23:00:49 <sarob> #startmeeting milk
23:00:50 <openstack> Meeting started Mon Jan 13 23:00:49 2014 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes.  The chair is sarob. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
23:00:51 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
23:00:53 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'milk'
23:01:29 <sarob> meeting agenda is posted on https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/milk
23:01:59 <sarob> roll call, who do we have with us today?
23:02:11 <MrJoshua> Joshua Kolden
23:02:28 <keyvan> Keyvan Fatehi, developer @ DigitalFilm Tree
23:02:40 <GAUBUCHON> Guillaume Aubuchon, CTO @ DigitalFilm Tree
23:03:20 <sarob> okay, lets go
23:03:43 <sarob> #topic finalize weekly meeting time 3pm PST 2200 UTC on #openstack-meeting
23:04:21 <sarob> #vote 3pm PST as meeting time
23:06:01 <MrJoshua> Hmm, suboptmial for me in the middle of the day, I'd prefer beginning of the day, lunch time, or end of day, but I'll make whatever work.
23:06:02 <sarob> do we have agreement to keep this as the meeting time going forward?
23:06:19 <sarob> im good with 12pm or 3pm
23:06:35 <keyvan> it's OK for me but my cohort, Jeanre is in south africa and 3pm is a bit late for him, as it's 1 AM his time
23:07:06 <sarob> so 12pm pst would be 10pm local?
23:07:33 <keyvan> yeah that works for him, he usually signs off at like 1PM
23:08:00 <keyvan> 1PM Pacific
23:08:22 <sarob> okay so we have 3 votes for 12pm pst mondays
23:08:57 <sarob> #action milk-dev meeting time on #openstack-meeting 12pm PST going forward
23:09:27 <GAUBUCHON> SOunds good to me
23:09:27 <sarob> #topic create mailing list milk-dev@etcusc.org
23:10:02 <sarob> so this is a google group with thread history here https://groups.google.com/a/etcusc.org/forum/#!forum/milk-dev
23:10:25 <sarob> any problems with how this is working so far?
23:10:43 <keyvan> i like it, nice job with the Wiki and all this stuff :)
23:11:22 <sarob> one happy customer, yeah
23:11:47 <sarob> how about the rest of yous?
23:12:26 <GAUBUCHON> I think it will work, I like that it keeps record
23:12:27 <MrJoshua> Yep, looks good to me.  I haven't tried to edit the wiki or anything, but looks like a good way to start at leaste.
23:13:10 <sarob> ah, right for editing the wiki, you will need to create a launchpad account
23:13:19 <sarob> painless, free and easy
23:13:43 <MrJoshua> k
23:13:55 <sarob> anyone can edit the wiki and history is maintained for booboos
23:14:29 <sarob> #topic share existing metadata API with group as starting point
23:15:03 <sarob> who should I work with to get this up on the milk wiki?
23:15:53 <MrJoshua> Where are we thinking to host the code?  Github?
23:15:58 <GAUBUCHON> is there any interest iun creating a google+ circle for this group and then do a weekly hangout?
23:16:06 <GAUBUCHON> Github
23:16:16 <sarob> or rather reference the existing API so we can work on the milk api
23:16:33 <sarob> github roger that
23:16:38 <GAUBUCHON> WHat existing API are you talking about?
23:17:11 <sarob> you offered to start with the metadata api as example
23:17:14 <GAUBUCHON> Are you talking about doeye, the metadata APi we were working on?
23:17:19 <keyvan> GAUBUCHON: i see some stubbing of that here, https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Milk i imagine this is where we'll fill out more detail pre-writing code?
23:17:35 <sarob> yup
23:17:58 <sarob> is the source on github, me cant find it
23:18:10 <GAUBUCHON> Yes we can gladly contribute that as well as code for additional functionality.
23:18:19 <keyvan> 1 sec ill open it
23:18:26 <sarob> oh, coolo
23:18:51 <sarob> we should limit the number of functions supported in the prototype
23:19:04 <sarob> so we wont want to forklift
23:19:33 <keyvan> https://github.com/DFTi/doe-eye
23:19:33 <sarob> but im open to what we can get done in the time we have
23:19:35 <GAUBUCHON> We are opening that right now with MIT licensing
23:19:49 <sarob> got it
23:19:56 <keyvan> i need to add a license and ... it is written in rails >.<
23:20:49 <sarob> im open to what the group wants to build the prototype on
23:21:05 <MrJoshua> Ah, rails.  We talked about python, but I'm ok with rails too. However most client side tools in post are python.
23:21:23 <keyvan> And it is lacking docs, but Jeanre and I should probably try to extract the good out into the Wiki, separated from the rails app
23:21:23 <sarob> yeah, most are python
23:21:31 <sarob> okay
23:21:40 <keyvan> yeah lets pull the knowledge / value out of it
23:21:45 <keyvan> and then make a decision later
23:22:04 <sarob> we can focus on the api functions that we think will be good to start from
23:22:16 <sarob> structure in milk api
23:22:41 <keyvan> id like to do it in Python, considering i dont use it much
23:22:42 <MrJoshua> We can prototype and document using something like http://apiary.io/.  And simply create a blueprint doc.
