Monday, 2012-08-13

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annegentlewhoops. got my UTC mixed up, any one around for the Doc / Web team meeting?14:21
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annegentleshall I go ahead for the sake of having notes?14:23
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danwentcome on markvoelker what are you waiting for?  don't you want to win? :P20:56
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salv-orlandoaloha20:57
SumitNaiksatamhi All20:57
danwent:)20:57
marktvoelkero/20:57
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danwenttoo slow markvoelker !20:57
marktvoelker /me still claims first wave20:57
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danwenthaha20:57
markmcclainhi20:57
PotHixo/20:58
* marktvoelker also blames the stomach bug....and just for good measure, @mestery too20:58
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danwentyeah, always good to blame kyle20:58
* mestery arrives from his previous meeting in a daze ...20:59
marktvoelkerIt's a solid strategy. =p20:59
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danwent#startmeeting21:00
openstackMeeting started Mon Aug 13 21:00:11 2012 UTC.  The chair is danwent. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.21:00
openstackUseful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote.21:00
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edgarmaganahello all21:00
danwentok, lots to do, not time to waste21:00
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danwent#link agenda: http://wiki.openstack.org/Network/Meetings21:00
danwenta coupel of announcments21:00
rkukurahi21:01
shivhhi21:01
danwent#info Quantum support in horizon merged last night.  Huge achievement, great work folks.21:01
mesteryYay!21:01
danwent#info we're about to release a version of the python-quantum library that is compatible with API v221:01
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ncodehi21:01
garykhi21:01
danwent#info python-quantumclient version will be "2.0" as well, and we can rerelease as needed, it is not tied to main openstack milestones21:02
danwenthi folks21:02
danwentOk, now on to Folsom-321:02
danwent#topic folsom-321:02
*** openstack changes topic to "folsom-3"21:02
danwent#link https://launchpad.net/quantum/+milestone/folsom-321:02
danwentfirst off, I'd like to thank everyone who put some extreme hours of work in over the weekend21:02
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gongyshi21:02
danwentwe're in a lot better shape going into this week than I would have expected. .. lot's of late night reviews + coding. so great work everyone.21:03
danwentAll F-3 features need to be merged by end-of-day on Tuesday21:03
danwentthat will be pacific time21:03
rkukuramidnight?21:03
danwentrkukura: if you want to be up at midnight pacific time, i'll be up to approve :)21:03
danwentrkukura: realistically, its when ttx wakes up in europe the next day, but yeah, let's say midnight21:04
gongysthat is my midday.21:04
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salv-orlandoI can fly to Paris and take tax out for the night tomorrow21:04
salv-orlandottx21:04
danwentsalv-orlando: haha21:04
zhuadlhello21:04
danwentif you're no longer coding or reviewing for F-3, please shift your focus to testing21:04
danwentthe set of feature freeze exceptions for items that don't land by tuesday midnight will be very limited.21:05
danwentits not just a matter of whether your code is disruptive, its also a matter of taking developer and reviewer time away from bug fixing, writing docs, etc.21:05
danwentok, so any general questions on F-3 before we go into specific reviews?21:06
danwentfirst up: rkukura, provider networks21:06
danwenthttps://review.openstack.org/#/c/10938/ is for LB, which we think is about ready to merge21:06
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danwenta second branch with OVS support is due tomorrow?21:06
rkukurayes, working on that now21:06
rkukuragetting phase 2 in today would really help21:07
danwentok… i'm mentally marking that as one that may go down to the wire.21:07
danwentrkukura: I think we'll be able to.  was too busy creating meeting agenda to review it after my doctor's appt21:07
rkukuraok21:07
danwentnext up: L3 + Floating Ips21:07
edgarmaganarkukura: do you need the LB merged first?21:07
danwentthis is fully functional and up for review21:07
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danwentbut is still in WIP, since we're missing unit tests for the agent, and for the CLI.21:08
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danwenti'm hoping to get those unit tests in place by tomorrow morning, but we should be able to do a review of the rest of the code already.21:08
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danwentarosen and mnewby own that review21:08
