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| masahito | hi blazar folks, time to blazar meeting | 09:02 |
|---|---|---|
| masahito | #startmeeting blazar | 09:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue May 29 09:02:14 2018 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is masahito. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 09:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 09:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: blazar)" | 09:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'blazar' | 09:02 |
| masahito | #topic RollCall | 09:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "RollCall (Meeting topic: blazar)" | 09:02 | |
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| priteau | o/ | 09:03 |
| hiro-kobayashi | o/ | 09:03 |
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| masahito | priteau, hiro-kobayashi: hi | 09:03 |
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| masahito | today's topic is | 09:03 |
| masahito | 1. the Vancouver summit recap | 09:04 |
| masahito | 2. R-2 milestone | 09:04 |
| masahito | 3. AOB | 09:04 |
| masahito | anything else? | 09:04 |
| masahito | #topic the Vancouver summit recap | 09:06 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "the Vancouver summit recap (Meeting topic: blazar)" | 09:06 | |
| masahito | Blazar team had 3 sessions in the latest summit. | 09:07 |
| masahito | 1. Project update, 2. onboarding, 3. forum | 09:07 |
| masahito | there were lots of people in update session and onboarding session. | 09:08 |
| masahito | that looks lots of stackers want to know/use Blazar | 09:08 |
| priteau | But not in Forum? | 09:08 |
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| masahito | and also we had lots of discussion in the forum. | 09:09 |
| masahito | As summary, 3 main topics were there. | 09:09 |
| masahito | 1. preemptible instance, 2. network reservation, 3. development lab usecase(ironic support) | 09:10 |
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| masahito | Preemptible instance is offered by scientific WG as you know. They proposed "PENDING" status to Nova already. I'm curious how we handle instances in the status to utilize free period in Blazar. | 09:12 |
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| masahito | It looks like network reservation still has different requirements by different usecase. | 09:13 |
| priteau | masahito: Is there an Etherpad from the forum session? | 09:14 |
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| masahito | ah etherpad is there https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/YVR18-forum-reservation-requirements | 09:15 |
| priteau | Thank you | 09:15 |
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| masahito | It looks like network reservation still has different requirements by different usecase. | 09:17 |
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| masahito | and finally, Ironic support is one of important feature for lab usecase. | 09:18 |
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| priteau | For Chameleo too | 09:18 |
| masahito | some said they schedules, deploys and cleanup baremetal by hands. | 09:19 |
| masahito | meaning writing the use of baremetal to a real calender and details of use in to instance's descriptions. | 09:20 |
| masahito | That's a summary of the summit. | 09:21 |
| masahito | hiro-kobayashi: do you have other comments about the summit? | 09:21 |
| hiro-kobayashi | From Placement point of view, there were a lot of information. | 09:21 |
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| hiro-kobayashi | This video is good to understand current and future Placement | 09:22 |
| hiro-kobayashi | https://www.openstack.org/videos/vancouver-2018/placement-present-and-future-in-nova-and-beyond | 09:22 |
| hiro-kobayashi | Presenters are key members of Placement | 09:22 |
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| hiro-kobayashi | And, https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/YVR-cinder-placementCinder and Placement session's summary is here:; | 09:23 |
| priteau | Thanks, will watch and read! | 09:24 |
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| hiro-kobayashi | My impression was that Cinder team just started to think of Placement support | 09:24 |
| masahito | hiro-kobayashi: thanks the follow up! | 09:24 |
| hiro-kobayashi | So, there was not a design level discussion. | 09:25 |
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| hiro-kobayashi | In addition, I have a good news. | 09:25 |
| hiro-kobayashi | My colleague who works on Placement said he will join Blazar team. | 09:26 |
