20:00:05 <ildikov> #startmeeting openstack_upstream_institute
20:00:06 <openstack> Meeting started Mon Apr 24 20:00:05 2017 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is ildikov. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
20:00:07 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
20:00:09 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_upstream_institute'
20:00:13 <mlavalle> o/
20:01:45 <jungleboyj> o/
20:01:49 <blancos> o/
20:02:13 <jaypipes> o/
20:02:14 <knikolla> o/
20:02:19 <spotz> \o/
20:02:20 <vkmc_> o/
20:02:32 <ildikov> hi y'all :)
20:02:42 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: around?
20:02:46 <jungleboyj> Happy Monday!
20:03:04 <jaypipes> is it?
20:03:06 <ildikov> jungleboyj: this was evil of you! :)
20:03:16 <vkmc_> That's optimistic
20:03:30 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  Why?  It has been a good Monday for me so far.
20:03:34 <ildikov> jaypipes: :)
20:03:42 <ildikov> so agenda for today: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/openstack-upstream-institute-meetings
20:03:48 <jungleboyj> jaypipes:  I am trying to be optimistic.
20:03:53 <jaypipes> jungleboyj: :)
20:04:04 <ildikov> jungleboyj: I'm only aware of not bad Mondays... :)
20:04:31 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  Atta Way!
20:04:32 <ildikov> so let's start! :)
20:04:40 <ildikov> #topic Announcements
20:05:03 <ildikov> the training is at the end of next week!!!!!
20:05:17 <ildikov> I'm freaked out, you shouldn't! :)
20:05:30 <jungleboyj> It is going to be great.
20:05:35 <spotz> We got this
20:05:49 * jungleboyj high fives spotz
20:05:51 <diablo_rojo> Hello :)
20:05:52 <ildikov> we still have work to do and figure out the hands on parts more, it's coming later in the agenda
20:06:09 <ildikov> update the content and do reviews!
20:06:24 <jaypipes> yeah, I need to get on that. sorry I haven't been able to do that yet :(
20:06:40 <jungleboyj> jaypipes:  Let me know if you need help buddy.
20:06:49 <ildikov> I will ping everyone who's signed up for Boston on the wiki this week to ensure we're all on the same page: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/OpenStack_Upstream_Institute
20:06:55 <diablo_rojo> There are 9 open reviews that need comments
20:06:58 <jaypipes> jungleboyj: nah, just need to get on the reviews...
20:07:11 <jungleboyj> jaypipes:  Ok.
20:07:16 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo:  ++
20:07:21 <ildikov> jaypipes: no worries, whenever you can
20:07:45 <ildikov> if there's anyone around, who's able to attend the training and has not signed up on the wiki please go and update!
20:07:55 <ildikov> we have 65 registered students as of now
20:07:58 <diablo_rojo> ildikov, +1
20:08:16 <jungleboyj> Nice.
20:08:29 <ildikov> I will send out a welcome, info and please confirm you're attending the training this week
20:08:35 <mlavalle> ildikov: is that more or less than in Barcelona?
20:08:38 <ildikov> and hope for the best re response and show up rate
20:08:42 <jungleboyj> ildikov: I have tdasilva set up as a swift representative if we need someone for Swift.
20:08:45 <diablo_rojo> mlavalle, a little less
20:08:55 <diablo_rojo> We ended up qith about 90 people between the two days
20:09:02 <mlavalle> wow
20:09:03 <diablo_rojo> lots of people showed up that didnt register though
20:09:06 <ildikov> mlavalle: we had roughly 75 RSVP's for Barcelona and roughly almost 90 people showing up... :)
20:09:23 <mlavalle> do we know their project interest already?
20:09:27 <ildikov> it was pretty unusual
20:09:36 <ildikov> mlavalle: we get there later today
20:09:36 <diablo_rojo> mlavalle, yes we have that.
20:09:38 <jungleboyj> mlavalle:  Yeah, was going to ask that.
20:09:45 <jungleboyj> Ok.
