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| openstackgerrit | Rohit Jaiswal proposed openstack/ceilometer: Using oslo.db retry decorator for sample create https://review.openstack.org/167034 | 01:49 |
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| openstackgerrit | OpenStack Proposal Bot proposed openstack/ceilometer: Imported Translations from Transifex https://review.openstack.org/165703 | 06:06 |
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| openstackgerrit | liusheng proposed openstack/ceilometer: Ceilometer retrieve all images by 'all-tenants' https://review.openstack.org/167077 | 08:16 |
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| openstackgerrit | Julien Danjou proposed stackforge/gnocchi: rest: validate metric format before using it in indexer https://review.openstack.org/167541 | 10:13 |
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| openstackgerrit | Kamil Rykowski proposed openstack/ceilometer: Typo in pylintrc https://review.openstack.org/167544 | 10:18 |
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| openstackgerrit | Julien Danjou proposed stackforge/gnocchi: InfluxDB storage driver https://review.openstack.org/165407 | 10:39 |
| openstackgerrit | Julien Danjou proposed stackforge/gnocchi: tests: drop testscenarios usage for storage https://review.openstack.org/164209 | 10:39 |
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| cdent | jd__, sileht: could I get your thoughts on and a go no-go on the compromise option listed in my final comment here: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/167298/ | 11:12 |
| cdent | I apparently needed to sleep to realize what was actually going on | 11:12 |
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| openstackgerrit | Ilya Tyaptin proposed stackforge/gnocchi: Add OpenTSDB storage driver https://review.openstack.org/107986 | 11:23 |
| ityaptin | cdent: Hi! May you take a look ^^^ | 11:33 |
| cdent | yup, will do ityaptin, after I get this issue with the functional tests resolved | 11:34 |
| ityaptin | cdent: cool, thanks! | 11:34 |
| openstackgerrit | Chris Dent proposed stackforge/gnocchi: Correct handling of fixtures and server in gate tests https://review.openstack.org/167298 | 11:37 |
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| openstackgerrit | Chris Dent proposed stackforge/gnocchi: Correct handling of fixtures and server in gate tests https://review.openstack.org/167298 | 12:33 |
| cdent | jd__, sileht: I've made a couple more patches. Turns out there's lots of stuff busted with the functional tests, but moving slowly in the right direction | 12:34 |
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| gordc | sileht: do you know if message signing was ever implemented in oslo.messaging or somewhere else? | 12:44 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/ceilometer: Typo in pylintrc https://review.openstack.org/167544 | 12:57 |
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| openstackgerrit | Chris Dent proposed stackforge/gnocchi: Correct handling of fixtures and server in gate tests https://review.openstack.org/167298 | 13:04 |
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| cdent | After 10 months I'm still not clear on the distinctions between many of the terms in ceilo and gnocchi and I want to make a glossary: https://tank.peermore.com/tanks/cdent-rhat/CeilometerGlossary | 13:07 |
| cdent | some of the stuff is pretty clear because there's only one term or little overlap | 13:08 |
| gordc | i use meter, metric, measurements interchangeably... which is apparently wrong | 13:08 |
| cdent | but for stuff like sample, metric, meter, measure, timeseries there feels like plenty of overlap | 13:09 |
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| gordc | i think timeseries is just superset of metric/meter/measure? | 13:09 |
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| cdent | I've always though a meter is a type of thing that gets measured and the measurements are metrics or samples | 13:13 |
| cdent | but that naming doesn't map to either ceilometer or gnocchi | 13:13 |
| cdent | (and a collection of metrics is a timeseries) | 13:13 |
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| eglynn | my 2 cents: a collection of measures (value+timestamp datapoints) is a timeseries, whereas a metric can be backed by multiple timeseries of different granularities | 13:15 |
| eglynn | (using the gnocchi terminology) | 13:15 |