| priteau | Very good news! | 09:26 |
| hiro-kobayashi | He has been contributing a lot to Placement. So, he must be a great help for Placement support. | 09:27 |
| masahito | Good news! | 09:27 |
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| hiro-kobayashi | I'll ask him to join Blazar weekly meeting. | 09:28 |
| masahito | Right. That could accelerate the Placement integration. | 09:28 |
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| masahito | I hope he will join this meeting. | 09:29 |
| hiro-kobayashi | Yes. I will persuade him ;-) | 09:30 |
| hiro-kobayashi | That's all from my side. | 09:30 |
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| masahito | hiro-kobayashi: Thanks for sharing. | 09:31 |
| masahito | priteau: any comment about the summit? | 09:31 |
| priteau | It looked interesting, too bad I cpuldn't join | 09:31 |
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| masahito | Next summit is in Berlin. so I hope you would join there :-) | 09:33 |
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| priteau | I assume I will be in Berlin | 09:33 |
| masahito | FYI: the next spring Summit is in Denver. | 09:34 |
| priteau | Like the PTG? | 09:35 |
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| priteau | I suppose it is hard to find many cities with large convention centres | 09:35 |
| masahito | at Central Center in the Denver. Different place from the PTG. | 09:35 |
| masahito | priteau: yes, I think so. | 09:36 |
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| masahito | ok, let's move on to next topic. | 09:36 |
| masahito | #topic R-2 milestone | 09:36 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "R-2 milestone (Meeting topic: blazar)" | 09:36 | |
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| masahito | R-2 milestone is next week. So I plan to add 2.0.0.0b2 tag to blazar's repo as usual. | 09:37 |
| hiro-kobayashi | thanks! Which patch should be merged until it? | 09:39 |
| masahito | If you have any specific patches to be merged, please let us know. | 09:39 |
| masahito | I hope some floating patches in the board are merged. | 09:40 |
| masahito | https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/blazar+branch:master+topic:bp/flavors-extra-specs | 09:40 |
| masahito | https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/blazar+branch:master+topic:bp/multi-freepools | 09:40 |
| masahito | and https://review.openstack.org/#/c/567745/ | 09:40 |
| hiro-kobayashi | I'm okay to merge az-support and instance-extra-spec related patches. | 09:41 |
| priteau | I noticed this morning that merging failed for https://review.openstack.org/#/c/566078/ | 09:41 |
| priteau | Maybe something broken in DevStack? | 09:41 |
| hiro-kobayashi | It looks so... | 09:41 |
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| hiro-kobayashi | I hope it will be fixed soon. | 09:43 |
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| masahito | others mentioned same thing. I hope some devstack or tempest setting were changed or just zuul failure. | 09:43 |
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| priteau | I have triggered a recheck | 09:44 |
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| masahito | thanks. | 09:46 |
| masahito | any comments for the release? | 09:47 |
| masahito | s/release/ milestone | 09:47 |
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| masahito | #topic AOB | 09:48 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "AOB (Meeting topic: blazar)" | 09:48 | |
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| masahito | Does someone have something to share/discuss? | 09:49 |
| hiro-kobayashi | Nothing from my side | 09:50 |
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| priteau | Not from me | 09:50 |
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| masahito | priteau: IIRC, you deployed jay's patch to your cloud to support Ironic and it works well, right? | 09:51 |
| priteau | Yes, we've been using it for a couple of weeks now | 09:51 |
| priteau | We did another deployment on a bigger site last week | 09:51 |
| priteau | It seems to work well so far | 09:51 |
| masahito | If possible, could you tell me the patch you picked? | 09:52 |
| masahito | I'm talking with our private cloud operators for deploying Blazar. | 09:52 |
| masahito | They needs Ironic support and I'd like to tell them what we need for it. | 09:53 |
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| priteau | It this patchset: https://review.openstack.org/#/q/status:open+project:openstack/nova+branch:master+topic:bp/aggregate-affinity | 09:53 |