20:09:48 <diablo_rojo> mlavalle, jungleboyj later on in the agenda :0
20:09:50 <diablo_rojo> :)
20:09:56 <ildikov> stay tuned, we're just announcing right now :)
20:10:04 * mlavalle will not jump the gun again :-(
20:10:23 <ildikov> mlavalle: all good, we like excitement :)
20:10:23 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo:  Yeah, been jumping the gun today.
20:10:38 <ildikov> so we have a sign up etherpad for presenting topics: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/boston-upstream-institute-presenters
20:10:43 <ildikov> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/boston-upstream-institute-presenters
20:10:49 <diablo_rojo> jungleboyj, meanwhile ildikov and I are scrambling today to get caught up frm last week
20:11:34 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo:  :-)
20:11:47 <ildikov> so jungleboyj was eager to take the how it's made parts, but I'm sure he's open to make a good deal if someone would like to jump in to that big block
20:11:55 <jungleboyj> I can take more sections to present or I can relinquish some if there are people who would rather talk.
20:11:55 <vkmc_> jungleboyj: may I take a few items of How OpenStack is made?
20:12:10 <jungleboyj> vkmc_:  Sure!
20:12:14 <jungleboyj> Happy to share.
20:12:33 <vkmc_> jungleboyj: +1
20:12:40 <vkmc_> Any preference?
20:12:57 <jaypipes> vkmc_: with lots of sausage and spaghetti? ;)
20:13:00 <ildikov> vkmc_: jungleboyj: I think it's good if we have multiple people presenting, might help with keeping up people's attention as well to have some movement
20:13:13 <ildikov> jaypipes: lol
20:13:13 <diablo_rojo> jaypipes, with beer?
20:13:17 <vkmc_> Haha
20:13:20 <jaypipes> diablo_rojo: ah, yes indeed :)
20:13:22 <vkmc_> +1 to all that
20:13:28 <jungleboyj> Beer.
20:13:32 <diablo_rojo> ildikov, +1
20:13:38 <vkmc_> Ok, will add my name to the etherpad
20:13:40 <ildikov> somehow we should share this joy with the students as well
20:13:48 <vkmc_> And we can later adjust it
20:13:54 <vkmc_> Yaay
20:13:54 <diablo_rojo> Need to change things up so people don't zone out.
20:13:55 <ildikov> these jokes always make me say out loud how much I like this community!
20:14:26 <ildikov> but back to track
20:14:41 <jungleboyj> vkmc_:  You want to take governance and  communication.
20:14:41 <ildikov> please add names to the etherpad and agree on who takes what on the final schedule
20:14:51 <jungleboyj> We can kind-of alternate?
20:14:59 <spotz> I'm holding on to my 2!!!!
20:15:22 <jungleboyj> I would like to keep the official projects and release-cycle since I worked on the slides quite a bit.
20:15:31 <vkmc_> Sounds good!
20:15:34 <ildikov> ok, you get 20 more seconds to discuss this and take the rest of the chats to the channel after the meeting plz :)
20:15:47 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  Ok, we are done.  :-)
20:16:08 <ildikov> jungleboyj: tnx :)
20:16:15 <ildikov> #topic Open reviews
20:16:19 <jungleboyj> Me and my excitement.
20:16:25 <diablo_rojo> I want to take some of them, but I will be disappearing periodically for keynote practice so it might be hard. I can sign up for some and have someone be my understudy?
20:16:29 <ildikov> so I'm lazy, here you can find all: https://review.openstack.org/#/q/project:openstack/training-guides
20:16:33 <ildikov> #link https://review.openstack.org/#/q/project:openstack/training-guides
20:17:05 <ildikov> diablo_rojo: that should work, I think we have multiple people for each section, who can cover
20:17:31 <vkmc_> I promise I'll check those out soon as well
20:17:46 <vkmc_> Have been jumping around different things lately
20:17:48 <jungleboyj> I am going to respond to the current comments ASAP.
20:17:54 <ildikov> so please do reviews, I will ping our not too many cores to do their duties too
20:18:04 <ildikov> vkmc_: I hear ya!
20:18:22 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  Thanks for looking through and merging some and commenting on others.
20:18:23 <ildikov> I think we're mostly good with the comments
20:18:32 <diablo_rojo> I have some comments to respond to, but please make more!
