13:06:38 <annegentle_> #startmeeting Doc/Web
13:06:39 <openstack> Meeting started Tue Nov 13 13:06:38 2012 UTC.  The chair is annegentle_. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
13:06:40 <koolhead17> Razique, ^^
13:06:41 <openstack> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.
13:06:42 <openstack> The meeting name has been set to 'doc_web'
13:07:36 <fifieldt> Agenda is at : http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/DocTeamMeeting
13:07:37 <annegentle_> http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings/DocTeamMeeting
13:07:41 <annegentle_> er
13:07:43 <annegentle_> :)
13:08:00 <annegentle_> #topic Action items from last meeting
13:08:18 <fifieldt> I didn't see any action items from last meeting
13:08:20 <annegentle_> There were none
13:08:23 <annegentle_> woo, moving on
13:08:30 <fifieldt> http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/doc_web_meeting/2012/doc_web_meeting.2012-10-08-20.02.html FYR :)
13:08:35 <annegentle_> #topic Folsom release branch now available
13:08:53 <annegentle_> I think you all saw that we were planning to make it on the mailing list, CI made the branch shortly afterwards
13:09:07 <annegentle_> There is one bug uncovered -- PDF links are broken
13:09:31 <annegentle_> the file names are blah-folsom.pdf for /trunk docs
13:09:39 <annegentle_> bug 1078076
13:09:40 <uvirtbot`> Launchpad bug 1078076 in openstack-manuals "FOLSOM : Unable to download PDF version of the documents" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1078076
13:09:58 <annegentle_> I haven't seen anything else though, and I can fix that today I believe. Might be a CI thing, might be in the book file (the PDF name)
13:10:08 <fifieldt> this is because docs.openstack.org still points at /trunk for docs?
13:10:24 <fifieldt> so a new /www/folsom/* needs to be created?
13:10:26 <annegentle_> fifieldt: my first guess is that I need to change the master branch book files to not have -folsom for pdf names in the book file
13:10:36 <fifieldt> right
13:10:43 <annegentle_> fifieldt: I think there is a new www/folsom
13:10:47 <fifieldt> my bad
13:10:59 <annegentle_> #link http://docs.openstack.org/folsom/
13:11:15 <annegentle_> also related to the new branch is that the Folsom branch and forward do not contain API docs
13:11:21 <annegentle_> so the openstack-manuals repo is much more lightweigth
13:11:38 <fifieldt> brilliant
13:11:55 <annegentle_> #info openstack-manuals repo does not contain any API docs now, see openstack/api-site for those docs
13:12:10 <annegentle_> I like the separation for my own mental sanity
13:12:21 <fifieldt> we also have the new launchpad for it too
13:12:29 <fifieldt> think that popped up since last meeting
13:12:43 <annegentle_> Also related is that there are many DocImpact bugs now logged for Grizzly - thanks fifieldt for keeping up with those
13:12:50 <annegentle_> ah yes
13:12:52 <fifieldt> #link https://launchpad.net/openstack-api-site
13:13:03 <annegentle_> #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-api-site
13:13:05 <annegentle_> heh
13:13:07 <annegentle_> sorry
13:13:27 <annegentle_> and it's also nice so that we can see DocImpact affecting API separately from install/config/run
13:13:32 <fifieldt> indeed
13:13:41 <Daisy> great !
13:13:42 <annegentle_> the API bugs are definitely going up in numbers
13:13:57 <annegentle_> Daisy: I think this move also helps with translation? Not really sure though
13:14:05 <koolhead17> annegentle_, and i hope we get some core devs from team helping us out with it
13:14:27 <annegentle_> koolhead17: yes I am very concerned with the lack of maintenance on API docs.
13:14:48 <annegentle_> ok, any questions on the Folsom release branch?
13:14:50 <koolhead17> annegentle_, we need some helping hand in docs too :P
13:14:54 <fifieldt> Quantum, Cinder  ?
13:14:58 <koolhead17> fifieldt, +1
13:15:10 <annegentle_> #link http://wiki.openstack.org/Documentation/HowTo#How_to_a_cherry-pick_a_change_to_a_stable_branch
13:15:23 <Daisy> Anne: not sure
13:15:30 <annegentle_> ^^ that's how you add to the stable/folsom branch… need to update that page with folsom examples
13:15:31 <uvirtbot`> annegentle_: Error: "^" is not a valid command.
