13:01:19 <eumel8> #startmeeting OpenStack I18n Office Hour
13:01:20 <openstack> Meeting started Thu Apr 26 13:01:19 2018 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is eumel8. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
13:01:21 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
13:01:23 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_i18n_office_hour'
13:04:17 <jpich> Hello!
13:04:22 <eumel8> fun fact: it's running cats
13:04:52 <eumel8> hello jpich, welcome to I18n Office Hour :)
13:05:07 <jpich> :)
13:08:10 <eumel8> no rain in Dublin, says the weather service
13:08:47 <jpich> got some drizzle over lunch, better than the hail+sun yesterday though
13:10:31 <eumel8> sounds like April. But from my feeling the summer is still over because we had over 30 degrees last weekend.
13:10:57 <jpich> !
13:11:19 <jpich> Last weekend was nice over here too but not 30C-nice ;)
13:12:21 <eumel8> Ireland I associate as the best winter vacation ever ;)
13:13:52 <jpich> "best" - I'm glad :-)
13:14:27 <jpich> With the next PTG is in Denver again maybe that means the next-next one will be in Dublin again too 0=)
13:16:14 <eumel8> Ohara Ale awaits us. There are still a lot of pubs to investigate
13:17:43 <tosky> Denver :/
13:18:29 <amotoki> hmmm..... I cannot track i18n meeting logs under http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_i18n_meeting/ .....
13:18:31 <eumel8> I would skip the second Denver visit. I heard the train issues are solved there, but I prefer a  European co-located event as midcycle for I18n
13:19:43 <eumel8> amotoki: last one is from 2018-04-19, which was last week
13:19:44 <amotoki> how are the train issues solved?
13:20:12 <jpich> amotoki: Probably http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack_i18n_office_hour/2018/ this time
13:20:20 <amotoki> eumel8: so http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/#I18N_Team_Meeting is no longer correct
13:20:50 <eumel8> amotoki: the railroad crossing are now saver, so it's not required to make noices.
13:21:45 <amotoki> almost all folks around me in Japan are trying to book other hotels now...
13:22:24 <amotoki> eumel8: do we have any information from the foundation stuffs on this?
13:23:09 <eumel8> #link http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2018-April/129564.html
13:23:50 <amotoki> thanks! I didn't notice that paragraph.
13:25:35 <eumel8> jpich: thanks for the link. Office Hours is only around the Summit. Will see later if we switch back to team meetings or make the Office Hours permanent
13:26:26 <jpich> yep
13:26:27 <amotoki> my suggestion is just to continue to use the same meeting name so that we can track all logs in a same folder.
13:26:50 <amotoki> regardless of meeting modes
13:27:10 <eumel8> normaly Office Hours are not recorded
13:27:25 <amotoki> really?
13:27:27 <jpich> it depends on the team
13:27:36 <jpich> I see another few "office hours" under eavesdrop for meetings
13:28:15 <amotoki> the keystone team used "office hours" as a meeting name but they switched back to continue the same name.
13:28:53 <amotoki> the meeting bot now logs all meetings in all channels.
13:29:22 <eumel8> I only know TC and there is no recording
13:29:54 <eumel8> I  think there is no chair required for such kind of things
13:30:03 <amotoki> keystone and QA teams use 'office hours'
13:31:04 <amotoki> sorry for bothering you on a meeting name
13:31:08 <amotoki> go aheda
13:31:08 <jpich> Mistral records theirs
13:33:15 <eumel8> it's just for highlight something later. Of course there are the regular channel logs
13:34:19 <tosky> ehm, metadiscussion on the discussion aside, I have a question that I think I already asked quickly during the PTG
13:34:24 <tosky> we are going to split (before Rocky) the sahara repository in two parts (sahara and sahara-plugins) and we will need to copy the translations
13:34:50 <eumel8> yes, I remember
13:35:45 <tosky> I don't know how internally zanata works, but I think that zanata would just drop the messages no more relevant from the old and new file
13:35:55 <ianychoi> hello
13:36:16 <tosky> so just to refresh my memory: is the above idea correct? Apart from marking the new repository as translatable, should we do anything else?
13:36:24 <eumel8> hello ianychoi
13:36:35 <amotoki> tosky: i think there are two ways.
13:36:59 <amotoki> tosky: the one is to upload translations manually for the new repo. it requires admin priv of zanata.
13:37:07 <amotoki> tosky: the other way is to use translation memory.
13:37:45 <amotoki> in the second approach, translators need to recover translations manually but they can use good suggestions based on the transaltion memory, so it would be simpe enough
13:37:57 <ianychoi_phone> I am traveling personally so my response might be slow
13:38:06 <amotoki> what they need is to click, click, and click on zanata.