23:22:48 <sarob> we can still use wsme, pecan a python api jump
23:22:50 <sarob> start
23:23:05 <MrJoshua> Then server tech isn't important.
23:23:06 <sarob> right i like that
23:23:59 <sarob> so we have three basic goals for the prototype
23:24:14 <sarob> #info Ingesting data from the many changes throughout the media pipeline
23:24:38 <sarob> #info Metadata from the data stored and the pipeline activities
23:24:57 <sarob> #info URL/URN marker identification for assets
23:26:08 <sarob> does doe-eye structure lend to the structure we came up with in dec
23:26:16 <keyvan> i found some docs
23:26:17 <keyvan> https://github.com/DFTi/doe-eye/blob/master/documentation/api.md
23:26:53 <MrJoshua> Do you guys have good coverage with rspec?  We can also use that for docs.
23:27:02 <keyvan> not sure what you guys came up with in December, my reference point is Guillaume's original document that Jeanre and I used for doe-eye
23:27:17 <keyvan> although Jeanre worked on doe-eye while i did node.js stuff on our other projects
23:27:20 <sarob> #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Milk#To_build
23:28:12 <sarob> #link https://wiki.openstack.org/w/images/thumb/7/74/Etcc-design-meeting-17dec2013.jpg/120px-Etcc-design-meeting-17dec2013.jpg
23:28:22 <keyvan> MrJoshua: https://github.com/DFTi/doe-eye/tree/master/spec/requests/api looks pretty specced out at the API level
23:28:36 <GAUBUCHON> It has some of the fundamentals
23:28:52 <sarob> #link https://wiki.openstack.org/w/images/7/74/Etcc-design-meeting-17dec2013.jpg
23:29:38 <sarob> reviewing
23:30:27 <sarob> okay we can start here
23:32:16 <MrJoshua> Yeah, this looks in some ways similar to what we have for C4.  We abstract things like 'projects' to 'groups' and make lots of different things (including projects) out of groups, and we differentiate 'assets' from other types of data / documents.
23:32:45 <sarob> we need to define some actions for the IO and metadata IO APIs
23:33:07 <sarob> DFT guys take metadata as homework
23:33:29 <sarob> and joshua?
23:33:44 <sarob> up to you guys
23:34:02 <keyvan> what do you mean take metadata as homework
23:34:15 <sarob> we can hold an extended hangout to work out the actions
23:34:56 <sarob> what actions will the metadata api be capable of
23:35:22 <sarob> when the metadata client queries
23:37:06 <keyvan> from what i understood from the original docs, vendors are just POSTing data to the API, letting the app know what doc type it is, and then post-processing occurs thereafter to make the potentially unstructured data structured
23:37:45 <keyvan> i know there's a comprehensive listing of the vision behind doe-eye , but i am still trying to figure out if that's what we're seeking to build here, or if milk is a superset or a subset or what
23:39:03 <sarob> as prototype it should be simple, collaboration project
23:39:25 <sarob> not trying to improve on doe-eye or other projects
23:39:57 <sarob> rather build a simple prototype with the three goals in mind
23:41:10 <GAUBUCHON> I know that we can contribute some of what we have already done. We can contribute for the NAB prototype without rewriting code that has already been written.
23:41:21 <sarob> if we can get the prototype working, then in may 2014 we start breaking off into groups like metadata, transport, security, archive
23:41:35 <sarob> and continue the development work
23:41:55 <sarob> guabuchon sounds good
23:42:09 <keyvan> that makes sense sarob, i like the idea of the 3 goals
23:42:33 <sarob> keyvan: excellent
23:42:44 <keyvan> i wrote them in a piratepad for my own benefit
23:42:48 <keyvan> http://piratepad.net/z9DdDDotma
23:43:04 <keyvan> as i know these 3 are like bullet points with many subpoints and discussions that can happen beneath them
23:43:16 <sarob> sure
23:43:17 <keyvan> i know we wont get to them now, but i like the idea of these as the starting point
23:43:40 <keyvan> now the 1st goal, ingesting data etc , is definitely what we were trying to do... any vendor could send us any data
23:43:59 <sarob> yup
23:44:04 <keyvan> then metadata and pipeline, to me, sounds like the next step we were to undertake which was to have workers try ot decipher/organize/structure the data
23:44:08 <GAUBUCHON> So I guess we need to know what the devision of labor is going to be and how we want to proceed
23:44:15 <sarob> so we prototype a couple of simple ones
23:44:16 <keyvan> and the URL/URN sounds like the basic request of giving everything a UUID
23:44:31 <MrJoshua> It seems to be where talking mostly about a database gateway, with some interface standardization.  Perhaps tied in with karma so that it can interface with any vender database?
23:44:36 <sarob> keyvan: yup you got it
23:44:37 <MrJoshua> #link https://github.com/InformationIntegrationGroup/Web-Karma
23:45:06 <keyvan> MrJoshua: ya karma is cool, were you at the ETC meeting when they demo'd it ?