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| priteau | I also had to make changes to Blazar, which I can upload to Gerri with a W-1 if you want | 09:53 |
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| masahito | priteau: Thank you so much! Don't be busy to prepare the patch :-) | 09:55 |
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| masahito | That's from my side. | 09:56 |
| masahito | Looks nothing more to discuss. | 09:56 |
| masahito | Let's finish this meeting. | 09:57 |
| priteau | Good bye everyone | 09:57 |
| masahito | Thanks all, see you in next week. | 09:57 |
| hiro-kobayashi | Thanks all! Good bye. | 09:57 |
| masahito | #endmeeting | 09:57 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/" | 09:57 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue May 29 09:57:26 2018 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 09:57 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/blazar/2018/blazar.2018-05-29-09.02.html | 09:57 |
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| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/blazar/2018/blazar.2018-05-29-09.02.txt | 09:57 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/blazar/2018/blazar.2018-05-29-09.02.log.html | 09:57 |
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| lbragstad | ping ayoung, breton, cmurphy, dstanek, gagehugo, hrybacki, knikolla, lamt, lbragstad, lwanderley, kmalloc, rodrigods, samueldmq, spilla, aselius, dpar, jdennis, ruan_he, wxy, sonuk | 16:00 |
| lbragstad | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/keystone-weekly-meeting | 16:00 |
| lbragstad | agenda ^ | 16:00 |
| lbragstad | o/ | 16:00 |
| ayoung | lbragstad, got an internal meeting but I'll try to pay attention. | 16:00 |
| sonuk | o/ | 16:00 |
| lamt | o/ | 16:00 |
| lbragstad | ayoung: ack | 16:00 |
| lbragstad | i have a feeling this meeting is going to be short | 16:00 |
| wxy| | o/ | 16:00 |
| cmurphy | o/ | 16:01 |
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| rmascena | o/ | 16:01 |
| gagehugo | o/ | 16:01 |
| kmalloc | o/ | 16:01 |
| lbragstad | the agenda is pretty light | 16:02 |
| lbragstad | which is typical following a gathering of any kind | 16:02 |
| lbragstad | #startmeeting keystone | 16:02 |
| openstack | Meeting started Tue May 29 16:02:42 2018 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is lbragstad. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 16:02 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 16:02 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 16:02 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'keystone' | 16:02 |
| lbragstad | i knew i was forgetting something... | 16:02 |
| gagehugo | lol | 16:03 |
| lbragstad | #topic summit recap | 16:03 |
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| *** openstack changes topic to "summit recap (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 16:03 | |
| lbragstad | so - obviously last week was the summit and i'm working on a summary that i hope to share soon | 16:03 |
| lbragstad | #topic unified limits specification follow up | 16:04 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "unified limits specification follow up (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 16:04 | |
| lbragstad | the last session for the week was on unified limits | 16:04 |
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| lbragstad | and i felt it was really productive, we got a bunch of a good feedback on wxy|'s specification | 16:05 |
| lbragstad | i spent some time friday working the latest comments from that session into the current spec | 16:05 |
| lbragstad | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/540803/ | 16:05 |
| lbragstad | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/540803/10..11/specs/keystone/rocky/strict-two-level-enforcement-model.rst | 16:05 |
| kmalloc | lbragstad: the conversation(s) ayoung and I have could simplify the lookups even in the "fluid" quota model we have proposed. | 16:05 |
| kmalloc | avoiding needing to do the lookup across all children. | 16:06 |
| lbragstad | cool | 16:06 |
| kmalloc | i can add comments and ayoung made a post that encapsulates it somewhat | 16:06 |
| lbragstad | do you have a link? | 16:06 |
| kmalloc | it also would make james' needs easy. | 16:06 |
| kmalloc | sec. | 16:06 |
| wxy| | kmalloc: the one ayoung post in his blog? http://adam.younglogic.com/2018/05/tracking-quota/#more-5542 | 16:07 |
| hrybacki | o/ | 16:07 |
| lbragstad | oh - nice | 16:07 |
| lbragstad | i'll have to read that | 16:07 |
