 18:29:11 my point is: the code for the tests currently in liberty is not working at all 18:29:25 #action [all] please review changes [3], [4], and link [5] in agenda and update the reviews 18:29:35 I'd like to discuss here. 18:29:42 tosky, please go ahead. 18:30:20 so what is the best solution: two backports, which are not impacting the stable jobs, but allows to at least work with the tests, or have a set of totally non working code? Shouldn't it be removed then? 18:31:07 the usefulness of the patches would have been stronger when they were proposed, and some time has passed 18:31:35 From a stable point of view, I think merging those would be easier and perhaps safer rather than removing code (or leaving some not-working code in the branch) 18:31:41 that's why I think it would be "nice" to close the story by merging them 18:31:52 that's all what I had to say 18:32:04 from a release stand point i think its test code that is changing 18:32:29 so my question would be how many people run this test code on a release 18:32:50 when our tests are not running it yet reliably 18:33:02 I don't think there's an easy/quick way to answer that question right now 18:33:19 those tests are a work in progress and cutting them out doesnt make sense 18:33:35 I don't know how many other people; selfishly, I did and it is something that would be useful for me 18:33:41 cp16net, but it is stable/liberty we're talking about. not master. 18:33:46 AFAIU, it's not going to harm the liberty release to merge those patches... but I could be wrong here as I'm not 100% familiar with the code base 18:33:56 amrith: yeah thats what i undestand 18:34:08 flaper87: it wont 18:34:30 these merges won't destablilize stable/liberty any more 18:34:35 but the question is how necessary is it to backport those changes 18:34:39 but, as was pointed out in earlier discussions, the issue is this. 18:34:46 this is the start of the slippery slope 18:34:51 and if we merge these TESTS 18:35:00 they we'll want some more TESTS 18:35:07 all of which won't destablize stable/liberty 18:35:16 and the stable team, I think, is asking the right policy question 18:35:27 of ... these tests don't pass now 18:35:31 so what do you intend to do? 18:35:36 get them to pass in stable/liberty? 18:35:36 the point is that after mitaka final is out, liberty will become a CVE only branch and no tests should be backported unless they fix security (or critical) issues 18:35:39 and if so, how? 18:35:50 and when we release code it should be to fix a bug in the core code not really for tests 18:35:54 I'd use the stable policy to prevent further backports at that point 18:36:00 amrith: who is "they" that will want more tests? 18:36:21 we, the same people who are making the argument to merge these tests. 18:36:25 I'm not going to request other backports at this point; I would have done it if the reviews have been merged two months ago 18:36:38 that last statment was ment around stable releases 18:37:18 so flaper87 you (representing stable) can WF+1 these. I'm not asking you to, I'm asking whether you feel comfortable making the argument for their merging? 18:37:34 #agree 18:37:34 do you have what you would need 18:37:56 tony breeds sends his apologies for not being able to attend this meeting 18:38:00 I think it is a tz issue, he'll read the transcript later. 18:38:07 I do, tbh. I didn't feel like it before this convo because I wanted to hear the teams view 18:38:34 flaper87: great i hope this was enlightening 18:38:35 I'm happy to +1 those backports if there are no *strong* arguments against doing so 18:38:38 good, flaper87 I'll look to you then as the stable/maint person to help us get to a resolution. 18:38:47 amrith: ++ 18:38:55 i have not strong argement for or against personally 18:39:01 I'd also be happy to be Trove's stable liaison if that helps 18:39:05 To the best of my knowledge, there are *NO* arguments against the backport, other than the procedural issue of the fact that these are tests. 18:39:09 (in the future, I mean) :D 18:39:24 Well, you are Stable's Trove liaison 18:39:25 :) 18:39:33 done :) 18:39:38 Trove has a stable liaison ... 