danwentI've also sliced off a very simple test review that anyone coudl do: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/11259/21:08
rkukuraedgarmagana: a lot of LB is getting cloned into OVS, so getting issues resolved now is key. Also, the constant rebasing is killing me.21:08
danwenta note on the L3 + floating ips: non-polling won't make it for F-3.  its something we can consider for a ffe21:09
danwentis simon here to talk about his branch?21:09
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danwentwork to implement host-routes + dnsnameservers in db-base-plugin21:10
danwenthttps://review.openstack.org/#/c/10791/21:10
danwentsalv, aaron, i think this is basically ready to be approved.  He just needed to rebase?21:10
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salv-orlandoyes21:10
danwentok, let's get that in asap21:10
danwentmarkmcclain: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/10997/  dhcp non-polling21:10
danwentlooks like garyk is ok with this branch21:11
danwent(or at least a previous version of it)21:11
SumitNaiksatamI am also looking at it21:11
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garykdanwent: yes. just have a few more files to review. it is looking good21:11
danwentSumitNaiksatam: yup, thanks.21:11
markmcclaincool.. the constant rebasing has been killing me too21:11
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danwentok… so i'm optimistic that we'll get that in by later today.21:11
SumitNaiksatamshould have the review in a bit21:11
danwentyeah, rebase hell is pretty much universal here.21:11
danwentgongys: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/10484/21:12
danwentper-tenant API quotas.21:12
danwentgongys: let's chat after the main irc meeting to sort out the design issue we've been discussin in the review21:12
gongysok21:12
danwentnati_uen_:  https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:bp/test-agent,n,z21:13
nati_uen_Hi21:13
danwentthis is somewhat new, but its related to our devstack gating, which is very important21:13
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danwentbasically, we need some smarter logic for devstack exercise scripts to be able to ping VMs now that we use namespaces (though I guess we could also just have devstack disable namespaces, now that arosen's patch landed)21:14
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danwenthere are both patches: https://review.openstack.org/#/q/topic:bp/test-agent,n,z21:14
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danwentonce we get our F-3 features in, it will be very important for us to get devstack gating working, as its a requirement for us to be a "core" project in Folsom21:14
danwentnati_uen_: if we don't get the test-agent in by tuesday, I think we could ffe it.21:15
danwentmulti-host dhcp:  this one causes me more concern: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/quantum/+spec/quantum-multihost-dhcp21:15
nati_uen_danwent: OK I got it21:15
danwentseems like design is still up in the air.  unlikely to land for F-321:15
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danwentthis is pretty important though, and is applicable across a wide number of people, so I'd consider an ffe for it.21:16
nati_uen_danwent: I think we agreed the design21:16
garykwhat is ffe?21:16
danwentnati_uen_: on paper, yes :)  always a slightly different thing to see if both people where thinking about the same design when it becomes code21:16
nati_uen_danwent: So at least we can request review until Thursday21:16
danwentgaryk: sorry, "feature freeze exception"21:16
danwentffe21:16
nati_uen_danwent: I agree21:17
garykdanwent: thanks21:17
danwentdefines what other than a pure bugfix can go in after tuesday night21:17
danwentgeneral criteria are 1) risk of disruption 2) value to the community21:17
danwentok, those are all of the community critical reviews I was tracking21:18
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danwentthere are some other items under review… if they are important to you, please get core devs to be aware and review thme.21:18
danwentnati_uen_: we'll talk about device_owner stuff below21:18
danwentanything missing?21:18
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danwentwe'll talk about xml and rootwrap in the discussion section21:19
nati_uen_danwent: Host route fixing should be in F21:19
danwentnati_uen_: are you talking about simon's patch? or something beyond that?21:19
danwentbtw, is there a bug tracking making dhcp inject those values?21:19
danwentthat is something we'll have to look at for an ffe.21:19
nati_uen_danwent: Yes it is21:19
nati_uen_danwent: My point is dhcp injection.21:20
danwentnati_uen_:  ok, yes, we discussed it above then.21:20
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danwentnati_uen_: yes, we'll probably have to do an ffe for that, unless you think you can whip it up very quickly.21:20