| kmalloc | yeah | 16:08 |
| kmalloc | thats is it. | 16:08 |
| kmalloc | tl;dr of it, store claims/consumption upwards in the tree | 16:08 |
| kmalloc | so child stores it's usage and propagate child usage to the parent | 16:08 |
| kmalloc | so we do an upwards traverse of the tree to collect the usage. | 16:08 |
| kmalloc | so worst-case is a _MAX_DEPTH_IN_KEYSTONE lookup | 16:09 |
| lbragstad | as opposed to a horizontal calculation? | 16:09 |
| kmalloc | yes | 16:09 |
| lbragstad | hmm | 16:09 |
| lbragstad | interesting | 16:09 |
| lbragstad | so - is this going to affect what we have proposed for the two-level-strict model? | 16:09 |
| kmalloc | it would make the two-level model more efficient | 16:10 |
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| lbragstad | ok | 16:10 |
| kmalloc | as you scale children out | 16:10 |
| lbragstad | i'll parse that today then and see how/if we can work it into the specification | 16:10 |
| kmalloc | 10000 children is still: Check Local, Check Parent | 16:10 |
| kmalloc | ayoung's post expands a bit more on it, but the very short summary i provided is the core | 16:10 |
| lbragstad | i'd like to try and get that specification merged by the EOW | 16:10 |
| kmalloc | it doesn't solve across-endpoint quota checks | 16:11 |
| kmalloc | but that is external to <local endpoint> | 16:11 |
| ayoung | yep | 16:11 |
| kmalloc | unless the limit is endpoint specific | 16:11 |
| kmalloc | which is also fine. | 16:11 |
| lbragstad | ok | 16:11 |
| rmascena | that looks like a great approach, since we probably don't have a big depth in the project tree | 16:12 |
| kmalloc | the idea is you'll need to store a child record on the parent that can be aggregated [somehow; eys glossing over specific implementation] | 16:12 |
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| kmalloc | rmascena: we also have a fixed max limit iirc | 16:12 |
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| kmalloc | which was... 8? | 16:12 |
| lbragstad | yeah - i don't think it was even that high | 16:12 |
| kmalloc | it still gets expensive to aggregate the data in 10000 nodes, but it's not 10000 lookups, it's _MAX_DEPTH lookups with a sum() | 16:13 |
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| rmascena | kmalloc, gotcha | 16:13 |
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| kmalloc | James' use-case made me really think about the implementation. | 16:13 |
| lbragstad | #link https://github.com/openstack/keystone/blob/cbc6cac4c01a4d7836a726fb30730ea603cde176/keystone/conf/default.py#L70 | 16:13 |
| kmalloc | crap.. we REALLY made that configurable =/ | 16:14 |
| lbragstad | yep | 16:14 |
| kmalloc | that makes me cry | 16:14 |
| kmalloc | can we deprecate that option? ;) | 16:14 |
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| lbragstad | that can only be 2 with the new model | 16:14 |
| ayoung | Nah, leave it | 16:14 |
| kmalloc | right, so lets deprecate that option while we're at it. | 16:14 |
| ayoung | we can't solve this | 16:14 |
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| kmalloc | let the quota model dictate the max | 16:14 |
| ayoung | need something like Istio or Congress running in front | 16:14 |
| ayoung | you need active participation, and Keystone is too passive | 16:15 |
| kmalloc | ayoung: we're not going to get that right now, so solve this the best we can. | 16:15 |
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| kmalloc | and if the quota model allows storage to something like etcd, we can share the data across endpoints | 16:15 |
| ayoung | depth of the project tree is irrelevant | 16:15 |
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| kmalloc | depth is relevant even with congress or istio | 16:15 |
| kmalloc | because you still need to look at the heirarchy | 16:16 |
| lbragstad | the bummer is that that option affects the API, and so does the enforcement model that you use | 16:16 |
| kmalloc | at 1000 deep [we don't set a max], it wont work well. | 16:16 |
| kmalloc | lbragstad: so lets deprecate that option. | 16:16 |
| kmalloc | minimize options that impact API | 16:16 |
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| * kmalloc gets off soapbox | 16:16 | |
| lbragstad | ok - looks like we have some things to work into the specification then this week | 16:17 |
| kmalloc | anyway, the other takeaway is the quota-model needs to be very opinionated on what data is stored. | 16:17 |
| kmalloc | it is on the quota model to define what we need to store, not "nova" | 16:17 |
| lbragstad | but - i also took a stab at trying to workout the context manager stuff for the oslo.limit library | 16:17 |