23:45:13 <GAUBUCHON> So if we break that down we already have basic ingest, we already have code that assigns a UUID, let's put that all together to prototype quickly
23:45:18 <sarob> nope but i have heard some
23:45:21 <MrJoshua> yes
23:45:33 <keyvan> MrJoshua: i was the loudmouth at the back being overly appreciative of it :P
23:46:00 <MrJoshua> haha, it is cool and seems like what we need.
23:46:05 <sarob> so you guys want to take a stab at the milk wiki
23:46:14 <GAUBUCHON> yes
23:46:27 <sarob> edit freely brother
23:46:41 <GAUBUCHON> I have to jet to antoher call, but we will take a hack through the wiki this week.
23:46:48 <MrJoshua> here's my proposal for uuid: `openssl dgst -sha256 ingestfile`  ;)
23:46:50 <sarob> roger
23:47:28 <sarob> #topic two additional core reviewers
23:47:29 <keyvan> lol yeah for these insanely large files
23:48:14 <sarob> sarob (me) as core reviewer, who else wants the responsibility?
23:48:21 <sarob> to share
23:48:32 <keyvan> i volunteer Gullaume
23:48:35 <keyvan> he accepts
23:48:46 <sarob> he left early so its his
23:48:48 <MrJoshua> I'm happy to help, as I we talked about on the phone.
23:48:55 <sarob> righto
23:49:32 <keyvan> when do you think we get to the writing code part ? im a bit excited to take a break from ruby and node.js and learn pro python with unit tests, etc
23:49:57 <sarob> #action gaubuchon mrjoshua are nominated to core reviewers
23:50:15 <sarob> fireworks and popcorn fiies
23:50:23 <MrJoshua> keyvan: haha.  You can just start writing anything you like.
23:50:44 <keyvan> well, i want to know how to write in the style of openstack developers
23:50:48 <sarob> wellllll, wsme and pecan need to be integrated into milk
23:50:49 <MrJoshua> One thing, however, is I strongly encourage us to develop in a TDD style.
23:50:56 <keyvan> i feel like a bit of an outsider since i dont prefer python
23:51:11 <keyvan> and i dont know the tools around doing it properly with tests
23:51:23 <keyvan> yeah MrJoshua definitely
23:51:44 <sarob> #link https://github.com/stackforge/wsme
23:52:09 <sarob> #link https://github.com/stackforge/pecan
23:52:27 <keyvan> sarob these hash commands are going into some doc that we'll get at the end of the meeting?
23:52:36 <sarob> yup
23:52:45 <sarob> meetbot tracks them
23:52:49 <sarob> cooolo
23:52:57 <keyvan> and thanks i didnt know about wsme, i would have gone and used CherryPy which is the last tool i used; no tests on that particular app either :P ended up porting it to ruby/sinatra
23:53:15 <sarob> keyvan: you up for checking these out?
23:53:35 <keyvan> yea definitly
23:53:37 <sarob> they are potential web services creation standards for openstack
23:53:54 <sarob> the ceilometer project worked on them
23:54:23 <sarob> you could whack the code and post a patch with dummy para
23:54:42 <sarob> would get you used to the gerrit review process
23:55:02 <sarob> #link http://docs.openstack.org/training-guides/content/operator-getting-started-lab.html
23:55:21 <sarob> i wrote this up for the openstack contribution process
23:55:41 <keyvan> ah ok perfect. yeah that owuld be cool to make use of the gerrit thing
23:55:50 <sarob> #topic timeline
23:56:08 <keyvan> do we have a CI infrastructure?
23:56:18 <sarob> yes sir, we do
23:56:34 <sarob> we are using the stackforge subset of openstack ci
23:57:24 <sarob> #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/InfraTeam
23:57:26 <keyvan> hm so its something im unfamiliar with -- well if i get a project up and going i'll ping the group on Google Groups
23:58:02 <keyvan> ah, wicked
23:58:12 <sarob> we already have everything setup
23:58:40 <sarob> milk repo is under the stackforge parent on githb
23:58:44 <sarob> github
23:59:04 <keyvan> oh yeah i just found it
23:59:22 <MrJoshua> I need to get up to speed on it too.
23:59:23 <keyvan> so i guess it just needs some general direction, and then some code ...
23:59:26 <sarob> march 2014 is our target r2 release
23:59:31 <keyvan> MrJoshua: empty repo basically https://github.com/stackforge/milk
00:00:08 <sarob> so late feb should be bug fixing
00:00:29 <sarob> empty repo
00:00:29 <MrJoshua> Yeah thanks, I'll try to get an apiary blueprint started, since I have some experance there.  It can connect right into the github repo.
00:00:31 <sarob> right
00:00:41 <sarob> okay i have to wind down
00:00:50 <sarob> lets continue on mailing list
00:00:59 <keyvan> cool thanks guys, look forward to helping out
00:01:00 <MrJoshua> Cool.  I have to go too.
00:01:01 <sarob> roger and out people
00:01:07 <sarob> #endmeeting