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| ttx | o/ | 09:00 |
|---|---|---|
| ttx | (Office hours time) | 09:00 |
| ttx | Who is around ? flaper87 johnthetubaguy maybe? | 09:01 |
| ttx | I don't see cdent on the channel list | 09:02 |
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| johnthetubaguy | ttx: I had intended to be, but got distracted | 10:55 |
| johnthetubaguy | ttx: hoping to have a job again soon-ish, apparently paperwork can take a long time | 10:56 |
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| ttx | It can indeed | 11:29 |
| flaper87 | o/ | 11:33 |
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| ttx | For those interested, I refreshed the contribution drop data a couple of weeks ago after smcginnis asked for it | 12:35 |
| ttx | See https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/9YSc50YgUb | 12:35 |
| ttx | A number of project exhibit a YoY drop > 30%: keystone, swift, glance, searchlight, designate, horizon, heat, trove, docs, oslo, sahara, chef, fuel | 12:38 |
| cdent | ttx: do insight to how many different factors are involved in the drop. For example we know that one major factor is lack of people supply, but is there any extent to which "maturity" could be a factor? | 12:39 |
| ttx | Most of the drop is stable (i.e. not worse today than a couple of months ago), only a few projects seem to have recently dropped: swift, fuel, sahara, trove | 12:40 |
| ttx | cdent: maturity is a factor in the 2016 drop around oslo, for sure | 12:40 |
| ttx | some are more of a long-term trend, like Horizon | 12:40 |
| ttx | (or docs) | 12:41 |
| ttx | Others are just base projects that had an unusual concentration in "original" contributors from Rackspace / IBM / Intel, like Glance or Keystone | 12:41 |
| ttx | so when one of the oldies decide to readjust their contribution, it hurts those base projects more | 12:42 |
| * cdent nods | 12:43 | |
| ttx | Keystone, Glance, Horizon & Docs are slightly more worrisome, since lots of projects depend on them | 12:44 |
| ttx | For Horizon & Docs I'd say that those teams should have migrated to more of a mentoring / base tooling team a long time ago | 12:44 |
| ttx | since there is no way you can do that work for everyone anyway | 12:45 |
| ttx | Dangerous levels (> 60% drop) are only reached for Fuel, Trove, Designate and Searchlight | 12:48 |
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| ttx | Trove seems to be in better shape now that amrith found a new home | 12:48 |
| ttx | Fuel is an outlier, which we should probably make a hosted project at that point | 12:48 |
| ttx | Designate we identified early I something that needs support | 12:49 |
| ttx | s/I/as | 12:49 |
| ttx | Searchlight... more of an open question I guess | 12:50 |
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| notmyname | ttx: FWIW, here's my graph tracking swift active contribs http://d.not.mn/active_contribs.png | 12:51 |
| cdent | searchlight will be interesting over the long run: nova wants to depend on it for listing instances from multiple cells | 12:51 |
| ttx | On the bright side, those projects experience YoY growth: ironic, karbor, kuryr, zun, kolla, watcher, cloudkitty, dragonflow, freezer, monasca, senlin, watcher | 12:52 |
| ttx | notmyname: would you see it tracks Rackspace's diminishing involvement, or there is more ? | 12:53 |
| ttx | (also why are you up at this hour ? traveling ?) | 12:54 |
| ttx | cdent: wasn't there a thread on using ELK stack (now ElasticStack) instead ? | 12:54 |
| ttx | notmyname: err.. I mean "say", not "see" | 12:55 |
| cdent | it's unclear how any of that resolved | 12:55 |
| cdent | the question of how to deal with parsing notifications still remains, and searchlight was going to fix that | 12:55 |
| notmyname | ttx: rackspace (at least cloud files) hasn't been actively involved for years. maybe since 2015. maybe 2014? | 12:56 |
| notmyname | ttx: other RAX activity has been largely from matt in australia (who was part of the OSIC fallout) | 12:56 |
| notmyname | ttx: I've got a meeting now, but I'd be happy to discuss later | 12:57 |
| ttx | notmyname: yeah, so maybe more of a "old project with old contributors" effect, where reduction of involvement from initial large shops affects old projects more (like Glance and Keystone) | 12:58 |
| ttx | notmyname: ack, happy to | 12:58 |
| notmyname | ttx: one factor is IBM (the increase starting mid 2015) and their subsequent 1.3 billion purchase on a swift competitor (spring 2016) | 12:59 |
| ttx | yeah, might just be a return to "normal levels", but still would prefer to see that curve start to flatten | 13:01 |
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| smcginnis | ttx: Thanks for pulling all that data. I find it useful. | 13:07 |
| ttx | smcginnis: also refreshed my YoY merged commits graph @ http://imgur.com/a/I52r0 | 13:10 |
| ttx | In terms of official "OpenStack" activity June 2015-June 2016 is comparable to June 2016-June 2017 | 13:11 |
| smcginnis | ttx: That actually doesn't look so bad, IMO. | 13:11 |
| ttx | smcginnis: especially if you consider that we stopped adding that many projects | 13:11 |
| smcginnis | True! | 13:12 |
| ttx | (which was fueling most of the growth) | 13:12 |
| ttx | Now ideally I would graph key projects with the same timeline... nomrlizing on 2014 contributions or so | 13:13 |
| * smcginnis likes pictures :) | 13:13 | |
| cdent | 4 color glossies | 13:13 |
| ttx | but then even that would be misleading, as it's "normal" that some projects drop activity when they get to "enough features" | 13:13 |
| ttx | one might even consider that healthy | 13:13 |
| * cdent queues up alice's restaurant | 13:14 | |
| ttx | I use that analysis to make sure there isn't a big issue flying under the radar, not really to dictate actions :) | 13:14 |
| ttx | for example here, I did not notice until few weeks ago that swift contributors have been dropping for the last year or so | 13:15 |
| smcginnis | Numbers can be skewed in so many different ways, it's hard to just take anything at face value since there are so many factors. | 13:15 |
| smcginnis | But I think you're right, it's good to see if anything stands out. | 13:15 |
| ttx | Right. I take those as "things are not completely horrible" | 13:16 |
| smcginnis | +1 | 13:16 |
| smcginnis | When I've been asked, I've been saying things are healthy and we're focusing more on things that are important. | 13:16 |
| smcginnis | These numbers at least don't disprove that. :) | 13:17 |
| ttx | smcginnis: still, I think we shouldn't ignore that the days where we could afford not to actively look for new contributors are over :) | 13:17 |
| ttx | especially for critical functions and projects others depend on | 13:18 |
| smcginnis | ttx: Times are certainly changing. | 13:18 |
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| fungi | oh, right, i should add our office hours to my schedule while i'm thinking about it (not that i was awake at 09:00 utc today) | 16:48 |
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