| eglynn | then in classic ceilo, a meter has associated with it multiple samples (value+timestamp+metadata datapoints) | 13:16 |
| sileht | gordc, don't really remember, kyte was a candidate, the oslo.msg part is here, but have never been finished, https://review.openstack.org/#/c/109806/, the spec for juno was never finished: https://review.openstack.org/#/c/128926 | 13:16 |
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| cdent | eglynn, gordc: I think it is pretty clear that the docs aren't doing a very good job of explaining these terms if Tim Bell is concerned about it. | 13:18 |
| cdent | I suspect the reason the docs dont' do a good job is because nobody is quite sure :) | 13:18 |
| eglynn | this http://docs.openstack.org/developer/ceilometer/glossary.html doesn't seem to wide off the mark for classic ceilo, or? | 13:20 |
| eglynn | ... but we probably need a decoder ring to map to & fro classic and gnocchi terminology also | 13:21 |
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| cdent | depending on what you're having, lunhc might be better | 13:22 |
| cdent | Is there a glossary of those terms in the admin or install guides? | 13:23 |
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| gordc | cdent: i don't think so. | 13:26 |
| cdent | I think we've already discussed how there's too much info in the dev docs and not in the other docs, yeah? | 13:27 |
| gordc | yep. but we've minimised it recently. | 13:28 |
| gordc | i should probably rip out the events stuff and make a pointer to admin docs | 13:29 |
| gordc | sileht: cool cool. i'll ask jamielennox to see if he's still working on that stuff. (i remember him mentioning it a long time ago) | 13:31 |
| cdent | are the dev docs supposed to be for people developing _on_ ceilo or _with_ ceilo? | 13:31 |
| gordc | probably on. i think the client related stuff might be captured in admin docs. | 13:32 |
| gordc | _on_ | 13:32 |
| sileht | gordc, that the guy you should ping I guess | 13:32 |
| gordc | _underline_ | 13:32 |
| gordc | sileht: kk. now i just got to be awake during australia work hours. | 13:33 |
| ildikov | cdent: we don't have glossary in OS Manuals, as it wasn't a high priority item to add in order to have a usable docs | 13:35 |
| gordc | i'm ok with this definition: http://paste.openstack.org/show/196560/ | 13:35 |
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| cdent | ildikov: the thing we've been talking about is the mailing list discussion about meter v metric and how it confuses folk and wouldn't it be nice if they weren't | 13:36 |
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| gordc | but tbh, i sort refer to all of that as metrics (ts/value with arbitrary collection of additional attributes) | 13:36 |
| ildikov | cdent: and well, when you write docco and you write down the same word for the 100th time you try to find some synonyms, which these terms are rightly not, but it was the easy way... | 13:37 |
| cdent | :) | 13:37 |
| ildikov | cdent: I know, but it finally ends up in a glossary too, that you also mentioned earlier | 13:37 |
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| ildikov | cdent: and well, sometimes I'm not 100% sure myself if we have only meters on board, like we have the event type meters now, which are events in reality... | 13:38 |
| gordc | ildikov: http://www.thesaurus.com? | 13:38 |
| cdent | yeah, it's all bit fuzzy | 13:39 |
| ildikov | gordc: LOL :), thanks | 13:39 |
| ildikov | cdent: and the thing is that there are still many people, who treats Ceilometer as a monitoring tool, which it is not and having only the meter term in the docs will not change anything | 13:41 |
| sileht | If some core have some times to take care of https://review.openstack.org/#/c/164237/ and https://review.openstack.org/#/c/164173/, thanks in advance | 13:42 |
| ildikov | cdent: I agree that we should be consistent though, I have no problem with that part, so I will open a bug for this and mark both Cceilo and OS Manuals as affected modules | 13:42 |
| cdent | Lots of people do think of ceilo as a monitoring tool, but we don't seem to do much to dissuade people of such things | 13:42 |
| ildikov | cdent: What do you see as actions to do so? | 13:44 |
| gordc | i don't think we should be telling users to do this and not that if the data is available to them. | 13:44 |
| cdent | I honestly don't know and I'm also partly in the gordc camp. | 13:45 |