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| lbragstad | curious if anyone would be interested in double checking my work there | 16:17 |
| kmalloc | since nova will be moving to the generic-resource type labels | 16:18 |
| kmalloc | lbragstad: i'll review/look it over, ping me when you need it | 16:18 |
| lbragstad | it's ready for review and it's in the code examples in the current spec | 16:18 |
| lbragstad | ps 11 | 16:18 |
| kmalloc | ok | 16:18 |
| kmalloc | will poke at it today | 16:18 |
| lbragstad | we had a list of things to change wrt integrating oslo.limit | 16:18 |
| kmalloc | but i warn you, unless your example says "HEEEEEEREEEEEEEE's JOHNNY" i'm going to -1billion it :P | 16:19 |
| kmalloc | >> | 16:19 |
| kmalloc | << | 16:19 |
| kmalloc | ^_^ | 16:19 |
| lbragstad | :) | 16:19 |
| kmalloc | i think the changes for oslo.limit are very positive | 16:19 |
| lbragstad | i do too... anything else on the unified limit stuff? | 16:20 |
| kmalloc | i think thats really it. | 16:20 |
| lbragstad | does anyone have questions? this is a probably a fast moving conversation for the folks who weren't there | 16:20 |
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| * cmurphy will try to catch up with the spec and the blog post | 16:22 | |
| ayoung | I think the problem is not depth of tree, but rather the number of projects that span from the initial project | 16:22 |
| ayoung | a wide flat tree would have the same effective cost | 16:23 |
| lbragstad | that was penick's concern | 16:23 |
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| ayoung | there might be linear constant for the deep tree (one average 2ce as many comparisons) but not N! more | 16:24 |
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| kmalloc | with penick's concern it was both depth and breadth of tree | 16:24 |
| kmalloc | becuase multi-depth was a reality | 16:24 |
| kmalloc | but i think we have a workable direction to go | 16:25 |
| lbragstad | ack | 16:25 |
| ayoung | yeah, but the number of comparisons is based on the number of subproject/split of the initial quota | 16:25 |
| kmalloc | ayoung: ++ | 16:25 |
| ayoung | so if a wide flat tree has 100s of sub projects, the effective cost will be pretty much the same | 16:25 |
| kmalloc | yes. | 16:26 |
| ayoung | coo | 16:26 |
| kmalloc | and we can work to address cross-endpoint stuff [kicking the can a little] as we move towards an implementation as long as we don't write ourselves into a corner | 16:26 |
| ayoung | let me know when were are done. I have a couple other things to share | 16:27 |
| kmalloc | lbragstad: i have a few open-topic things to seed. | 16:27 |
| kmalloc | as well | 16:27 |
| ayoung | you first | 16:27 |
| lbragstad | #topic open discussion | 16:27 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "open discussion (Meeting topic: keystone)" | 16:27 | |
| kmalloc | 2 quick things | 16:27 |
| lbragstad | rmascena: has a topic too | 16:27 |
| rmascena | kmalloc, go ahead | 16:27 |
| kmalloc | 1) I'm looking at ETCD for some cross-endpoint storage, notably policy data (loaded via KSM). Please let me know if you really hate this idea. | 16:27 |
| kmalloc | since we have a central source, we can start looking at distributing via watches (yes, i know, eventlet weirdness sometimes), vs pure rest | 16:28 |
| ayoung | fine by me, but you knew that already | 16:28 |
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| kmalloc | no direct answer needed here, just stew on it/bug me. other things are a bit higher prio for me atm than that future bit | 16:28 |
| lbragstad | i wouldn't mind discussing it a bit more to get a better understanding of it | 16:29 |
| lbragstad | i don't know enough now to have an opinion | 16:29 |
| ayoung | lbragstad, its kindof like a more effective memcache | 16:29 |
| kmalloc | lbragstad: right, so lets start that offline and formulate a better understanding | 16:29 |
| kmalloc | it's too complex for meeting time right now. | 16:29 |
| kmalloc | and too early | 16:29 |
| ayoung | ++ | 16:29 |
| lbragstad | ack - sounds good, thanks kmalloc | 16:30 |
| ayoung | used very heavily in Kubernetes, and effictively | 16:30 |
| ayoung | effectively | 16:30 |
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| kmalloc | and #2, i want to start looking at moving (next cycle) Keystone Specs and testing to be heavily focused on Behavior Driven [discuss the behaviors/encode it] vs "intent" | 16:30 |
| kmalloc | again, early on discussion and things to think about | 16:30 |