nati_uen_danwent: OK. And also simon's patch only deal with subnet model. So I'll work on port model21:20
danwentnati_uen_: ok.21:20
nati_uen_danwent: OK I'll request review in Today's night21:21
danwenthehe, ok21:21
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nati_ueno:)21:21
danwent#topic developer discussion21:21
*** openstack changes topic to "developer discussion"21:21
danwentok, we have a couple topics to cover21:21
danwentthe first is XML support in the API21:21
danwenti'm guessing most of you saw the "spirited" discussion on the ML for nova's XML support21:21
danwentright now, quantum is JSON only.21:22
zhuadlyes :-)21:22
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danwentwe have a patch that adds at least some XML support21:22
danwentbut I'm not sure we want to go down that route21:22
danwentmy preference is to keep quantum JSON only.  but i'm willing to debate :)21:22
nati_ueno+1 for JSON only21:23
zhuadl+1 for XML support :-)21:23
markmcclain+1 for json only21:23
salv-orlandoIn my opinion, the first choice we should make is whether we believe we can decide on our own, or whether we should rely on the decision of openstack as a whole21:23
PotHix+1 for JSON only21:23
lzyeval_+1 for only json21:23
danwentsalv-orlando: apparently, there are already projects that do not support XML21:23
salv-orlandogreat.21:23
nati_uenoWhat's happen for nova is they can't get enough contributer for XML. So XML support is very poor.21:23
danwentat some point, openstack as a whole may decide to mandate XML support, in which case we would obviously comply21:24
cdub"The OpenStack Quantum API supports both the JSON and XML data serialization formats. "21:24
lzyeval_nova is only going to support xml apis which already exists21:24
cdubquick, rewrite the docs21:24
salv-orlandoWe are in a position where we are free to make any decision without disrupting anybody, as this is our first "public" release21:24
edgarmaganashouldn't be a topic to discuss during the next summit?21:24
danwentedgarmagana: next summit is too late for Folsom21:24
salv-orlandoedgarmagana: indeed, so...21:24
salv-orlandoI say Folsom will have no XML support.21:25
danwentbasically, if we want to support XML, we'll need to find someone who signs up for seriously standing behind it21:25
salv-orlandoWe'll discuss whether we want to add it as part of quantum v2.1 at the summit21:25
danwentin quantum21:25
zhuadlI'm willing to help on this21:25
danwentwe also need to answer more practical questions, like how we represent "null" values21:25
salv-orlandodanwent: at the end of the day, I believe it boils down to serialization/deserialization21:25
cdubdanwent: is/was there XML support of nova-networks (in which case it'd be a pure parity requirement I'd think)21:25
salv-orlandoin quantum v1 already had test instrastructure to cover both in the same way21:26
edgarmaganadanwent: my point is that we should discuss it during the summit and by now just JSON support21:26
danwentcdub: there was no official nova api that exposed networks21:26
danwentand even if there was, I don't see it as parity21:26
lzyeval_danwent: doesn't json have null value?21:26
lzyeval_danwent: oh xml u mean21:26
danwentlzyeval_: yes21:26
cdubok21:26
danwentanyway, if we decide to support XML for folsom, I'd consider if for an FFE21:27
salv-orlandodanwent: I would not put absence of null value as an excuse for not supporting xml :)21:27
salv-orlandoand if we make that decision, that we will have to stand by it, at least until we release quantum v321:27
danwentbut I'd want to see a very credible plan for how someone introduces support, unit testing etc, so XML support is actually a first-class citizen.21:27
danwentsalv-orlando: i'm just saying that its a practical question we'd have to tackle in the next week or so.21:28
danwent(i.e., how to represent null) since our API design includes it.21:28
salv-orlandodanwent: agreed.21:28
danwentso zhuadl, cdub, others who are interested in XML support.  do you want to work with each other to put something together on this?21:28
zhuadli remember xml is able to support null value21:28
danwentzhuadl: great.  i'm not saying it doesn't, just that I'm not sure how it does.  I don't use XML much :)21:29
salv-orlandoI used to use emptty elements as null values21:29
zhuadlyes, i can21:29
zhuadlxml has nullable definition21:29
danwentok, thanks.  Even if this is given an FFE, the work would have to be done pretty quickly.21:29
cdubdanwent: i'm actually not interested as much as i'd like to avoid some last minute firedrill if we there are clear reasons why it has to be done ;-)21:29
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salv-orlandoYou can stack your work on top of andrews patch21:29
danwentplease take a look at the work andrewsmedina did and is posted to gerrit21:29