| gordc | my camp as in the definitions that eglynn posted earlier? | 13:45 |
| cdent | I do, however, think that ceilo has a bit of an identity crisis because it is being so many things at once | 13:45 |
| cdent | gordc: no, the not-telling-users-what-to-do camp | 13:45 |
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| gordc | cdent: ah got it... i think the original plan was metering but the fact that we're acting on the same notifications as what some users use for monitoring i think forces us to expand. | 13:46 |
| gordc | we use to publish notifications twice so ceilometer/monitoring tool could consume and it really floods the MQ. | 13:48 |
| ildikov | I prefer single responsibility more than identity crisis as the latter can more easily cause architectural issues as the requirements are different in each case | 13:49 |
| cdent | single responsibility is what I'd like us to have, but it isn't | 13:50 |
| cdent | gordc: sounds like wer'e gonna need a bigger bus | 13:50 |
| ildikov | or a stargate... | 13:51 |
| * gordc never seen the show... i'm assuming it's a show | 13:51 | |
| ildikov | cdent: can you see a way to achieve single responsibility? | 13:51 |
| ildikov | gordc: you haven't seen the movie? | 13:52 |
| cdent | gordc you said "floods the MQ" and to me that is probably the most fundamental issue we're faced with in OpenStack: the message bus needs to be able to handle _far_ more data so that we can (mostly reliably) send far more notifications, otherwise we'll never scale appropriately | 13:52 |
| cdent | ildikov: in the short term, not really, in the longer term I think doing things like separating aspects out into other code repos (like gnocchi) is a good way to break things apart so that each has its own responsibility | 13:53 |
| ildikov | cdent: yeap, right, it seems like a good starting point | 13:54 |
| gordc | cdent: fair enough. i mean ceilometer can listen to multiple mq... i guess it's a matter of how coupled/decoupled you want everything to be. | 13:54 |
| gordc | ^ that is two separate thoughts... i just munged them together | 13:55 |
| cdent | so how about we have a "cmon let's stop faffing about and actually fix it" design session? (where "it" is something not yet defined) | 13:57 |
| ildikov | well, maybe we can simply call it identity crisis ;) | 13:58 |
| gordc | i guess this is a sessino on every project's track? | 13:58 |
| cdent | jd__: for refernce, it appears that the gnocchi functional gate jobs were never starting up correctly, even before I started messing with it, so my investigations on that patchset continue to continue | 13:59 |
| cdent | gordc: It probably shoudl be but I was just thinking ceilo for now | 13:59 |
| ildikov | I think every project has slightly different issues | 14:00 |
| ildikov | so they might have similar ones | 14:01 |
| ildikov | maybe it would be useful for us too if we could define it a bit more | 14:01 |
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| openstackgerrit | Merged openstack/python-ceilometerclient: alarm: Use new gnocchi aggregation API https://review.openstack.org/164237 | 14:50 |
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| sileht | jd__, first run after I have introduced sequences for resource history: 'NotImplementedError: Dialect 'mysql' does not support sequence increments.' | 15:09 |
| * sileht cries | 15:09 | |
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| jd__ | sileht: -_- | 15:21 |
| jd__ | I feel your pain bro | 15:21 |
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| * cmyster hads sileht a cookie | 15:36 | |
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| openstackgerrit | Chris Dent proposed stackforge/gnocchi: Correct handling of fixtures and server in gate tests https://review.openstack.org/167298 | 15:51 |
| cdent | I hope that will finally work | 15:51 |
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| openstackgerrit | gordon chung proposed openstack/ceilometer: minimise the use of hmac https://review.openstack.org/167690 | 16:46 |
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| openstackgerrit | gordon chung proposed openstack/ceilometer: minimise the use of hmac https://review.openstack.org/167690 | 18:26 |
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| openstackgerrit | Chris Dent proposed stackforge/gnocchi: Correct handling of fixtures and server in gate tests https://review.openstack.org/167298 | 18:45 |