20:18:33 <ildikov> is there anything to put up for discussion here?
20:18:37 <diablo_rojo> nope
20:18:46 <jungleboyj> Hope all the updates I made last week are ok.
20:19:18 <ildikov> jungleboyj: I think I added comments to all by now, so we should be close either way
20:19:28 <jungleboyj> Great.  Thanks.
20:19:34 <spotz> I think I've been through them all if not poke with a specific one
20:19:51 <jungleboyj> spotz:  Yeah, appreciated all the collaboration.
20:20:18 <ildikov> awesome, so I think we're looking good here
20:20:24 <ildikov> let's move forward with the agenda
20:20:33 <ildikov> #topic Topics
20:21:02 <ildikov> let's start with the areas to cover first as that's shorter than chatting about the slides
20:21:18 <ianychoi> oh hi
20:21:25 <ildikov> so the list is on the etherpad as part of the agenda: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/openstack-upstream-institute-meetings
20:21:33 <ildikov> ianychoi: hi, you're up early!
20:22:08 <ildikov> so we have quite a few areas to cover, I only added numbers to those, where we have only a few people interested in that specific area
20:22:33 <ianychoi> ildikov, I am now transferring in SFO airport :) I need to go to Oslo - Norway before Summit and I would be unable to attend to upstream institute on Saturday :(
20:22:50 <spotz> ianychoi: :(
20:22:52 <ildikov> the ones without numbers are more than 5 people
20:22:56 <ildikov> ianychoi: :(
20:23:05 <ildikov> ianychoi: are you still up for Sunday?
20:23:36 <jungleboyj> vkmc_:  That is right, you are Manila and I have a swift candidate so I think we have all the storage covered.  :-)
20:23:37 <ildikov> ianychoi: going to Boston through SFO from Norway sounds pretty cruel
20:23:42 <diablo_rojo> So we NEED networking people, auth& security people, and containers people the most
20:23:43 <ianychoi> ildikov, I will be back around afternoon Saturday so I will be on Sunday :)
20:24:11 <ildikov> knikolla: are you still available for Boston?
20:24:17 <diablo_rojo> ildikov, and I will poke at liaisons for those projects, but if you know of anyone that is going early or in the area that works on them- rope those people in!
20:24:21 <ianychoi> ildikov, yep but Korea <-> Norway and Korea <-> Boston are worse and Korea <-> Norway <-> Boston is so expensive.. T.T
20:24:27 <knikolla> ildikov: yes I am.
20:24:33 <spotz> ildikov: I can see when a friend on Barbican is coming, it's been a year since I did anything with it
20:24:38 <ildikov> knikolla: to cover Keystone and maybe other parts as well
20:24:48 <diablo_rojo> spotz, bring Igor!
20:24:58 <vkmc_> I can ping some people later
20:25:01 <ildikov> spotz: would be great!
20:25:03 <vkmc_> For the missing projects
20:25:09 <knikolla> ildikov: yes. it is the weekend before the summit right?
20:25:18 <ildikov> knikolla: yes
20:25:20 <spotz> diablo_rojo: He replaced me as Heat engineer so he's not using it any more either:)
20:25:59 <spotz> Checking with redrobot:)
20:26:41 <ildikov> I added the areas to the sections etherpad: https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/boston-upstream-institute-presenters
20:26:51 <jungleboyj> I am not sure if Brant Knudson is going to be in Boston.  He could cover auth.
20:26:54 <ildikov> please check, I will try to clean it up a bit later
20:26:55 <jungleboyj> Oh you know who is going to be there.
20:27:02 <jungleboyj> Lance.
20:27:13 <jungleboyj> I will ping Lance for Auth.
20:27:18 <diablo_rojo> when does he get in?
20:27:24 <ildikov> jungleboyj: we have knikolla as Keystone liaison
20:27:25 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo:  Checking.
20:27:33 <diablo_rojo> SO long as they are there for Sunday that will be fine.
20:27:36 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  Ok, never mind.