13:15:51 <annegentle_> #topic Bug creation and process with DocImpact flag
13:16:33 <annegentle_> So far fifieldt and I have kept up with the process of: 1) DocImpact email comes in 2) Read it and create a doc bug in the appropriate Launchpad place 3) Triage with as much info as is available
13:16:40 <fifieldt> Seems like it's going well  - we've tagged 13 bugs with grizzly milestone so far
13:16:43 <fifieldt> #link https://launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+milestone/grizzly
13:16:55 <annegentle_> To me there is one part I'm unsure of - how will we know when it lands and the code changes?
13:17:10 <fifieldt> I believe this is part of bug triage  ...w
13:17:13 <Daisy> oh. It's not a small workload.
13:17:20 <fifieldt> when the patch is merged, we set the status to confirmed
13:17:25 <fifieldt> and can in theory start working on it
13:17:27 <annegentle_> fifieldt: okay, fair enough. I will also ask CI if they have ideas
13:17:56 <fifieldt> I try to include the link to the gerrit page for patches in the launchpad bugs
13:17:59 <annegentle_> fifieldt: ok, I think I set one or two to Triaged, are you leaving them as Status: New?
13:18:02 <fifieldt> so you can easily click through to merge
13:18:06 <annegentle_> fifieldt: yep, me too
13:18:10 <fifieldt> So far I was leaving them as new
13:18:16 <annegentle_> any other process improvements there?
13:18:18 <fifieldt> until they are merged
13:18:21 <Daisy> Can the tag trigger email after the patch is merged?
13:18:21 <fifieldt> but I'm happy with whatever works
13:18:33 <annegentle_> fifieldt: ok sounds good. I'll also see if there's any additional improvements.
13:18:35 <koolhead17> annegentle_, for the folsom release of docs is our arch diagrams and stuff modified covering the new components?
13:18:48 <annegentle_> #action Anne to ask CI team if there's notification capability with a patch with DocImpact actually merges
13:19:05 <annegentle_> koolhead17: not with new cinder?
13:19:14 <annegentle_> koolhead17: log a bug if you know of a diagram missing cinder
13:19:15 <fifieldt> Potential action point: Send an followup email to the dev list thanking them for their response to the ":use docimpact" email ?
13:19:23 <annegentle_> fifieldt: perfect, yes
13:19:24 <koolhead17> annegentle_, i already have
13:19:37 <koolhead17> annegentle_, i don`t see even Quantum in the arch :(
13:19:38 <annegentle_> #action fifieldt to send an followup email to the dev list thanking them for their response to the ":use docimpact" email
13:19:50 <annegentle_> koolhead17: bug number please? for the notes?
13:20:01 * koolhead17 checks
13:20:17 <fifieldt> https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+bug/1076282
13:20:18 <uvirtbot`> Launchpad bug 1076282 in openstack-manuals "Modification needed in Architecture Diagram" [Low,Confirmed]
13:20:19 <annegentle_> koolhead17: can you add an Agenda item to talk about the gaps you still see?
13:20:26 <annegentle_> we'll keep going through the Agenda we have
13:20:40 <annegentle_> ok anything else on DocImpact?
13:20:41 <koolhead17> https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+bug/1076282
13:20:51 <koolhead17> annegentle_, ok
13:20:58 <annegentle_> #topic Doc tools update - 1.5.1, 1.6.0 purposes and explanations
13:21:14 <annegentle_> Okay, needed to explain what's going on with the 1.5.1 update
13:21:22 * fifieldt sits on edge of seat
13:21:36 <annegentle_> I've been going through and changing as many pom files as I can to point to 1.5.1 so that the Google Analytics tracking can track across *.openstack.org
13:21:42 <annegentle_> it required a change to the maven plugin
13:21:47 <annegentle_> exciting stuff, yes!! :)
13:22:13 <annegentle_> Yesterday I found I can't build the Identity API 2.0 guide with 1.5.0 or 1.5.1. Sigh.
13:22:24 <Daisy> what could Google Analytics track?
13:22:39 <annegentle_> bug 1078108
13:22:40 <uvirtbot`> Launchpad bug 1078108 in openstack-api-site "Identity API 2.0 guide won't build on 1.5.0 or 1.5.1 version of Clouddoc tools maven plugin" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1078108
13:22:48 <annegentle_> Google Analytics tracks visitors, visits, that sort of thing
13:23:00 <annegentle_> it's helpful for knowing how readers navigate all the sites
13:23:31 <annegentle_> The Foundation staff requested the change for better usability, etc.
