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| mlavalle | #startmeeting neutron_drivers | 14:00 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Fri May 24 14:00:03 2019 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is mlavalle. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 14:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 14:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: neutron_drivers)" | 14:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'neutron_drivers' | 14:00 |
| slaweq | hi | 14:00 |
| tidwellr | hi | 14:00 |
| mlavalle | hi there | 14:00 |
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| mlavalle | let's wait a couple of minutes to get quorum | 14:01 |
| davidsha | hey | 14:01 |
| njohnston | bcafarel: Can you give me the link to the most current version of the OSP 15 issues spreadsheet?o/ | 14:02 |
| njohnston | oops wrong channel! :-/ | 14:02 |
| bcafarel | :) | 14:02 |
| slaweq | njohnston: You are thinking about OSP-15 all the time :D | 14:03 |
| njohnston | :-D | 14:03 |
| mlavalle | tidwellr: I think we were not supposed to read that. so erase it from your memory | 14:04 |
| mlavalle | :-) | 14:04 |
| tidwellr | I see nothing....... | 14:04 |
| slaweq | watch out at home, You can say to Your wife "can You give me link to OSP-15 spreedsheet" instead of "can You give me a salt" :D | 14:04 |
| njohnston | ROTFL | 14:04 |
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| ralonsoh | sorry I'm late | 14:06 |
| mlavalle | no problem. waiting for quorum | 14:06 |
| mlavalle | we need one more driver | 14:06 |
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| slaweq | I think that amotoki should be around, he was reviewing some patches just few minutes ago :) | 14:07 |
| mlavalle | amotoki: ping | 14:07 |
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| * haleyb wanders in late | 14:14 | |
| mlavalle | welcome haleyb | 14:14 |
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| haleyb | sorry, was at vet with a very excited dog | 14:14 |
| haleyb | the vet gives lots of cookies | 14:14 |
| mlavalle | oh, I thought you went late to bed watching the Bruins | 14:15 |
| haleyb | not until the 27th, it feels like next season | 14:15 |
| slaweq | haleyb: cookies were for You or for the dog? :D | 14:15 |
| haleyb | the dog ate enough for both of us :) | 14:16 |
| mlavalle | LOL | 14:16 |
| slaweq | LOL | 14:16 |
| mlavalle | ok, let's get going | 14:16 |
| mlavalle | #topic RFEs | 14:16 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "RFEs (Meeting topic: neutron_drivers)" | 14:16 | |
| mlavalle | We have one RFE to discuss today | 14:16 |
| mlavalle | https://bugs.launchpad.net/neutron/+bug/1828607 | 14:16 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1828607 in neutron "[RFE] DVR Enhancements" [Wishlist,In progress] | 14:17 |
| mlavalle | which was submitted by tidwellr | 14:17 |
| tidwellr | so, we talked about this at the PTG. This an admittedly lame attempt at starting the ball rolling, there are probably smaller RFE's that fall out of this | 14:18 |
| amotoki | hi, sorry for late.. | 14:18 |
| mlavalle | welcome amotoki | 14:18 |
| slaweq | hi | 14:19 |
| slaweq | tidwellr: IMHO each point from "proposed changes" in Your spec can be separate RFE | 14:19 |
| tidwellr | slaweq: I think so too | 14:20 |
| mlavalle | this seems to me more of a "directional RFE" | 14:20 |
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| mlavalle | what I mean by that is this is going to take us several cycles to implement | 14:20 |
| mlavalle | in any case, we would be agreeing to go in a certain direction | 14:20 |
| mlavalle | right? | 14:20 |
| slaweq | IMO yes | 14:21 |
| amotoki | mlavalle: totally agree. | 14:21 |
| njohnston | mlavalle: definitely | 14:21 |
| tidwellr | I would think so, doing openflow DVR completely and the related OVN topic will take time to evolve | 14:21 |
| haleyb | tidwellr: i've been meaning to talk to you about the spec, since some exists already in OVN, and maybe the answer could be to move more in that direction? | 14:21 |
| mlavalle | and then probably spawn several individual efforts | 14:21 |
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| mlavalle | haleyb: yes, that is really my next question | 14:22 |
| tidwellr | haleyb: that was a PTG topic, and yes I'm in agreement that we explore how to "meet in the middle" | 14:22 |
| mlavalle | I think since this is more of a directional think, we need to ponder how this play with the convergence with OVN | 14:22 |