20:27:43 <diablo_rojo> Since saturday will be less project specific
20:28:10 <ildikov> I know Lance likes this initiative, so if he can be around that's great of course
20:28:19 * redrobot pokes head in
20:28:29 <spotz> jungleboyj: Yeah make Lance come!
20:28:38 <spotz> I can poke him too ildikov:)
20:28:43 <jungleboyj> spotz:  Ok.  I will poke him.
20:28:46 <ildikov> so we have Storage, Auth and Compute covered
20:29:15 <spotz> I've also hit up the barbican channel:)
20:29:22 <ildikov> spotz: jungleboyj: just don't be too pushy, we're a nice and friendly community not forcing people into things ;)
20:29:31 <diablo_rojo> I would ask Flavio about containers, but I imagine he will be in the board meeting.
20:29:32 <spotz> ildikov: They're my friends:)
20:29:42 <diablo_rojo> spotz, thank you :)
20:29:47 <ildikov> spotz: jungleboyj vkmc_ : if you find more people plz add them to the wiki and the etherpad as well!
20:29:59 <vkmc_> Sure thing
20:30:17 <vkmc_> Do we have access to the list of people that RSVP?
20:30:19 <spotz> redrobot won't get in until 2:(
20:30:26 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  Will do.  Wish we had Networking contacts.
20:30:27 <vkmc_> And their main interests
20:30:27 <ildikov> spotz: jungleboyj: vkmc_: we need to have a rough idea how many people will be around from organizational perspectives, like catering, etc.
20:30:38 <vkmc_> Yeah
20:30:43 <ildikov> vkmc_: yes, the list on the etherpad is built from their response
20:30:50 <vkmc_> Awesome
20:31:04 <spotz> ildikov: On the plus side if we don't have projects represented we can send folks to the onboarding rooms
20:31:10 <ildikov> I will add more numbers, just had some issues with the tools, so added indication to those topics, where we have only a very few people
20:31:28 <jungleboyj> Lance doesn't get in until 2 on Sunday.  :-(
20:31:31 <ildikov> the rest is the we must have people in the room for those :)
20:31:41 <ildikov> we need to figure out Networking
20:32:06 <jungleboyj> diablo_rojo:  Lenovo has Kolla contacts.  I can have our guy reach out if Flavio can't help.
20:32:28 <mlavalle> ildikov: I'm going to be there Sunday afternoon
20:32:32 <ildikov> I think Flavio was interested in coming too, he might be able to cover some containers stuff
20:32:58 <ildikov> mlavalle: I know
20:33:02 <spotz> I could check with inc0 from kolla
20:33:12 <diablo_rojo> jungleboyj, the more the merrier :)
20:33:26 <jungleboyj> :-)
20:33:34 <ildikov> mlavalle: do you know whether anyone else from the team might be around if people would be eager to ask a bit more specific questions during the first half of the training?
20:33:46 <ildikov> spotz: sounds good, tnx, I will ping Flavio
20:33:59 <mlavalle> ildikov: no, I'll ask tomorrow morning during the weekly irc meeting
20:34:10 <ildikov> mlavalle: cool, thanks
20:34:32 <ildikov> mlavalle: there's a good chance we don't get to the deep dives until Sunday afternoon
20:34:47 <ildikov> mlavalle: unfortunately we don't have a reliable timing for the agenda yet
20:34:57 <mlavalle> ildikov: what am I supposed to do during the deep dive?
20:35:03 <ildikov> which would be good in general, so that's on the "roadmap" for the team
20:35:05 <jungleboyj> We are going to rock the timing.
20:35:36 <ildikov> mlavalle: we will get to that in a second
20:35:58 * mlavalle jumping the gun again. bad mlavalle, bad!
20:36:23 <jungleboyj> mlavalle:  tsk, tsk, tsk
20:36:40 <ildikov> mlavalle: sorry :)
20:36:54 <mlavalle> just kidding :-)
20:37:06 <ildikov> ianychoi: if you'll be around and not too tired on Sunday I guess you can talk to people interested in docs, right?
