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| openstackgerrit | 王昊 proposed openstack/election master: Late candidacy for Zaqar PTL position of Xena Cycle https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/election/+/780150 | 06:25 |
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| yoctozepto | zaqar moved to late | 08:02 |
| yoctozepto | better and better every day :-) | 08:02 |
| yoctozepto | 2 projects left - they consider dpl | 08:03 |
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| openstackgerrit | Aurelien Lourot proposed openstack/governance master: Add Magnum charm to OpenStack charms https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/780212 | 09:53 |
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| jungleboyj | yoctozepto: ++ That is good news. | 13:54 |
| jungleboyj | Understandable that people are running behind. Lot going on everywhere right now. | 13:55 |
| fungi | so far the late volunteers can be found at https://review.opendev.org/q/project:openstack/election+is:open+label:code-review=-2 | 13:59 |
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| rosmaita | anyone around to talk about requirements updates? | 14:28 |
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| fungi | in what context? | 14:49 |
| * fungi has not caught up on e-mail this morning, so apologies if it's in there somewhere | 14:50 | |
| rosmaita | fungi: no, not in email | 14:51 |
| rosmaita | just had a discussion with hberaud in #openstack-cinder | 14:51 |
| rosmaita | so my short term question is answered | 14:51 |
| fungi | ahh, okay cool | 14:51 |
| rosmaita | more general question is that i updated the requirements for os-brick for last week's release, and got some negative feedback | 14:52 |
| rosmaita | http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2021-March/020899.html | 14:52 |
| rosmaita | eharney noticed that by updating eventlet in os-brick, that means consumers of the brick library (looking at nova) will have to use 0.30.1 too) | 14:53 |
| rosmaita | which they probably are in the gates | 14:53 |
| rosmaita | but still, it might be better to have some coordination on this | 14:53 |
| rosmaita | also about that email, eharney suggested that maybe in requirements we only specify x.y.0 versions as minimums when doing general updates, and only specify a patch version when the patched version is known to be needed | 14:53 |
| rosmaita | which seems reasonable | 14:53 |
| rosmaita | so i guess this is really a request for the TC to come up with a clear policy | 14:53 |
| fungi | i think the concern there is that increasing your listed minimums even if you don't have reason to believe it's necessary isa knee-jerk reaction to not testing them any longer | 14:53 |
| rosmaita | yeah, i can see that, but just running unit tests doesn't seem to be much validation | 14:54 |
| rosmaita | we | 14:54 |
| fungi | or in order to simplify testing of them | 14:54 |
| rosmaita | 'd have to run complete integration gates with the l-c, i would think | 14:54 |
| fungi | the counterargument is that distribution package maintainers are going to need to do their own testing either way to confirm whether the versions of dependencies they ship will work, regardless of whether they're older or newer than what our projects claim to support | 14:55 |
| rosmaita | yeah, that was what i took away from the discussion in february | 14:57 |
| rosmaita | this one: http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2021-February/020556.html | 14:58 |
| rosmaita | but i was starting to wonder whether i had misread the thread | 14:59 |
| gmann | yeah, we cannot test it in integration way i mean if we have to do it will be large effort. | 14:59 |
| fungi | well, the thread didn't say projects should increase their minimums any differently than they've done in the past, but i suppose it didn't say they can't either | 14:59 |
| rosmaita | gmann: btw, left a comment for you on https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/cinder/+/774163 | 15:00 |
| gmann | rosmaita: ack, | 15:00 |
| rosmaita | gmann: no rush, just before RC-time :) | 15:00 |
| gmann | there are lot of things from distro side we would not be able to tests at upstream | 15:01 |
| gmann | rosmaita: we discussed it in yesterday TC meeting also and will continue in next TC meeting too | 15:01 |
| rosmaita | i didn't realize that! | 15:01 |
| rosmaita | will have to look | 15:01 |
| gmann | and find what all we can do (which is what we have proposed in ML) and how to document those | 15:01 |
| rosmaita | i have a conflict for TC thursday meeting, so i don't attend very often | 15:02 |
| rosmaita | i didn't realize that the discussion was still continuing | 15:02 |
| gmann | rosmaita: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/tc/2021/tc.2021-03-11-15.00.log.html#l-126 | 15:02 |
| rosmaita | thanks | 15:03 |
| gmann | rosmaita: anyways I will ping you when we continue it | 15:03 |
| rosmaita | gmann: ty | 15:03 |
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| fungi | rosmaita: to be clear, we didn't really discuss projects updating their requirements minimums, just whether the tc should be implementing a lower bounds testing policy of any kind and if so, what it should include | 15:07 |
| rosmaita | fungi: right, it would be helpful to get some guidance about updating the minima | 15:07 |
| fungi | my concern is that the cure (tc enshrining lower bounds management and testing policy) could be worse than the disease (letting projects decide for themselves how they want to handle it) | 15:09 |
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| gmann | if we have l-c file lower bound mismatch with requirements.txt then requirement check fail so we have to sync requirements min if we tests l-c | 15:09 |
| rosmaita | i am ok with letting each project decide | 15:09 |
| rosmaita | just want to make sure i am not being too aggressive and causing problems for other people | 15:10 |
| fungi | the lower bounds in each project's requirements.txt and test-requirements.txt files have to be at least as low as the lower bounds in the global-requirements.txt, yes | 15:10 |
| fungi | pretty sure we already test that | 15:10 |
| fungi | but it would be good to double-check that's still the case | 15:11 |
| gmann | there is no lower bound in global-requirements.txt anymore | 15:11 |
| gmann | everything else other than lower-constraints job are tested with upper bound in upper-constraints.txt | 15:12 |
| gmann | challenge in "letting projects decide" is, we will be leaving Debian use case of lower bound uncomplete, when many or few project start removing the loer bound testing and some keep. | 15:13 |
| fungi | oh, yep i see the lower bounds got removed from global-requirements.txt, now it just has inclusions | 15:13 |
| gmann | we should either do it in all projects or say we do not do and if any project does that is just extra things from them | 15:14 |
| gmann | yeah | 15:14 |
| gmann | i mean "as openstack upstream we do not provide lower bound" or "as openstack upstream we provide lower bound consistently for all project we release" | 15:15 |
| fungi | oh, yep, looks like i missed that the lower bounds were stripped out of global-requirements.txt after queens. i guess that was because we decided it was too hard to test that the lower bounds in each project were at least as inclusive? | 15:16 |
| gmann | yeah. in queens or so | 15:16 |
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| fungi | anyway, honestly, i think i'd be okay saying that openstack can't make any guarantees about lower bounds without thorough integration testing with them, and as that's not feasible, we just publish lists of the package versions we tested with and expect distribution package maintainers to perform their own testing if they want to ship different versions of dependencies than we tested (which is inevitable | 15:17 |
| fungi | anyway) | 15:17 |
| openstackgerrit | Ghanshyam proposed openstack/governance master: Appoint Hao Wang as Zaqar PTL https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/780279 | 15:20 |
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