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| mnaser | It's office hours if my calendar is making sense of the time | 01:23 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ifat Afek proposed openstack/governance master: Appointment of a new Vitrage PTL https://review.opendev.org/660563 | 05:38 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ifat Afek proposed openstack/governance master: Appointment of a new Vitrage PTL https://review.opendev.org/660563 | 05:44 |
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| asettle | o/ | 09:29 |
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| mnaser | hola | 11:18 |
| asettle | o/ | 11:42 |
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| evrardjp | mnaser: you seem to be at kubecon there. | 13:15 |
| mnaser | evrardjp: ..really? I'm pretty sure I'm not :-P | 13:15 |
| evrardjp | "hola" | 13:16 |
| mnaser | oh | 13:16 |
| mnaser | lol | 13:16 |
| evrardjp | still in china? | 13:16 |
| mnaser | it's 'late' and I thought providing some comedic relief, ha | 13:16 |
| mnaser | yeah | 13:16 |
| mnaser | I'm forcing myself to not use a vpn and it's not easy | 13:16 |
| evrardjp | it's generally the other way ? :p | 13:17 |
| mnaser | for starters: we use google apps so that's hectic on it's own | 13:17 |
| mnaser | secondly, it's just unreal how this entire country *runs* on wechat, it's not just a 'chat' thing here | 13:17 |
| mnaser | the entire country runs on it, from mobile payments, to ordering food, to online wallet, its like at the heart of everything | 13:18 |
| mnaser | I wouldn't compare it to a whats app or something | 13:18 |
| fungi | yes, i hear there are now lots of establishments where you can't pay unless you use the wechat app on a smartphone | 13:18 |
| evrardjp | yes | 13:18 |
| mnaser | yep. I actually really wanted to 'be involved' so I've got myself a Chinese #, bank account, WeChat pay, everything, heh. | 13:18 |
| ricolin | o/ | 13:18 |
| mnaser | and I think we massively underestimate the language barrier. | 13:18 |
| fungi | which i'm sure is great because that way the government knows exactly where you are vai gps any tmie you make a financial transaction | 13:19 |
| mnaser | seriously. there is a TON of talent here, but English is very rare | 13:19 |
| ricolin | mnaser, that's true:) | 13:19 |
| mnaser | I am very much surprised at how little English exists, I have a lovely interpreter/translator that has been great but the talent is amazing here, seriously, I am very impressed at work in general.. just the language. | 13:19 |
| mnaser | I can only assume because translation is hard (in general), it's been difficult to get accurate translations. | 13:21 |
| mnaser | interestingly enough, google translate isn't blocked though, so something to keep on your phone if you need | 13:22 |
| mnaser | and if you're roaming with your SIM, you're not subject to firewall stuff | 13:22 |
| ricolin | mnaser, that's the trick:) | 13:23 |
| mnaser | I hear you can buy 'Hong Kong' sims which also aren't subject to that as well | 13:23 |
| mnaser | but having a Chinese numbers helps a lot in getting the local services (i.e. Didi, the 'uber/lyft' of china) | 13:23 |
| * mnaser twiddles thumbs while waiting for a clone of openstack-ansible at 21.00 KiB/s | 13:23 | |
| mnaser | high latency + git = no bueno | 13:24 |
| ricolin | I wonder how many people know that they can't call uber or any taxi service if they don't have Didi there;( | 13:24 |
| mnaser | didi was hard to get on an iPhone to be honest | 13:24 |
| mnaser | you had to get a Chinese phone number, setup a Chinese iTunes Store account to be able to download it. android is much easier | 13:25 |
| asettle | I'm sure the Foundation is already on it, but this kind of content will be helpful before the Shanghai summit | 13:25 |
| asettle | Just a "before you go tips and tricks" kinda thing | 13:25 |
| mnaser | yep. I'm sure the foundation has that stuff covered, they're there pretty often, but they know I'd be happy to share some of the things I've learned as a 'first timer' | 13:25 |
| ricolin | asettle, get your own SIM, download some local app to have map service with local wifi, and stay with whoever got Didi in their phone:) | 13:26 |
| mnaser | tc-members: I'd like to put more eyes on https://review.opendev.org/#/c/655484/ -- I'm going to move it from project-update to formal-vote rules because it seems to have sparked a discussion that I think more TC members need to be involved in. | 13:28 |
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| asettle | Ya got it | 13:32 |
| asettle | ricolin, seems like the way to go | 13:32 |
| fungi | i think what ricolin just said is we should simply follow him around the whole week ;) | 13:33 |
| fungi | or whoever he's following around | 13:33 |
| asettle | Basically | 13:34 |
| zaneb | that's been my plan for some time | 13:37 |
| ricolin | fungi, asettle, zaneb I can teach you how to say 'bear' and 'restroom' in Mandarin, that should solve most of the needs:) | 13:38 |
| asettle | Oh brilliant very helpful thank you ricolin | 13:38 |
| ricolin | s/bear/beer/ | 13:38 |
| asettle | It was better when it was bear... | 13:38 |
