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| ifat_afek | #startmeeting vitrage | 08:01 |
|---|---|---|
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Nov 2 08:01:27 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is ifat_afek. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 08:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 08:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: vitrage)" | 08:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'vitrage' | 08:01 |
| ifat_afek | Hi everyone :-) | 08:01 |
| eyalb | hi | 08:02 |
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| ifat_afek | #topic Barcelona recap | 08:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Barcelona recap (Meeting topic: vitrage)" | 08:03 | |
| ifat_afek | Barcelona summit was extremely successful! | 08:04 |
| ifat_afek | Here are links to the recorded sessions: | 08:04 |
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| ifat_afek | #link https://www.openstack.org/videos/video/demo-openstack-and-opnfv-keeping-your-mobile-phone-calls-connected | 08:04 |
| ifat_afek | #link https://www.openstack.org/videos/video/nokia-root-cause-analysis-principles-and-practice-in-openstack-and-beyond | 08:05 |
| ifat_afek | #link https://www.openstack.org/videos/video/ptls-and-cores-we-are-not-as-scary-as-you-think-organized-by-the-women-of-openstack | 08:05 |
| ifat_afek | #link https://www.openstack.org/videos/video/fault-management-with-openstack-congress-and-vitrage-based-on-opnfv-doctor-framework | 08:05 |
| ifat_afek | In addition, we had Vitrage hands-on lab that was supposed to be recorded, and three design sessions. | 08:05 |
| ifat_afek | The keynote demo with Doctor made a huge impression. The feedback we got was that it was the best demo in the keynotes this year. I think that as a result of this demo, more people came to Vitrage booth and to the hands-on lab. | 08:06 |
| ifat_afek | eyalb: thanks for your help in the keynotes! | 08:06 |
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| eyalb | I sent an email to the rdo mailing list | 08:07 |
| eyalb | updated them about vitrage | 08:07 |
| eyalb | I also pushed another package review for the dashboard | 08:07 |
| eyalb | and I started working on the puppet integration project that is needed for rdo | 08:08 |
| eyalb | thats all | 08:08 |
| ifat_afek | eyalb: that’s great, thanks | 08:08 |
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| ifat_afek | and did you understand that red hat are currently working on it? | 08:09 |
| eyalb | yes they started working on this | 08:09 |
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| elisha_r | hi - sorry I got here late | 08:10 |
| ifat_afek | great | 08:10 |
| ifat_afek | it’s very important for vitrage installation | 08:10 |
| ifat_afek | We had a meeting the next day with Doctor team, and we agreed that the next step should be to finish Vitrage installation using TripleO and then to support Vitrage installation using Apex OPNFV installer. | 08:11 |
| ifat_afek | And for that we need to have the rdo ready | 08:11 |
| ifat_afek | We understood that there are currently some issues with Apex, so we need to wait some time before we can start working on this integration. | 08:11 |
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| elisha_r | so I'll update briefly about the session we had on the principles of RCA | 08:13 |
| elisha_r | The session took place late Thursday, but we still had a nice crowd | 08:14 |
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| elisha_r | the session went well, overall, except for the fact that we had some technical glitches with the PPT... :) | 08:15 |
| ifat_afek | :-) | 08:15 |
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| elisha_r | we gave an overview of what RCA is all about, and the motivation behind what we do in vitrage, which we coined "automated expert judgement". I think that working on preparing this session helped me, at least, to clarify our current focus in vitrage, within the world of RCA | 08:16 |
| elisha_r | Then Ifat presented a LIVE (!!) demo, which went very well, as well as discussing the future steps of Vitrage | 08:17 |
| elisha_r | After the session we had a few interesting questions, which were not recorded, so I'll review them here | 08:18 |
| elisha_r | first, we were asked about handling multi-tenancy, specifically in cases where the Admin is not supposed to know or care what the tenanats are doing within their VMs | 08:18 |
| elisha_r | I answered that part of this is already supported in the multi-tenancy support added recently, before the summit | 08:19 |
| elisha_r | however, it's possible that we would need to enhance this support for such cases, since currently the Admin sees everything | 08:19 |
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| elisha_r | Alternatively, one coud run several vitrage instances, one for customer, one for admin, each with its own set of relevant datasources | 08:20 |
| elisha_r | I think Vitrage should support the first option, but for full flexibility you might need the second no matter what | 08:20 |
| elisha_r | I know there were a few more questions, about how simple it would be to add a new datasource. But don't recall the details | 08:21 |
| elisha_r | that's it as far as I can recall | 08:21 |
| ifat_afek | I was asked several times (after this session and in other times) about Vitrage-Aodh integration | 08:21 |
| ifat_afek | I explained that Aodh are the alarm manager, and have no intention of doing RCA. We have a POC of raising Vitrage alarms in Aodh, but it’s not working well at the moment | 08:23 |