| tidwellr | I've been talking with mlavalle about this, and I think the OVN convergence is very closely related to this proposal | 14:23 |
| haleyb | i just don't want to spend time doing something twice if we don't have to, but identifying what we need/want is the first step | 14:24 |
| tidwellr | haleyb: I agree, I don't want to re-invent the wheel | 14:24 |
| mlavalle | haleyb: out of the features list in the RFE, what is already available in OVN? | 14:24 |
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| haleyb | distributed dhcp is, let me look | 14:24 |
| haleyb | openflow dvr of course | 14:25 |
| haleyb | ipv6 is WIP | 14:25 |
| tidwellr | it's my understanding that it lacks the fully distributed north-south (AKA fast-exit) | 14:26 |
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| mlavalle | you mean openflow dvr? | 14:26 |
| tidwellr | no, OVN | 14:26 |
| haleyb | tidwellr: right, there is no ipv6 fast-exit | 14:26 |
| tidwellr | what about IPv4? | 14:26 |
| tidwellr | can your route IPv4 directly to the compute node, bypassing a central node? | 14:27 |
| haleyb | it does have it for ipv4, it just doesn't have to be on the local compute, it can be on one of many | 14:28 |
| haleyb | it's essentially dvr+ha, but the n/s lives on some number of nodes, and can fail-over | 14:28 |
| tidwellr | but not on every compute node? | 14:29 |
| haleyb | it can be, it's just not required. i'm probably not explaining it well | 14:30 |
| tidwellr | we can chat offline in more detail | 14:30 |
| mlavalle | we don't have any other RFE today | 14:30 |
| njohnston | haleyb: would it be accurate to say it's like having most or all computes function like distributed network nodes, so traffic might ingres/egress with a different compute from where the instance is | 14:30 |
| mlavalle | so we might as well spend some time exploring this today | 14:30 |
| haleyb | njohnston: right, it will ingress/egress via a "local" compute node | 14:31 |
| tidwellr | with DVR today, I can turn on BGP and expose fixed IP's directly to the fabric and traffic goes directly to the appropriate compute node | 14:32 |
| tidwellr | if there were a BGP driver for OVN, is that possible given the state of networking-ovn today? | 14:32 |
| haleyb | tidwellr: right. i'm not sure there's a 1:1 for that, but i could look into it, might even have a doc explaining it better | 14:33 |
| haleyb | tidwellr: of course there's nothing stopping people from running the agent on every compute node | 14:34 |
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| * haleyb is still an ovn newbie | 14:35 | |
| tidwellr | sure, my question is more around whether networking-ovn has the smarts to build the environment in that way | 14:35 |
| * tidwellr is a newbie too | 14:35 | |
| mlavalle | well, it has haleyb .... ;-) | 14:35 |
| haleyb | i think it does, and bgp is definitely on the list of things we're looking at | 14:35 |
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| mlavalle | let me make an attempt to porpose a next step..... | 14:36 |
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| mlavalle | 1) we approve this rfe as a general direction of where we want to go, with reference impelementation, ovn or a combination of both | 14:37 |
| mlavalle | 2) tidwellr spells out in the associated spec his complete vision, including the BGP bits | 14:38 |
| mlavalle | 3) From there we decide the gaps in the the reference implementation and OVN and make a plan, based on it, on how to meet in the middle | 14:38 |
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| slaweq | +1, sounds like a good plan for me :) | 14:40 |
| mlavalle | This way we force everybody to get more familiar with OVN | 14:40 |
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| tidwellr | Sounds good. For me, this is really about 2 things: A) how to rid ourselves of the concept of "network nodes" B) Take advantage of offloading for L3 functions | 14:40 |
| haleyb | i can document the gaps we have between OVN and the reference implementation, since we have a lot of that already | 14:40 |
| mlavalle | yes, the offloading piece is really important | 14:41 |
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| mlavalle | it keeps us looking into the future | 14:41 |
| tidwellr | yes, and getting the routing functions pushed into OVS helps the offloading cause | 14:41 |
| tidwellr | for me, OVN or not is the "how" | 14:42 |
| mlavalle | right | 14:42 |
| haleyb | mlavalle: the other thing that would be good to have is performance numbers, because we keep hitting our heads on things like rabbit it seems | 14:42 |