18:39:40 thanks all 18:39:52 thanks tosky 18:39:55 w00h000 18:40:13 alright we knocked that out 18:40:19 can I say "#agreed flaper87 to WF+1 the patches in question [3] and [4]" 18:40:33 you can :D 18:40:35 if yes, cp16net would you do that for posterity 18:41:02 #agreed flaper87 to WF+1 the patches in question [3] and [4] 18:41:15 thanks folks, thx tosky 18:41:22 #topic Summit planning 18:41:34 #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/trove-newton-proposed-sessions 18:41:40 ^^ tonyb ^^ 18:42:31 we have a long list of topics for the *netwon* summit 18:42:32 so, are there other projects and topics we want to propose for the summit 18:42:50 we're going to have to accomodate as many as we can 18:42:54 in the sessions we have 18:43:17 #info Conference room allocations announced (Trove: 3fb, 6wr, cm:half) 18:43:23 can I get a show of hands on who's likely to be at summit 18:43:41 o/ 18:44:04 o/ 18:44:04 i 18:44:17 #startvote Will you be at the summit? Yes, No, Maybe 18:44:18 Begin voting on: Will you be at the summit? Valid vote options are Yes, No, Maybe. 18:44:19 Vote using '#vote OPTION'. Only your last vote counts. 18:44:22 There we go 18:44:23 o/ 18:44:25 #vote Yes 18:44:30 #vote Yes 18:44:31 #vote Yes 18:44:41 #vote No 18:44:46 #vote Yes 18:44:48 #vote Yes 18:45:01 #vote Yes 18:45:08 #vote Yes 18:45:21 imandhan, johnma, pmackinn ? 18:45:28 #vote maybe 18:45:31 peterstac? 18:45:52 tellesnobrega? 18:45:53 I seem to recall raising my hand last week ... 18:45:59 #vote Yes 18:46:03 amrith: telles will be there 18:46:09 not sure where he's right now 18:46:12 #vote yes 18:46:14 Ok, thanks ... 18:46:17 #endvote 18:46:18 there 18:46:18 :P 18:46:23 #endvote 18:46:24 Voted on "Will you be at the summit?" Results are 18:46:25 Maybe (1): imandhan 18:46:26 Yes (9): vkmc, vgnbkr_, tellesnobrega, amrith, peterstac, mvandijk_, cp16net, flaper87, dougshelley66 18:46:27 No (1): tosky 18:46:32 thx 18:46:35 :/ 18:46:41 great that worked well 18:46:53 I'll update the agenda for summit sessions on the etherpad. 18:46:58 there are 4 more coming from Tesora 18:46:58 thanks folks 18:47:12 thx dougshelley66 18:47:26 great love to see everyone 18:47:30 #movingon 18:47:35 #topic Using 'reno' for release notes 18:47:54 this is an important topic for furture features and bugs 18:48:02 Ok, making release notes at the end of a release is a pain if we have to create them at that time. 18:48:13 yes it is 18:48:14 so when you commit code/bugs/features, please add a release note too. 18:48:16 it is easy 18:48:21 +1 for using reno 18:48:22 reno new 18:48:22 #link http://docs.openstack.org/developer/reno/ 18:48:31 super easy, useful and fast 18:48:35 you get a file that you put simple stuff into 18:48:38 as part of your commit 18:48:43 #link http://docs.openstack.org/developer/reno/usage.html#creating-new-release-notes 18:48:49 when we cut a release, voila, we have content for release notes 18:48:57 I guess reviewers should also keep an eye on this and request for these release notes to be added 18:49:04 So, here's why I raised this here. 18:49:11 s/I guess// 18:49:25 Do we believe that "I think you need a release note is a good review comment." 18:49:49 sorry, do you agree that "I think you need a release note" is a good review comment? 18:49:59 yeah i completely agree with that 18:50:02 because I intend to start doing that and I'd encourage all of you to as well. 18:50:02 Sure it's a good comment, but is it grounds for -1? 18:50:06 I do 18:50:12 i know going back through the list of commits is a HUGE PITA 18:50:16 I think it's fair and it grounds for -1 18:50:27 peterstac, I'd like to start with giving the comment and seeing whether a -1 is required later. 18:50:34 It's not really an opinion. It's something that is missing in the patch 18:50:45 There are other ways to incent people to do them, like delegating the writing of release notes to those who don't :) 18:51:03 so that's something for all to keep in mind. 18:51:21 if you'd like to see what the release notes look like, how you create them, etc., cp16net has posted links above. 18:51:23 yes that is something for everyone to keep in mind moving forward 18:51:26 thanks, that's all I had.