| ifat_afek | I think it’s extremely important to finish this integration. I realized there is a real need for people to get Vitrage alarms using Aodh | 08:23 |
| ifat_afek | Moving on - Our design sessions were very interesting and productive. Among the issues that we discussed: | 08:24 |
| ifat_afek | •RCA history | 08:24 |
| ifat_afek | •Graph log inspector | 08:24 |
| ifat_afek | •Benchmark for Vitrage evaluator | 08:24 |
| ifat_afek | •Vitrage UX | 08:24 |
| ifat_afek | •Vitrage-Aodh Integration | 08:24 |
| ifat_afek | •Vitrage-Congress integration | 08:24 |
| ifat_afek | Link to the design sessions etherpad: | 08:24 |
| ifat_afek | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/vitrage-barcelona-design-summit | 08:25 |
| ifat_afek | We also had Vitrage hands-on lab, which succeeded beyond our expectations. Over 40 people came by to work in this lab, and many stayed after the end | 08:27 |
| ifat_afek | This session was supposed to be recorded as well, but we can’t find the video. doffek is checking it | 08:27 |
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| ifat_afek | Last thing (I think) - we had Vitrage demos in Nokia booth in the market place. The booth was crowded all day long. | 08:28 |
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| ifat_afek | That’s what I had to say :-) Anything else? | 08:29 |
| ifat_afek | So we’re done | 08:33 |
| eyalb | bye | 08:33 |
| ifat_afek | Bye! | 08:33 |
| elisha_r | bye | 08:33 |
| ifat_afek | #endmeeting | 08:34 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 08:34 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Nov 2 08:34:01 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 08:34 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/vitrage/2016/vitrage.2016-11-02-08.01.html | 08:34 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/vitrage/2016/vitrage.2016-11-02-08.01.txt | 08:34 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/vitrage/2016/vitrage.2016-11-02-08.01.log.html | 08:34 |
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| alex_xu | #startmeeting nova api | 13:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Nov 2 13:00:09 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is alex_xu. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 13:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 13:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: nova api)" | 13:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'nova_api' | 13:00 |
| alex_xu | who is here today? | 13:00 |
| cdent | o/ | 13:00 |
| Kevin_Zheng | o/ | 13:00 |
| johnthetubaguy | o/ | 13:00 |
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| alex_xu | ok, let us start the meeting | 13:01 |
| alex_xu | #topic update from summit | 13:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "update from summit (Meeting topic: nova api)" | 13:01 | |
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| alex_xu | johnthetubaguy: the only one priority task for the API is the query parameter validation? | 13:01 |
| johnthetubaguy | that sounds about correct | 13:02 |
| johnthetubaguy | although there is no separate freeze date this time around | 13:02 |
| alex_xu | johnthetubaguy: ok, cool, let us focus on it for this very short release cycle | 13:02 |
| gmann__ | and proxy API and extension tide up things ? | 13:02 |
| gmann__ | alex_xu: johnthetubaguy i can help on extension code cleanup if sdague need help on this | 13:03 |
| johnthetubaguy | so here is the thing... | 13:03 |
| johnthetubaguy | cells v2 is kinda blocked by not having good validation on the filter/sort params for instances | 13:03 |
| johnthetubaguy | so thats a good thing to focus on | 13:04 |
| johnthetubaguy | we should still make progress on all those other loose ends and tidyups | 13:04 |
| gmann__ | +1 | 13:04 |
| johnthetubaguy | including agreeing the capabilities API with API WG | 13:04 |
| alex_xu | so for the proxy API, we can continue image-metadata, due to the spec already merged, right? | 13:04 |
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| johnthetubaguy | #link http://specs.openstack.org/openstack/nova-specs/specs/ocata/approved/deprecate-image-meta-proxy-api.html | 13:05 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah | 13:05 |
| alex_xu | ah, cool | 13:05 |
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| johnthetubaguy | there is also this one: http://specs.openstack.org/openstack/nova-specs/specs/ocata/approved/flavor-root-disk-none.html | 13:06 |
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| alex_xu | ok, I didn't notice that one | 13:06 |
| johnthetubaguy | http://specs.openstack.org/openstack/nova-specs/specs/ocata/approved/detach-boot-volume.html | 13:07 |
| johnthetubaguy | so there are some good features lined up there | 13:07 |
| johnthetubaguy | generally fixing up the boot from volume situation, I guess | 13:07 |
| alex_xu | cool | 13:08 |
| johnthetubaguy | so got distracted from summit update... | 13:08 |
| gmann__ | yea, this seems nice. it will provide more nice management on volume things | 13:08 |
| johnthetubaguy | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ocata-nova-summit-api | 13:08 |
| johnthetubaguy | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/386555 | 13:09 |
| johnthetubaguy | we should all review the above capabilities proposal | 13:09 |
| alex_xu | johnthetubaguy: for the query parameter validation, we only fix the validation for server list/detail, do we need to add validation for other api which have query parameters | 13:09 |
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| johnthetubaguy | alex_xu: not for the priority, but I think we should look at all the sort/filter params to start with | 13:09 |