20:37:38 <diablo_rojo> mlavalle, lol
20:37:48 <spotz> inc0 is texted
20:37:48 <ildikov> mlavalle: I know :)
20:38:17 <ianychoi> ildikov, yep sure. I can talk docs part :)
20:38:18 <ildikov> I think we are roughly good with this part
20:38:25 <ildikov> ianychoi: cool, tnx
20:38:26 <jungleboyj> :-0
20:38:29 <jungleboyj> :-)
20:38:31 <diablo_rojo> ildikov, yep
20:38:51 <ildikov> ianychoi: we had Christian having a docs deep dive with people in Barcelona, but he cannot come this time :(
20:39:08 <ildikov> ok, so let's move on to the content
20:39:16 <ianychoi> ildikov, he now more focuses on Kolla :) I see
20:39:35 <ildikov> ianychoi: I know, he covered docs well too last time though
20:39:52 <ildikov> so we mentioned deep dives today, let's talk about that a bit
20:40:23 <ildikov> the idea/expectation for the last part of the training is to have small group sessions with the students
20:40:31 <ildikov> which are these deppe dives
20:40:39 <ildikov> s/deppe/deep/
20:40:47 * ildikov cannot type anymore...
20:41:23 <ildikov> so what we tried to do last time was, showing people how we deal with the code or docs
20:41:24 <spotz> too much BBQ....
20:41:36 <jungleboyj> spotz:  He he he.
20:41:40 <ildikov> spotz: right on the point :)
20:42:02 <ildikov> the aim is to show them how to run tests, how to and what to do with Devstack
20:42:14 <jungleboyj> ildikov: ++
20:42:21 <jungleboyj> That was what my group was looking for.
20:42:37 <ildikov> how to test their modifications both unit/functional tests and how to test it in Devstack
20:42:52 <ianychoi> great :)
20:43:11 <ildikov> we have ideas like download the code for a project, mess up something and let the team run the tests, find the failing ones and figure out what went wrong
20:43:30 <ildikov> they can get a cookie if they find it by themselves or smth :)
20:43:35 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  Oh, we did talk about that.
20:43:47 <jungleboyj> That doesn't sound all bad.
20:44:09 <spotz> ildikov: We could already have something broken that they clone so we can know how to debug it?:)
20:44:18 <ildikov> another thing is to figure out an exercise that would require adding new log messages and then restart the services and find them in the logs
20:45:25 <ildikov> spotz: I didn't mean to randomly break something there
20:45:53 <jungleboyj> spotz: Yeah, I think that was the idea.
20:45:57 <ildikov> spotz: or well, it would be ideal to have the mentors prepared with what to break, which tests will fail and how to debug the thing
20:46:00 <spotz> I was just thinking of it from the troubleshooting side, if we knew ahead of time what is broken it's easier to guide them to fix it
20:46:11 <spotz> so basically same thing:)
20:46:16 <ildikov> spotz: that's exactly the idea :)
20:46:45 <ildikov> spotz: it's another thing to get there with a team of cats to make these tings happen and be less on the fly style :)
20:46:46 <jungleboyj> Yep.  Could even have them cherry-pick a patch that we have created that breaks things.  Would demonstrate another skill.
20:47:00 <mlavalle> ildikov: so each mentor can will come up with his / her own specific thing to do
20:47:05 <mlavalle> right?
20:47:09 <ildikov> mlavalle: yes
20:47:12 <jungleboyj> Though, the smart ones can just look at the diff, but *shrug*
20:47:25 <mlavalle> cool
20:47:26 <ildikov> mlavalle: we collect areas of interest so people can play with that code base they are actually interested in
20:47:35 <jungleboyj> mlavalle: I think we should all take an similar approach though.
20:47:35 <ildikov> mlavalle: also those services in Devstack, etc
20:48:07 <ildikov> jaypipes: vkmc_: knikolla: are you on board with the above ideas?
20:48:33 <mlavalle> jungleboyj: yeah, I'll create a patch that breaks something and have them debug it
20:48:47 <jungleboyj> mlavalle:  Sounds good.
20:48:49 <knikolla> ildikov: will have to read above as i wasn't here
20:48:52 <ildikov> mlavalle: sounds awesome, thanks!
20:48:56 <vkmc_> Sounds good to me!