danwentcdub: got it.  I already have clearence from ttx to not support it if the community does not want to support it.  but if there is community demand and those members are going to do a good job on nit, I"m happy to have XML support.21:30
danwentOk, zhuadl please send something out on this soon, ok?21:30
danwent#todo zhuadl send plan for XML support in Folsom21:31
zhuadlok21:31
danwentplease include andrewsmedina as well, as he's done some work on this.21:31
danwentok, next topic:  rootwrap21:31
danwentrkukura: plan is to not merge Thierry's patch, and instead merge a patch from RH that fixes up quantum?21:31
rkukurasounds good to me21:32
cdubdanwent: jrd has a conflict w/ this irc time, but his email status is basically up to date21:32
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cdubdanwent: although he's not 100% confident he can make it done and reviewed by tomorrow21:32
danwentyup, saw the email.  I think he should target having it done ASAP, though as I said, an FFE would be feasible for this, as the community benefit is obvious.21:32
danwentnext topic.21:32
cdub*nod*21:33
danwentnati_ueno has a patch that introduces a 'device_owner' attribute on a port21:33
nati_uenohttps://review.openstack.org/#/c/10922/21:33
danwentthe reason for this is that we found that people where often mangling device_ids with the source of the device21:33
danwente.g., dhcp, qrouter, etc.21:33
danwentit will also add in debugging to be able to see which ports are owned by which service.21:34
nati_uenoThis could be used for transaction support also.21:34
salv-orlandoI am going to review patch 1092221:34
danwentanyway, I think it makes sense, but wanted to raise it here to see if there were concnerns.21:34
salv-orlandoNo concern from me.21:34
danwentok, any other deveoper discussion topics?21:34
markmcclainneed a review on https://review.openstack.org/#/c/11278/21:34
danwentI also just wanted to not that Salvatore is working with Docs people at Rackspace to get an official V2 API spec out.21:35
danwentmarkmcclain: just +2'd21:35
nati_uenoIf you need more debug command for quantum, please ping me :) https://review.openstack.org/#/c/11189/9/quantum/debug/README21:36
danwentI will also be hounding people to help write docs once F-3 features are in21:36
gongysOur quantum.sh in devstack is running?21:36
danwentgongys: nati_ueno is working on the v2 version of that.21:36
garyki have been unable to get it running21:36
nati_uenogongys: Not yet. I'm debugging it21:36
danwenti haven't tested it in a few days21:36
danwentbut that is critical to getting quantum devstack gating working, which i mentioned earlier.21:37
danwentonce F-3 features are in, that will be top priority for the community21:37
danwentthis will help a ton with avoiding breakage21:37
gongysIs quantum gate testing  enabled in jenkin env?21:37
gongyswhich will call our quantum.sh.21:37
danwentgongys: no, we need to get the new quantum.sh merged in, then jeblair will turn it on21:38
gongysok.21:38
danwent#topic open discussion21:38
*** openstack changes topic to "open discussion"21:38
danwentanything?21:38
danwentor back to reviews?21:38
nati_uenodanwent: Could you take a look? I fixed your point.  https://review.openstack.org/#/c/10922/21:38
danwentas I said, it was an incredible effort from several team members over the weekend that got us in good shape.  thanks for all the hard work.21:39
nati_uenoand alos https://review.openstack.org/#/c/10639/21:39
danwentnati_ueno: ok, will look.  i have a stack of reviews, as well as my own coding to do later today ;)21:39
danwentany other open discussion?21:39
nati_uenodanwent: Thanks!21:40
danwentotherwise, stick around if you want to discuss the quota extension issue with gongys and i, otherwise, ill talk to you all next week21:40
salv-orlandok21:40
nati_uenolet's have a meet up after F321:40
carlpthanks dan!21:40
danwentnati_ueno: i'm actually putting an on-site bug squashing even together21:40
danwentthanks folks21:40
danwent#endmeeting21:40
*** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack meeting channel. See http://wiki.openstack.org/Meetings for schedule and http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack-meeting/ for meeting logs"21:40
openstackMeeting ended Mon Aug 13 21:40:49 2012 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)21:40
openstackMinutes:        http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack-meeting/2012/openstack-meeting.2012-08-13-21.00.html21:40
openstackMinutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack-meeting/2012/openstack-meeting.2012-08-13-21.00.txt21:40
openstackLog:            http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/openstack-meeting/2012/openstack-meeting.2012-08-13-21.00.log.html21:40
nati_uenodanwent: Awesome!21:41
nati_uenoBye!21:41
danwentnati_ueno: timing is complicated, as it depends when the baby arrives :)21:41
zhuadlthanks,bye~21:41