| gmann__ | alex_xu: johnthetubaguy are we going to do validation for SHOW api also in case some bogus id is mentioned in query URL ? | 13:10 |
| alex_xu | johnthetubaguy: i see now, server list/detail is priority, try others if we have time | 13:10 |
| gmann__ | alex_xu: johnthetubaguy or something can be taken after wards | 13:10 |
| johnthetubaguy | thats already done I assume? | 13:10 |
| johnthetubaguy | for the instance uuid I mean | 13:10 |
| gmann__ | seems no, i saw 1 tests in tempest sending special char as id and expecting 404 error | 13:11 |
| alex_xu | i'm not sure we should validate that id, if people input bogus id, then API just return not found, that looks like correct | 13:11 |
| gmann__ | johnthetubaguy: for SHOW server API i think no, we just try to fetch the given id | 13:11 |
| gmann__ | alex_xu: i was thinking to return 400 and avoid to look into DB | 13:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | OK, so I am not sure which bit you mean | 13:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | anyways, feels less important that the filter/sort things | 13:12 |
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| gmann__ | like this. /v2.1/server?query id#$@@ | 13:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | gmann__: I think 404 is fine for an invalid uuid I guess | 13:12 |
| gmann__ | johnthetubaguy: yea we can talk later | 13:12 |
| johnthetubaguy | gmann: oh, thats the server list that we are talking about right? | 13:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | thats just a filter | 13:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | show is /server/<uuid> in my head | 13:13 |
| gmann__ | sorry just SHOW yea, server/*&^ | 13:13 |
| johnthetubaguy | anyways, do we have someone sorting out the specs for all the filter/sort params? | 13:14 |
| johnthetubaguy | alex_xu has the base one, I guess | 13:15 |
| johnthetubaguy | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/388518/ | 13:15 |
| alex_xu | that needs a separated spec? | 13:15 |
| alex_xu | johnthetubaguy: yea | 13:15 |
| johnthetubaguy | oh, maybe not, let me check | 13:15 |
| johnthetubaguy | ah, so I think we need a spec for the microversion change to the server's API that adds all the parameter validation | 13:16 |
| johnthetubaguy | we also need to talk about what we are doing for older microversions, I think | 13:16 |
| johnthetubaguy | I think we just ignore things that are not allowed in the new list? | 13:17 |
| gmann__ | johnthetubaguy: in old microversion ? | 13:17 |
| alex_xu | johnthetubaguy: yes, i think that is the first step, and without microversion | 13:17 |
| alex_xu | and fix this bug without microversion https://bugs.launchpad.net/nova/+bug/1609039 | 13:17 |
| openstack | Launchpad bug 1609039 in OpenStack Compute (nova) "Should not be able to sort instances based on joined tables" [High,In progress] - Assigned to Zhenyu Zheng (zhengzhenyu) | 13:17 |
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| alex_xu | strict the validation won't be the ocata thing I guess? | 13:18 |
| johnthetubaguy | yeah, I suppose that could be a bug fix, but I would rather have a spec thats got the details | 13:18 |
| alex_xu | johnthetubaguy: ok | 13:18 |
| johnthetubaguy | doesn't need to be a long one | 13:19 |
| johnthetubaguy | just think its good to agree the direction for the /servers/... changes for the parameter validation | 13:19 |
| alex_xu | Kevin_Zheng: are you interesting on that spec ^ ? | 13:19 |
| Kevin_Zheng | sure i can try | 13:19 |
| alex_xu | johnthetubaguy: yea | 13:19 |
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| alex_xu | Kevin_Zheng: thanks, free to ping if you need any help | 13:20 |
| gmann__ | then we need to finalize the new allowed list first? | 13:20 |
| Kevin_Zheng | np | 13:20 |
| gmann__ | or fixing this bug for joined tables filter only | 13:20 |
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| johnthetubaguy | well, the spec needs to have the list of allowed things really | 13:20 |
| johnthetubaguy | I would rather we do it properly, as this is blocking the cells work | 13:20 |
| gmann__ | yea, +1 | 13:21 |
| Kevin_Zheng | got it | 13:21 |
| alex_xu | yea | 13:21 |
| johnthetubaguy | it seems close, but maybe I am being optimistic | 13:22 |
| alex_xu | emm...when we have the detail list, then we will know whether we are optimistic | 13:23 |
| johnthetubaguy | true :) | 13:23 |
| alex_xu | #link https://review.openstack.org/#/c/389003/ | 13:24 |
| alex_xu | I update the patch, added the unittest and refactor the code. but I guess not hurry, maybe see more detail before merge | 13:24 |
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| alex_xu | ok, so...anything more we want to bring up? | 13:25 |
| johnthetubaguy | I think thats the main bits from the summit | 13:26 |
| johnthetubaguy | Parameter validation, capabilities API WG spec, continue loose ends | 13:26 |
| alex_xu | a lot of loose ends :) | 13:28 |
| gmann__ | yea | 13:28 |
| alex_xu | yea, the nova API code is huge | 13:28 |
| johnthetubaguy | yup yup | 13:28 |
| alex_xu | #topic Open | 13:28 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open (Meeting topic: nova api)" | 13:28 | |
| gmann__ | and lot number of APIs :) | 13:29 |
| alex_xu | so anything more want to bring up, otherwise let us end the meeting early | 13:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | I guess we need to update the etherpad | 13:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ocata-nova-priorities-tracking | 13:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | add our new focus areas | 13:29 |
| alex_xu | #action Kevin_Zheng will bring up the spec about the server list query parameters | 13:29 |