13:23:41 <Daisy> tracking even within DocBook pages?
13:23:52 <annegentle_> I can send another brief summary to the mailing list of what we see in our web analytis.
13:23:59 <fifieldt> that would be cool
13:24:06 <annegentle_> #action Anne to send summary report of Google Analytics info to openstack-doc mailing list
13:24:21 <Daisy> thanks.
13:24:24 <annegentle_> Daisy: yep the pom.xml contains the GA code and then embeds it in each page
13:24:35 <Daisy> that's great!
13:25:24 <annegentle_> ok so that's the reasoning for 1.5.1
13:25:48 <annegentle_> now the actually exciting one is 1.6.0
13:25:55 <annegentle_> we won't have all these pesky PDF links break any more
13:26:01 <fifieldt> :O
13:26:11 <annegentle_> it contains fixes for the manual file naming for PDFs
13:26:25 <annegentle_> but, it means all the pom.xmls must change when using 1.6.0
13:26:44 <annegentle_> #link https://github.com/rackspace/clouddocs-maven-plugin
13:26:47 <fifieldt> pom.xmls are easy enough to change ... I think
13:26:54 <annegentle_> that has the release notes for what's coming in 1.6.0
13:27:11 <annegentle_> Another feature we may want to think about is the "Automatically handle images"
13:27:34 <annegentle_> you know how you have to insert two image refs for the PDF and HTML output? This will handle that more gracefully --- and tell you if you're missing images.
13:27:40 <fifieldt> Generate pdf file names in the format basename-20121110.pdf where basename is the base pdf name and 20121110 is the taken from /*/info/pubdate in the document.
13:27:52 <fifieldt> How does that work for the docs which are split using os= ?
13:28:00 <annegentle_> Also in 1.6.0 we get the fix for the book titles for our install guides built conditioinally
13:28:14 <annegentle_> fifieldt: ah good question.
13:28:46 <annegentle_> fifieldt: we also don't want that style of naming for Google Analytics purposes for tracking over longer periods like releases
13:28:55 <annegentle_> #action Anne to investigate PDF file naming
13:29:30 <annegentle_> Another bit of news for Doc tools is that their repo is moving to openstack-ci/clouddocs-maven-plugin
13:29:39 <annegentle_> This move enables more contributors to the plugin
13:29:57 <fifieldt> brilliant
13:30:11 <annegentle_> any questions on the maven plugin?
13:30:25 <annegentle_> David Cramer is the lead dev on it and couldn't be here this morning but says hello
13:30:38 <annegentle_> #topic Gaps in Folsom doc - prioritizing
13:30:43 <annegentle_> Added that for you koolhead17
13:30:47 <fifieldt> Quantum, Cinder
13:31:09 <annegentle_> We did get a nice boost for Cinder from jgriffith which is why I went ahead and cut the folsom branch
13:31:26 <annegentle_> but we need cleanup on the install guide particularly if we are going to use Cinder as default?
13:31:52 <fifieldt> I think we still need to provide both nova-volume and cinder in Folsom doc
13:31:58 <fifieldt> to facilitate "transition"
13:32:05 <fifieldt> despite it being such similar code
13:32:07 <koolhead17> annegentle_, john did modified some cider doc which requers more clarification
13:32:10 <annegentle_> fifieldt: I think that's true
13:32:12 <koolhead17> i have assiged the bug to him
13:32:41 <koolhead17> i would say priority is to get the arch corrected
13:32:54 <annegentle_> koolhead17: bug number please?
13:32:56 <koolhead17> the bugs which are tagged with quantum needs special attention
13:33:15 <annegentle_> I'd also like to address the difference people are noting between the "ubuntu all in one" Appendix and the rest of the guide
13:33:25 <annegentle_> see bug 1078084
13:33:27 <uvirtbot`> Launchpad bug 1078084 in openstack-manuals "Install guide bugs: paste ini doesnt need mods, confusion between appendix nova.conf and sample nova.conf" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1078084
13:33:37 <fifieldt> https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+bugs?field.tag=quantum
13:33:47 <fifieldt> eg
13:33:48 <fifieldt> https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+bug/1064643
13:33:50 <uvirtbot`> Launchpad bug 1064643 in openstack-manuals "add example of basic "flat" scenario for quantum" [Medium,Triaged]
13:34:00 <annegentle_> fifieldt: yep that's the one
13:34:09 <fifieldt> Deploying quantum is not "simple" right now
13:34:11 <annegentle_> Dan Wendlandt said he'd address last week
13:34:27 <koolhead17> annegentle_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/openstack-manuals/+bug/1078057
13:34:29 <uvirtbot`> Launchpad bug 1078057 in openstack-manuals "OpenStack Install and Deploy Manual - Ubuntu: cinder flag setting is not clear" [Medium,Confirmed]
13:34:29 <annegentle_> fifieldt: koolhead17 and razique say floating ups don't work
13:34:31 <fifieldt> I think there needs to be a nice big warning about it not supporting multihost flatDHCP HA
13:34:37 <fifieldt> I'm not surprised
13:34:39 <annegentle_> fifieldt: oh good point
13:34:40 <koolhead17> itarchitectkev, around?
