00:00:34 #startmeeting OpenStack I18n Meeting 00:00:35 Meeting started Thu Nov 21 00:00:34 2013 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is Daisy. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 00:00:36 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. 00:00:39 The meeting name has been set to 'openstack_i18n_meeting' 00:00:53 Good morning/evening, everyone. 00:01:00 Welcome to I18n meeting. 00:01:12 We have ujuc, macjack, and zero00072. 00:01:13 Good morning everyone 00:01:15 Hi :) 00:01:26 Do we have anybody else ? 00:01:43 No? 00:02:04 OK, people may join us in the meeting. 00:02:33 #topic Horizon translation update 00:02:54 The first stable Havana update (2013.2.1) is plalned in early Dec. Julie and Akihiro suggested to include Horizon improved translation. 00:02:59 hi, i need to leave soon but can join for a while. 00:03:06 Great, amotoki! 00:03:15 We need you in the early part. 00:03:28 I agree with Julie and Akihiro. 00:03:40 So let's set a deadline and if any languages team have translation update, please send email to mailing list and Akihiro will help to update. 00:04:14 amotoki: do you know the exact date of Havana (2013.2.1)? 00:04:20 OK :) 00:04:33 i haven't checked the detail date. perhaps we can check stable-maint list to knwo it. 00:04:35 amotoki: do you have any suggestions to the deadline of translation update? 00:04:58 amotoki: can you help to check the exact date? 00:05:00 i think importing will be done just before freeze. 00:05:26 Daisy: yeah. 00:05:34 Thanks. amotoki. 00:05:48 Another question for you, amotoki. 00:05:57 Is the translation verification test website still runnable or not ? 00:06:18 it is still running but automated import is stopped now. 00:06:30 i usually use it for demo :-) 00:06:36 are you going to start the automation import ? 00:06:54 can resume it if needed 00:07:03 ok. Thanks. 00:07:36 #action amotoki to check the exact freeze date of Havana (2013.2.1) and suggest the last deadline to the mailing list. 00:07:41 i have a question about transifex resource: horizon vs horizon_havana. 00:07:55 Yes, i'm going to address this issue now. 00:08:09 We have finished Havana translation. And Horzion is moving to Icehouse. I will prefer to copy the existing resources to Icehouse version, and rename the existing resource with a Havana suffix. Then we will keep both Havana and Icehouse version in Transifex, with different suffix. 00:08:26 How do you think, amotoki ? 00:08:31 sounds nice. 00:08:42 Great. so I will do it after the meeting. 00:09:13 #action Daisy to rename exisiting resources in Horizon with a Havana suffix. 00:09:14 as julie said, some string updates are under review. I will update POT file to transifex (havana) directly 00:09:57 Nice, amotoki. 00:10:12 When you are done, don't forget to send a mail to ML. 00:10:18 sure 00:10:37 anything do you want to talk in the first topic: Horizon stable release? 00:10:45 If no, we will move to next topic. 00:10:48 nothing from me. 00:11:03 #topic I18n team structure discussion 00:11:19 The mission of our team, as written in wiki, is 00:11:28 to make OpenStack ubiquitously accessible to people of all language backgrounds, by providing a framework to create high quality translations, recruiting contributors and actively managing and planning the translation process. 00:11:49 The explaination in "by providing..." is much focus on translation. But I18n is more than translation. 00:12:10 Refer to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internationalization_and_localization to get the explaination of I18n and L10n. 00:12:23 In my mind, I18n team will cover more than translation, for example, in design summit, we proposed two blue prints: 00:12:31 https://blueprints.launchpad.net/oslo/+spec/log-messages-id 00:12:38 https://blueprints.launchpad.net/oslo/+spec/separate-translation-decorators 00:12:48 They are code refactors, but they are much related with I18n and L10n. 00:12:53 sorry for interrupt. 00:12:56 i need to leave now. i would like to know what and how i should do for ja doc index page (one of action items). let me know after the meeting. 00:13:07 bye 00:13:11 OK. I will send you email. Bye. 00:13:19 By studying the I18n teams of other open source communities, I think, we can rename our translation team to Localization team. Localization team will reponsible for openstack localization, including the translation. 00:13:25 bye :) 00:13:43 Two examples: https://l10n.gnome.org/teams/ and http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ 00:14:01 Any comments, till now? 00:15:00 Then we will have I18n core team and L10n sub-teams. 00:15:03 I18n core team will include the leaders (or the coordinators) in L10n sub-teams and developers who would like to contribute to OpenStack I18n features. 