| johnthetubaguy | cool | 13:30 |
| alex_xu | johnthetubaguy: thanks | 13:30 |
| alex_xu | I will update the etherpad | 13:30 |
| alex_xu | so anything more? | 13:32 |
| johnthetubaguy | I am happy | 13:33 |
| alex_xu | 3... | 13:33 |
| gmann__ | not from my side | 13:33 |
| alex_xu | 2.. | 13:33 |
| alex_xu | 1. | 13:33 |
| alex_xu | thanks all! | 13:33 |
| alex_xu | #endmeeting | 13:33 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 13:33 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Nov 2 13:33:25 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 13:33 |
| gmann__ | thanks all | 13:33 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_api/2016/nova_api.2016-11-02-13.00.html | 13:33 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_api/2016/nova_api.2016-11-02-13.00.txt | 13:33 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/nova_api/2016/nova_api.2016-11-02-13.00.log.html | 13:33 |
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| dtardivel | #startmeeting watcher | 15:00 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Nov 2 15:00:19 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is dtardivel. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:00 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: watcher)" | 15:00 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'watcher' | 15:00 |
| dtardivel | hi | 15:00 |
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| jamemcc | Hi | 15:00 |
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| tmetsch | hi | 15:01 |
| vincentfrancoise | o/ | 15:01 |
| vincentfrancoise | Today's agenda https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Watcher_Meeting_Agenda#11.2F02.2F2016 | 15:01 |
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| jed56 | Hi | 15:01 |
| sballe_ | hi | 15:01 |
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| serverascode | hi are you sure this meeting is now? I think the ops telecom/nfv meteing is in here now unless I have the time wrong | 15:02 |
| dtardivel | acabot, our PTL, is not available for the meeting. vincentfrancoise and me will lead it. | 15:02 |
| serverascode | was 14:00 UTC not an hour ago? | 15:02 |
| dtardivel | oups | 15:02 |
| GeraldK | i also had expected the OpenStack Operators Telcom/NFV Functional Team bi-weekly meeting on this channel at this point in time | 15:02 |
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| PerfectChaos | Hi~ I'm with serverascode on this one~ | 15:02 |
| dtardivel | sorry, we close it | 15:03 |
| vincentfrancoise | vfrancoise: time change... | 15:03 |
| dtardivel | #endmeeting | 15:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 15:03 | |
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| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Nov 2 15:03:19 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 15:03 |
| serverascode | ok sorry, but yeah you missed it by an hour | 15:03 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/watcher/2016/watcher.2016-11-02-15.00.html | 15:03 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/watcher/2016/watcher.2016-11-02-15.00.txt | 15:03 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/watcher/2016/watcher.2016-11-02-15.00.log.html | 15:03 |
| serverascode | #startmeeting operators_telco_nfv | 15:03 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Nov 2 15:03:29 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is serverascode. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 15:03 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 15:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: operators_telco_nfv)" | 15:03 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'operators_telco_nfv' | 15:03 |
| serverascode | #topic roll call | 15:03 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "roll call (Meeting topic: operators_telco_nfv)" | 15:03 | |
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| serverascode | hi all! | 15:03 |
| * PerfectChaos waves | 15:03 | |
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| ad_rien_ | o/ | 15:04 |
| ad_rien_ | Hi | 15:04 |
| GeraldK | Hi | 15:04 |
| jamemcc | Hello | 15:04 |
| serverascode | ok great, we have the most ppl ever :) | 15:04 |
| serverascode | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/BCN-ops-telcom-nfv-team | 15:05 |
| serverascode | ^ that's the session from last week at at the summit | 15:05 |
| serverascode | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/ops-telco-nfv-meeting-agenda | 15:05 |
| serverascode | ^ that's our agenda page | 15:05 |
| serverascode | I only have one real thing on the agenda right now, feel free to add to it if you have other things to discuss | 15:05 |
| serverascode | the one thing was our list of potential projects | 15:06 |
| serverascode | anyone have any comments/suggestions/ideas before I go into that topic? | 15:06 |
| jamemcc | No - good organization Curtis - lets push forward | 15:06 |
| serverascode | ok | 15:07 |
| serverascode | #topic Potential Projects | 15:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Potential Projects (Meeting topic: operators_telco_nfv)" | 15:07 | |
| serverascode | so the idea was to follow the large deployment teams lead and fiind a medium to long term project to shepherd through the openstack ecosystem | 15:08 |
| serverascode | they worked on getting network segments into neutron and were pretty successful | 15:08 |
| ALUVial | o/ (back to lurk mode) | 15:09 |
| serverascode | basically they found a common feature or issue and worked on it over time | 15:09 |
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| serverascode | so we have a list of things from the summit at that link above | 15:09 |