| mlavalle | but at the same time, if we keep OVN as a target, it forces us to work on the convergence | 14:42 |
| tidwellr | some goes for ridding the world of what I see is the plague of network nodes | 14:42 |
| tidwellr | *same | 14:43 |
| mlavalle | haleyb: ahhh you raise a very good point | 14:43 |
| haleyb | tidwellr: plague, lol | 14:43 |
| amotoki | +1 for the next steps. there are several points we need to address. we can clarify the next steps and what need to be addressed. you all goes faster than me :) | 14:43 |
| mlavalle | tidwellr: can we add the improvement of the RPC channel as item 3 to you list above ^^^^? | 14:44 |
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| tidwellr | mlavalle: yes, I forgot to mention that | 14:44 |
| mlavalle | item C, rather | 14:44 |
| tidwellr | mlavalle: so, is this really our convergence spec taking shape then? | 14:44 |
| mlavalle | I say let's see it that way until reality forces us to re-think | 14:45 |
| mlavalle | how about that? | 14:45 |
| tidwellr | makes sense to me | 14:45 |
| mlavalle | if we get this going, the other big piece will be how to handle the non ovs banckends | 14:46 |
| mlavalle | and an inventory of features parity gaps | 14:47 |
| slaweq | mlavalle: but we already have such gaps, right? | 14:47 |
| mlavalle | yes | 14:47 |
| mlavalle | we just need to address them | 14:48 |
| mlavalle | easy peasy | 14:48 |
| slaweq | :) sure | 14:48 |
| mlavalle | ;-) | 14:48 |
| haleyb | mlavalle: things like linuxbridge should just keep working, right? i guess i more worry about supporting things like the iptables firewall driver indefinitely and such | 14:48 |
| amotoki | are you talking about linuxbridge and other drivers? I think when we talk about DVR we are already talking about ovs-dvr. | 14:48 |
| slaweq | in fact if there will be someone interested in closing such gaps, then he will propose solutions :) | 14:48 |
| mlavalle | one point for me is that I need to start deploying OVN in my performance testbed | 14:49 |
| mlavalle | that way we can make comparisosns on the same platorm | 14:50 |
| mlavalle | haleyb: yes, you are probably right. I am just trying to come up with a list of things we need to think thorugh | 14:50 |
| tidwellr | amotoki: my understand of this is that we are looking at converging ML2+OVS, everything else would continue to live on | 14:51 |
| mlavalle | that's probably right | 14:52 |
| amotoki | yeah, i think so. if we talk about other drivers like linuxbridge, it would be a discussion on the future of such impls. | 14:53 |
| mlavalle | so I think we have a consensus for the plan | 14:53 |
| mlavalle | right? | 14:53 |
| slaweq | right :) | 14:54 |
| amotoki | +1 | 14:54 |
| njohnston | +1 | 14:54 |
| haleyb | mlavalle: right, just saying eventually something in say, linuxbridge will break, and without a champion it will become best-effort, even happens with some of these whiz-bang features we've added recently | 14:54 |
| haleyb | +1 btw | 14:54 |
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| mlavalle | haleyb: good point | 14:55 |
| * haleyb doesn't mean to pick on linuxbridge, could just as easily be the metering agent :-o | 14:55 | |
| mlavalle | I will probably talk to GoDaddy about championing LB | 14:55 |
| mlavalle | ok guys | 14:55 |
| mlavalle | we have a plan | 14:56 |
| mlavalle | I am going to capture it in the RFE | 14:56 |
| mlavalle | and mark it as approved | 14:56 |
| mlavalle | Thanks for attending | 14:56 |
| tidwellr | I will work on fleshing out this sad excuse for a spec I have going :) | 14:56 |
| mlavalle | and have a nice weekend | 14:56 |
| njohnston | thanks, you too! | 14:57 |
| mlavalle | tidwellr, haleyb: long weekend for us \o/ | 14:57 |
| mlavalle | and you too njohnston | 14:57 |
| slaweq | lucky You :P | 14:57 |
| tidwellr | \o/ | 14:57 |
| slaweq | have a great long weekend then :) | 14:57 |
| amotoki | :) | 14:57 |
| mlavalle | #endmeeting | 14:57 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/" | 14:57 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Fri May 24 14:57:40 2019 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 14:57 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_drivers/2019/neutron_drivers.2019-05-24-14.00.html | 14:57 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_drivers/2019/neutron_drivers.2019-05-24-14.00.txt | 14:57 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/neutron_drivers/2019/neutron_drivers.2019-05-24-14.00.log.html | 14:57 |
| davidsha | Enjoy, cya! | 14:58 |
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