20:49:09 <vkmc_> It will probably be more organized that way
20:49:22 <ildikov> knikolla: sure, you can ask on the channel too after the meeting if you need more info for this
20:49:37 <ildikov> vkmc_: you mean having a patch that breaks something?
20:50:15 <jaypipes> ildikov: sure, fine by me.
20:50:28 <ildikov> jaypipes: cool, tnx
20:50:39 <mlavalle> if jaypipes agrees, we are on the right track
20:50:45 <mlavalle> Great!
20:51:03 <ildikov> mlavalle: :)
20:51:15 <jaypipes> heh
20:52:07 <jungleboyj> All hail Lord Pipes!  ;-)
20:52:28 <ildikov> I think it would be great to have some rough outlines for the deep dives
20:52:41 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  ++
20:52:50 <ildikov> if not before the training then summarizing it after as what work and what did not work
20:52:55 <jaypipes> jungleboyj: lol
20:53:48 <ildikov> also I would like to ask every mentor to try to get all the students involved and let them and also encourage them to play with the environment and the code by themselves on their machine
20:54:01 <diablo_rojo> ildikov, +1
20:54:12 <jungleboyj> Sounds good.
20:54:22 <ildikov> they will still miss the we don't fix a real bug experience
20:55:01 <spotz> ildikov: We tried having some for git and gerrit it's just too hard to find enough of them they can do especially not knowing skill sets
20:55:11 <ildikov> I think we could theme this a bit, like having a Launchpad bug that describes the issue
20:55:53 <ildikov> they can get the patch that breaks the code on the training and they can upload their fix to the Sandbox project on Gerrit or smth like
20:56:13 <ildikov> or the description how they found the issue, or smth like
20:56:21 <spotz> oooh nice
20:56:21 <ildikov> so they practice what they learned
20:56:29 <spotz> +1
20:56:51 <ildikov> spotz: I don't like the fix real bug on the training idea to be honest
20:57:03 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  That sounds good.
20:57:05 <ildikov> spotz: I think we need to be more "strategic" and educational than that
20:57:11 <spotz> yeah it's not real doable
20:57:35 <spotz> we do fake doc bugs and patches and reviews
20:57:39 <ildikov> agreed, so my thinking is do things like how we all do it in real life and give the students success
20:58:00 <jungleboyj> I have had a request from my team to cover more on git and rebasing changes but I just don't see a way to get that into the education.  :-(
20:58:11 <ildikov> and also let them practice everything they learned on the way
20:58:35 <ildikov> jungleboyj: that's the lunch and learn maybe :)
20:58:53 <ildikov> and also telling people that sometimes they will need to cherry-pick anyhow...
20:58:53 <jungleboyj> ildikov:  I think having a bug and pulling down a broken patch and then going through the process of fixing it and proposing a change for each project is great.
20:59:08 <ildikov> jungleboyj: awesome, tnx
20:59:43 <jungleboyj> Is there a way to do that in the Sandbox environment?
21:00:11 <ildikov> so homework for mentors to come up with a small patch that breaks something in their project, have a bug report for it the Sandbox project on Launchpad and then let the students rock!
21:00:17 <ildikov> jungleboyj: not on code level
21:00:46 <jungleboyj> Ok, so they can do part of it in the sandbox.
21:00:53 <ildikov> jungleboyj: I mean they can upload a diff a description of how they fixed the issue, but obviously we will not have the code base and test jobs there
21:00:55 <jungleboyj> I will figure it out.
21:01:05 <jungleboyj> ildikov: Right.
21:01:11 <ildikov> ok, time's up
21:01:12 <jungleboyj> That is all we need.
21:01:23 <ildikov> let's jump on the channel for further discussions
21:01:31 <ildikov> thanks everyone, great meeting!
21:01:33 <jungleboyj> Great meeting.  thanks!
21:01:37 <ianychoi> Thanks a lot all!
21:01:43 <ildikov> see most of you next week!!! :)
21:01:50 <jaypipes> ciao :)
21:02:08 <diablo_rojo> We still have one more meeting before the training
21:02:22 <ildikov> #endmeeting