| serverascode | anyone see anything in particular that jumps out as needing to be solved? | 15:09 |
| GeraldK | NFVI benchmarking ref.platform got +4 | 15:10 |
| GeraldK | Rolling/live upgrade has +3 | 15:10 |
| serverascode | right there was a lot about benchmarking in that list | 15:10 |
| serverascode | how about the people in the meeting today? what are your issues or requirements? | 15:11 |
| ad_rien_ | Is there a specific use-case that can serve as a guide line ? | 15:11 |
| GeraldK | upgrading is something we (DOCOMO) would be interested in | 15:12 |
| ad_rien_ | We can identify a lot of challenges but with a common theme it might be easier to focus and make priorities between those challenges | 15:12 |
| GeraldK | currently, we skip releases and would like to improve on this | 15:12 |
| serverascode | right, and it's not really possible anymore, afaik, to skip releases | 15:13 |
| serverascode | ad_rien: what's a common theme? like "benchmarking" is a theme? is that what you mean? | 15:13 |
| ad_rien_ | From all the challenges I can see on the etherpad | 15:13 |
| GeraldK | #link http://specs.openstack.org/openstack/openstack-user-stories/user-stories/proposed/rolling-upgrades.html PWG user story on rolling upgrades | 15:14 |
| ad_rien_ | I get the feeling that some are rather general (i.e. upgrade is an interesting challenge but not specifc to the NFV WG If I'm right) | 15:14 |
| PerfectChaos | Rolling upgrades strike me as something that are generally going to be of interest to anybody | 15:14 |
| PerfectChaos | ...yeah, exactly what ad_rien_ just said =3 | 15:14 |
| ad_rien_ | So this is my point. | 15:14 |
| ad_rien_ | There are several challenges, all look really interesting but it might make sense to identify the ones that are really specific to the NFV use-cases | 15:15 |
| GeraldK | in contrast to other openstack users, Telcos might prefer not to have very frequent rolling upgrades. | 15:15 |
| PerfectChaos | I guess the thing to consider is - if it's a general problem there are more likely to be other people elsewhere working on them. | 15:15 |
| GeraldK | got your point. | 15:16 |
| PerfectChaos | Whereas NFV-specific problems are less likely to have people who aren't use out there driving to get them solved | 15:16 |
| ad_rien_ | PerfectChaos: yes exactly my point | 15:16 |
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| serverascode | ok, it seems like there is a bit of a consensus that working on upgrades might not be NFV specific enough | 15:17 |
| serverascode | that leaves us with benchmarking as a theme, at least in terms of what has been mentioned today | 15:17 |
| ad_rien_ | It might become critical/specific but later. | 15:17 |
| jamemcc | Just to give it a little more insight I think the possible more NFV related use case comes through with the massive cloud assumption | 15:18 |
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| PerfectChaos | Well, if the main problems NFV/Telecoms folks are all general problems, then we shouldn't just discard the idea of looking into those. It's down to what those people will find the most useful, right? | 15:18 |
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| jamemcc | If you go with the assumption that the NFV/Telcom brings with it the massive cloud - then the upgrade of massive cloud has addtional challenges | 15:18 |
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| jamemcc | That said - I think somethign closer to Telcom/NFV is more appropriate | 15:19 |
| * PerfectChaos nods | 15:19 | |
| ad_rien_ | Maybe we should start by simple actions/challenges and then increase the complexity step by step. | 15:19 |
| ad_rien_ | ForI agree with jamemcc remark but this mean that first you should be able to have an Openstack deployment accros distinct locations | 15:20 |
| ad_rien_ | s/ForI/I sorry for the typo | 15:20 |
| ad_rien_ | Is there a specific NFV use-case that can help us in our exchange ? | 15:21 |
| jamemcc | @ ad_rien yeah - agreed if I follow - So back to defining the reference implementation? | 15:21 |
| ad_rien_ | yes | 15:21 |
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| serverascode | by reference implementation...what does that mean? | 15:22 |
| serverascode | is that kind of like what OPNFV is doing? | 15:22 |
| ad_rien_ | What is the OpenStack deployment architecture if you want to address NFV use-cases? How can you instantiate such an architecture? | 15:22 |
| serverascode | ah, ok | 15:22 |
| serverascode | At work we have been trying to define NFVi, specifcally around features | 15:23 |
| ad_rien_ | is it deployed in one location or across several locations? where are the compute nodes that host the VMs? The control plane? … | 15:23 |
| ad_rien_ | serverascode: NFVi ? | 15:23 |
| ad_rien_ | i for Infrastructure ? | 15:24 |
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| serverascode | my impression is that under the ETSI definition, OpenStack is NFV infrastrcture (NFVi) and a VIM | 15:24 |
| serverascode | VIM = virtualized infrastructure manager | 15:24 |
| ad_rien_ | yepp | 15:25 |
| ad_rien_ | thanks | 15:25 |
| ad_rien_ | so that also something that can help the OpenStack community | 15:25 |
| serverascode | and it's hard b/c it's really a spectrum of requirements | 15:25 |
| ad_rien_ | I get the feelings that our words (i.e. from the network community vs the distributed computing community) differ sometimes | 15:25 |
| GeraldK | ETSI NFV003 defines NFVI: totality of all hardware and software components that build up the environment in which VNFs are deployed | 15:25 |
| GeraldK | so it's more than Openstack and also includes the hardware | 15:25 |
| serverascode | ok thanks GeraldK | 15:26 |