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PotHixo/21:41
zhuadl:D21:41
carlpI'm also planning on focusing on Quantum support with chef during the Hack-a-thon my company is hosting on the 21st.21:41
danwentcarlp: cool.  down in LA i assume?21:41
nati_uenodanwent: :) I understand you21:41
danwentgongys: hey21:42
gongysDan: hi21:42
gongysHave you see my comments just before the meeting?21:42
danwentgongys: no, let me take a look.  one second.21:42
carlpdanwent: yep! Anyone is welcome to join us - we'll be on IRC as well21:43
edgarmaganagood luck with baby Dan, mine is just 6 months.. i can provide some tips!21:43
danwentgongys: ok.  i read it.21:43
nati_uenocarlp: #openstack-dev ?21:43
danwentedgarmagana: haha, sounds good.  how about babysitting (j/k)21:43
carlpnati_ueno: #openstack-chef21:43
nati_uenocarlp: I got it :)21:44
danwentgongys: I still think there's a misunderstanding here21:44
edgarmaganadanwent: you got me there!21:44
danwentedgarmagana: :P21:44
gongysdan: ?21:44
danwentgongys: really, it seems like there are two types of extensions21:44
danwentall extensions prior to quotas where specific to the plugin, as the plugin needed to do something to support the extension (e.g., change settings on a switch)21:45
gongysdan: Is it very important to differentiate them?21:45
danwentit seems like quotas are a departure from this, as they act independent of a particular plugin, but still need a database21:45
gongysdan: yes.21:45
danwentwhat I don't understand is why you have the "provider" extension using the mechanism you've introduced.21:46
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danwentthe provider extension to me is something that some plugins will support, others will not21:46
zhuadlDan, where's the previous work of xml support? any blueprint/patches there?21:46
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danwentzhuadl: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/10856/21:46
gongysdan: if it is that your concern, I can put it back in old enabling way.21:46
zhuadlthanks21:46
gongysdan: I said old way and new way can work together.21:47
danwentgongys: yes, I agree with that.21:47
danwentI'd just suggest that we use the "new way" only for things that can be enabled completely independently of which plugin is used.21:47
gongysdan: I just want all the enabling put together.21:47
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danwentgongys: but we want plugins to be enable extensions without modifying extensions.py at all21:48
danwentso we still need the "old way" in my opinion21:48
danwentso i think if we just undo the provider stuff in your patch, we're good.21:49
gongysdan: Yes, I want to device a way such as configuration to host that structure, but it make thing complex.21:49
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PotHix(we want plugins to be enable extensions without modifying extensions.py) +1 for this! :P21:49
gongysdan: by now I will jut put the provider back.21:49
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danwentok, sounds good.  thanks.21:49
danwentgongys: anything else we need to discuss?  Otherwise, I think i'm good with the patch.21:50
danwentbtw, are you ok with me pushing a client release now?21:50
gongysok.  review it in a few mins.21:50
danwentjames said he added quantum drivers to the list that can push a release21:50
gongyssure. but what about the floating client?21:51
danwenti'll also add you to that group, so you can push releases as well.21:51
danwentgongys: yeah, that's the question.  My assumption is that we'd release a 2.1 along with the RC for quantum-server21:51
gongysthat's fine.21:51
danwentok, sounds good.21:52
gongysafter we have floating ip on client, we can enable the nova quantum api's floating ip feature.21:52
gongysso the nova will have 2.1?21:52
danwenti think nova is already on 2.6 or whatever.21:52
danwentwe can choose to release a new version of python-quantumclient as frequently or infrequently as we want.21:53
danwentup to you on whether you want to wait for router/floatingip stuff21:53
danwentmy concern was that there's no v2 compatible quantum client that can be installed via pip right now21:53
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danwentwhich might be causing the problem's we're seeing in jenkins for gating quantum21:53
danwent(I CC'd you on an email about this last week, I think)21:54
gongysok. I agree we put the quantum client in.21:54
danwentok, sounds good.  talk to you later :)21:54
gongysyes. I think you will put the quantum client to pip.21:54
danwentcool.  i will add you to the drivers group so that you can release as well.21:54
gongysok, you release first version, I will do later versions.21:55
danwentsounds good21:55
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salv-orlandorkukura: are you still around?23:18
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