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| cdent | gordc: do you have a playbook from which your ongoing series of patches is coming from or do you just do what comes up? | 18:47 |
| cdent | because there seems to be some kind of method in your madness but I'm not seeing the backstory and I'm curious | 18:49 |
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| gordc | cdent: i have trouble focusing... i usually notice stuff, forget, and then remember a few weeks/months later | 19:08 |
| gordc | also, i'm pretty sure a lot of the stuff is just stuff i broke so i go back to see what i touched. | 19:09 |
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| cdent | i'm glad to see it happening gordc: it's the sort of just making stuff better (instead of new stuff) that we need more of | 19:11 |
| gordc | cdent: agreed. that message signing thing is pretty big performance hit though. i wonder why MQ security isn't enough. | 19:14 |
| cdent | is signature a checksum? | 19:14 |
| cdent | no bits were lost kind of thing | 19:15 |
| gordc | yeah, well i think it was added to ensure nothing was tampered with. (which is why we have the 'secret key') | 19:15 |
| gordc | i guess it doubles as checksum | 19:15 |
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| gordc | my only issue is that when can verify it's not tampered with once ceilometer knows about it, but it can easily be done before we see it... i'm sure there's some use case for it... or maybe it's moot now | 19:17 |
| gordc | we can verify* | 19:17 |
| cdent | it's frustrating how deep the debt is | 19:19 |
| cdent | I was just speaking with a friend and he was all "you know you keep valiantly try to explain it to me, but I still have no idea what ceilometer is" | 19:20 |
| cdent | this is someone who has several years of python and javascript experience, deploys shit, works on puters all the time | 19:20 |
| cdent | "can't you just have one web page that says what it is and sort of sells it", he says | 19:20 |
| cdent | "jesus, launchpad, really, WTF!?" | 19:21 |
| gordc | lol | 19:21 |
| gordc | well there's the missions statement in governance. | 19:21 |
| cdent | so its not really even tech debt, it's modern world debt | 19:21 |
| cdent | yeah, that's some pretty good buzzword bingo right there | 19:22 |
| cdent | and besides where does that mission statement actually show up where someone searching on ceilometer would find it? | 19:22 |
| cdent | Searches on "what is ceilometer for" go to the wiki page, where we find the mission statement, excellent, that's a start | 19:22 |
| cdent | but you read that and still... | 19:22 |
| * cdent scratches head | 19:23 | |
| gordc | lol i build my resume on buzzwords... my entire resume is one sentence, 'i do machine learning on big data from the cloud to connect the internet of things' | 19:23 |
| * cdent reloads his gas tank | 19:23 | |
| cdent | there's much to do | 19:23 |
| cdent | HIRED | 19:23 |
| gordc | awesome! | 19:24 |
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| cdent | would you like fries with that? | 19:27 |
| gordc | lol! that's after probation. i would still get 3 to 8 months of amazing pay. | 19:27 |
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| openstackgerrit | Chris Dent proposed stackforge/gnocchi: Correct handling of fixtures and server in gate tests https://review.openstack.org/167298 | 19:36 |
| cdent | Either everybody has stockholm syndrome or I'm a prima donna. Perhaps both. | 19:37 |
| cdent | that's tweetworthy | 19:38 |
| gordc | i vote both. | 19:38 |
| *** harlowja_away is now known as harlowja | 19:38 | |
| cdent | Yeah, both seems right. | 19:39 |
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| openstackgerrit | Chris Dent proposed stackforge/gnocchi: Correct handling of fixtures and server in gate tests https://review.openstack.org/167298 | 20:19 |
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| openstackgerrit | Chris Dent proposed stackforge/gnocchi: Correct handling of fixtures and server in gate tests https://review.openstack.org/167298 | 21:07 |
| cdent | i'm clearly an idiot | 21:07 |
| gordc | lol! i commend you for your persistence. | 21:09 |
| cdent | it's such a slow turnaround because i have to wait on the gate, but oh well | 21:12 |
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| openstackgerrit | gordon chung proposed openstack/ceilometer: broadcast data to relevant queues only https://review.openstack.org/167826 | 22:48 |
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