13:34:57 <itarchitectkev> o/
13:35:06 <Razique> itarchitectkev : I think I finally figured it out
13:35:11 <koolhead17> annegentle_, we need Dan or someone from Quantum team to regularly look at those bugs
13:35:19 <annegentle_> one thing I wondered is if the "Demo Setup" section is 1) chunked too much (as in, people don't click NEXT> and 2) placed so far down in the guide as to be invisible?
13:35:22 <Razique> floating don't work, since the L3 package is broken in the official repost
13:35:29 <koolhead17> i see most of the recent bugs coming for quantum
13:35:35 <annegentle_> koolhead17: I was supposed to send him a list of bugs, I'll take an action to do that today
13:35:45 <koolhead17> Daviey, ^^^
13:35:47 <annegentle_> #action Anne to send Dan Wendlandt a list of highest priority Quantum doc bugs
13:35:59 <annegentle_> Razique: Good detective work man!
13:36:18 <koolhead17> annegentle_, and see if we can poke kpepple for a new arch diagram to go ahead with folsom doc :)
13:36:26 <koolhead17> :)
13:36:29 <fifieldt> I think he did one, didn't hi?
13:36:30 <fifieldt> he*
13:36:31 <annegentle_> koolhead17: he did update it for folsom, but what's missing?
13:37:14 <fifieldt> #link http://docs.openstack.org/trunk/openstack-compute/admin/content/logical-architecture.html
13:37:44 <koolhead17> annegentle_, http://docs.openstack.org/trunk/openstack-compute/install/apt/content/externals.html#d6e476
13:38:21 <annegentle_> koolhead17: ah those are from Lorin if my memory serves
13:38:27 <koolhead17> Razique, are you talking about the bug related to iptables
13:38:36 <koolhead17> annegentle_, assign it to him then :D
13:38:45 <annegentle_> koolhead17: log a bug please
13:38:45 <Razique> koolhead17 : yah the one preventing floating ips from working
13:39:06 <koolhead17> annegentle_, i have logged that bug already
13:39:07 <annegentle_> Any other concerns with Folsom docs?
13:39:13 <itarchitectkev> Can I butt in with a "we need a getting started guide" - the docs are great, but you need to know where to look for the info, rather than the info being obvious.
13:39:19 <koolhead17> Razique, it will b fixed in few days
13:39:27 <itarchitectkev> I know there are some - but the documentation on quantum is immense
13:39:27 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: sure butt in!
13:39:39 <koolhead17> itarchitectkev, http://docs.openstack.org/trunk/openstack-compute/install/apt/content/ap_installingfolsomubuntuprecise.html
13:39:42 <koolhead17> there u go :P
13:39:48 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: yeah that "Demo Setup" section was supposed to be the "get started" but it causes some frustration
13:39:57 <koolhead17> me and Razique are working to get it in place :D
13:40:06 <annegentle_> #link http://docs.openstack.org/trunk/openstack-network/admin/content/app_demo.html
13:40:07 <itarchitectkev> I tend to gravitate to a blog post and I'd love to get a PDF on it from docs.openstack.org instead
13:40:27 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: which blog post is good for "getting started?"
13:40:52 <itarchitectkev> EmilienM is the go to it seems
13:41:07 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: I agree we need a better Getting Started location - so you don't like http://www.openstack.org/software/start/ ?