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| ayoung | kmalloc, is that along the lines of the move to the new planning tool? | 16:31 |
| kmalloc | kmalloc: it was in the same vein. | 16:31 |
| wxy| | kmalloc: +1 for Etcd proposal. I like the watch mechanism | 16:31 |
| kmalloc | but more on our process side | 16:31 |
| ayoung | Keystone is on the short list for testing it out, right? | 16:31 |
| kmalloc | ayoung: yes. and once we're on storyboard we can start discussing other method changes | 16:31 |
| * hrybacki looks at kmalloc with intrigue | 16:31 | |
| ayoung | ++ | 16:32 |
| kmalloc | i want to start moving us in better directions on how we process things, but nothing until we get moving on SB and other community-wide initiatives | 16:32 |
| hrybacki | speaking of, lbragstad when is a good time to ping diablo_rojo aobut that again? I wanna poke at things | 16:32 |
| * knikolla is late | 16:32 | |
| lbragstad | i'm sure she'll reach out once they have the migration ready to go | 16:32 |
| hrybacki | ack | 16:33 |
| kmalloc | but, tl;dr behavior driven development is focusing on the user-story style of things, but also more specific expected behaviors. | 16:33 |
| * ayoung likes | 16:33 | |
| kmalloc | I post a USER object to /users and X happens | 16:33 |
| lbragstad | i'm not expecting to hear anything this week, with the summit wrap up and things like that | 16:33 |
| kmalloc | in informal sentences which can be expanded to the more rigid spec | 16:33 |
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| kmalloc | trying to encompass ideas -> specs -> code in a better way | 16:34 |
| hrybacki | One more question: We landed default roles spec noting a folow-up with changing of the 'auditor' role name to ... 'readonly' ? Leaving us with 'readonly', 'member', and 'admin' | 16:34 |
| kmalloc | hrybacki: as i remember, yes | 16:34 |
| ayoung | reader | 16:34 |
| ayoung | you can have multiple roles, so reader is for reading things | 16:34 |
| hrybacki | kmalloc: rope me into that when possible -- I wanna learn from your thought process | 16:34 |
| * lbragstad likes reader over readonly | 16:34 | |
| * kmalloc hands the microphone to the next person... but if it's adam, turns off the mic first | 16:34 | |
| * ayoung needs no mike | 16:34 | |
| hrybacki | what about reader, member, and adminer? /s | 16:35 |
| ayoung | ++ | 16:35 |
| kmalloc | hrybacki: sure thing, I spent a chunk of the weekend looking at development methodologies and specifically in python. | 16:35 |
| knikolla | reader, because member implying readonly is awkward. | 16:35 |
| kmalloc | it was good. | 16:35 |
| ayoung | readinator, membenator, administrator | 16:35 |
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| kmalloc | ayoung: what about burninator? | 16:35 |
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| kmalloc | cause i think we need trogdor now | 16:35 |
| ayoung | reserved for Trogdor | 16:36 |
| hrybacki | justreads, readsandmembers, readsandmembersandadmins ? | 16:36 |
| gagehugo | kmalloc ++ | 16:36 |
| kmalloc | ayoung: there is your "delete only" role. | 16:36 |
| ayoung | OK...me up? | 16:36 |
| lbragstad | ayoung: go for it | 16:36 |
| hrybacki | kmalloc: feel free to shoot me any good reading links | 16:36 |
| ayoung | a lot of people spoke to the pain of customizing policy | 16:36 |
| kmalloc | hrybacki: i'll dig some up. | 16:36 |
| ayoung | esp AT&T doing read only | 16:36 |
| ayoung | needs some tooling support | 16:36 |
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| kmalloc | (hey! this is going to benefit from the etcd thing) | 16:36 |
| gagehugo | we love read-only | 16:36 |
| hrybacki | gagehugo: yes y'all do :) | 16:36 |
| ayoung | so...was coming up with a spec for a tool to help build policy | 16:37 |
| ayoung | and...I guess I should dump to an Etherpad... 1 sec | 16:37 |
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| ayoung | https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/posse-policy-tool | 16:38 |
| ayoung | Sorry about format, but I had it on my blog. I'll clean up | 16:38 |
| ayoung | this is pure requirements, no design at this state | 16:38 |
| hrybacki | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/posse-policy-tool | 16:38 |
| lbragstad | so - isn't this what we're going to be implementing with hrybacki's specification? | 16:39 |
| ayoung | and the idea is that this is something for offline or installtime use first and foremost, not an API. Might grow into one in the future. | 16:39 |
| ayoung | possibly. | 16:39 |
| hrybacki | lbragstad: I think he's reaching for something bigger. a unified way to add custom policy on-top-of these default roles | 16:39 |