| fungi | oh, i thought running from bears in the streets of shanghai was going to be something we needed to deal with | 13:39 |
| asettle | Can you learn how to say bear and get back to us? | 13:39 |
| mugsie | well, bear may be useful if we want to rob a panda on the way home ;P | 13:39 |
| ricolin | asettle, we not going to the zoo asettle :) | 13:39 |
| asettle | All that panda robbing you had planned mugsie , down the drain | 13:39 |
| zaneb | ricolin: can you though? your attempts to teach me to say 'Huawei' have been pretty unsuccessful | 13:39 |
| asettle | ricolin, HOW DO YOU KNOW | 13:39 |
| asettle | zaneb, it's your shit accent ;) | 13:39 |
| zaneb | rofl | 13:39 |
| mugsie | or is he just too loud | 13:39 |
| fungi | BEAR! | 13:40 |
| * fungi runs | 13:40 | |
| asettle | fungi, that's not in Mandarin | 13:40 |
| fungi | d'oh | 13:40 |
| zaneb | also I'm gonna need to know how to say both beer and bear now | 13:40 |
| asettle | Yeah phew | 13:40 |
| asettle | So glad I'm here to help | 13:40 |
| ricolin | zaneb, well, practice make a better man! | 13:40 |
| asettle | Okay, everyone get practicing, thanks to Google translate we now have "bear" | 13:40 |
| asettle | 熊 | 13:40 |
| asettle | I hope that helps | 13:40 |
| ricolin | haha | 13:41 |
| mugsie | so much better, thanks asettle | 13:41 |
| asettle | I aim to please. | 13:41 |
| asettle | Conversely, for beer zaneb you need to say: 啤酒 | 13:41 |
| openstackgerrit | Mohammed Naser proposed openstack/governance master: help-most-needed: remove reference to infracloud https://review.opendev.org/655793 | 13:43 |
| ricolin | asettle, nice! you will do great in Shanghai now with bear熊 and beer啤酒 :) | 13:43 |
| asettle | Hooray! | 13:43 |
| asettle | I'm a natural. | 13:43 |
| mnaser | evrardjp, mugsie: https://review.opendev.org/#/c/643603/ seems like you have concerns that have gone unanswered, do you think you can reach out to Ivan directly perhaps? | 13:46 |
| mugsie | I don't :) | 13:46 |
| persia | (for those that prefer other sources of alcohol, generally anything in the *酒 class serves the purpose) | 13:49 |
| evrardjp | mugsie: you wrote "but I will see if a can drum up some feedback from the JS experts" | 13:49 |
| evrardjp | :D | 13:49 |
| mugsie | there was a thread, I thought it was linked : | 13:50 |
| mugsie | :/ | 13:50 |
| evrardjp | it is linked | 13:50 |
| mugsie | nope | 13:50 |
| evrardjp | oh I thought you meant http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2019-March/003809.html | 13:51 |
| evrardjp | which could be the reason why I was expecting more things :) -- but this is old, I am not sure my memory goes that far :p | 13:51 |
| mugsie | http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2019-March/003856.html says "This means that it should be safe to change | 13:52 |
| mugsie | NodeJS version on gates to use v10 and Bionic." | 13:52 |
| mugsie | so I think we are OK | 13:52 |
| mnaser | oof, I think the governance tooling isn't accurate in enforcing rules | 13:53 |
| mnaser | 0 yes, 1x -1 and it somehow things its ok to land | 13:53 |
| fungi | which change? | 13:53 |
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| mnaser | https://review.openstack.org/657140 for exmaple | 13:54 |
| mnaser | looks like a very open 'else' clause | 13:54 |
| fungi | oh, you mean the governance script which tells you which changes still need votes | 13:54 |
| fungi | not gerrit itself | 13:54 |
| mugsie | mnaser: code review vs Rollcall? | 13:54 |
| evrardjp | mugsie: let me rephrase -- I have seen that it was okay to move to 10 with that thread, but I wasn't sure if we need to bump to that specific version. 8 makes sense for some distro, 11 makes sense for devs... We are in the middle and basically defining what the stack will be. -- Which is a great position, because if we do that, I don't see technically why we couldn't have a similar approach to decide python versions :p | 13:55 |
| mnaser | I guess it's technically right: "For other changes within an existing project team, like addition of a new git repository or self-assertion of a tag, we use lazy consensus. If there is no objection posted one week after the change is proposed (or a significant new revision of the change is posted), then the change can be approved by the chair." -- but there's no one saying 'yes' either so I'll adjust accordingly | 13:56 |
| mugsie | evrardjp: I am documenting what we do right now, which is download node from the nodejs website, and ignore the distor version | 13:56 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Add IPv6 support and testing goal for Train https://review.opendev.org/653545 | 13:56 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Add new Keystone SAML Mellon charm repositories https://review.opendev.org/656658 | 13:56 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Clean up infra repo list https://review.opendev.org/657275 | 13:56 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Do not mark refstack repos as retired https://review.opendev.org/657594 | 13:56 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Remove osf and jjb projects from Infrastructure https://review.opendev.org/657676 | 13:56 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Add cyborg-tempest-plugin repository to the governance repository https://review.opendev.org/657766 | 13:56 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Add Foundation MemberID for TC members https://review.opendev.org/657787 | 13:56 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Use opendev for repository links https://review.opendev.org/658369 | 13:56 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Nest tag project output to make sorting look sane https://review.opendev.org/659310 | 13:56 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Add ':' separator for tag deliverables https://review.opendev.org/659792 | 13:56 |
| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/governance master: Remove source license from generated doc output https://review.opendev.org/659321 | 13:56 |
| evrardjp | mugsie: I see. | 13:56 |
| evrardjp | so 10 being the current LTS it makes sense | 13:57 |
| mugsie | yeah | 13:57 |
| mugsie | let me fix the spelling of node.js to keep jroll happy, and we should be good to go | 13:57 |
| evrardjp | Node.js? | 13:57 |
| fungi | yeah, we have zuul roles to fetch nodejs/npm from nodesource for jobs which want to do that, so i guess if openstack projects are using those roles in the jobs they run then they weren't really following the pti anyway | 13:58 |
| evrardjp | fungi: I see, I didn't know that either | 13:58 |
| fungi | Node.js is the official spelling, nodejs is the package name on a number of popular distros | 13:58 |
| evrardjp | fungi: I was just joking towards mugsie :p | 13:59 |
| fungi | (due to normalization rules for package names) | 13:59 |
| openstackgerrit | Mohammed Naser proposed openstack/governance master: tools: report dissenting votes for project-update https://review.opendev.org/660718 | 14:00 |
| openstackgerrit | Graham Hayes proposed openstack/governance master: Update nodeJS PTI version for Train https://review.opendev.org/643603 | 14:00 |
| openstackgerrit | Graham Hayes proposed openstack/governance master: Update nodeJS PTI version for Train https://review.opendev.org/643603 | 14:00 |
| openstackgerrit | Mohammed Naser proposed openstack/governance master: gitignore: add .eggs https://review.opendev.org/660720 | 14:02 |
| mnaser | so, it looks like any motions (i.e. formal-vote) imply the following: "Motions should therefore be announced on the development mailing list and posted to Gerrit for review for a minimum of 7 calendar days." | 14:08 |
| mnaser | don't know how much of sending the the development mailing list we do. should we start enforcing that somewhat (and revise mentioning openstack-discuss), should we drop that requirement.. I'm open for thoughts | 14:09 |
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| fungi | yes, that was meant to reduce the number in our community who are surprised by the tc passing motions they were unaware of any prior discussion for | 14:13 |
| fungi | so that they can just watch the ml and not have to subscribe to the governance project in gerrit to find out | 14:13 |
| fungi | i think it's still a good idea | 14:14 |
| fungi | and in most cases we do, insofar as motions/resolutions tend to stem from ml discussions which have already happened or are underway | 14:14 |
| fungi | i would argue that if we're actually proposing stuff which hasn't already been discussed on the ml, that's a warning sign that we may be operating in an echo chamber | 14:16 |
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| dhellmann | mnaser : the check-review-status tool only counts RollCall votes when determining if it's OK to land something, so if that patch is old enough and has no RC votes I think it's saying based on the lazy approval rules it's OK for you to just approve it | 14:25 |
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| mnaser | dhellmann: gotcha. | 14:34 |
| mnaser | I added an extra check for CR because usually we seem to check for those (on things like depends-on, etc) in 660718 -- I welcome comments :? | 14:34 |
| mnaser | :> | 14:34 |
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| fungi | in case anyone asks about usa export restriction details for openstack, we can direct them to http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/foundation/2019-May/002778.html and the resources linked from that | 19:30 |
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| * smcginnis was happy to see that | 19:33 | |
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| dims | thanks fungi | 19:53 |
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| fungi | i didn't write it, but happy to help circulate! | 19:54 |
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| openstackgerrit | Dirk Mueller proposed openstack/project-team-guide master: Update global-requirements stable policy to match reality https://review.opendev.org/660853 | 22:38 |
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| openstackgerrit | Dirk Mueller proposed openstack/project-team-guide master: Extend and clarify the section about when security fixes are acceptable https://review.opendev.org/660855 | 22:52 |
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