| GeraldK | it also could have multiple VIMs | 15:26 |
| ad_rien_ | but you can have different ways to deliver such a NFVi | 15:26 |
| ad_rien_ | see in the pad line 37 | 15:26 |
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| ad_rien_ | either a brokering approach where an orchestrator operates several VIMs or a bottom up approach | 15:27 |
| ad_rien_ | where OpenStack becomes cooperative enough to be able to natively federate distinct data centers/locations | 15:28 |
| serverascode | interesting, so are we discussing reference implementations right now? kind of? | 15:28 |
| PerfectChaos | I think we are, kind of. | 15:28 |
| ad_rien_ | I would say yes (at least from my side ;)) | 15:28 |
| GeraldK | I believe Telco's want to stay in control so prefer the brokering approach | 15:29 |
| PerfectChaos | The first step would presumably be deciding how deep the reference implementation goes | 15:29 |
| ad_rien_ | There should be different scenarios, a first action can consist of identifying them | 15:29 |
| serverascode | I almost feel like in order to get any work done we first have to define at least one or two reference implmentations | 15:29 |
| ad_rien_ | GeraldK: we work with Orange Labs and BT and the choice is unclear. We are trying to see what are the pros/cons of the different deployment strategies. | 15:29 |
| serverascode | so that we at least know what we are talking about to one another | 15:30 |
| GeraldK | and then, how different would this be to the reference platform developed by OPNFV? Or, how could we collaborate with OPNFV in it? | 15:30 |
| serverascode | I was hoping, at some level, that this group could work as a bridge between OPNFV and OpenStack Operators doing NFV | 15:30 |
| GeraldK | to work on the main topic of "NFVI benchmarking" we may not need our own reference implementation, do we? | 15:31 |
| ad_rien_ | serverascode: yes this makes sense | 15:31 |
| serverascode | no I don't think we need to make our own definition, but we'd have to have some common language to do work in this group | 15:32 |
| serverascode | ok, so we are about 30 minutes into our hour long meeting | 15:33 |
| * ad_rien_ is looking on google for information on the reference architecture of a OPNFV deployment | 15:33 | |
| serverascode | I think we have discussed three themes so far: 1) upgrades 2) benchmarking and 3) reference implementation definition | 15:35 |
| GeraldK | ad_rien_, maybe a good document to check current status of OPNFV is http://artifacts.opnfv.org/opnfvdocs/colorado/docs/documentation/index.html | 15:36 |
| ad_rien_ | Maybe a stupid question/comment but is there a link somewhere to clearly understand the differences between OPNFV and OpenStack in terms of internal mechanisms | 15:36 |
| GeraldK | not sure I get your question. OPNFV is using OpenStack. | 15:36 |
| ad_rien_ | ok | 15:36 |
| ad_rien_ | Let me reword, what does OPNFV bring? | 15:37 |
| serverascode | that is a question I hear quite often :) | 15:37 |
| ad_rien_ | from my understanding | 15:37 |
| PerfectChaos | Basically, they bring together various pieces that combined make an NFVI. One of those pieces is OpenStack. | 15:38 |
| ad_rien_ | OPNFV enables administrators to program the network active equipments (in somehow, an advanced Neutron component) | 15:38 |
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| ad_rien_ | so the reference architecture can be several openstack instances and one OPNFV to deliver a NFVi ? | 15:39 |
| GeraldK | there are several goals: integrate various upstream projects, act as intermediate body between ETSI NFV work and OpenStack, join forced to push new features to upstream projects, ... | 15:39 |
| GeraldK | ad_rien_, OPNFV builds a reference platform including OpenStack, ODL, and others | 15:40 |
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| ad_rien_ | ok | 15:40 |
| GeraldK | there was a nice handout on OPNFV in the Summit. let me see if I can find it online | 15:41 |
| ad_rien_ | but If I'm correct the working group focused on NFV within the OpenStack ecosystem? | 15:41 |
| ad_rien_ | so do we care about ODL and others :-) ? | 15:41 |
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| serverascode | I think we do have to be aware of SDN systems like ODL, and OVN | 15:42 |
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| serverascode | certainly some NFV deployments will rely on functionality that only SDN can provide | 15:42 |
| serverascode | but not all deployments will need that. Then there are projects like neutron-sfc | 15:43 |
| serverascode | oh and vlan aware virtual machines which was just blogged on superuser | 15:43 |
| ad_rien_ | serverascode: sorry for my remarks, it was a bit provocative. I agree we should be aware but we should also focus on OpenStack, shouldn't we? | 15:43 |
| serverascode | #link http://superuser.openstack.org/articles/four-opens/ | 15:43 |
| serverascode | ad_rien: no worries, not provocative at all | 15:43 |
| jamemcc | Agred focus inwards toward OpenStack and represent combined knowledge interest of OPNFV and SDN | 15:44 |
| jamemcc | and ETSI | 15:44 |
| ad_rien_ | AFAIK, there is not reference architecture for delivering a NFVi with OpenStack, maybe we can try to identify how we can progress on that point? | 15:44 |
| PerfectChaos | So... since there are a -lot- of different variables which could vary wildly between use-cases even within NFV/telecom use, we'd have a hard time picking one reference implementation which would be consistently useful, I think. | 15:45 |
| ad_rien_ | at least as a starting step? | 15:45 |
| GeraldK | #link http://go.linuxfoundation.org/l/6342/2016-10-11/3jhnwr/6342/158966/OPNFV_WhitePaper_Paving_Way_OpenSource_NFV_101016.pdf WhitePaper on OPNFV | 15:45 |