| ayoung | I was more concerned with getting the requirements clear pre-spec | 16:39 |
| ayoung | and this is something that an operator should be able to use to customize policy in a sane way | 16:40 |
| ayoung | as part of a larger workflow, without specifying that workflow | 16:40 |
| ayoung | I was hoping to whip up a quick POC on that, but its too big | 16:41 |
| kmalloc | i think the further reach, especially something that can do the policy file editing in a clean way (programatically, lets face it the DSL is sucky to work with as a human) could be beneficial | 16:41 |
| ayoung | we need to collect policy, in a few different forms. We need a catalog of APIs (VERB + PATH) | 16:41 |
| ayoung | we need the mapping from API to policy key | 16:42 |
| ayoung | etc. | 16:42 |
| ayoung | so lets gather the reqs in one place. Feel free to hack that doc, etc. And we can convert to a spec later | 16:42 |
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| ayoung | OK second thing | 16:42 |
| ayoung | Another end user was pretty vehement that Keystone RBAC was too course grained, that policy enforcable only at the project/Role level meant that he could not use it | 16:43 |
| ayoung | also from AT&T, so real world deployment | 16:43 |
| ayoung | so...I started writing down a label based enforcement scheme that could be done within a project | 16:43 |
| ayoung | this would require a lot of remote project support, so long term | 16:43 |
| ayoung | and I just want a sanity check on it | 16:43 |
| ayoung | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/access-tags-planning | 16:43 |
| ayoung | ths short short is this: | 16:44 |
| kmalloc | it takes some notes from k8s tagging | 16:44 |
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| ayoung | use the roles that a use has to tag a resource, and then later match the tags when performing operations | 16:44 |
| kmalloc | it's a decent concept, but needs a lot of eyes on it to be vetted before moving to something more concrete | 16:44 |
| ayoung | and specifically, morphing operations: PUT, DELETE, PATCH | 16:44 |
| ayoung | exactly | 16:44 |
| ayoung | it takes a page from SELinux, but also tries to be much less ambitious and thus easier to understand and implement | 16:45 |
| lbragstad | ok - i have post-it notes lining the bottom of my monitor to review this stuff | 16:45 |
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| ayoung | but, say I tab a volume with the "DBA" access tag, I need to have the "DBA" role in order to morph it | 16:45 |
| ayoung | thanks | 16:46 |
| ayoung | those two things plus quota was what I got out of the summit | 16:46 |
| ayoung | the tool maybe should live in oslo-policy, so we can consider that, too | 16:46 |
| lbragstad | yeah | 16:46 |
| lbragstad | something to think about | 16:47 |
| lbragstad | i have an idea that i was talking to hrybacki about | 16:47 |
| lbragstad | and it sounds like it might have some overlap with that tool | 16:47 |
| knikolla | ayoung: want me to try a simpler solution with the proxying api calls between projects? | 16:47 |
| hrybacki | lbragstad: you'll have to referesh my memory | 16:47 |
| ayoung | knikolla, Isio! | 16:47 |
| ayoung | Istio | 16:47 |
| ayoung | but, yes, there is that | 16:48 |
| lbragstad | hrybacki: it was after that moon presentation | 16:48 |
| ayoung | knikolla, can you talk through the proxy-between approach, and where it is now? | 16:48 |
| hrybacki | lost in the ethereum lbragstad =/ | 16:48 |
| * kmalloc makes a bad etherpad joke. | 16:49 | |
| ayoung | knikolla, I suspect, though, that if we proxy like you say, we would need a way to manage cross-project access control at the keystone level eventually | 16:49 |
| ayoung | so there is still an admin overhead | 16:49 |
| kmalloc | remember rmascena has something to talk about too. 10 left [timecheck] | 16:49 |
| knikolla | github.com/openstack/mixmatch is an API proxy for service to service communication with k2k. theoretically instead of k2k, it can rescope the token for another project. | 16:49 |
| kmalloc | 10m* | 16:49 |
| * ayoung surrenders the conch shell | 16:49 | |
| knikolla | ayoung: we can use HMT for that. a larger project and subprojects. | 16:50 |
| ayoung | knikolla, ++ | 16:50 |
| rmascena | I hope that will be quick :) can I start? | 16:50 |
| lbragstad | #link https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystone/+bug/1754677 | 16:50 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1754677 in OpenStack Identity (keystone) "Unable to remove an assignment from domain and project" [High,In progress] - Assigned to Raildo Mascena de Sousa Filho (raildo) | 16:50 |