13:38:43 <tosky> amotoki: I know the second way (I did it in other projects), I was thinking about a way to not rely on each translator/translation team
13:38:54 <tosky> so nothing is lost immediately after the split
13:39:07 <tosky> of course if it's more complicated for admins, it's not really a choice :)
13:39:25 <eumel8> tosky: how are the sizes? is this a 50:50 split?
13:40:04 <tosky> eumel8: that's a good question and I can't answer right now; is there an easy way to simulate the message extraction locally?
13:40:45 <eumel8> we're talking about 22 pages to translate in Zanata
13:41:01 <eumel8> let me check the git repo
13:43:39 <eumel8> #link https://translate.openstack.org/iteration/view/sahara/master/documents?docId=sahara%2Flocale%2Fsahara
13:44:43 <eumel8> tosky: ok, it seems you have only talk to me, because it's only German translation on master ;-))
13:44:58 <tosky> eumel8: oh :D
13:45:22 <tosky> so whatever it's easier for you
13:47:25 <amotoki> can I add another topic?
13:47:47 <eumel8> amotoki: sure
13:48:09 <amotoki> I noticed Japanese users refer to translated documents in older releases
13:48:12 <amotoki> in https://docs.openstack.org/ja/
13:48:35 <ianychoi_phone> Sorry my Internet is unstable
13:49:05 <ianychoi_phone> amotoki: some language people prefer to stay older releases. How about Japanese?
13:49:08 <amotoki> we have translated documents in older releases without any version information.
13:50:39 <amotoki> this is an example https://docs.openstack.org/ja/user-guide/
13:50:58 <amotoki> the content was old and it is based on the content before doc-migration.
13:51:26 <amotoki> I wonder how we should handle this kind of things.
13:51:42 <ianychoi_phone> Aha.. docs team decided to stay older documents and tranlated documents
13:52:05 <ianychoi_phone> Maybe adding some release information on language landing pages would be good?
13:52:10 <amotoki> but I think all documents should be versioned.
13:52:33 <amotoki> I think we agreed to use /mitaka/ja/ or /ja/mitaka/
13:52:40 <eumel8> tosky: I would say: split the repo, we setup new project in Zanata, I will upload the German po file and the other languages with < 5 % translations comes from the Translation Memory or there are newcomer to translate Sahara in other languages. The rest will Oslo and Zanata manage automatically.
13:53:08 <ianychoi_phone> User guides were published without versioning I thonk
13:53:39 <ianychoi_phone> Some guides like Admin guides, user guides, ha guides publish only at master
13:53:40 <amotoki> it is true, but the user guide was split out into projects
13:53:48 <amotoki> so they are now completely obsolete
13:54:10 <eumel8> #link https://docs.openstack.org/de/
13:54:23 <amotoki> don't we move them to /ocata/ (if doc-migration happened in pike)
13:54:39 <eumel8> maybe you can read it, we have different versions of install guide linked there
13:55:24 <amotoki> google find non-linked existing documents
13:56:22 <amotoki> I believe URL with releases are much clearer than URLs without release info.
13:56:46 <ianychoi_phone> I think it might be worth finding out which docs (including translated docs) are obsolete.
13:56:48 <amotoki> eumel8: install guide was versioned since before doc-migration
13:57:23 <tosky> eumel8: ack, thanks
13:58:02 <ianychoi_phone> For obsolete docs, moving to the prev release comparing to last updated would be nice
13:58:41 <ianychoi_phone> For translated docs, it seems a little bit complicated - maybe more search on which release is based would be needed
14:00:04 <amotoki> can anyone move this forward?
14:01:48 <ianychoi_phone> Would it be possible to retrieve all the content from files.openstack.org/docs ?
14:01:50 <eumel8> I don't got it right. Maybe have to think about it.
14:02:21 <ianychoi_phone> Retrieving all the content and investigation would be needed I think
14:03:45 <eumel8> ianychoi: catch your prefered infra guy and he can  make ls -LR on the machine :)
14:05:04 <ianychoi_phone> eumel8: Nice suggestion :)
14:09:06 <amotoki> ls -lR locally seems the only way
14:10:40 <ianychoi_phone> Agreed
14:14:14 <amotoki> actually I am not translating docs at all. I just bridge what I am asked on translated contents.
14:14:36 <amotoki> bye, going to another meeting.
14:14:42 <eumel8> ok
14:14:52 <ianychoi> amotoki, bye :)
14:14:58 <eumel8> will close the Office Hour
14:15:07 <ianychoi> okay
14:15:18 <eumel8> #endmeeting