13:41:09 <itarchitectkev> But needs some direction on writing for a user
13:41:16 <itarchitectkev> rather than that very specific set up
13:41:32 <itarchitectkev> I would love to go there for the guides :)
13:41:34 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: ah yes. I would prefer that people contribute to the docs rather than write one-offs but not sure how to handle
13:41:38 <itarchitectkev> and I'll gladly help
13:41:51 <koolhead17> annegentle_, +1 :D
13:42:00 <fifieldt> yay, peeps
13:42:03 <annegentle_> #link https://github.com/EmilienM/doc-openstack
13:42:08 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: that the one?
13:42:12 <itarchitectkev> yeah
13:42:27 <koolhead17> itarchitectkev, i liked skible doc`s quantum archs diagram though :)
13:42:35 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: how about linking to it from  http://www.openstack.org/software/start/ ?
13:42:35 <itarchitectkev> diagrams are good
13:42:45 <itarchitectkev> annegentle_, can do for now
13:43:06 <annegentle_> #action Anne to link to EmilienM's getting started doc from  http://www.openstack.org/software/start/
13:43:19 <fifieldt> NB: that doc is for essex
13:43:20 <itarchitectkev> You know what I'd like? Even though the *cough* CloudStack Getting Started PDF is a gazillion pages long - we can do that, right?
13:43:42 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: link?
13:43:47 <fifieldt> So, I think we can help here if we write that book chapter we were thinking about in the 'planning the cluster' thing?
13:44:02 <fifieldt> the one that Joe sugggested
13:44:03 <annegentle_> fifieldt: ah right
13:44:03 <koolhead17> annegentle_, we have a getting started here too http://docs.openstack.org/trunk/openstack-compute/install/apt/content/ap_installingfolsomubuntuprecise.html
13:44:05 <annegentle_> #link https://github.com/EmilienM/openstack-folsom-guide
13:44:20 <koolhead17> it works well without quantum though :P
13:44:25 * itarchitectkev goes to look but they've moved their site since the new release
13:45:00 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: this? http://docs.cloudstack.org/CloudStack_Documentation
13:46:01 <fifieldt> ooh, they have Japanese
13:46:03 <annegentle_> koolhead17: I think that the ap_installingfolsomubuntuprecise.html serves a single purpose, want to see what itarchitectkev is talking about with a "getting started"
13:46:25 <koolhead17> well we just want to have a getting started somewhere
13:46:32 <koolhead17> :)
13:46:37 <itarchitectkev> #link http://download.cloud.com/releases/3.0.0/CloudStack3.0.0-3.0.2QuickInstallGuide.pdf
13:46:56 <fifieldt> http://docs.cloudstack.org/Leap_Second_issues_on_CloudStack_Management_Servers_%28RHEL%29_and_KVM_hosts <-- I find this amusing :s
13:47:30 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: so I think our "Install and Deploy Guide" is meant to be that, but isn't for some reason.
13:47:41 <fifieldt> Just needs some Tough Love, IMO
13:47:45 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: or for multiple reasons
13:47:58 <annegentle_> fifieldt: yeah maybe it needs to be simplified?
13:48:09 <koolhead17> annegentle_, yeah
13:48:10 <itarchitectkev> annegentle_, +1
13:48:13 <itarchitectkev> I think that's right
13:48:15 <annegentle_> Actually can we switch to open discussion so we can talk about the SLES OpenSuse addition to that guide?
13:48:17 <koolhead17> one place click button
13:48:21 <koolhead17> and bang ur done
13:48:22 <koolhead17> :)
13:48:23 <fifieldt> fine with me
13:48:29 <annegentle_> #topic SLES and OpenSuse addition to the Install guide
13:48:51 <fifieldt> https://review.openstack.org/#/c/15721/
13:48:54 <fifieldt> https://review.openstack.org/#/c/15888/
13:48:57 <annegentle_> looking at the outline for the Cloud Stack Basic Install Guide, it's really what we have… just needs revisions
13:48:59 <fifieldt> ^ the SUSE patches
13:48:59 <uvirtbot`> fifieldt: Error: "the" is not a valid command.
13:49:01 <annegentle_> ah thanks Tom
13:49:23 <fifieldt> So, actually, B1 Systems are kinda experts on SUSE deployments
13:49:39 <annegentle_> so I had another idea - what if we have two install guides, one for Object Storage + Identity, one for Identity + Compute + Image + Volumes?
13:49:51 <annegentle_> which still doesn't give us a "Basic Install Guide" sadly.