| PerfectChaos | Since people were interested in benchmarking NFVI, would it instead make sense to be thinking about frameworks/infrastructure with which we might be able to test/verify/benchmark different NFVIs? | 15:45 |
| GeraldK | I couldn't find the handout, but the figure are also available in the whitepaper | 15:46 |
| serverascode | I do think service function chaining (SFC) will probably be a common feature, and with neutron-sfc you don't technically need a 3rd party SDN controller | 15:46 |
| serverascode | so we could do a reference arch that supports neutron-sfc | 15:47 |
| ad_rien_ | We (at Inria) are interested by performing such evaluations | 15:47 |
| serverascode | also there is some interesting work around "neutron router flavors" | 15:47 |
| serverascode | #link https://specs.openstack.org/openstack/neutron-specs/specs/newton/multi-l3-backends.html | 15:47 |
| jamemcc | I think to define reference architecture and combinging wiht what is said about focusing on OpenStack - w are saying what openstack components are included and in what arrangement to get basic NFVi working. | 15:47 |
| ad_rien_ | We have access to the Grid'5000 testbed so we can perform experiments in a quite easy manner | 15:48 |
| ad_rien_ | jamemcc: +1 | 15:48 |
| jamemcc | And from my perspective this would be across at least 3 separate clouds though perhaps form testing and benchmarking we ought to pick a higher # | 15:48 |
| GeraldK | neutron-sfc is also being discussed in OPNFV (https://jira.opnfv.org/browse/VFNGRAPH-3) but I am not aware of any details on this project | 15:49 |
| GeraldK | IMHO this topic requires some discussion on collaboration with OPNFV. I am sure they would be interested on some collaboration. | 15:49 |
| serverascode | ok, interesting, so I'm feeling a bit of consensus around some kind of "vanilla" or "minimal" NFVi reference architecture, perhaps including neutron-sfc? | 15:50 |
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| ad_rien_ | +1 | 15:50 |
| ad_rien_ | I think I should be able (or at least give a try) to add Orange folks in the loop | 15:50 |
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| serverascode | ok, so we have about 8 min left | 15:51 |
| serverascode | where should we go from here? do we agree this is one area to explore? | 15:51 |
| GeraldK | the goal should be to get some benchmarking or similar, but not to have "just" a reference architecture. | 15:51 |
| jamemcc | Agreed | 15:52 |
| jamemcc | and likes it | 15:52 |
| serverascode | ok, and do you think it would be benchmarking some kind of "vanilla" or "minimal" NFVi based on OpenStack projects? | 15:52 |
| serverascode | so neutron-sfc for example | 15:53 |
| ad_rien_ | First step can be a reference architecture, Second step a scenario that inclue neutron-sfc (maybe we can push such a scenario in Rally) and Three perform some evaluations? | 15:53 |
| PerfectChaos | See above about benchmarking frameworks - what about, say, coming up with some standard set of benchmarking tests for those evaluations? | 15:53 |
| PerfectChaos | (which could subsequently be run against a different NFVI to see how it performs in comparison, if one was so inclined) | 15:53 |
| GeraldK | what I mean is: create a set of (standardized) benchmarks and test those on a reference implementation. but the focus would be the benchmarks. | 15:53 |
| PerfectChaos | Right. Sounds like we're on the same page, then. | 15:54 |
| GeraldK | agreed | 15:54 |
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| serverascode | cool, there is also a performance working group that we could team up with | 15:54 |
| ad_rien_ | PerfectChaos: can you point once again the link regarding the benchmark ? | 15:54 |
| serverascode | that would fit in well with the user committee wanting more communication between openstack working gorups | 15:55 |
| serverascode | we could collaborate with OPNFV and the performance team | 15:55 |
| serverascode | ok so can I say something like we agree that: | 15:55 |
| ad_rien_ | We are involved in the performance WG at Inria. If I'm correct here we do not really talk about performance but more on functional benchmarks ? | 15:55 |
| PerfectChaos | ad_rien_: Hmm? I didn't have any links on benchmarks? | 15:55 |
| serverascode | ah ok functional vs performance | 15:56 |
| ad_rien_ | "PerfectChaos: See above about benchmarking frameworks " - see above ? | 15:56 |
| PerfectChaos | My assumption was that it would include both functional and performance benchmarks... | 15:56 |
| ad_rien_ | ok | 15:56 |
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| PerfectChaos | ad_rien_: Oh, I was just referring back to my previous comment "would it instead make sense to be thinking about frameworks/infrastructure with which we might be able to test/verify/benchmark different NFVIs?" | 15:57 |
| PerfectChaos | To which I think the answer is "we should be thinking about both". | 15:58 |
| serverascode | ok, can I say something like: "We agree that this working group will develop and perform benchmarks on a NFVi reference architecture which we will determine in future meetings" | 15:58 |
| PerfectChaos | That seems like a good point to start from | 15:58 |
| GeraldK | what would be the timeframe for this? and would we focus on this one only or allow a second topic? | 15:58 |
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| GeraldK | but definitely a good starting point | 15:58 |
| serverascode | I think we'd have to come up with a timeframe in future meetings | 15:59 |
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| serverascode | we could certainly work on more than one thing | 15:59 |