00:15:10 I think it is right. 00:15:16 Thanks, zero00072 00:15:27 L10n team includes leaders (or coordinators), translators, developers who would like to localize openstack, and even testers. 00:15:27 crate new loco tem? 00:15:45 Not new, I think. Just rename the translation team to loco team. 00:16:08 Ok :) 00:16:15 good idea, Daisy 00:16:37 but it is not only translation, and also need to approach different component to make sure they are enabled with globalization? 00:16:58 Now most members in L10n team are translators. That's OK. We can give time for the team to grow. 00:17:07 Yes, laserjetyang. 00:17:14 Not only translation. 00:17:15 Doing translation is something l10n team's work. 00:17:16 I have seem KDE i18n project renamed to l10n project in Debian. 00:17:54 Anyway, it's my proposal. 00:18:25 I think, we need broad discussion in the mailing list, not only i18n mailing list but also dev mailing list to see people's opinions. 00:18:40 If we only do translation, that's much easier. 00:18:52 If we want to do code refactor, we need support of dev mailing list. 00:19:00 agree, 00:19:35 but with the push from i18n point of view, it shoud be easier to make it happen 00:19:52 I'd like to understand how much Python knowledges do you have and if you would like to contribute code. Just a small survey. 00:20:09 If we say: we want to do code refactor, surely we need people who can do this job. 00:20:26 ujuc: can you write python program? 00:20:37 how about you, macjack and zero00072? 00:20:41 litle :) 00:20:48 Good, ujuc. 00:21:13 I love Ruby than Python. Haha 00:21:20 KKK 00:21:27 :)) 00:21:41 :)). They are similar, zero00072. 00:21:41 Anyway, some Python Code I can read and write. 00:21:50 Nice, zero00072. 00:22:12 Daisy python is awesom but did do that for a whilw 00:22:35 I believe, we will have very simple development jobs in I18n areas. 00:22:45 At that time, we can have a try. 00:22:54 Daisy: used to try to deep dive into Django code ever 00:23:04 Thanks, macjack. Very good. 00:23:18 I know a little Python too, I can write simple program. My background is in Java. 00:23:45 ok. So I will move this discussion to the mailing list. 00:24:00 #topic Blueprints & bugs tracking 00:24:23 We can use Launchpad to track the bugs and blueprints. 00:24:30 My question is what to track? 00:24:35 https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-i18n 00:24:42 https://blueprints.launchpad.net/openstack-i18n 00:24:53 (sorry I'm late) 00:24:59 Welcome, fifieldt. 00:25:28 As to the bug, we can track our translation errors reported by users. 00:25:50 Anything else can we track in Launchpad openstack-i18n? 00:26:19 great to see you fifieldt :) 00:26:30 So, we need to add a button to Horizon so that any one can reatch the tracking system? 00:26:41 Most of code errors in I18n areas are tracking in their own project in Launchpad. 00:27:49 zero00072, I wonder if Horizon team agree. I suggest you to discuss with Akihiro Motoki and Julie Pichon. 00:28:15 At least, we need a place to allow our users to report errors to us. 00:28:29 We can write the link in our wiki. 00:28:36 Agree. 00:28:47 But what do we want to track in blueprints? 00:28:54 I have no idea now. 00:28:58 Ok :) 00:29:05 why not? 00:29:20 laserjetyang, what do you mean? 00:29:38 I mean, why not track in blueprints? 00:29:47 what should we track, I mean? 00:30:03 Yes, you are right, laserjetyang. 00:30:04 it should be similar to bug, to me most of the blueprints are to solve bugs 00:30:12 I guess that most of our 'blueprint'-style things are about changes in the infrastructure ... 00:30:33 We can track our improvements in the translation platform, like the staging server for translate documents. 00:30:41 Right, fifieldt 00:30:44 That's the problem. 00:30:51 so the question is whether we track it in openstack-ci 00:30:56 or in openstack-i18n 00:31:07 ok, get your point 00:31:11 given we need review assistance from #openstack-infra 00:31:16 should we ask their preference? 00:31:28 good idea, fifieldt. 00:31:34 Let me do it. 00:31:51 I guess they would like to track in openstack-ci. 00:32:10 I don't know. Let me try. 00:32:29 we could also create blueprints in both places 00:32:33 since they are different audiences 00:32:45 #action Daisy to ask openstack-ci whether they would like to track I18n blueprints in openstack-i18n. 00:32:52 i18n people could request features by making the blueprints in openstack-i18n 00:32:57 :) 00:33:01 and then blueprints in openstack-ci could be created 00:33:04 * fifieldt shrugs 00:33:09 Then we bypass them to different projects? 00:33:25 actually 00:33:25 then we pass them to different projects. 