13:50:08 <annegentle_> fifieldt: yeah I really want to get the content in
13:50:12 <fifieldt> but glance stores images ... where? ;)
13:50:29 <annegentle_> fifieldt: ah there's the rub
13:50:47 <fifieldt> So, a bit of reality for a second
13:50:53 <annegentle_> what about putting the SUSE stuff in both manuals?
13:50:56 <annegentle_> fifieldt: sure
13:50:58 <fifieldt> The smallest swift cluster that is reasonable to deploy
13:51:01 <fifieldt> is 6 nodes
13:51:08 <fifieldt> (5 storage + 1 proxy)
13:51:31 <fifieldt> Even this is sometimes too large for an "OpenStack in the small" deployment
13:51:44 <fifieldt> So, perhaps it comes down to scale
13:51:46 <koolhead17> fifieldt, 6 nodes is too much :P
13:52:08 <fifieldt> If you're at the stage where 6 nodes is too much, you don't deploy swift
13:52:08 <annegentle_> fifieldt: yes
13:52:12 <fifieldt> but given our #1 design tenet is scalability
13:52:14 <annegentle_> fifieldt: you speak truth :)
13:52:25 <fifieldt> we should provide some option for storing images that sucks less than normal
13:52:56 <annegentle_> fifieldt: as in document how to store images not-in-swift?
13:53:00 <fifieldt> well,
13:53:02 <fifieldt> there are a number of caching options here that we currently don't deploy
13:53:07 <fifieldt> such as cache in glance, cache in nova
13:53:21 <fifieldt> and these mitigate the need for large amounts of high performance storage for images in some cases
13:53:30 <fifieldt> (the options are available, but there is not overview as such)
13:53:38 <fifieldt> s/available/documented
13:53:52 <annegentle_> fifieldt: agreed
13:53:59 <fifieldt> apologies for going away from the SUSE discussion :)
13:54:02 <fifieldt> just noting
13:54:05 <annegentle_> no problem
13:54:18 <annegentle_> my hope with the install/deploy guide was to have real deployments documented
13:54:24 <fifieldt> aye
13:54:25 <koolhead17> fifieldt, so are we going to have a 6 node swift doc in place :)
13:54:29 <annegentle_> fifieldt: because people shouldn't have to figure this out by word-of-mouth
13:54:33 <fifieldt> indeed
13:54:43 <koolhead17> fifieldt, sounds good to me.
13:54:44 <koolhead17> :)
13:54:47 <fifieldt> so, this is why I really like the idea of a 'designing your OpenStack' thing
13:54:50 <annegentle_> koolhead17: the install/deploy guide does say you'd need that many nodes for a real deploy (or does it?)
13:54:56 <fifieldt> to guide people through the choices they can make
13:55:01 <fifieldt> swift or no swift
13:55:02 <koolhead17> annegentle_, i doubt it does
13:55:04 <fifieldt> volumes or no volumes
13:55:09 <fifieldt> cinder or nova-network
13:55:19 <fifieldt> but to get to this stage is a serious amount of effort :)_
13:55:29 <fifieldt> hence I hope GSOC gets up!
13:55:31 <annegentle_> fifieldt: maybe this is a page-long discussion (the decision making)
13:55:32 <koolhead17> fifieldt, annegentle_ then lets have a one guide on as itarchitectkev said getting started bare minimum config
13:55:46 <annegentle_> fifieldt: yes and I was also going to say, in the operators manual
13:55:54 <koolhead17> once we have that lets extend our existing guide with multinode
13:55:55 <koolhead17> :)
13:55:58 <itarchitectkev> koolhead17 +1: this should be an agreed bare minimum that has choices dictated to the user
13:56:03 <annegentle_> koolhead17: there are already those, we just need bug fixing on them right?
13:56:25 <itarchitectkev> its not an OpenStack manual - its about getting lift-off without referring to google
13:56:35 <koolhead17> annegentle_, kind of yes. But not as descriptive as fifieldt mentioned :)
13:56:47 <annegentle_> (and you'll tell me if I'm deluded into thinking we can get there with what we have right?)
13:56:48 <koolhead17> we can even add doc with multiple scheduler implementation
13:56:50 <fifieldt> With a "bare minimum" Openstack doc in place, we still need to provide enough docs to support the people who install eg Swift Only, Glance Only
13:56:55 <koolhead17> and multiple compute node 4 same
13:57:20 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: so we have applied as a small group of deployers to write an operators manual with a Google Doc Summit.
13:57:26 <annegentle_> but haven't heard if we're accepted
13:57:37 <itarchitectkev> who do I need to point the gun at?