| serverascode | only about a minute left | 15:59 |
| GeraldK | sure. but roughly? 1 year? | 15:59 |
| serverascode | probably something like that, at least a couple releases | 15:59 |
| serverascode | sorry I have to end the meeting! | 15:59 |
| GeraldK | okay | 15:59 |
| GeraldK | bye | 16:00 |
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| serverascode | #endmeeting | 16:00 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 16:00 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Nov 2 16:00:10 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 16:00 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/operators_telco_nfv/2016/operators_telco_nfv.2016-11-02-15.03.html | 16:00 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/operators_telco_nfv/2016/operators_telco_nfv.2016-11-02-15.03.txt | 16:00 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/operators_telco_nfv/2016/operators_telco_nfv.2016-11-02-15.03.log.html | 16:00 |
| serverascode | thanks everyone! I'll send an email to the list | 16:00 |
| serverascode | also I might email the user commitee list too | 16:00 |
| ad_rien_ | so talk to you next week ? | 16:00 |
| serverascode | two weeks from now currently | 16:00 |
| ad_rien_ | I mean sorry in two weeks ? | 16:00 |
| ad_rien_ | ok | 16:00 |
| serverascode | thanks again! | 16:00 |
| ad_rien_ | thanks for chairing | 16:00 |
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| JRobinson__ | hello all, the User Guides team meeting will start now. | 21:01 |
| JRobinson__ | I just have one key agenda item to go through today. | 21:01 |
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| JRobinson__ | #startmeeting docuserguides | 21:01 |
| openstack | Meeting started Wed Nov 2 21:01:52 2016 UTC and is due to finish in 60 minutes. The chair is JRobinson__. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. | 21:01 |
| openstack | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. | 21:01 |
| *** openstack changes topic to " (Meeting topic: docuserguides)" | 21:01 | |
| openstack | The meeting name has been set to 'docuserguides' | 21:01 |
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| JRobinson__ | At the recent Ocata summit, one of the Docs working groups talked about the legacy commands in the User guides | 21:02 |
| JRobinson__ | The etherpad has more details | 21:03 |
| JRobinson__ | #link https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/BCN-Docs-UserGuidesWG | 21:03 |
| JRobinson__ | the docs PTL also sent out a summary of each working group session to the docs mailing list. | 21:03 |
| JRobinson__ | To follow up on the email, the fortnightly User Guide meeting will eventually change to a monthly team meeting. | 21:07 |
| JRobinson__ | #topic Legacy to OpenStack client commands | 21:07 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Legacy to OpenStack client commands (Meeting topic: docuserguides)" | 21:07 | |
| JRobinson__ | With the summit recap completed, the issue that needs attention is the legacy command changes | 21:07 |
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| JRobinson__ | #link https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Documentation/ReorganizeUserGuides#Legacy_to_OpenStack_command_conversion_table | 21:09 |
| JRobinson__ | I have began setting up the checklist table mentioned at Summit. | 21:09 |
| JRobinson__ | So far, its Admin guide files | 21:09 |
| JRobinson__ | I started with files that already have OpenStack client commands in them | 21:09 |
| JRobinson__ | I then moved to step two | 21:10 |
| JRobinson__ | Searching through each file for legacy commands | 21:10 |
| JRobinson__ | then adding the file to the checklist, along with the commands, and their line location in file. | 21:11 |
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| JRobinson__ | This way, there is an accurate picture of what needs to change. | 21:11 |
| JRobinson__ | #topic Open Discussion | 21:11 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "Open Discussion (Meeting topic: docuserguides)" | 21:11 | |
| JRobinson__ | Any questions or comments on the process, contact the docs mailing list, or ping me on irc. | 21:12 |
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| JRobinson__ | I'll close up this brief recap meeting. | 21:13 |
| JRobinson__ | #action JRobinson__ to continue to update table with Admin and User Guide commands. | 21:14 |
| JRobinson__ | #endmeeting | 21:14 |
| *** openstack changes topic to "OpenStack Meetings || https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings" | 21:14 | |
| openstack | Meeting ended Wed Nov 2 21:14:43 2016 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | 21:14 |
| openstack | Minutes: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/docuserguides/2016/docuserguides.2016-11-02-21.01.html | 21:14 |
| openstack | Minutes (text): http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/docuserguides/2016/docuserguides.2016-11-02-21.01.txt | 21:14 |
| openstack | Log: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/docuserguides/2016/docuserguides.2016-11-02-21.01.log.html | 21:14 |
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| JRobinson__ | Hello all, The second user guide meeting set for the APAC timezone is ordinarly scheduled to happenin in about 12 minutes, | 23:17 |
| JRobinson__ | I'm cancelling the meeting for this fortnight. | 23:17 |
| JRobinson__ | The US meeting minutes are available on the User Guide team page: | 23:18 |
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| JRobinson__ | https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/User_Guides#MeetingLogs | 23:18 |
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