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| ayoung | rmascena, go ahead. | 16:50 |
| ayoung | knikolla, schedule time for next week to discuss that, please? | 16:50 |
| knikolla | ayoung: ++ | 16:50 |
| raildo | so, enjoying that we are talking about HMT :D | 16:50 |
| raildo | there is this bug that lbragstad pointed out | 16:51 |
| raildo | and I sent this patch with a reproducer for it: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/570438/2 | 16:51 |
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| ayoung | raildo, that commit message needs context in it | 16:52 |
| raildo | so, basically we can add role assignments for a domain side and a project side of this entity, but we can't remove it right know, since the table was not prepared for having two assignments for one entity | 16:52 |
| raildo | ayoung, yeah, it needs :) | 16:52 |
| raildo | ayoung, https://bugs.launchpad.net/keystone/+bug/1754677/comments/1 | 16:53 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1754677 in OpenStack Identity (keystone) "Unable to remove an assignment from domain and project" [High,In progress] - Assigned to Raildo Mascena de Sousa Filho (raildo) | 16:53 |
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| ayoung | raildo, think you can tackle the solution? | 16:53 |
| raildo | ayoung, kind of, should we just change the table schema to make this a real thing? | 16:54 |
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| raildo | I'm afraid of creating some invalid duplicate entries if we enabled that | 16:54 |
| ayoung | should be a mod of the query, not the table, IIUC | 16:54 |
| ayoung | check_grant_role_id needs the type in it | 16:54 |
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| raildo | ayoung, well, what I understood is that in the role assignment table, we will have two entries for the same role_id, with the same target_id and pointing to the same user_id | 16:55 |
| lbragstad | and the python code doesn't actually hand that ambiguity | 16:56 |
| lbragstad | right? | 16:56 |
| ayoung | raildo, we already have that | 16:56 |
| raildo | lbragstad, right | 16:56 |
| ayoung | that is what the error message states, we just assume the query returns one | 16:56 |
| ayoung | 'type'\ is domain or project, I think | 16:56 |
| lbragstad | so - would we need to inspect each target in the response and make sure it's what we expect it to be (a domain or a project) | 16:57 |
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| ayoung | or add to the up front query | 16:57 |
| ayoung | check_system_grant(self, role_id, actor_id, target_id, inherited): does not have a type in it | 16:57 |
| ayoung | check_grant_role_id neither | 16:57 |
| raildo | ok, so I'll add a check type on this query before try to remove it, that should be fine | 16:58 |
| lbragstad | the manager logic for the system assignments is explicity about types | 16:58 |
| lbragstad | in the actual business logic | 16:58 |
| lbragstad | and calls to a separate driver | 16:58 |
| ayoung | I think that if project_id is NOne, type is a domain assignemnt, if project_id is set, it is a proejct role assignment | 16:58 |
| ayoung | should be a change limited to the sql driver | 16:59 |
| ayoung | cool? | 16:59 |
| * lbragstad would love to refactor the domain/project assignment backends to be more explicity and less implicit | 16:59 | |
| * ayoung wants to just kill domains | 16:59 | |
| raildo | so, let's do it! :D | 16:59 |
| lbragstad | raildo: i have your patch open in a tab and i'll review it today | 17:00 |
| hrybacki | that hour flew by | 17:00 |
| lbragstad | thanks for proposing the test first | 17:00 |
| raildo | lbragstad, ok, thanks | 17:00 |
| raildo | that's all from my side | 17:00 |
| lbragstad | anywho, that went quick | 17:00 |
| lbragstad | we're out of time, but office hours is starting in -keystone | 17:00 |
| lbragstad | thanks everyone for coming | 17:00 |
| lbragstad | #endmeeting | 17:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/" | 17:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Tue May 29 17:00:48 2018 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 17:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2018/keystone.2018-05-29-16.02.html | 17:00 |
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| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2018/keystone.2018-05-29-16.02.txt | 17:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/keystone/2018/keystone.2018-05-29-16.02.log.html | 17:00 |
| hrybacki | o/ | 17:01 |
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