13:57:38 <itarchitectkev> :)
13:57:43 * fifieldt dodges
13:57:45 <annegentle_> #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/EssexOperationsGuide
13:57:54 <annegentle_> basically to write a book like that outline in a week :)
13:58:26 <itarchitectkev> easy
13:58:44 <itarchitectkev> Get 1,000 monkeys, with typewriters and hope that they don't come up with some Shakespeare this time
13:58:53 <fifieldt> I prefer Chaucer
13:58:53 <koolhead17> itarchitectkev, :P
13:59:02 <koolhead17> annegentle_, GSOC ^^
13:59:35 <annegentle_> the group is fifieldt (U of Melbourne), Everett Towes (Cybera then Rackspace), Joe Topjian (Cyberra), and Jon Proulx (Mass. Institute of Tech.)
14:00:11 <itarchitectkev> when do you know?
14:00:19 <annegentle_> #link https://sites.google.com/site/docsprintsummitv2/
14:00:28 <annegentle_> itarchitectkev: I've been bugging them for the last 2 weeks :)
14:00:31 <annegentle_> I know the organizers
14:00:47 <annegentle_> ok what else?
14:01:11 <fifieldt> SUE?
14:01:17 <fifieldt> SUSE?
14:01:32 <fifieldt> You think we can work with them to make it a complete standalone suse version?
14:01:43 <fifieldt> or not possible? or it will take too long and you want it out asap?
14:01:58 <annegentle_> fifieldt: seems like that's the only "real" pattern we have
14:02:15 <annegentle_> fifieldt: I'm not in a hurry -- and I still have a concern about it -- what about Keystone for Identity?
14:02:24 <fifieldt> indeed
14:02:28 <annegentle_> fifieldt: do we require that any standalone version use Keystone?
14:02:31 <fifieldt> do they have packages yet?
14:02:50 * fifieldt notes 1 hour has passed, and apologies for stringing the conversation along
14:03:46 <koolhead17> fifieldt, :)
14:03:49 <annegentle_> you know I'm loathe to reject a doc addition
14:03:53 <annegentle_> fifieldt: no worries
14:04:06 <annegentle_> fifieldt: if they don't have Identity package, does it matter (esp. for swift?)
14:04:14 <fifieldt> for swift, not at all
14:04:21 <annegentle_> it's kind of tied up in the "what is really openstack?" discussion I suppose
14:04:30 <fifieldt> hmm, I'm more pragmatic
14:04:34 <annegentle_> fifieldt: we could let them have a standalone guide and not conditionalize it at all
14:04:41 <fifieldt> the doc contribution was in the install guide which is combined
14:04:48 <annegentle_> fifieldt: yeah I'd rather get more info out in the docs ecosystem
14:04:48 <fifieldt> whereas we do have a swift-only guide
14:04:57 <fifieldt> which it could be included in right now . . .
14:05:01 <annegentle_> fifieldt: yeah that's another idea --- new install section in the swift-only guide
14:05:05 <annegentle_> fifieldt: I like it
14:05:18 <fifieldt> though I have a feeling they have more to contribute
14:05:23 <fifieldt> and would come on board if we asked :)
14:05:36 <annegentle_> fifieldt: yeah
14:05:49 <fifieldt> perhaps we could organise a meeting with the B1 guys? Or maybe it only needs an email?
14:05:51 <annegentle_> fifieldt: I see one of their guys at Austin OpenStack meet ups and they really want to help
14:06:02 <annegentle_> fifieldt: just to ensure I know the proposal --
14:06:05 <annegentle_> let me repeat it
14:06:28 <annegentle_> 1. Note in the Install/deploy guide that packages for SLES OpenSuse are available
14:06:58 <annegentle_> 2. Move the info from https://review.openstack.org/#/c/15721/ to the Object Storage admin manual
14:07:12 <annegentle_> 3. Ask about Identity
14:07:18 <annegentle_> sound right?
14:07:23 <fifieldt> das is gut
14:08:01 <annegentle_> fifieldt: ok, I'll start with an email
14:08:17 <annegentle_> #action Anne to send email to Christian Berendt with proposal for moving forward with SLES OpenSuse install info
14:08:22 <annegentle_> sweet!
14:08:25 <annegentle_> I like the new meeting time
14:08:30 <annegentle_> ok, thanks for sticking it out
14:08:35 <annegentle_> #endmeeting