00:33:30 we also have a 3rd option 00:33:44 we could be testers of the new "Storyboard" tool 00:33:49 which will replace launchpad 00:33:51 for OpenStack 00:33:53 in the future 00:34:09 we could. what's the benifit? 00:34:29 better interface 00:34:32 easier to use 00:34:43 we could help drive the development & adoption 00:34:46 do they call for tester now? 00:34:55 they have asked for "guinea pigs" 00:35:04 so far UX team has consented to join 00:35:13 Then we could. 00:35:14 but the software is still in early stage development 00:35:21 Storyboard sounds interesting!! 00:35:44 lol 00:35:56 I18n team need to take a look and then make decision. 00:36:09 https://github.com/openstack-infra/storyboard is the code so far 00:36:19 where is the live website? 00:36:52 it is still being turned on, I think 00:36:57 ok. 00:37:10 Then we take a look at first, try it, and then we make decision. 00:37:18 it is still poc? 00:38:01 we move to next topic. 00:38:10 #topic Reorganize wiki page 00:39:04 We need to improve our wiki page, to make it better organized. 00:39:33 +1 00:39:37 I want to clearly list I18n team and L10n teams, and localize L10n team. 00:39:55 Localize the page of L10n teams. 00:40:10 For example, we will have native language page for Taiwan L10n team. 00:40:35 And we provide a link to it in the main page of I18n team. 00:40:55 Any comments? 00:41:03 It's right, a native language page. 00:41:16 Daisy great! great! 00:41:29 thanks, zero00072 and macjack. 00:42:16 Clearly guide people how to join and how to contribute, that's our goal. 00:42:28 Who would like to take this job? 00:42:49 Who want to work together with me to rre-organize our wiki pages? 00:43:27 o/ me me, I can do that 00:43:35 Great, macjack. 00:43:38 :) 00:43:40 pick it up 00:43:46 I also can. 00:43:59 #action macjack, zero00072, and Daisy to re-organize the wiki page. 00:44:43 macjack and zero00072, you can create a new wiki page to make the draft, then people can give suggestions. The current wiki page won't be affected. 00:44:56 Thank you. 00:44:57 in language other than english? 00:45:18 yes, we provide local language page for L10n teams. 00:45:23 great 00:45:33 ok, move to next 00:45:43 #topic Plans in Icehouse cycle 00:45:49 Daisy: glad to do so 00:46:12 We need to make a plan for what we want to do in Icehouse. 00:46:20 firstly, document translation. 00:46:30 Again, operation guide translation. 00:47:00 operation guid version folsom? or havana? 00:47:11 Good question. 00:47:17 I think, they only have folsom, right? 00:47:28 um 00:47:29 Does operation guide have havana version? 00:47:36 ujuc, you don't like it? 00:48:20 Anne Gentle told me this year: operation guide is the top priority 00:48:20 noting :) 00:48:40 operation guide is a stable document. 00:48:47 ok :) 00:48:48 Not much changes at all. 00:49:25 for now 00:49:31 so, there is plan to make a havana version 00:49:49 fifieldt: will there be many changes? 00:50:23 there are many new components since Folsom 00:50:28 I think there should be new changes 00:50:40 we don't know yet Daisy 00:50:53 Based on icehouse release schedule: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Icehouse_Release_Schedule 00:50:54 it's going to take some effort event to say what needs to be updated 00:51:08 Which team build the guide documents? 00:51:14 String frozen is March 6th. 00:51:47 I think we need to start the message translation one month before March 6th, in order to catch the release date. 00:52:01 So before Feb 6th, we can do document translation. 00:52:38 We can have 1 document translated from now to Feb 6th. 00:52:55 OK :)) 00:53:04 I think we need a dictionary site to save words and compare the words before we can translate the documents. 00:53:09 zero00072: it's doc team, I think. 00:53:24 Yes, we definitely need one. 00:53:41 Transifex has a place to save glossary. 00:54:01 We have imported openstack glossary into Transifex. 00:54:20 Besides glossary, we also need to summarize many common words too. 00:54:42 I believe there are some tools which can do the terminologies extraction. 00:55:12 zero00072: can you take a look at the terminology extraction tool and try it ? 00:55:35 We can use the tool to extract common words, and then we translate them at first. 00:55:45 OK, I will take a try. 00:55:49 Thanks, zero00072. 00:56:07 #action zero00072 to take a look at term extract tool. 00:56:33 #action Daisy to work with Anne Gentle to check which document is better to start translation. 00:56:58 OK. I have done what I want to talk. 00:57:01 Move to next topic 00:57:07 #topic Open discussion 00:57:39 Anything you want to talk ? 00:58:21 No? 00:58:41 Me, No~~o :) 00:58:42 I have no any disscussions. 00:58:46 OK. 00:58:49 We are just in time. 00:58:51 no 00:59:02 #endmeeting